For those who think Christ is not God.

[Pearl]

Well done, and who is the 'arm' of the Lord and the 'rock' that followed the Isrealites in the wilderness..

Excellent Pearl
J.

It's from gotquestions.org

 

[Johann]

The precise identity of the “angel of the Lord” is not given in the Bible. However, there are many important “clues” to his identity. There are Old and New Testament references to “angels of the Lord,” “an angel of the Lord,” and “the angel of the Lord.” It seems when the definite article “the” is used, it is specifying a unique being, separate from the other angels. The angel of the Lord speaks as God, identifies Himself with God, and exercises the responsibilities of God (Genesis 16:7-12; 21:17-18; 22:11-18; Exodus 3:2; Judges 2:1-4; 5:23; 6:11-24; 13:3-22; 2 Samuel 24:16; Zechariah 1:12; 3:1; 12:8). In several of these appearances, those who saw the angel of the Lord feared for their lives because they had “seen the Lord.” Therefore, it is clear that in at least some instances, the angel of the Lord is a theophany, an appearance of God in physical form.

The appearances of the angel of the Lord cease after the incarnation of Christ. Angels are mentioned numerous times in the New Testament, but “the angel of the Lord” is never mentioned in the New Testament after the birth of Christ.

It is possible that appearances of the angel of the Lord were manifestations of Jesus before His incarnation. Jesus declared Himself to be existent “before Abraham” (John 8:58), so it is logical that He would be active and manifest in the world. Whatever the case, whether the angel of the Lord was a pre-incarnate appearance of Christ (Christophany) or an appearance of God the Father (theophany), it is highly likely that the phrase “the angel of the Lord” usually identifies a physical appearance of God.

Do be careful to go to GotQuestions.org @Pearl, they are Calvinistic.
J.

 

[Johann]

It's from gotquestions.org

So I gathered.
J.

 

[marks]

The human body is a body of death requiring redemption. True or False?

Adam's lineage is condemned. But human bodies are not intrinsically bodies of death, sin did that. Romans 5, sin brings death. Adam's line of humanity is corrupted by sin, and condemned by God.

All of humanity was in Adam when he sinned, and became corrupted. It's not that a particular individual became corrupted. Adam was Humanity, and Humanity was corrupted. So all born from Adam share that corruption. We share in that which the head of our Humanity has.

When Adam was created, he was not yet corrupted. However, Only God is good, therefore, while Adam was created "good" by God, it was not the same as God's goodness. Adam was created in a good state, God is intrinsically good. Adam, having been created, was subject to change. God, being eternal, having life in Himself, does not change.

To say that God might change is against Scripture, and would impose the idea that God somehow improves, or degrades, and neither are Scriptural. Adam however was subject to change, and change he did.

Jesus - God in flesh - is not subject to change, and while He incarnated in a body that would grow and mature, and that could be killed, if He permitted it, lived according to His Own identity, the Creator, the Lawgiver, the Redeemer, and Judge. He did not change, even though He took on a body.

That is the difference between the first Adam and the Last Adam. The first Adam was not intrinsically good, and therefore was not "stable". Jesus is intrinsically good, and has joined me to Him, and that will not change, because He does not change.

With me so far?

Much love!

 

[Pearl]

Do be careful to go to GotQuestions.org @Pearl, they are Calvinistic.
J.

To be honest @Johann I don't know what Calvinistic means - I led a sheltered life.

 

[Johann]

Adam's lineage is condemned. But human bodies are not intrinsically bodies of death, sin did that. Romans 5, sin brings death. Adam's line of humanity is corrupted by sin, and condemned by God.

All of humanity was in Adam when he sinned, and became corrupted. It's not that a particular individual became corrupted. Adam was Humanity, and Humanity was corrupted. So all born from Adam share that corruption. We share in that which the head of our Humanity has.

When Adam was created, he was not yet corrupted. However, Only God is good, therefore, while Adam was created "good" by God, it was not the same as God's goodness. Adam was created in a good state, God is intrinsically good. Adam, having been created, was subject to change. God, being eternal, having life in Himself, does not change.

To say that God might change is against Scripture, and would impose the idea that God somehow improves, or degrades, and neither are Scriptural. Adam however was subject to change, and change he did.

Jesus - God in flesh - is not subject to change, and while He incarnated in a body that would grow and mature, and that could be killed, if He permitted it, lived according to His Own identity, the Creator, the Lawgiver, the Redeemer, and Judge. He did not change, even though He took on a body.

That is the difference between the first Adam and the Last Adam. The first Adam was not intrinsically good, and therefore was not "stable". Jesus is intrinsically good, and has joined me to Him, and that will not change, because He does not change.

With me so far?

Much love!

Absolutely
J.

 

[marks]

Only if you believe Satan's lie in the garden... You shall not surely die.

That's not a fair statement.

Much love!

 

[Johann]

To be honest @Johann I don't know what Calvinistic means - I led a sheltered life.

My apology @Pearl
Yours in Christ Jesus
J.

 

[Waiting on him]

Get rid of deeply ingrained preconceived ideologies,
J.

For real, everything you believe is deeply ingrained in pagan Roman sophistry.

 

[Pearl]

For real, everything you believe is deeply ingrained in pagan Roman sophistry.

What church do you belong to? @Waiting on him

 

[Waiting on him]

What church do you belong to? @Waiting on him

I do not belong to a church.

 

[Pearl]

I do not belong to a church.

So did you ever belong to a church? I know lots of Christians don't go to church these days. Are you one of them?

 

[Waiting on him]

So did you ever belong to a church? I know lots of Christians don't go to church these days. Are you one of them?

I go to God, as Jesus instructed. You should try it sometime, less critics to satisfy.

 

[Pearl]

I go to God, as Jesus instructed. You should try it sometime, less critics to satisfy.

I do always go to God but I was part of a church fellowship too but I haven't been to a church gathering for ages.

 

[Johann]

I do always go to God but I was part of a church fellowship too but I haven't been to a church gathering for ages.

Same here, was in a mission, outreach mission.
J.

 

[Brakelite]

Yeah its Christian tradition to suggest Gabriel is an archangel. Whoever he is God saw it essential for him to be involved in the New Covenant whereas Michael relates to the old. I'm not dogmatic on this.

Gabriel was prominent in interpreting Daniels visions, and received assistance from Michael 'the Prince' when working on the minds of the Persian rulers

 

[Brakelite]

You have already said I do not believe that Christ was created, and that I believe in your pagan vile incarnation

I have always known you believed Christ to be a created being. I have no idea why you would think otherwise, and I certainly have not claimed otherwise.

 

[APAK]

I have always known you believed Christ to be a created being. I have no idea why you would think otherwise, and I certainly have not claimed otherwise.

Well you were really fooling me judging from your last few posts I addressed bro. Yes of course I do believe Christ was created at his conception in the womb of Mary... all good then...no need to ring my very old relative in Melbourne then..lol

 

[Brakelite]

That's not a fair statement.

Much love!

It is fair when considering the fact that the bulk of Christianity today minimizes death as merely a separation, not realizing that separation from the only source of life means death. It is accepted by trinitarians that because Jesus is an inseparable equal part of the trinity, and it's therefore immortal, that He cannot die. That His divine person didn't die, just His body. But then all we would have is a human sacrifice. The "real" Jesus didn't "surely die", just as Adam and Eve didn't surely die... They continued to live... Somewhere.... Because human spirits, do it is taught, are immortal. No-one according to modem Christianity "surely dies". They believe Satan's lie, and apply it even to Jesus. Which renders the wages of sin is death meaningless.

 

[Brakelite]

Well you were really fooling me judging from your last few posts I addressed bro. Yes of course I do believe Christ was created at his conception in the womb of Mary... all good then...no need to ring my very old relative in Melbourne then..lol

Read my last posts...I do happen to disagree with you. I firmly believe Christ pre-existed Bethlehem. As Johann and I have mentioned, the Angel of the LORD is the Son. Not a created angel, but archangel... Literally head of the angels. Just a president Biden is chief of the armed forces, but it doesn't make him a soldier.
Jesus acted as the Father's messenger... Angel... Throughout the OT. Didn't make Him a created angel however... He created the angels a ministering spirits, which is why He is said to be above them. "Let all the angels of God worship Him", even as they worship the Father.