Grace

[marks]

@David H.

Do you believe that you can live santified now, today, by trusting Jesus to make it so for you, now, today?

I've never been able to find your answer to this question.

Much love!

1 Corinthians 1:27-31 KJV
27) But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;
28) And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:
29) That no flesh should glory in his presence.
30) But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
31) That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

As we walk in the Spirit, the fruit of the Spirit is in our lives. We love, we rejoice, we rest, we believe, we are gentle, patient, kind, and we walk in His works. We love the truth, we love unity, we love each other, because that's the Spirit Who is in us.

This passage is much like in Romans 4, that "Abraham was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God".

This passage is also much like in Galatians 2, "I've been co-crucified with Christ, yet I live, yet not I, but Christ lives in me".

2 Corinthians 4, "that the life of Jesus may be made manifest in our body", that people can see the life of Jesus when they look at me.

Not that I become more alive in Jesus, but that this life which I have now may be seen in me.

Not that I become more crucified in Christ, but that I will live according to this truth.

In looking for a "second work of grace", it's as if this isn't enough.

What we need is to be conformed in our thoughts and behavior to our new creation. We don't need newer creation. We are already alive in Christ. We need our minds to be renewed in the knowledge of Him, being transformed by the renewing of our minds, not being transformed by more sanctification.

Again, this idea of progressive sanctification describes the perceived process as our minds are renewed. We learn to think according to Scripture, and this produces in us the correct thinking, and the fruitful works, and as these increase, some call it "progressive sanctification".

My objection to that terminology is that it gives the impression that we're not already sanctified, and therefore lack the ability to live holy lives. I believe as I trust Jesus to give me His holy living, that is what He does.

I find that I'm inconsistent with this, but as the years go by, my consistency increases. And as I've learned, no matter when or to where I've fallen, by trusting in Jesus, I'm immediately restored. Because in fact the only restoration needed is in my own heart and mind. Jesus has already reconciled me to God.

Repentance is turning from the world to God, from sin to God, from the flesh to God, and then we are reborn. We are born from above, sharing our Father's nature, and we are learning to live that way.

Much love!

 

[Miss Hepburn]

All I have to add is when Grace happens to you ---there are no words...in fact,
you may be breathless.
It is sudden and seems out of the blue...and is profound and deeply humbling...leaving
you speechless and in a state of gratitude and reverence for a VERY long time.
I wish this heavenly gift for everyone.

 

[David H.]

Do you believe that you can live santified now, today, by trusting Jesus to make is so for you, now, today?

I've never been able to find your answer to this question.

I Have answered this question many times for you, you just do not like my answer. @ Salvation, when we are born again we are instantly sanctified what happens after that is called progressive sanctification, where the vessel is made holy unto the LORD, which is a lifelong process. We Grow in Grace. It is really quite simple and common sense, we become his workmanship after we are born again (Ephesians 2:10) and follow the path to sainthood that all believers follow.

But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work. (2 Timothy 2:20-21)

Which type of vessel do you want to be in the kingdom of God?

 

[marks]

I Have answered this question many times for you, you just do not like my answer. @ Salvation, when we are born again we are instantly sanctified what happens after that is called progressive sanctification, where the vessel is made holy unto the LORD, which is a lifelong process. We Grow in Grace. It is really quite simple and common sense, we become his workmanship after we are born again (Ephesians 2:10) and follow the path to sainthood that all believers follow.

But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work. (2 Timothy 2:20-21)

Which type of vessel do you want to be in the kingdom of God?

I've never seen you say yes or no to this. But the way you write tells me you do not at all believe that IF you were to get up this morning trusting that Jesus will live through you to produce that good life in you TODAY, that you would be able to live that good life TODAY.

I'd like to suggest that you relook at this, and realize, well, what did Jesus say so many times? Be it to you according to your faith.

I've found that to be true. The only impediment to righteous living which I've found is when I have a lack of faith. When I feel defeated I'm not trusting Him. When I am trusting Him I'm never defeated.

You can test this right now, at this very moment.

Accept fully the fact that God has reconciled you to Himself, and that He will never never let you go. Accept fully the fact the Holy Spirit is in you and wants to give you holy living, and is able to. Accept fully the fact that your new creation spirit is a full and willing participant with God to have this life.

The relax in these truths, rest, and fellowship with you Maker as one who is fully pleasing to Him. And see what you life becomes.



We truly have been given all we need. IF only we would just believe!

Much love!

 

[David H.]

I've never seen you say yes or no to this. But the way you write tells me you do not at all believe that IF you were to get up this morning trusting that Jesus will live through you to produce that good life in you TODAY, that you would be able to live that good life TODAY.

I'd like to suggest that you relook at this, and realize, well, what did Jesus say so many times? Be it to you according to your faith.

I've found that to be true. The only impediment to righteous living which I've found is when I have a lack of faith. When I feel defeated I'm not trusting Him. When I am trusting Him I'm never defeated.

You can test this right now, at this very moment.

Accept fully the fact that God has reconciled you to Himself, and that He will never never let you go. Accept fully the fact the Holy Spirit is in you and wants to give you holy living, and is able to. Accept fully the fact that your new creation spirit is a full and willing participant with God to have this life.

The relax in these truths, rest, and fellowship with you Maker as one who is fully pleasing to Him. And see what you life becomes.



We truly have been given all we need. IF only we would just believe!

You, My friend, are sitting at the starting line of the race not knowing which direction to run. What you say is true, but it is merely the start of the journey, You have to take the step or leap as the case may be of faith. Once we learn to rest in His finished work, we can begin to trust in His providence, this is the LIFE he offers us you need to embrace and live that life.

You will find as you take this journey, that there are all kinds of skeletons in your closet that He will make you aware of and that each time you find you must come to repentance as he cleans the vessel and makes it holy. He will expose what is in your darkest recesses, sins you are unaware of that the sinful heart of men do, and he will clean you from the inside out, But if you continue in the Laodicean delusion that you are in need of nothing then he will not work in you.

Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. (Hebrews 12:1-2)

 

[marks]

You, My friend, are sitting at the starting line of the race not knowing which direction to run.

Hardly!

And, I'm pretty much done talking about myself to you. I'm not that interested in myself.

I'll try to find in your posts content to respond to, but all of your presumptions and assumptions about me, I'm just going to ignore from here on out, I'm thinking.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
You, My friend, are sitting at the starting line of the race not knowing which direction to run. What you say is true, but it is merely the start of the journey, You have to take the step or leap as the case may be of faith. Once we learn to rest in His finished work, we can begin to trust in His providence, this is the LIFE he offers us you need to embrace and live that life.

You will find as you take this journey, that there are all kinds of skeletons in your closet that He will make you aware of and that each time you find you must come to repentance as he cleans the vessel and makes it holy. He will expose what is in your darkest recesses, sins you are unaware of that the sinful heart of men do, and he will clean you from the inside out, But if you continue in the Laodicean delusion that you are in need of nothing then he will not work in you.

Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. (Hebrews 12:1-2)

Wonderful passage! There are so many who have gone in faith before us! We have the ability to "lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us,"

Do you believe this? Are you able to lay aside every weight and every sin and run your race? Or are you still trying untangle from sins? You will know the truth, and the truth shall set you free. He whom the Son makes free is free indeed! How free is free indeed?

Jesus begins our faith, and Jesus completes our faith. You don't have to struggle for faith, rather live by the faith of Jesus Christ. His faith in you.

He endured, because He knew - faith so certain it is knowledge - he endured even though He hated it. And we can do the same. Not be determination of will to behave badly, but by determination of will to trust Him.

It sound's like you are pointing to this passage to say we run for the prize of more faith, more santification. But look again at the words.

We're called to Lay aside every weight, and sin that entangles us. Can we?

Seriously, can we? Or are we waiting for something to happen?

OK, we can be waiting for something to happen, and it will, if all we are doing is waiting, and not trusting. Chastisment. However, you DO have the option to simply take God at His word, and lay aside those weights. Do you want to?

Much love!

 

[David H.]

Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. (Hebrews 12:1-2)

Wonderful passage! There are so many who have gone in faith before us! We have the ability to "lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us,"

Do you believe this? Are you able to lay aside every weight and every sin and run your race? Or are you still trying untangle from sins? You will know the truth, and the truth shall set you free. He whom the Son makes free is free indeed! How free is free indeed?

Jesus begins our faith, and Jesus completes our faith. You don't have to struggle for faith, rather live by the faith of Jesus Christ. His faith in you.

He endured, because He knew - faith so certain it is knowledge - he endured even though He hated it. And we can do the same. Not be determination of will to behave badly, but by determination of will to trust Him.

It sound's like you are pointing to this passage to say we run for the prize of more faith, more santification. But look again at the words.

We're called to Lay aside every weight, and sin that entangles us. Can we?

Seriously, can we? Or are we waiting for something to happen?

OK, we can be waiting for something to happen, and it will, if all we are doing is waiting, and not trusting. Chastisment. However, you DO have the option to simply take God at His word, and lay aside those waits. Do you want to?

It is a wonderful passage indeed, as it is clear that Jesus is both the Author and finisher of our faith. A Lot of people like him to be the author of the faith but do not let him be the finisher, instead they wish to do so by their own strength and will, But it is he who is the finisher.... they are the legalists amongst us.
Others accept him as the author, but do not allow him to be the finisher, Instead they never run the race in the first place, They stop at the author part...these are the lawless ones amongst us that never grow in the grace of God.

In My opinion, your error lies in the following assumption:
"You don't have to struggle for faith," This is flat out anti biblical.... for example:
Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience. (James 1:3) In Other words our faith is tried, or tested, and that trial yields patience...
As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving. (Colossians 2:6-7) Our faith is BUILT UP, it grows and is established, it does not come effortlessly....

You may want to study what the Patience and the faith is as this is what you fail to see. I Highly suggest you read these verses and let the Holy Spirit teach you....
See Revelation 13:10, Revelation 14:12, Revelation 2:19, Hebrews 6:12, 2 Thessalonians 1:4-10

It is clear to me now where our difference lies, and this is it, faith for you is a one time thing, for me it is a way of living a way of life to be walked in. (For we walk by faith, not by sight) (2 Corinthians 5:7)

 

[Behold]

In My opinion,

Well, you were finally honest.

You just told us that everything you say and believe is "your opinion".
And God knows that's the reality.

No doubt you'll be happy to share more of your opinion theology for the rest of your life.
Its why you are here.

 

[marks]

"You don't have to struggle for faith,"

People do struggle, I know that. But you can choose to believe. I don't have time now, but at the end of the day, it's about getting us to that point of rejoicing and expectation. You can get there by tribulations, and you can get there by choosing to believe what He has written.

But God has given us absolutely everything we need for life and Godliness. He really has!

Much love!

 

[marks]

It is clear to me now where our difference lies, and this is it, faith for you is a one time thing, for me it is a way of living a way of life to be walked in. (For we walk by faith, not by sight) (2 Corinthians 5:7)

Again, you show by your words you don't have the first idea about me.

I'm trying to convince you to take up that faith now, and walk in it now, and you come back to me to say, "I see now you don't walk in faith . . ."

I'm just going to camp out on a couple of points here.

2 Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,
3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:
4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

We have everything we need now, we just need to trust that, and walk in it.

8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power:

What more are you waiting for?

God will do whatever He needs, chastise, woo, to draw you into this walk of faith, renewing the mind by believing these things are true and living accordingly.

You will pull your hand from the flame because you believe it will hurt you, and it will. When you believe that God receives you RIGHT NOW His oh so beloved son, you will live according to that belief. When you believe that God has given you freedom from sin RIGHT NOW you will live free from sin.

Just like you believe food will nourish you, so you eat it, and you believe poison will kill you, so you don't eat it.

If you believe Jesus in you frees you from sin, and you believe that you aren't the one who wants to sin, that's your flesh, then you walk away from sin, and walk in His good works.

This is the life Jesus gives to us. Let's live it.

No waiting.

Much love!

 

[marks]

It is clear to me now where our difference lies, and this is it, faith for you is a one time thing, for me it is a way of living a way of life to be walked in. (For we walk by faith, not by sight) (2 Corinthians 5:7)

I think the difference is . . . you think that we cannot live sanctified today, and I think that we can. You think that trusting Jesus for a sanctified life today won't work, and I think it does.

Much love!

 

[David H.]

I think the difference is . . . you think that we cannot live sanctified today, and I think that we can. You think that trusting Jesus for a sanctified life today won't work, and I think it does.

I Just know sanctification is a lifelong process. Read my post from A.B. Simpson as sometimes you need to hear from a different source other than the one you arguing with.... Grace for grace: A.B. Simpson From "A Larger Christian Life" | Christian Forums @ Christianity Board

Are you yourself free from sin? If not, then you are still in the process of being made Holy, correct? It really is as simple as that.

My experience in life and faith is that once a certain sin is overcome in my life, the Holy Spirit exposes another in me that has been affecting my fellowship with him, and quenching the Spirit. But when you are hungering and thirsting for righteousness, those sins are quickly overcome... hence the term overcomers. Sins like the pride of life being some of the most difficult to overcome....

God bless

 

[marks]

Are you yourself free from sin? If not, then you are still in the process of being made Holy, correct? It really is as simple as that.

Renewing the mind. That's the Biblical terminology, and doesn't confuse what sanctification actually is.

I am holy in Christ, not in my good behavior. Improving my behavior does not make me more holy, it only shows the holiness of Christ in my life.

Much love!

 

[David H.]

Renewing the mind. That's the Biblical terminology, and doesn't confuse what sanctification actually is.

I am holy in Christ, not in my good behavior. Improving my behavior does not make me more holy, it only shows the holiness of Christ in my life.

Yes, we have the righteousness of Christ imputed upon us, But that is not an excuse for sinning that is known as turning the grace of God into Lasciviousness. (Jude 1:4)
I Noticed you did not answer the question, How come? I will ask again....

Are you yourself free from sin? If not, then you are still in the process of being made Holy, correct? It really is as simple as that.

 

[marks]

My experience in life and faith is that once a certain sin is overcome in my life, the Holy Spirit exposes another in me that has been affecting my fellowship with him, and quenching the Spirit. But when you are hungering and thirsting for righteousness, those sins are quickly overcome... hence the term overcomers. Sins like the pride of life being some of the most difficult to overcome....

God bless

In my experience of life, we "build our character" as our minds are renewed, and more readily do those things which please God. What I mean by "building our character", we choose with determination to resist the flesh, and as we feel the tug of it's appetites, we force ourselves to not yield, no matter how hard they pull. As we continue in this we get better at it, more effective. It's good, it's what we are to do. To me, it's comparable to keeping the Law until Faith comes.

However . . .

When we are fully trusting Him, fully focused on Him, fully cognizent that He lives in us, we can walk in His Spirit, and not do the works of the flesh. Not have those evil thoughts. Not feel those inappropriate emotions. Not do those things that are not expedient. Not want those things the flesh hungers for.

I've spent so much of my life trying to improve my character, my ability to resist the evil in my flesh by the force of my Godly will. What I've discovered is that the battle is already won, and faith takes me straight to that victory.

So you say that we become more sanctified, but I say we learn to walk in the sanctification He has given us.

In my view, we have sanctification available to us RIGHT NOW. In your view we do not. In my life, I know that as I trust Jesus, NOTHING of the flesh controls me. I am a child of my Father.

And even when I see in myself the evil my flesh wants to do, the fear or anger that my flesh feels, it's not me. And I don't feel that way. And I don't have to do those things. I have liberty.

Much love!

 

[marks]

In My opinion, your error lies in the following assumption:
"You don't have to struggle for faith," This is flat out anti biblical.... for example:
Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience. (James 1:3) In Other words our faith is tried, or tested, and that trial yields patience...
As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving. (Colossians 2:6-7) Our faith is BUILT UP, it grows and is established, it does not come effortlessly....

You say, we have to struggle for faith, and you show this passage, that the testing of your faith works patience. So here in this passage, you aren't gaining faith, you are gaining endurance. You already have faith. Your faith is being tested. And the testing of the faith that you already have produces patience.


As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith,

You wrote, our faith is built up, but the passage you quote says that WE are built up, we are rooted and built up in Him, and established in the faith.

The testing of your faith shows that it is genuine.

1 Peter 1:6-9 YLT
6) in which ye are glad, a little now, if it be necessary, being made to sorrow in manifold trials,
7) that the proof of your faith—much more precious than of gold that is perishing, and through fire being approved—may be found to praise, and honour, and glory, in the revelation of Jesus Christ,
8) whom, not having seen, ye love, in whom, now not seeing and believing, ye are glad with joy unspeakable and glorified,
9) receiving the end of your faith—salvation of souls;

I think what is important is that we come to realize that our faith is the faith of Christ, just like the Bible says, and that what we really need is to understand the reality of our new creation, and that we are truly freed from sin, that by trusting Jesus, we can live in love, and joy, and peace, and all the rest, right down to self-control.

Feeling the Love, feeling the Joy, thinking good things, doing good things, living a life of love and peace.

It's what we want, it's what Jesus died for us to have, it's what God intends for us to know. Trials come to bring us to this place. Chastisement, the same thing, and afterward, the peaceable fruits of righteousness.

I can fight against temptation and the flesh, and spend years trying to deal with it. Or I can believe my freedom from sin, freedom from the flesh, Christ's power in me, His Spirit empowering my life, and go straight to victory. Overcoming through faith.

The body may scream! But the spirit remains in control. Through faith.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Are you yourself free from sin? If not, then you are still in the process of being made Holy, correct? It really is as simple as that.

Romans 6:6-7 YLT
6) this knowing, that our old man was crucified with him , that the body of the sin may be made useless, for our no longer serving the sin;
7) for he who hath died hath been set free from the sin.

Romans 6:11-12 YLT
11) so also ye, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to the sin, and living to God in Jesus Christ our Lord.
12) Let not then the sin reign in your mortal body, to obey it in its desires;

Romans 6:17-18 YLT
17) and thanks to God, that ye were servants of the sin, and—were obedient from the heart to the form of teaching to which ye were delivered up;
18) and having been freed from the sin, ye became servants to the righteousness.

The question is not, have we been freed from sin, we have. The question is, can we believe this is true?

Much love!

 

[David H.]

Romans 6:17-18 YLT
17) and thanks to God, that ye were servants of the sin, and—were obedient from the heart to the form of teaching to which ye were delivered up;
18) and having been freed from the sin, ye became servants to the righteousness.

The question is not, have we been freed from sin, we have. The question is, can we believe this is true?

It's the part about becoming servants to righteousness that is my focus here. Progressive sanctification yields the Fruit of the Spirit in our lives.

In my experience of life, we "build our character" as our minds are renewed, and more readily do those things which please God. What I mean by "building our character", we choose with determination to resist the flesh, and as we feel the tug of it's appetites, we force ourselves to not yield, no matter how hard they pull. As we continue in this we get better at it, more effective. It's good, it's what we are to do. To me, it's comparable to keeping the Law until Faith comes.

What ever term you use, it is the same thing as Progressive sanctification.... "Building our character", "renewing our mind" these are all parts of progressive sanctification. It is all God working in us and through us.

So you say that we become more sanctified, but I say we learn to walk in the sanctification He has given us.

Again it is the same thing, and you are mischaracterizing what I believe in this statement. Read the Post again from A.B. Simpson that I posted. Learning to walk in the sanctification is progressive sanctification. I Do not understand why you are so hung up on not being able to accept this term it is biblical and theological, and an accepted doctrine in most evangelical denominations. The Only ones who do not believe this are the ones using the grace of God as an excuse to live sinfully turning the grace of God into lasciviousness.

The fundamental difference is the legalist seeks to suppress the flesh by their own will and strength, I am not promoting that, for eventually you will fail. The Key to overcoming sin is learning to become a servant of righteousness, Thus focusing on the fruit of the Spirit...."against such there is no law." (Galatians 5:23) Fruit grows hence the analogy used in scripture.... These are the things we "Add to our faith" as Peter Spoke of (2 Peter 1:5-10) This is "Building our character" when it comes down to it.

The solution to the sin problem and learning to overcome sin is as simple as letting go and letting God. It is counter intuitive, because it involves NOT trying of our own will and strength But instead yielding and submitting to the will of God.... These are "bad words" in modern culture, Submission is seen as a form of bondage, But what I found out is this is the most liberating thing we can do for God is merciful and gracious to those who are submitted to Him, a Humble and contrite heart Being precious to Him. (Psalm 51:17, Psalm 34:18)

For me personally, My focus turned from fighting to yielding and submitting in 2007 in the midst of the housing crisis... ( I was a builder by trade). I Cried out to him, in brokenness and repentance that night and rededicated my life to him, and began this Journey.... it was a journey. I Wanted to serve Him, and as I studied the Word, and was taught by the Holy Spirit, I started to change. I Was a "social drinker" and my focus was not on changing that, as I quite enjoyed that, But the more my desire became to serve him, the less desire I had to drink, till one day in 2010 I had my last drink..... I Did not try to stop drinking, He replaced my desire to drink with the desire to be a servant of righteousness.... In Fact I did not even realize that my desire had gone for drinking And that I had not had a drink for some time after that last drink.... The thing is, I do not even miss drinking any longer, and I Know it was not me who changed this in my heart, But God working in me cleansing me. When He cleanses the heart the desire for sin is totally gone. Not like the A.A. Statement "once an alcoholic always an alcoholic" of someone who is suppressing their desire by their own will and strength. This is real victory, and there is no turning back (Backsliding).

This is so counter intuitive to what religion thinks is the way to holiness and sanctification. It is not about suppressing the flesh... for we fight not against flesh and blood.... But about submitting to God. (James 4:7-10, 2 Corinthians 10:3-5, Ephesians 6:11-12) Read those verses carefully.... For Satan fights from 2 towers, legalism and lawlessness, when you suppress the flesh he wins because he knows you are not strong enough and will fail, or worse become condemning and proud of your accomplishments. But when we bring every thought captive to the obedience of Christ There is victory, and the fruit of the Spirit is produced. So Yes, renewing the mind is part of it, changing the focus from fighting to submitting and becoming a servant of righteousness.... For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. (Ephesians 2:10)

 

[marks]

What ever term you use, it is the same thing as Progressive sanctification.... "Building our character", "renewing our mind" these are all parts of progressive sanctification. It is all God working in us and through us.

OK, it's all good. We're talking about the same thing, I'm sure, only, I'm using Biblical terminology and you are using popular terminology.

Much love!

 

[marks]

I Do not understand why you are so hung up on not being able to accept this term it is biblical and theological, and an accepted doctrine in most evangelical denominations.

Some use it, and some don't, but the Bible does not.

And it give the wrong idea to anyone who knows what the words mean. We are not becoming more holy by living better lifes. We are made holy, and because of that we are able to be trained to live better lives.

That's the difference.

For me, words have their own meanings. But if in fact we are sanctified in our rebirth in Christ, this term "progressive sanctification" is wholey innacurate.

Much love!