FOR - YOU - WHO - CLAIM - YOUR BORN AGAIN
- Thread starter Rabbi Reuben
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I see that you are willing to open up a topic that many are going to dislike. I'll bet you know that most everyone here will disagree.Come and explain exactly how this transpired.
I mean surely anyone who has actually been born again
would know all the details of what transpired
before and during and after it happened to them.
They would surely know things about it that
are not written in some book by another man?
If you are or have claimed to be born again
come tell us all about it.
Those asking that question... need to get born again!
If you "think" you have been born again... HOW did you get that done in your life?
And what does a "Rabbi" know about getting born again anyway?
I have so many brothers and sister because we have been adopted by the family of Yahweh by our belief in His Son. Sadly, we segregate ourselves in many denominations - each one claiming that the other ones are incorrect in their theology. In attending and leading scripture study groups, I have seen that unscriptural things are thought to be true with no justification. Those beliefs, which when believers are asked "why?", tended to be just something they were taught that they liked. I've had folks happy to learn something in our conversations and I've had people get up and leave.
We, as students of scripture, have to decide a few things BEFORE we study scripture. Scripture studies is difficult in that it takes prayer, time, and humility. May I suggest:
1. Genuine understanding and the conviction of truth comes from God - not man, not majority opinion, and certainly by choosing what we like. Pray for God to open your eyes, ears, and mind. Accept what Yahweh shows you. This is not as easy as I would wish, because we have to drive down our egos and humble ourselves - realizing we are not "all that and a bag of chips."
2. All scripture is true - in its original version. Our English translations? Not so much.
3. Scripture will not contradict itself. If something appears to be a contradiction, then there is something that we do not know yet. Many times, I find that our problem often comes from our not knowing the Hebrew culture and customs of the time when these passages were written.
4. Related to #3 is that we should never read just one of two passages and create a doctrine. The scriptures cover thousands of years at a time that we didn't exist with events that are unknown to use. Context, context, context... So very important.
5. Lastly, we must remember that scripture interprets itself. If you find yourself in a room of Theology scholars with PHD behind their names, be prepared for disagreement. Do NOT allow man to tell you what to believe. If our hearts and minds are open - and we let Him - God will tell you.
I said all this just so you know that if I participate further in this thread, allow yourself to look at the references I offer and ask God to guide your result. Since I tend to offer more scripture than opinion, your disagreements must come from scripture and not what you were at one time taught.
I hope we can remember that we are all in a different place in our Christian growth.
We, as students of scripture, have to decide a few things BEFORE we study scripture. Scripture studies is difficult in that it takes prayer, time, and humility. May I suggest:
1. Genuine understanding and the conviction of truth comes from God - not man, not majority opinion, and certainly by choosing what we like. Pray for God to open your eyes, ears, and mind. Accept what Yahweh shows you. This is not as easy as I would wish, because we have to drive down our egos and humble ourselves - realizing we are not "all that and a bag of chips."
2. All scripture is true - in its original version. Our English translations? Not so much.
3. Scripture will not contradict itself. If something appears to be a contradiction, then there is something that we do not know yet. Many times, I find that our problem often comes from our not knowing the Hebrew culture and customs of the time when these passages were written.
4. Related to #3 is that we should never read just one of two passages and create a doctrine. The scriptures cover thousands of years at a time that we didn't exist with events that are unknown to use. Context, context, context... So very important.
5. Lastly, we must remember that scripture interprets itself. If you find yourself in a room of Theology scholars with PHD behind their names, be prepared for disagreement. Do NOT allow man to tell you what to believe. If our hearts and minds are open - and we let Him - God will tell you.
I said all this just so you know that if I participate further in this thread, allow yourself to look at the references I offer and ask God to guide your result. Since I tend to offer more scripture than opinion, your disagreements must come from scripture and not what you were at one time taught.
I hope we can remember that we are all in a different place in our Christian growth.
mailmandan
Well-Known Member
To be born again is to be "born from above." 1 Peter 1:23 - having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever.
mailmandan
Well-Known Member
Ephesians 2:5 - even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, 7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.
The moment that we place our faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation we become born again. I will never forget on October 11, 1998, when I placed my faith in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and knew without a doubt that I had become born again. What really blew my mind after becoming born again is how everything that people had explained to me about the gospel prior to that (which made no sense to me as an unbeliever) now made perfect sense and I remember saying to myself, "that's what he was trying to tell me, that's what she meant, that's what they were trying to say to me." It's like the light finally came on and scripture came alive to me as well. Praise God!
Perhaps we should look at the tenses of the verbs in passage?
In all of these, our new birth happens when Yeshua comes back (we receive an actual new body). (Yes, I know that there are those who equate justification as the New Birth but I see only "raised up a new creature in Christ") But, until then, we receive the indwelling spirit of God to teach us, convict us, and help us get through the life we now live. Being "saved" has tenses. All of us are now "being saved." But, our hope is that "we endure to the end" so that we will be saved. When Jesus returns and we receive our glorified bodies, that will be our new birth without corruption as it was before Adam sinned. Consider how we live now knowing that this world is not our home. We are not yet "born again." We are merely justified and seeking to know God more fully and serving him with our actions (sanctified).
I realize that all this goes against what churches today teach. Please consider, if we are already "born-again", we would no longer have to go in front of God to see if our names are in the Lamb's Book of Life. But, as we know, we still battle sin in our lives. Please just prayerfully ponder these with an open mind.
1 Jn 3:2 Beloved, we are God’s children now (present tense), and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is.
1 Th 4:16–17 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.
2 Co 5:1–5 For in this tent we groan, longing to put on our heavenly dwelling, if indeed by putting it on we may not be found naked. For while we are still in this tent, we groan, being burdened—not that we would be unclothed, but that we would be further clothed, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who has given us the Spirit as a guarantee. (We have God's spirit to help us to "endure to the end.")
1 Co 15:42–46 So is it with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable; what is raised is imperishable. It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness; it is raised in power. It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. Thus it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit. But it is not the spiritual that is first but the natural, and then the spiritual.
Re 3:3–5 Yet you have still a few names in Sardis, people who have not soiled their garments, and they will walk with me (future tense) in white, for they are worthy. 5 The one who conquers will be clothed (future) thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father and before his angels.
Jn 6:39–40 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”
1 Co 15:22–23 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive. But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ.
Php 3:20–21 But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself.
Ro 6:3–5 Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life. For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his.
In all of these, our new birth happens when Yeshua comes back (we receive an actual new body). (Yes, I know that there are those who equate justification as the New Birth but I see only "raised up a new creature in Christ") But, until then, we receive the indwelling spirit of God to teach us, convict us, and help us get through the life we now live. Being "saved" has tenses. All of us are now "being saved." But, our hope is that "we endure to the end" so that we will be saved. When Jesus returns and we receive our glorified bodies, that will be our new birth without corruption as it was before Adam sinned. Consider how we live now knowing that this world is not our home. We are not yet "born again." We are merely justified and seeking to know God more fully and serving him with our actions (sanctified).
I realize that all this goes against what churches today teach. Please consider, if we are already "born-again", we would no longer have to go in front of God to see if our names are in the Lamb's Book of Life. But, as we know, we still battle sin in our lives. Please just prayerfully ponder these with an open mind.
1 Jn 3:2 Beloved, we are God’s children now (present tense), and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is.
1 Th 4:16–17 For the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a cry of command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the sound of the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we will always be with the Lord.
2 Co 5:1–5 For in this tent we groan, longing to put on our heavenly dwelling, if indeed by putting it on we may not be found naked. For while we are still in this tent, we groan, being burdened—not that we would be unclothed, but that we would be further clothed, so that what is mortal may be swallowed up by life. He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who has given us the Spirit as a guarantee. (We have God's spirit to help us to "endure to the end.")
1 Co 15:42–46 So is it with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable; what is raised is imperishable. It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness; it is raised in power. It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. Thus it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit. But it is not the spiritual that is first but the natural, and then the spiritual.
Re 3:3–5 Yet you have still a few names in Sardis, people who have not soiled their garments, and they will walk with me (future tense) in white, for they are worthy. 5 The one who conquers will be clothed (future) thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father and before his angels.
Jn 6:39–40 And this is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose nothing of all that he has given me, but raise it up on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.”
1 Co 15:22–23 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive. But each in his own order: Christ the firstfruits, then at his coming those who belong to Christ.
Php 3:20–21 But our citizenship is in heaven, and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself.
Ro 6:3–5 Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life. For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his.
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