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I don't think that you understand either his or my views, and I wish you'd just let me speak for myself.
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
Joel Cairo (Peter Lorre) from "The Maltese Falcon"
Victorian era was even better. Best modern speakers and writers for Christ. Moody, Spurgeon. E.M. Bounds, etc.
No one has to be told to love themself. We all do. The unnatural part is to love others, and love God.
Much love!
I'm not sure what you mean here.
I see justification as being our death in Christ, which removes is from the corrupt man of flesh, and our resurrection in Him, which is our rebirth as a child of God. I don't see these in a technical sense, rather, an actual, practical sense. In Paul's words, the one who has died as been justified away from sin (Rom 6).
We've been forgiven of all our sins, and we've been recreated righteous and holy.
Much love!
In the past, you've said that you don't commit what you call "willful sin", but might commit what you call "unintentional sins". It sounds to my ear now that you are expressing that you commit no sin at all, so I'm asking for confirmation of that, or if I'm misunderstanding.
Much love!
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
I speak for you, because you are confused when it comes to thinking yourself on the same page as Behold. You are NOT.
You speak for me, because I'm not capable to speak for myself?
What do you think of me? What do you think of yourself? You set yourself over me as the judge of my mind?
What is it that Behold teaches? I can put his central theme into a couple of sentences, accurately. Can you? Can you do that with my view? I've asked this for some time, now, it seems to be ignored.
I really think it's important to understand someone's view if you want to discuss it intelligently.
As it stands, you don't even think I know my own mind, and you do?
Much love!
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
Only God knows the TRUTH about me, but I don't have anything on my conscience. I have very few friends alive who live here so I don't go out. So no arguments. And my knowledge is such that I am mature. marks when you really understand and apply 2 Peter 1:2-11, you will never stumble.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
I completely agree, that only God knows for sure. I also happen to think that our conscience will not be always accurate, which of course must be true if only God knows for sure.
And for these reasons, I think that the entire discussion of whether the Christian sins or not to be academic. Because at the end of the day, none us can say with any real certainty, today I did not sin.
I see this as part of the Way Things Are. We do not know completely, so therefore, if we are to make the argument that no one knows for sure whether they've committed sin or not, that means that no one could know whether they are a child of God or not.
And that's the error of legalism. Because over and over the Bible shows that we can have certainty.
If you go by faith and grace, we are His. If you go by what you perceive or think of yours or others behavior, you will never know, at best. Your confidence in Christ will only be as good as your confidence in your own sinlessness.
Much love!
CharismaticLady said: ↑
I speak for you, because you are confused when it comes to thinking yourself on the same page as Behold. You are NOT.
So then . . . is it because I wasn't posting at the time, or because I'm confused?
It's an excellent thing to commit Scripture to memory; it can thus be blessed in the years and decades ahead....
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
You throw "legalism" at me thinking it will stick. Left to my old nature I would have to work in my old strength (not!) to be holy. But I've been literally born again, and filled with His power, and even felt it happen, so my assurance is sure according to 1 John 3:18-24.
According to my new nature I do what comes naturally. Going against your old nature is legalism. Can you honestly not see the difference?
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
Justification is the erasing of our sin(s) replaced with Christ's constant righteousness (righteous acts or works) throughout his eathly sojourn, nothing more, nothing less. It is a zero-sum transaction, if you will. We agree to trade our bad stuff for His good stuff. Period.
And for every eight people who make this statement, you'll get nine different explanations.
People base their doctrines almost entirely on the writings of Paul. Just do a scan of the board some time and you'll see what I mean (if you haven't already). Much of what he writes is very straightforward. But much of it isn't. The folks he wrote to were in the midst of a philosophical renaissance unlike the world has ever seen. So even the lower classes of the Northern and Eastern Mediterranean possessed very sophisticated (confused/over-complicated) knowledge and thought processes. Paul was an extremely intelligent and very highly-educated person. He was especially qualified to deal with their sophistry. Peter warns in his 2nd epistle that Paul writes some things that are hard to understand. Yet we of the modern and post-modern era largely believe ourselves to be above this pitfall. He even goes so far as to say that untaught and unstable folks twist his writings to cause their own destruction. That's pretty heavy talk. Most people think that untaught and unstable means stupid and crazy. I don't think so. I think it means inexperienced and not well-established in the faith. And if other parts of Scripture are to be believed, we could probably all of us put ourselves into at least 1 of those 2 categories if we're being humble enough. My attitude is that over the years I've learned just enough to realize that I don't know much of anything compared to what is yet available for me to learn from the bible. So I tread very lightly where there are arguments over what Paul is saying in a given passage. Just my two cents' worth.
Justification by faith is also seen in the Old Testament.Justification is the erasing of our sin(s) replaced with Christ's constant righteousness (righteous acts or works) throughout his eathly sojourn, nothing more, nothing less. It is a zero-sum transaction, if you will. We agree to trade our bad stuff for His good stuff. Period.
And for every eight people who make this statement, you'll get nine different explanations.
People base their doctrines almost entirely on the writings of Paul. Just do a scan of the board some time and you'll see what I mean (if you haven't already). Much of what he writes is very straightforward. But much of it isn't. The folks he wrote to were in the midst of a philosophical renaissance unlike the world has ever seen. So even the lower classes of the Northern and Eastern Mediterranean possessed very sophisticated (confused/over-complicated) knowledge and thought processes. Paul was an extremely intelligent and very highly-educated person. He was especially qualified to deal with their sophistry. Peter warns in his 2nd epistle that Paul writes some things that are hard to understand. Yet we of the modern and post-modern era largely believe ourselves to be above this pitfall. He even goes so far as to say that untaught and unstable folks twist his writings to cause their own destruction. That's pretty heavy talk. Most people think that untaught and unstable means stupid and crazy. I don't think so. I think it means inexperienced and not well-established in the faith. And if other parts of Scripture are to be believed, we could probably all of us put ourselves into at least 1 of those 2 categories if we're being humble enough. My attitude is that over the years I've learned just enough to realize that I don't know much of anything compared to what is yet available for me to learn from the bible. So I tread very lightly where there are arguments over what Paul is saying in a given passage. Just my two cents' worth.
CharismaticLady
Well-Known Member
You are only confused about Behold. His posts are frothy but there is one doctrine of his that makes grace a license to sin. I don't believe you believe like that. You agree with him that a Christian doesn't sin. But what you don't see is that he believes the actions of the flesh that a Christian may commit (that used to be SIN) are not sin anymore, because Jesus has all your sins. (while you are committing them). Except Behold doesn't call those actions sins.
BarneyFife
Well-Known Member
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