"Have you ever had a spiritual paranormal encounter?"

[bbyrd009]

Everything from children to adults, and from illiterates to the highest intelligence, is "done with much intention".
What counts is the godly 'calibre of judgement' that is employed.

ok now dont take this wrong ok, but note that while you say that, you are making a bad sentence construction deal? "Everything" should go with actions, but you tie it to ppl, instead of "everyone," see, thus mooting your point entirely. Which totally not a big deal, dont get me wrong, i point it out bc Scriptural dialectics kinda follow the same pattern imo, novel phrases that may be read diff ways

 

[bbyrd009]

and i dont know about yall, but i have def hucked off a couple cornices in my day without much of what yall seem to be defining as "intention."
(Is that the same as "conviction?")

 

[bbyrd009]

It seems to me that the main form of evangelism of these people is to deny the supernatural so as to ensure we don't get all excited about Jesus.
After all, they don't want people to get the idea that Jesus is someone who is not normal and natural or is supernaturally powerful.

if you run across any more of them lemme know? ty
Jesus of Nazareth
John Doe, from Nowhere

I said "you are elohim"

 

[Mike Waters]

ok now dont take this wrong ok, but note that while you say that, you are making a bad sentence construction deal? "Everything" should go with actions, but you tie it to ppl, instead of "everyone," see, thus mooting your point entirely. Which totally not a big deal, dont get me wrong, i point it out bc Scriptural dialectics kinda follow the same pattern imo, novel phrases that may be read diff ways

So are you reckoning that I should have said "Everyone........is "done with much intention"?
That's grammatical nonsense in my book.

 

[bbyrd009]

So are you reckoning that I should have said "Everyone........is "done with much intention"?
That's grammatical nonsense in my book.

as is "everything..." rather than "everyone, from children to adults..." right, but also i might be misunderstanding you at "intention," too, dunno. Obv many things are done completely unintended too, yeh? No intention at all

i post again to point out that "someone counted 667," right, and also to invoke the Scriptural concept of "all three must (should) agree," which i have brought up before here but it doesnt get much traction usually

I doubt we will ever break through the exaggerated scriptural misrepresentation promoted by the various Post Reformation Statements of Faith, such as that of the Evangelical Alliance. Everyone fails to recognise that 300 years ago we were still in the infancy of "the age of enlightenment" when many newbie Protestants were still extremely illiterate and 'fair game' for the primitive ultra fundamentalist influence that has 'stuck' ever since.

i mean fwiw i pretty much agree to both here; not sure what you are trying to say with the "intention" thing i guess

This was done with much intention.

 

[Enow]

Now that's where I go wrong... big time.
I'm always so anti those who experience what I just cannot understand.

The apostle John did warn believers to not believe every spirit but test them in 1 John 4:1 and I believe that test is knowing the Holy Spirit is in you ( John 14:16-17 ) as it is the examination of our faith ( 2 Corinthians 13:5 ) since you had been saved at the calling of the gospel when you first believed in Jesus Christ so that when a spirit doe come over you or a believer later on in life, you can discern that was not the real Holy Spirit as in greater is He that is in you than he that is in the world" as per 1 John 4:4. They may even wind up speaking in a supernatural tongue which is babbling nonsense or gibberish that can be found in the world as 1 John 4:5-6 also testifies of and did exists before Pentecost came with God's gift of tongues which is a foreign language to speak unto the people; 1 Corinthians 14:20-21 It may come with other sensational signs in the flesh where believers fall back in a loss of self control or do other outwardly acts of confusion which God is not the author of as per 1 Corinthians 14:32-33.

Basically, we can test the spirits and these "extra" supernatural phenomenon that may come over a believer later on in life as a saved believer by the written scriptures. So you are not missing out on anything when the focus is not on Jesus Christ but on seeking after the visitations of those spirits. The real indwelling Hoy Ghost will always keep the spotlight on Christ Jesus in testifying of Him in seeking His glory. The spirit of the antichrist wishes to take that spotlight off of Christ and unwittingly, the believers are serving something else in the glory of that and not the Lord Jesus Christ in seeking His glory.

 

[faithfulness]

That's it. The opposite of chaos is not control ("get smart" notwithstanding). Chaos needs order not control. The church is to provide order. Control is going way too far. Quenching the Spirit.

I’m coming up from behind you, in understanding God’s definition of ‘order’ in the context of “God is not the author of confusion (chaos) but of peace...
let everything be done decently and in order”.

Between instruction to ’let the women keep silence according to the law, to mention of the prophet and prophecy..anyone can see by reading the letter, where or in whom God places/provides His order for His church.

Oh that there were such a heart in them, that they would fear me, and keep my commandments always, that it might be well with them, and with their children ...

 

[hermeneutics]

I'm asking this to further test out my own 'odd ball' situation.

BUT
I have never "enjoyed anything remotely resembling a 'Road to Damascus' conversion".
Is that the reason why I appear to some to be an 'Intellectual Believer' without a Saving Faith?
What say you all?
Have you ever had a Paranormal Spiritual Encounter?
Met Christ Face to Face?
Seen a blinding light?
Enjoyed a life changing moment?
Experienced a Reincarnation?

These points can and do take place. The most likely times that God will make himself known to one, is when they sit down and read the bible daily. When you have read it all, start over again, and then again.

 

[Enow]

These points can and do take place. The most likely times that God will make himself known to one, is when they sit down and read the bible daily. When you have read it all, start over again, and then again.

John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me. 40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life

Matthew 11:25 At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes. 26 Even so, Father: for so it seemed good in thy sight. 27 All things are delivered unto me of my Father: and no man knoweth the Son, but the Father; neither knoweth any man the Father, save the Son, and he to whomsoever the Son will reveal him. 28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

2 Timothy 3:14 But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; 15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. 16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: 17 That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works.

 

[marksman]

if you run across any more of them lemme know? ty
Jesus of Nazareth
John Doe, from Nowhere

I said "you are elohim"

Sorry but your post is too cryptic for me.

 

[marksman]

Strawman argument.

Not at all. Based on years of study and listening to what people say and do. For example, if a person says they speak in tongues you know they are not a devotee of the reformed doctrine.

If a person says they are four square on baptism by immersion then the chances are that they attend a Baptist Church.

And if you lived in the UK in the sixties and a person talked about the supernatural chances are they were part of the restoration movement.

So no, you are wrong because the scripture says by their fruits you will know them.

I had a lot of Brethren in my background, but I had already experienced the baptism of the spirit so although they denied there was such a thing it did not phase me because I knew the reality of it.

I ended up in a church started by a Brethren Elder who had been baptized in the Spirit. They told him to give it up or leave the Brethren so he left.
The church became one of the greatest expressions of church life in the restoration movement as there was the supernatural at work in almost every meeting.

People came from all over the country, Europe and America to see what was so dynamic about it.

 

[Enow]

Not at all. Based on years of study and listening to what people say and do. For example, if a person says they speak in tongues you know they are not a devotee of the reformed doctrine.

If a person says they are four square on baptism by immersion then the chances are that they attend a Baptist Church.

And if you lived in the UK in the sixties and a person talked about the supernatural chances are they were part of the restoration movement.

So no, you are wrong because the scripture says by their fruits you will know them.

I had a lot of Brethren in my background, but I had already experienced the baptism of the spirit so although they denied there was such a thing it did not phase me because I knew the reality of it.

I ended up in a church started by a Brethren Elder who had been baptized in the Spirit. They told him to give it up or leave the Brethren so he left.
The church became one of the greatest expressions of church life in the restoration movement as there was the supernatural at work in almost every meeting.

People came from all over the country, Europe and America to see what was so dynamic about it.

And yet out of all of that, I saw no testimony how that glorified Jesus Christ at all. All I saw was how special those people are by having that phenomenon, thus alluding that saved believers are missing out on something, thus unwittingly, giving another calling, another Jesus, another baptism of the Holy Ghost apart from salvation, and thus another gospel.

Didn't Jesus say that when one is born again, there is no sign?

John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. 8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Did not Nicodemus asked the question how one is born again and did not Jesus told him how?

John 3:9 Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be? 10 Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things? 11 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness. 12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things? 13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven. 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

What did Paul say?

Hebrews 11:1Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.

Galatians 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith....26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

Reads to me that you are not serving the Lord Jesus Christ in seeking His glory but something else in His name by which others can glory by.
Do consider that in normal prayer.

 

[marksman]

And yet out of all of that, I saw no testimony how that glorified Jesus Christ at all. All I saw was how special those people are by having that phenomenon, thus alluding that saved believers are missing out on something, thus unwittingly, giving another calling, another Jesus, another baptism of the Holy Ghost apart from salvation, and thus another gospel.

Didn't Jesus say that when one is born again, there is no sign?

John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. 8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

Did not Nicodemus asked the question how one is born again and did not Jesus told him how?

John 3:9 Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be? 10 Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things? 11 Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness. 12 If I have told you earthly things, and ye believe not, how shall ye believe, if I tell you of heavenly things? 13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven. 14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: 15 That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

What did Paul say?

Hebrews 11:1Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.

Galatians 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith....26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

Reads to me that you are not serving the Lord Jesus Christ in seeking His glory but something else in His name by which others can glory by.
Do consider that in normal prayer.

Hallo Enow. How many years did you spend in the UK during the time when the restoration movement was at its most vital bearing in mind I was part of it for 10 years?

 

[Enow]

Hallo Enow. How many years did you spend in the UK during the time when the restoration movement was at its most vital bearing in mind I was part of it for 10 years?

I doubt being in the UK has anything to do with being involved with that restoration movement. Surely not everybody in the UK is involved so I fail to see why you had asked me that question?

I just point out that you never mentioned what believing in Jesus Christ at the calling of the gospel did for you. So I ask you how you can prove you are not preaching another gospel?

Tell me if this site is addressing the restoration movement you are involved in because it seems there are a few that have different origins on the search engine and that one may not be the one you are involved with.

What is the Restoration Movement? | GotQuestions.org

 

[marksman]

I asked the question because it is very easy to be an armchair critic of something you do not understand. I was there right in the middle of it and saw first hand what happened.

For the first time, all sorts of denominations met together once a month on Saturday evening to worship God and be taught by Godly men. People like Arthur Wallis who I knew personally and who was one of the most gracious men I have ever met. Read his books and read the books of Michael Harper, Gerald Coates, Terry Virgo, to name a few who all wrote from first-hand experience. They were not armchair critics like you.

And no one thought they were superior as you claim. We just enjoyed the fact that we had been introduced to a new dimension in Christian living. At one of our youth camps when the kids were worshipping God, Angels physically appeared in the room and joined them in their singing.

But I do realise you can't comprehend this as it doesn't fall into your category of everything done decently and in order.

 

[hermeneutics]

Didn't Jesus say that when one is born again, there is no sign?

John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. 8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

When the wind blows, one can feel and hear the sound. When one is born again one will hear that person speaking in an unknown tongue and the presence of God is all around everyone there.

Worship of God is real and it is Spiritual.

 

[Enow]

Thank you for sharing, but I do have some grave concerns for you.

When the wind blows, one can feel and hear the sound.

If you do not know when it comes from or where it goes, that would indicate there is no sign for when one is born again of the Spirit.

John 3:8 The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

When one is born again one will hear that person speaking in an unknown tongue and the presence of God is all around everyone there.

Paul would disagree with you.

1 Corinthians 12:30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?

1 Corinthians 14:22 Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.

Hebrews 11:1Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen. 2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.

Galatians 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith....26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

Worship of God is real and it is Spiritual.

We will know the real Holy Spirit by Him dwelling within us and not by how the world receives spirits by seeing it happen again and again like mediums or the American Indians that dance and chant for the Great Spirit to come or how the Jews would feel God's Presence in the Temple.

John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

1 Corinthians 6:19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.​

2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

In testing the spirits, 1 John 4:2 is saying the same thing as 2 Corinthians 13:5 above for where the spirit of Christ is presently as being in us.

1 John 4:1Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. 2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. 4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

That means what you are feeling around you in the worship place is the spirit of the antichrist because the real Holy Spirit is in you by faith alone.

 

[reformed1689]

When one is born again one will hear that person speaking in an unknown tongue and the presence of God is all around everyone there.

There is ZERO support in Scripture for this.

 

[Enow]

I thank you for your reply.

I asked the question because it is very easy to be an armchair critic of something you do not understand. I was there right in the middle of it and saw first hand what happened.

The Lord warned me one day while reading something from the Upper Room or the Daily Bread that I was to choose that day Whom I will serve, the Lord Jesus Christ or something else in His name. I answered out loud and said "You, of course," but the urgency remained and so I prayed "Help me to do it" and I had received His peace. A week later on vacation with my folks to my aunt's family about four states over, they had shown a video about a holy laughter event that had happened in their church just a week prior. When service began, two young people shared their supernatural experience and then the pastor said that he did not know what was going on, but he was going to go along with it. Then he announced that no man can move the Holy Spirit, but man must move out of the way and the Holy Spirit will move in". That's new age mentality FYI. Anyway, I did not connect the warning from the Lord to that event and I felt a presence in the church of a hand behind me pushing me forward where there was no one behind me to do that. Long story short, that was the spirit of the antichrist that I felt in the church when the Lord edified me by His words that the real Holy Spirit is in me and that His role is to testify of the Son to glorify the Son for why as His disciple, I serve Him as led by the Spirit to do and thus the Lord kept me from "falling for that" in serving that movement in seeking the glory of it and by that movement of the spirit of the antichrist.

The Lord Jesus Christ is not glorified in the holy laughter movement by having the spotlight on the visiting spirit making people lose self control to laugh or fall backwards and so that is why by my armchair quarterbacking, you are waving the banner of the restoration movement in seeking the glory of that movement for all the drama that comes by it without mentioning nary the name of Jesus Christ nor crediting Him at all. Paul warned about how some will depart from faith to give heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils in 1 Timothy 4:1 whereby their conscience will be seared with a hot iron in hypocrisy ( 1 Timothy 4:1 ) by how they acknowledge the Holy Spirit is in them and yet they are receiving Him again apart from salvation. It is a lie for why God will permit that strong delusion to occur as Paul warned about this iniquity that will cause the falling away from the faith in the latter days and how that iniquity was already at work in His day in 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12 as those that err risk a damnation of becoming a vessel unto dishonor in His House as per ( 2 Timothy 2:18-21 ) and how Paul reminded believers when the only time a believer will receive the sanctification of the Spirit was when they had received the love of the truth at the calling of the gospel in 2 Thessalonians 2:13-15. He goes on to testify in the next chapter that those that err and have not faith & are disorderly ( 2 Thessalonians 3:1-7 ) are still brothers, but we are to withdraw from the to admonish them as per 2 Thessalonians 3:14-15.

For the first time, all sorts of denominations met together once a month on Saturday evening to worship God and be taught by Godly men. People like Arthur Wallis who I knew personally and who was one of the most gracious men I have ever met. Read his books and read the books of Michael Harper, Gerald Coates, Terry Virgo, to name a few who all wrote from first-hand experience. They were not armchair critics like you.

Experiences do not trump scripture nor the lines of discernment drawn by the scripture when testing the spirits.

And no one thought they were superior as you claim. We just enjoyed the fact that we had been introduced to a new dimension in Christian living. At one of our youth camps when the kids were worshipping God, Angels physically appeared in the room and joined them in their singing.

How can that not be seen as preaching another gospel? How can angels joining the congregation in singing not make that congregation "look" superior?

But I do realise you can't comprehend this as it doesn't fall into your category of everything done decently and in order.

I just object to the fact that you still have not glorified the Son nor exalted the name of Jesus at all but the name of the restoration movement.

1 Corinthians 2:2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

 

[Marymog]

Indeed! Even as various translators have rephrased the very same original words written by inspired men, why could not an anointed person today say the rephrase

Carry on as you think you must!

Lol.....thank you. I think I must always defend Scripture against bizarre theories. Even the Reformers and the reformers of the Reformers didn't agree with your theory and would have told you your wrong!!

Sooooo carry on with your bizarre theory.....if you think you must.