Healing For Today

[Brother Mike]

Healing is for Today !!!!

By Brother Mike

Isa 53:4 Yet surely, our sicknesses, he, carried, And, as for our pains, he bare the burden of them,—But, we, accounted him stricken. Smitten of God and humbled,
Isa 53:5 Yet, he, was pierced for transgressions that were ours, was crushed for iniquities that were ours,—the chastisement for our well-being, was upon him, And by his stripes, there is healing for us.


Well, Glory to God. Time for the healing debate!!! Woot, Woot. Now God is Good, and before you get ready to fire off a debate, there could be something in here to save your life or someone you love. It's to late to change my mind. I see healing in the Word, and have experienced it more than once. I have also been used by God to minister Healing.... So, just consider this.......

Jesus our High Priest and the Head of the Church. I know, some think its board of directors, or it's the actual Church. Nope, It is still Jesus, and He has not changed a bit. (Heb 13:8) Now, turn your bibles to the book of Luke, 5th Chapter... or just look below...

Luk 5:12 And it came to pass, when he was in a certain city, behold a man full of leprosy: who seeing Jesus fell on his face, and besought him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.

Here we have Luke's Account by the Holy Ghost, of a man full of Leprosy. Luke was a Doctor, so he let us know that this man must have been covered with Leprosy. The man comes to Jesus and says, Lord if it be your will, I know you can do anything. If it is your will Lord, make me clean.

This sounds like the prayer of millions today. Remember, those Word of faith folks are not the majority that make up the body of Christ. Prayers often sound like this. "Lord I know you can do all things, please Lord, if it is your will, please Lord. Please Heal me."

Bless these peoples hearts, they think they are praying just like Jesus Prayed in the Garden. You remember it. Jesus told God that all things were possible with Him, if it be thy will, take this cup from me. Nevertheless, Thy will be done.
You see, Jesus already knew the will of God concerning the matter. The scripture says Jesus was obedient unto death. Jesus was not confused about the will of God, but was all ears if there was another way. We know there was not any other way.

Well, Jesus was not having a healing meeting in the Garden, so using that Garden prayer for Healing would be out of place. However, we have the same type of prayer being used in Luke 5, hand picked by the Holy Ghost so we won't get confused about the Lords will on Healing.

The question asked again was. Lord, you can do all things, if it be your will, Heal me. This is what the man with Leprosy was asking. The man had no doubt about the power of anointing and ability on Jesus, He, like so many others did not know what the Lord's will was concerning Him.

The Lord did something pretty amazing, and it speaks volumes about his will concerning Healing. Jesus Laid his hands on this contagious man.

Luk 5:13 And he put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, ..........................................

At this point, Jesus could have said anything, in fact, some think He should have said something different if you listen to them preach. Once again, the bible says if all the works of Jesus were recorded, it would fill volumes. We are given those things that would answer questions in the future and be eternal. God already knew the issue man would have with Healing today. So, this account about the man with Leprosy was hand picked, by the Holy Ghost.

Luk 5:13 And he put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, ..........................................

Now some think Jesus should have said something like....... "Now, now. Son, we just never know what God is going to do, He is mysterious in all his ways, and they are past finding out. God may be using this leprosy to build character in you. Now go your way, and try to stay strong."

Now would have been a good time to add that, if that was what God wanted us to learn. Many think He should have, but what did Jesus really say?

Luk 5:13 And he put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will: be thou clean. And immediately the leprosy departed from him.

I WILL !!!!!!!!!

I don't think it gets anymore clear than that. In fact, for God to heal someone and not you, would make him a respecter of persons. God does not have favorites.

Act 10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.


Not one time did Jesus say sickness was for teaching anyone anything, In fact, no scripture does. People just make that stuff up after playing way to much Church bingo. Jesus never turned down anyone for healing, and no scripture says he has changed or healing has passed away. Once again, these are just Man's Ideas of trying to bring the Word down to what they have experienced, instead of getting in faith and having the Word change them to the level of what is written.

Jesus Healed ALL!!! Acts 10:38. I sure would not want to be the one to stand before the Head of the Church and attempt to explain to him why I told his precious people he is no longer the Healer. Nope, count me out. Jesus has never changed, not one little bit, and you know what? That is good news for me and you.

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[fivesense]

Jesus Healed ALL!!! Acts 10:38. I sure would not want to be the one to stand before the Head of the Church and attempt to explain to him why I told his precious people he is no longer the Healer. Nope, count me out. Jesus has never changed, not one little bit, and you know what? That is good news for me and you.

Jesus Is Lord.

I also would not like to stand before the Lord of all the universe, the Head of the Body of Christ, and explain to Him why I interferred with His sovereign right to rule over human lives as He deems necessary to their benefit. It is a difficult thing taking this type of Circumcision truth and applying it to us, without damaging the emotions and spirits of cherished loved ones of the faith who have waited on God for years for blindness, crippling palsy, and all other malady of the flesh that plagues us, to disappear into thin air at our behest.
When the heralding of the Kingdom is at hand once again, as in the days of our Lord's earthly mission, these things will most certainly occur again, even greater works than these. Such will be the testimony of the 144,000 and others wielding God's power. Until that day comes, His return to earth, we will just wait and aid our eyes and stomachs, as did Paul and Timothy, with spiritual service in decaying bodies. The change is yet to come...
It is important to rightly divide the word of truth, the different operations of God between His people and the rest of the nations. Much precious time and truth is being lost in this battle with the Adversary.
fivesense

 

[whirlwind]

Healing is for Today !!!!

By Brother Mike

Isa 53:4 Yet surely, our sicknesses, he, carried, And, as for our pains, he bare the burden of them,—But, we, accounted him stricken. Smitten of God and humbled,
Isa 53:5 Yet, he, was pierced for transgressions that were ours, was crushed for iniquities that were ours,—the chastisement for our well-being, was upon him, And by his stripes, there is healing for us.


Well, Glory to God. Time for the healing debate!!! Woot, Woot. Now God is Good, and before you get ready to fire off a debate, there could be something in here to save your life or someone you love. It's to late to change my mind. I see healing in the Word, and have experienced it more than once. I have also been used by God to minister Healing.... So, just consider this.......

Jesus our High Priest and the Head of the Church. I know, some think its board of directors, or it's the actual Church. Nope, It is still Jesus, and He has not changed a bit. (Heb 13:8) Now, turn your bibles to the book of Luke, 5th Chapter... or just look below...

Luk 5:12 And it came to pass, when he was in a certain city, behold a man full of leprosy: who seeing Jesus fell on his face, and besought him, saying, Lord, if thou wilt, thou canst make me clean.

Here we have Luke's Account by the Holy Ghost, of a man full of Leprosy. Luke was a Doctor, so he let us know that this man must have been covered with Leprosy. The man comes to Jesus and says, Lord if it be your will, I know you can do anything. If it is your will Lord, make me clean.

This sounds like the prayer of millions today. Remember, those Word of faith folks are not the majority that make up the body of Christ. Prayers often sound like this. "Lord I know you can do all things, please Lord, if it is your will, please Lord. Please Heal me."

Bless these peoples hearts, they think they are praying just like Jesus Prayed in the Garden. You remember it. Jesus told God that all things were possible with Him, if it be thy will, take this cup from me. Nevertheless, Thy will be done.
You see, Jesus already knew the will of God concerning the matter. The scripture says Jesus was obedient unto death. Jesus was not confused about the will of God, but was all ears if there was another way. We know there was not any other way.

Well, Jesus was not having a healing meeting in the Garden, so using that Garden prayer for Healing would be out of place. However, we have the same type of prayer being used in Luke 5, hand picked by the Holy Ghost so we won't get confused about the Lords will on Healing.

The question asked again was. Lord, you can do all things, if it be your will, Heal me. This is what the man with Leprosy was asking. The man had no doubt about the power of anointing and ability on Jesus, He, like so many others did not know what the Lord's will was concerning Him.

The Lord did something pretty amazing, and it speaks volumes about his will concerning Healing. Jesus Laid his hands on this contagious man.

Luk 5:13 And he put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, ..........................................

At this point, Jesus could have said anything, in fact, some think He should have said something different if you listen to them preach. Once again, the bible says if all the works of Jesus were recorded, it would fill volumes. We are given those things that would answer questions in the future and be eternal. God already knew the issue man would have with Healing today. So, this account about the man with Leprosy was hand picked, by the Holy Ghost.

Luk 5:13 And he put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, ..........................................

Now some think Jesus should have said something like....... "Now, now. Son, we just never know what God is going to do, He is mysterious in all his ways, and they are past finding out. God may be using this leprosy to build character in you. Now go your way, and try to stay strong."

Now would have been a good time to add that, if that was what God wanted us to learn. Many think He should have, but what did Jesus really say?

Luk 5:13 And he put forth his hand, and touched him, saying, I will: be thou clean. And immediately the leprosy departed from him.

I WILL !!!!!!!!!

I don't think it gets anymore clear than that. In fact, for God to heal someone and not you, would make him a respecter of persons. God does not have favorites.

Act 10:38 How God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Ghost and with power: who went about doing good, and healing all that were oppressed of the devil; for God was with him.


Not one time did Jesus say sickness was for teaching anyone anything, In fact, no scripture does. People just make that stuff up after playing way to much Church bingo. Jesus never turned down anyone for healing, and no scripture says he has changed or healing has passed away. Once again, these are just Man's Ideas of trying to bring the Word down to what they have experienced, instead of getting in faith and having the Word change them to the level of what is written.

Jesus Healed ALL!!! Acts 10:38. I sure would not want to be the one to stand before the Head of the Church and attempt to explain to him why I told his precious people he is no longer the Healer. Nope, count me out. Jesus has never changed, not one little bit, and you know what? That is good news for me and you.

Jesus Is Lord.

What a wonderful message to read this morning! This topic has really been on my mind for a time now. I read the words, agree with them and yet question...are all to be healed physically? In your quote of [Acts 10:38] He healed those "oppressed of the devil" so to me those healings were of a spiritual nature.

I know that He is in us and, as we are indwelt by Him, He is free to work through us and that work can be to heal others. Some, in His one body, are given various gifts. If the gift of healing is given to us how do we use it? Is it to say, "I will," and "lay hands" on the subject? Have you done this? Have you seen this done and I don't mean some terrible Benny Hinn type shenanigans?

 

[Brother Mike]

You folks had me concerned for a moment..... I thought there would be nobody to debate with... Thank you Fivesense!!!

are we suppose to want to debate though??? :unsure: I am sure there is a scripture about it somewhere... cough...cough....

Fivesense wrote:

I also would not like to stand before the Lord of all the universe, the Head of the Body of Christ, and explain to Him why I interferred with His sovereign right to rule over human lives as He deems necessary to their benefit.

Yes, the Sovereign of God Doctrine. I was hoping for something a little more in the lines of something I have not heard before though.
The plan of God is already determined for us before we are even born. From start to finish. God's plan for the earth is already set in God's Word. This has nothing to do with us being healed though. You can't do the plan, if your broke, sick, and crippled. There is not one scripture that says healing is past,or that Jesus Changed any. Not one scripture that tells us it's the will of God that we should be sick.

It is a difficult thing taking this type of Circumcision truth and applying it to us, without damaging the emotions and spirits of cherished loved ones of the faith who have waited on God for years for blindness, crippling palsy, and all other malady of the flesh that plagues us, to disappear into thin air at our behest.

Bible hope makes us not ashamed. Healing already has been done!!! A Way for salvation has already been done!!! (Born again) The word Salvation is Greek for Healing, made whole. Physically and morally. Look it up, and look up the word saved while your at it. This is why healing was so powerful, because it was preached that way. We read the Word Salvation different from what they saw it. Jesus said he only did what he saw his Father do, and Healing was a big part of his ministry. Has he changed any? Was any turned away?

Check your Doctrine Fivesense, don't let it rob you. What scriptures are you believing. I have been doing this for awhile now. Need some help?

Paul's Thorn
Paul left Trophimus sick.
how bout job?
Jacob's hip?
Pharaoh (God hardened his heart, who can argue with that?)
The pool of Bethesda? Jesus only healed that one person, and left all the others... sniff, sniff...

come up with something Fivesense..... or consider what you believe, and get victory!!!!!
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Whirlwind


Glory to God Brother!!!!!!!

.are all to be healed physically? In your quote of [Acts 10:38] He healed those "oppressed of the devil" so to me those healings were of a spiritual nature.

Of course the devil is a spirit. Anything He does, starts in the realm of the spirit. Lets compare scripture though.......... we should not just take a scripture, and make a doctrine about it. We need a witness, line upon line, comparing like things, spiritual with spiritual (God's Word is Spirit)

If we look at the operation of Satan, He is the God of fleshly things. The Things of men. (Mark 8:33)

The word of God tells us that it's Satan the blinds the eyes of those, so that the glorious Gospel can not reach them. (2 Cor 4:4) We know that is spiritual in a sense. Having ears to hear but not hearing, stealing the word sown (Mark 4)

However....................................................................................................................

There was another side to Satan, the one Acts 10:38 talked about. Jesus himself called Bondage (oppressed), as being physically crippled, or sick. Now that is the words of Jesus.

Luk 13:11 And, behold, there was a woman which had a spirit of infirmity eighteen years, and was bowed together, and could in no wise lift up herself.

Luk 13:16 And ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan hath bound, lo, these eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the sabbath day?

Now we see the physical side of Satan's Bondage and Oppression. There are two parts, being taken captive spiritually, and being taken captive with physical issues.

Now we did not see Jesus chase the sick much, He taught and the sick came as mobs be be healed. However, this women caught his attention. Jesus said this Women Ought to be healed, because she was a daughter of Abraham. Jesus was here to enforce that covenant and do the will of God. This daughter was a seed of Abraham, and his attitude was that no seed of Abraham, whom God made covenant with for eternity should be sick, and crippled. That covenant had to be enforced.

Gen 17:7 And I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after thee in their generations for an everlasting covenant, to be a God unto thee, and to thy seed after thee.

How do you think Jesus feels today about that everlasting covenant? You think He might have changed his mind about it? Even though it was going to cause issues with those religious folks, that Daughter of Abraham, the seed of Abraham needed to be set free. She must be healed!!!!! I got some great news for you!!!!

Gal 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Now, when we are attacked in our bodies, and sick, or hurt. What do you think the Lord is saying to us? You think his mind changed any? NO, NO, NO........... He saying believe on me, by my stripes you are healed!!!! Stand up and thank God you are healed. It's not by what we feel, what the doctor says, what the people tells us. We are not moved by those things, but moved by what we believe. I am not the sick, but I am the Healed, telling the devil to get his hands off God's property. I have a covenant the creator, and not subject to some fallen angel that is in disobedience to God.

Witness number two: Satan and Physical destruction.

A man was caught sleeping with his step mom or mother. Not sure which. Paul said the believers were puffed up, and should have put this man away from them. This man had committed great sin, and everyone was acting like it was no big deal.
Now notice God did not step in to teach this man a good lesson. God is not that way, He is not the author of sickness, but of Life. (I will not go into why Satan could not get to him, but Paul had to turn him over to the proper authority)

1Co 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

Paul knew who was doing the killing, stealing and destroying. Paul knew who the author of sickness was, the perversion and opposite of everything God intended. It was Mr. Satan. The destroyer of Health, the destruction of flesh. Jesus healed those oppressed of the devil. All of them.

Notice this was not to teach the man anything, but to destroy him. Sickness was never designed to teach anyone, anything.
Sickness was designed for punishment for not obeying God. Way to many believers just accept it, and sickness does not belong to us. (I wish I could get more into this advanced spiritual principle Paul used.)

Witness 3

Mat 12:22 Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw.


Here we see the blind and dumb healed. Who's at fault................ Ya, Satan again.

Mat 12:26 And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?

Just spiritual healing????????? "By his stripes we are healed" Isa 53

Remember, that sickness is punishment. It is part of the curse of the law. The curse for disobedience.

Deu 28:15 But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe to do all his commandments and his statutes which I command thee this day; that all these curses shall come upon thee, and overtake thee:

Deu 28:22 The LORD shall smite thee with a consumption, and with a fever, and with an inflammation, and with an extreme burning, and with the sword, and with blasting, and with mildew; and they shall pursue thee until thou perish.

Sickness, sore joints, being crippled, were designed to take away quality of life, and destroy you. Not teach us anything as many preach. They do not know what they are talking about. Every sickness on the planet was meant to do you harm.

Deu 28:61 Also every sickness, and every plague, which is not written in the book of this law, them will the LORD bring upon thee, until thou be destroyed.


But Glory to God, Jesus took that punishment we deserved. This is why we should resist sickness and broken things in our life. Jesus paid the price so that we can be physically healed from the effects of the curse of the Law.

Isa 53:5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.


Now, this is just spiritual healing?????? Yes, because Healing starts in the realm of the spirit........... but it's physical, as the things in the spirit created this physical realm. Those that just say it's all spiritual, really mean that it has no effect on anything. They have no idea what they are saying, or even understand the realm of the spirit.

However, How did the Teacher, the Holy Ghost interpret this scripture????? What he said about it is important, as it's eternally recorded in the Word of God.

Mat 8:16 When the even was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with his word, and healed all that were sick:


Mat 8:17 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities, and bare our sicknesses.

Now that should make us happy Not just some spiritual healing...........

Your Questions:

I know that He is in us and, as we are indwelt by Him, He is free to work through us and that work can be to heal others. Some, in His one body, are given various gifts. If the gift of healing is given to us how do we use it? Is it to say, "I will," and "lay hands" on the subject? Have you done this?

The nine gifts of the Spirit, Healing being one of them is a ministry operation of the Spirit of God. Normally when someone is anointed by this powerful gift, we see some pretty amazing things. We are talking about lots of power here to heal anything.
This type of anointing was on Jesus constantly, and it is as the Spirit wills. Some are called to operate in this type of anointing more than others. This gift is to be used for the unsaved, and new Christians. I have not seen it really operate for those that have been born again for awhile, though it can.

In Mark chapter 16 we see Jesus tell us that if we believe on him (His name above all names, even the name of HIV, and cancer, we can lay hands on the sick and they shall recover. This is for anyone that will have the faith to step out, and use that mighty name. The word Recover does not always mean instant, it means recover. The person you lay hands on must also be in agreement and faith. I see the most amazing healing occur in this way.

Jas 5:14 Is any sick among you? let him call for the elders of the church; and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord:
Jas 5:15 And the prayer of faith shall save the sick, and the Lord shall raise him up; and if he have committed sins, they shall be forgiven him.


Here is another operation for healing. Once again, it may not be instant, but a promise that anything that was wrong, shall be healed. This is more for the church and it's members. A person still should trust in their Doctor,and do what the Doctor says, but the end report will be "Healed" Putting action to faith, is not to stop taking your insulin shots, or medication. Faith and the power of the Lord will automatically adjust that for you.

I have been involved in Instant Healing. One time the Lord told me to step out and speak over someones back that had been hurt for years. Healed instantly, the other time was a girl that just Got saved, and walked up to me on the platform and asked me if God would heal her stomach. She was due for another surgery. That took me by surprise, as everyone was just watching in the congratulation. I told her God was going to heal her right here and now. I put my hand on her stomach and said something like "Stomach, I command you to be fully healed in the mighty name of Jesus, Devil, you get your hands off her NOW!!!" Bam!!! healed instantly, and no surgery. At her checkup, they found nothing wrong, and were puzzled by that.
I can't say the Healing anointing was working, I don't know, I just know it's the will of God everyone is Healed and have foundation to believe that. This Girl surprised me in front of everyone.

I hope this answered your questions.......... there is much more, but it's not about me. It's about our Lord, and he gets all the glory!!!!!!

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[whirlwind]

Remember, that sickness is punishment. It is part of the curse of the law. The curse for disobedience.

Even in a child?

 

[jiggyfly]

Even in a child?

Good question whirlwind, I'm curious to see if you get an answer. Seems that those who still believe that the curse of the law is still in effect must still be living under law.

"It was not because of his sins or his parents' sins," Jesus answered. "He was born blind so the power of God could be seen in him.John 9:3 NLT

I also would not like to stand before the Lord of all the universe, the Head of the Body of Christ, and explain to Him why I interferred with His sovereign right to rule over human lives as He deems necessary to their benefit. It is a difficult thing taking this type of Circumcision truth and applying it to us, without damaging the emotions and spirits of cherished loved ones of the faith who have waited on God for years for blindness, crippling palsy, and all other malady of the flesh that plagues us, to disappear into thin air at our behest.
When the heralding of the Kingdom is at hand once again, as in the days of our Lord's earthly mission, these things will most certainly occur again, even greater works than these. Such will be the testimony of the 144,000 and others wielding God's power. Until that day comes, His return to earth, we will just wait and aid our eyes and stomachs, as did Paul and Timothy, with spiritual service in decaying bodies. The change is yet to come...
It is important to rightly divide the word of truth, the different operations of God between His people and the rest of the nations. Much precious time and truth is being lost in this battle with the Adversary.
fivesense

Good response Fivesense.

 

[Brother Mike]

Ah, my friend Jiggyfly............Thought you forgot about me............


Gal 3:13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

There is a curse, Jesus Had to deliver us from it, or we should be delivered from the curse. Everything we get from God comes from Grace though faith. Grace, because we did not commit any acts of righteousness that impressed God, and faith believes what God said.

Jiggyfly your version of John 9:3 is a little different than what I read. Not that you would agree with me once your mind is set, but here it is anyway.

Two questions were asked. Was this man blind because of sin or the parents sin. Jesus answered those questions. He said neither. That was the end of it. Pay attention how Jesus responded to questions. You will find he did not change His thought process by those that asked questions.

Mar 10:24 And the disciples were astonished at his words. But Jesus answereth again, (notice he is not changing thought here) and saith unto them, Children, how hard is it for them that trust in riches to enter into the kingdom of God[/u]!
Mar 10:25 It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter into the kingdom of God.
Mar 10:26 And they were astonished out of measure, saying among themselves, Who then can be saved?

Notice that even though his disciples were distressed because they did not yet understand that Jesus was not talking about the kingdom of Heaven or eternal life, but the operation of the Kingdom of God. All they heard was the rich young rulers question. So, they assumed Jesus was talking about eternal life. Jesus however was on his own thing.

So, Peter being Peter interrupted the Lord.

Mar 10:28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.

Now what is the problem? Though the disciples left all, they had more money than they could possibly need. Judas had the bag, and it was full of money. They gave to the poor constantly, even so much that when Judas left the supper table, they just figured He was out giving their money away again to the poor, when in reality he was betraying Jesus.

Jesus finally got around to answering their question to put their mind at ease.

Mar 10:29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
Mar 10:30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

So, the Lord was just trying to increase the young rich ruler, and operate the Kingdom of God by the laws of sowing and reaping. Jesus also added at the end for their sake that, Yes, Yes, and you get eternal life also.

Now back to John 9:3

Joh 9:3 Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.
Joh 9:4 I must work the works of him that sent me, while it is day: the night cometh, when no man can work.
Joh 9:5 As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world.

Jesus said the works of God should be manifest in him. The whole reason Jesus came, to destroy the works of the devil. He made it clear once again in the next verse, and once again in John 9:5. I am the light of the World.

So, Jesus answered the question with Neither. Then He said that the man must be healed. It had nothing to do with God made him blind so God could prove something. Bless God, that don't even make sense, as there was plenty of sick to go around.
Also, the Kingdoms could not be divided. God was not making people sick with the devil just so Jesus could try to keep up and get them healed. That is just silly thinking.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Brother Whirlwind.....................

Sick Children and the Curse of the Law......................................

First, we don't have redeemed Bodies yet, We live on a planet that can hold life for a time, but can not sustain it.
All sickness is part of the Curse. Now as Jesus said above, being sick does not mean we sinned. It means we have to believe God and resist the devil by faith. A thief needs no reason to try something, but bless God for the victory. He can't devour everyone. Remember, Jesus said that When the flood comes................. WHEN!!!! there were two positions. One with a house on a rock or one with a house on the sand. Where your house is, will depend on how the flood effects you. Jesus was talking sudden destruction here, and the power of the word to save us.

1Pe 5:9 Whom resist stedfast in the faith, knowing that the same afflictions are accomplished in your brethren that are in the world.

We are told to resist the devil and his Junk.


No weapon formed against us shall prosper. (Isa 54:17) God never said weapons would not be formed. It's the outcome.....

All sin leads to death........... This is not some off in the distant spiritual death. Sin can effect your health, wealth, and mental well being. It goes to work to destroy those things in our life, to choke them out and kill. That is the effect of sin.

Were talking about Children though!!!!!


1Co 7:14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.


Children share the same covenant with God, that the parents do. This is what the Amplified says...........

1Co 7:14...................................Otherwise your children would be unclean (unblessed heathen, [1] outside the Christian covenant), but as it is they are [2] prepared for God [pure and clean].


If the Parents don't believe it's the will of God to heal, then guess what happens to the Children???

When my son was 8 he developed T-Cell lymphoma. It's a more rare form of leukemia and not that easy to treat like B-Cell. B-Cell is the most common and now has a 85% cure rate if found early enough. T-Cell attacks all the organs of the body, leaving tumors everywhere.
My son in Chicago Memorial Hospital just got worse and worse. At day 9, I was told he was not going to make it. It would be that night or the next day. They did all they could.
I got the call that day, on day nine............ I told the devil that there was no way he could kill my son, and I was not going to be moved. (There was a lot more to this story)
The last day, day 9 was the hardest for me. I got a evil report. Israel got a evil report, there are Giants in that land............. They got in doubt and fear because of that Report and it cost them dearly............. Not me, I learned my lesson from what Israel did. My son shall live, and not die.............I told God I was not moved by these things, and his word is true and he would not fail. End of story.................

One day 10, my wife called and she was crying. She said they did test after test. (Bone marrow, and spinal tap. Ack :blink: )
They could not find one cancer cell in his body. The doctors just wrote that it was exceptionally sudden response to treatment. They could not explain it. I still have the Report. They spent all day looking for the cancer, the testing lasted for over eight hours.

Say what you will............... people have came way to late, to tell me God is not the healer today. What he done for me, He will do for you, and greater things will he do for you, all the glory goes to our good, good God..............

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[jiggyfly]

[font="tahoma][size="2"]

Two questions were asked. Was this man blind because of sin or the parents sin. Jesus answered those questions. He said neither. That was the end of it. Pay attention how Jesus responded to questions. You will find he did not change His thought process by those that asked questions.

[/size][/font]
[font="tahoma] [/font][/color]
[font="tahoma][size="3"]I disagree, that's not the end of it, Jesus goes on to tell them why the man was born blind. Maybe you should pay closer attention to what your reading, ya think?[/size][/font]

 

[Brother Mike]

I am trying Jiggyfly............. but I guess the KJV just does not have what your looking at............

Still, agree or not on how we read John 9:3. I made some very valid and solid points. Why shoot down something with all the evidence I have presented. I still have memory of a certain tithing thread we had going. (2 years ago?)

Anyway..................... Be blessed.

Jesus Is Lord

 

[whirlwind]

[
Were talking about Children though!!!!!


1Co 7:14 For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.


Children share the same covenant with God, that the parents do. This is what the Amplified says...........

1Co 7:14...................................Otherwise your children would be unclean (unblessed heathen, [1] outside the Christian covenant), but as it is they are [2] prepared for God [pure and clean].

1 Corinthians 7:12,14 But to the rest speak I, NOT THE LORD: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away. (14) For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy.

If the Parents don't believe it's the will of God to heal, then guess what happens to the Children???


Jesus Is Lord.

And if it happens before the parents ever consider it being His will to heal or not?

 

[Brother Mike]

Glory to God Whirlwind!!!!


I gave plenty of evidence about the Lord's will to heal. What the parents believe do effect the children. Even sin, can destroy Children. Spiritual law is spiritual law, and healing is very evident in many scriptures. God expects us to know What his Word says.
Now for the unsaved, they are without hope, and without God. No protection for the Children.

Eph 5:17 Wherefore be ye not unwise, but understanding what the will of the Lord is.

We are commanded by God to know what his will is. There is really no excuse to be ignorant. We have the Word, and the Holy Spirit. What more tools do we need???

Jas 1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.

It shall be given...............It Shall Be.................Wisdom.

For example:

When my son was home from Chicago Memorial Hospital, Cancer free. It was just a few months when he developed a server fever.
We took him to the hospital, and they did blood test. They found 4 different types of bacteria in his blood stream. Two were life threatening. The did test after test to determine the source of the infection. They were concerned because they could not find the source.

Well, my son had a pick line in his arm. It is used in Children to give medicine because of the Cancer. Though my son had no cancer, they still wanted to do low doses of radiation for two years. Standard procedure, for just in case. I did not agree with that, but we have to follow the State guide lines.

The Doctors checked and tested that pick line twice, and both times the test showed up clean. No bacteria.

So, I went to pray about it. I started to pray in tongues about it, seeking wisdom.

Pro 4:7 Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding.

The wisdom of God can save months and months of having to stand in faith for something. Most the time it's not having to spend hours in the Word getting some great faith, just get the wisdom of God.

Well, after praying for a bit, the Spirit of the Lord spoke to me. Not a voice you can hear with your ears, but inside my spirit. The Lord told me to tell the Doctors to completely remove that pick line. So, I went to the Doctor and asked him to remove the pick line. The Doctor told me very firmly that the pick line was not the issue.
Well, God or Doctor........... ummm... I'll pick God............ I then said that as my sons Parent, I am asking for that pick line to be removed. So, they sent someone in to remove the line. These lines go pretty deep into the veins and in the arm.

Once the whole line was out, they sent it to the lab to test it one more time. Sure enough, they found the source of the Bacteria.
My son had to spend another three days just to recover. I don't like to think what would have happened if I had not known God, and knew that God is faithful to answer and give Wisdom. My sons fever had reached 106 F

So, Good Christian parents do loose children........ It's sad, that the devil is able to steal from them. Jesus said however all things are possible to those that believe. As a parent, what are you believing???

Someone that is begging God to heal their child, or saying please Lord let them live, is someone that does not know God, and is not in faith with What God said in his word. Without faith, it is impossible to please God. (Heb 11:6)

We are told if we pray according to his will, then we know he hears us, Well, if we don't know his will, then you have no guarantee that God even heard the pray. People need to realize this.

1Jn 5:14 And this is the confidence that we have in him, that, if we ask any thing according to his will, he heareth us:

God is not the one that makes things complicated, the Doctrine of men does...............

Jesus Is Lord



Side Note:

I would think it wise to take Paul's advice, as Paul is not going to go against the will of God. He may have wrote that without the auction of the Holy Ghost, but He did have the mind of Christ.

What the parents do, effect Children, what they believe, also effect children. I like the NIV version...... We must consider spiritual Law........God's Word is Spirit.

Hos 4:6 my people are destroyed from lack of knowledge.
"Because you have rejected knowledge,
I also reject you as my priests;
because you have ignored the law of your God,
I also will ignore your children.

 

[fivesense]

[/quote]
I am quite in agreement with you Bro Mike, God the Great Healer desires at all times to heal, help, secure the lost, and reconcile all things in heaven and in the earth. No questions about that. This is what His nature is, and it has always been His will.

But the powerful display of His people Israel, the raising of the dead, the laying on of hands, the languages, all those things they tasted of before rejecting the Kings' re-offer of the Kingdom, have not been seen since the circle of Twelve was broken apart, and will only be conterfeited till they are returned from death at the Lord's command. And the benefits the earth and its inhabitants are seeking, such as cures, crops, wealth, and such like terrestrial comforts will come to them through the Priesthood of God's people, Israel.

Until then, He is in the process of forming a spiritual counterpart for His Son, that will inhabit a heavenly, celestial realm where the Adversary, with whom we wrestle, is always scheming to keep us from being mindful of our expectation, which is becoming as He is in the wink of an eye, and with Him ever after.

Focusing on the Circumcision truths, those truths which were delivered by Him personally to His people while He was on earth, and not giving Paul the Apostle to the nations his proper respect, is a scheme that has been in existence for centuries now. It has produced schism after schism after schism. Paul prophecied the same. We are not part of the OT promises, we are not even part of the New Covenant in fulfillment of Jeremiah 31. We are the nations, Gentiles, no Law, no promises, no legislation, nothing but enemies and strangers as gentiles. We have the glorified Christ and His Spirit, the earth belongs to the Jews according to a God I have never known to lie.

Pray for healing, pray for sickeness, pray for jobs, pray, pray, pray. Pray without ceasing, but trust Paul when he says that God's power is found best displayed in weakness, not strength; in infirmities, not healings. This earth is passing, decaying, corrupted. It is destined for melting in fervent heat. Cleaving to that which is not ideal is not good.

and now there doth remain faith, hope, love-these three; and the greatest of these is love.YLT 1C 13:13

Pursue the love, and seek earnestly the spiritual things, and rather that ye may prophecy, 1C 14:1 .

Love is what will never cease, ever. There will be no need of healing, prophecy, languages, helps or any of the other spiritual gifts in heaven, where we already are seated with Him. Faith will be fulfilled, expectation and hope completed once we are there with Him, only Love will remain. Live in love, work in love, do all things from love for it alone will never pass away.

As long as we are earthbound, we may ask for anything, our spirit working with God's Spirit to accord with the will of God, for we do not always know what to pray for. But do not expect Him to fulfill His promises to Israel through the Body of Christ while it is on earth, and forget His promises He made. He will not.

Set your mind on heavenly things, and not on earth, was the admonition. And for good reason. Our hope, expectation, allotment and promises pertain to a heavenly and celestial realm, now and later at the resurrection. Our home, our life, our Christ is not on the earth. It is hidden in Christ in God
fivesenseYLT for ye did die, and your life hath been hid with the Christ in God; Col 3:3

 

[jiggyfly]

I am trying Jiggyfly............. but I guess the KJV just does not have what your looking at............

Still, agree or not on how we read John 9:3. I made some very valid and solid points. Why shoot down something with all the evidence I have presented. I still have memory of a certain tithing thread we had going. (2 years ago?)

Anyway..................... Be blessed.

Jesus Is Lord

Well Mike, I don't see where you have made any valid or solid points nor do I believe you have dealt with John 9:3, so let's do John9:3 and then go on from there.
Seeing how you seem to favor KJV I'll start with it.

Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.

Here it is in KJV and keyed with Strong's.
JesusG2424 answered,G611 NeitherG3777 hath this manG3778 sinned,G264 norG3777 hisG846 parents:G1118 butG235 thatG2443 theG3588 worksG2041 of GodG2316 should be made manifestG5319 inG1722 him.G846

Here is the ESV
Jesus answered, “It was not that this man sinned, or his parents, but that the works of God might be displayed in him.

Here is Young's literal translation.
Jesus answered, `Neither did this one sin nor his parents, but that the works of God may be manifested in him;

So Mike you might think it is silly but I disagree, I think it is very important and vidal to having a better understanding of God's plan toward's man.

God is not the one that makes things complicated, the Doctrine of men does...............

Well Mike I found something we kinda agree on.

You said, "[font="tahoma][size="2"]God is not the one that makes things complicated, the Doctrine of men does..............." and I agree, but I include the self-centered WOF message in the doctrine of men.[/size][/font]

 

[whirlwind]

Glory to God Whirlwind!!!!


I gave plenty of evidence about the Lord's will to heal. What the parents believe do effect the children. Even sin, can destroy Children. Spiritual law is spiritual law, and healing is very evident in many scriptures. God expects us to know What his Word says.
Now for the unsaved, they are without hope, and without God. No protection for the Children.

The parents of this child are not the "unsaved," as I'm sure is the case in many other's lives. I must disagree with your teaching that illness is the result of sin.

I would think it wise to take Paul's advice, as Paul is not going to go against the will of God. He may have wrote that without the auction of the Holy Ghost, but He did have the mind of Christ.

I agree with that but thought it interesting to note.

What the parents do, effect Children, what they believe, also effect children. I like the NIV version...... We must consider spiritual Law........God's Word is Spirit.

Hos 4:6 my people are destroyed from lack of knowledge.
"Because you have rejected knowledge,
I also reject you as my priests;
because you have ignored the law of your God,
I also will ignore your children.

And....does He send illness on a child of parents that do not reject Him?

Although we must agree to disagree on the issue of the cause of illness....I still appreciate your message on healing and agree with that power from Him.

 

[Brother Mike]

Thank you Brother Whirlwind


Brother, I never said sickness was punishment for sin........... God did.

Deu 28:15 But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe to do all his commandments and his statutes which I command thee this day; that all these curses shall come upon thee, and overtake thee:

Now, if you read the rest of Deut 28. You will see all the things that come upon someone that did not hearken to the voice of the Lord or his Written Law. (Word) As it is written, all sin leads to death.

When Adam was created, there was no sickness. It was not God's plan for Adam to be sick. When Adam obeyed Satan, Adam became Satan's servant. Satan became Adams god. (John 8:34) (Rom 6:16)

God gave the earth to men, (Psa 115:16) though God still owned everything. man was suppose to be in Charge, but now a disobedient angel had hold of it. Adam turned it over to Satan. Because of one man's sin, death reigned. (Rom 5:12)

Death filled this Planet, and the planet started to die. If you notice, it is not getting any better.

Rom 5:14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

So, death filled the Planet and effected those that even did not sin the same as Adam. The Curse was in effect. So, sickness is part of the Curse of the Law, but can still effect those that have not sinned. It's part of living on this corrupted planet, and having these flesh bodies. So, sin does not always bring sickness, there are lots of other things listed under the Curse of the Law that can happen if someone gives place to the Devil and refuses to repent. There is a law of Grace on this earth that keeps Satan in Check. Satan is also defeated.

So, the effects of the curse can still attempt to overtake even believers. Remember God's people are destroyed for lack of knowledge. This is why I am against Doctrines that teach healing has been done away with. It is not true for one, and for another, I hate when God's Children are destroyed, because they just lack revelation. I have seen more than one good Christian die, or what I would consider good. Those that love God.

The Biggest killer is breaking that Love command. Doing so removes any protection you may have had.

Jas 3:16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

Example:

While in Prison 1997, A virus swept though our wing in the Prison compound. Out of the 100 of us, over 60 where lying in the Hospital very sick. They locked our wing down, and we were fed with Styrofoam trays. We were quarantined.
I knew that sickness did not belong to me. It was part of the curse, and Jesus redeemed me from the curse of the Law. Jesus took the punishment I deserved, and set me free from the powers of Darkness. Satan should not be able to enforce sickness on me. (Though I have had symptoms more than once.)

A week before this, I got into a spat with one of my Brothers in Christ. I was out in the day room (Place where we watched TV) and I was watching Wrestling. (WWF at the time) Undertaker was speaking in some fake demonic tongues, girls running around in bikini's, What a show.
My brother in Christ came up to me and rebuked me for watching wrestling with the other inmates. He said I was not setting a good example. Let me tell you, prison is boring. I told him to mind his own business, and we just stopped talking to each other.

All week I ignored him, and he ignored me. Then that stupid Virus hit, and they locked our wing down. Well, the first week it hit, I got sick. I got very sick, and I rebuked devils, quoted scriptures, everything I knew to stand in faith against it. Another week came, and more inmates ended up in the Hospital. I did not go because I am the Healed, not the sick. Still, I was not feeling any better. Finally at the end of the second week, I thought enough was enough. I went to God to ask why I was not getting better. I normally do not ask God why his Word is not working. We are commanded to have patience.

[size="4"[b]]Heb 10:36[/b] For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done [b]the will of God[/b], ye might receive the promise. [/size]

The Lord spoke to me, not a voice, but inside. He said, "Go tell your brother you love him." I told God that if my Brother comes to me and tells me sorry, then I will tell him I loved him. I stayed sick for another 2 days waiting. Finally I dragged myself out to the dayroom and saw him sitting there reading his bible. I just walked over to him and said, "[b]Brother, I love you. I am sorry[/b]."
We cried and talked for a little bit, but I really wanted to just lay back down. When done I got up and headed to my bed.

While walking to my bed, the power and anointing of God hit me. It's hard to explain if you never experienced it. I felt it start at my head all the way down to my feet. Bam !!! I was healed instantly. My throat was still a little scratchy, but no fever, no ache, no headache, Nothing. Healed completely.

I learned something that day. When the bible said love your bother in Christ, I guess God really meant to love your brothers and sisters in Christ. Satan had a place, and no amount of rebuking and praying was going to fix it until I came in line with What God said.


[u][size="5"]I also will ignore your children.

[/size][/u]

God is not sending sickness to parents or Children. I know the Hebrew reads that God will do this and do that. Part of the issue is Passive Hebrew verbs being converted to English. Most Hebrew Scholars agree that instead of saying God will do this or that, it would be more correct to say, God will allow, or turn his face against. This is in most cases, not every one. The curse was already here, and without God getting involved, the people were in trouble. Another issues is that Satan and his Kingdom was not revealed in the Old testament.
God wanted all the focus on Him, So if God got the blame, fine with God. All you had to do is what God said, and you had protection in the OT. The other issue, nobody was filled with the Holy Ghost, there was no power or authority to deal with Satan, God had to deal with Satan directly. The last issue is, if the people found out the cause of all the problems and found out Satan was behind it, because of their wicked hearts they would have started to sacrifice to Satan in attempts to appease him in some way. Make Satan happy, and all the problems go away, no need to obey God. We know that Satan will never be happy with us.

So, it is not God, it is never God. God's word is full of ways that God tries to bless people and get them free. We fought him every step of the way.

2Pe 1:3 According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:

Everything you and I need, is already in the Word. Faith lays hold of it, as faith comes by hearing the Word of God. Faith just believes God that all your needs are meet, instead of believing the pile of bills laying on the table. Faith looks at the word and declares that is true over circumstances. (Phil 4:19) it's the same faith we used to get born again. We just believe Jesus died for us, and the Blood removed our sins. We could not prove it physically, but we believe the Word. Everything else is like that in the Word of God.

Everything we need that pertains unto life is in the Word of God, but it's only going to be obtained though the knowledge of Him. Jesus, the Word, If we are ignorant of something, then we are not going to stand in faith for it, just like we would not stand in faith to get born again. This is the issue with some parents and children.

For example, I have heard christian parents tell their children to look both ways before crossing the street, or they could get hit and killed by a car. why would they say that? It's because they believe that can happen.

[size="4"[b]]Mar 11:23[/b] ......................................but [b]shall believe[/b] that those things which he saith shall come to pass; he shall have whatsoever he saith. [/size]

How many children cross the street everyday without looking and not get hit and killed???? Why speak an outcome over something you don't want to happen? Jesus said you have what you say, That is the Lord talking. It is good enough to remind the child to look, not that they could be killed.

[size="4"]Eph 6:2 Honour thy father and mother; (which is the first commandment with promise
Eph 6:3 That it may be well with thee, and thou mayest live long on the earth.
[/size]

You speak what you believe, it comes from the abundance of the heart. You believe that your child can be hit and killed or you believe God said your children will live long on earth. You can't believe both. This is where parents get in trouble, they choose some else besides what God said. God fully expects us to believe His Word.

I Hope this clears some things up........

Be blessed.

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[whirlwind]

Thank you Brother Whirlwind


Brother, I never said sickness was punishment for sin........... God did.

Deu 28:15 But it shall come to pass, if thou wilt not hearken unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe to do all his commandments and his statutes which I command thee this day; that all these curses shall come upon thee, and overtake thee:

Now, if you read the rest of Deut 28. You will see all the things that come upon someone that did not hearken to the voice of the Lord or his Written Law. (Word) As it is written, all sin leads to death.

Does a child sin? Does an infant sin? Are they able to "hearken to the voice of the Lord?"

You speak what you believe, it comes from the abundance of the heart. You believe that your child can be hit and killed or you believe God said your children will live long on earth. You can't believe both. This is where parents get in trouble, they choose some else besides what God said. God fully expects us to believe His Word.

I Hope this clears some things up........

Be blessed.

Jesus Is Lord.

No...it doesn't clear anything up.

 

[Brother Mike]

Does a child sin? Does an infant sin? Are they able to "hearken to the voice of the Lord?"

No, what the parents believe effect the Children. However........................................ even though a Child may agree with the parents in things that do not please God. This is What God said about Children.

Heb 11:15 And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.
Heb 11:16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.

The promise land Israel was told of, coming out of Egypt was a foreshadow of what Jesus was going to bring. Eternal life with God. Going to heaven, Saved and a place with God, Heaven, whatever you call it.

Num 14:29 Your carcases shall fall in this wilderness; and all that were numbered of you, according to your whole number, from twenty years old and upward, which have murmured against me,

Num 14:31 But your little ones, which ye said should be a prey, them will I bring in, and they shall know the land which ye have despised.

Now these parents were making bad confessions over their children. God brought us out to die in the desert, we are going to get snake bitten, Them giants will get us, if we don't starve to death. I am sure the Children were saying the same things as the parents, but God did not consider any thing the Children may have done wrong from Twenty years and younger. He was still going to bring them to the promise land. I believe this answers the question of age of accountability.

The parents got what they said, Just like Jesus said we would in Mark 11:23. (You have what you say.) James says our tongues is a rudder on a ship that is able to steer our course of life.

Num 14:28 Say unto them, As truly as I live, saith the LORD, as ye have spoken in mine ears, so will I do to you:

So, sin was not imputed on the children 20 and younger. They saw the promise land. As the scripture I have given, God is not looking at the child, but the parents. The above scripture was a promise of the promised land, or a foreshadow of Heaven.

As for the safety of the Child, that's the Parents Job, they have the spiritual authority over the Children, and can keep them from Satan. A child sinning or not sinning does not matter. Satan can't touch them if the parents have knowledge of what belongs to them in Christ Jesus. The children are sanctified by the BELIEVING parent. I have experienced this with my own son, as well as others that have stood on the Word of God unmoving for their children. I have also was with a child in the last days before death, because the parents kept on confessing they may not make it. They would not come in line with What God said, that Children would have long life. (See scripture above in EPH) I prayed and tried, but the Lord told me to stop Praying, the Parents were responsible and God expects Parents to believe and obey the Word. I showed them scripture after scripture, and told them, if God would save my child, he would save theirs. They would agree for just a time, until the next doctor report. They accepted the evil report, and it cost them.

I thank you for you interest in this, I don't know how else to explain. My hope is though these things stay in mind, and you can use them to get victory in your own life, as well as others.

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[whirlwind]

Please stop with this Brother Mike. It is not addressing the question. A CHILD DOES NOT SIN. The sins of the father are not placed on the child. It is RIDICULOUS to believe that our Father places illness on a child because of what parents may have done. I have also stated that the child in question is blessed with parents that believe.

I thank you for you interest in this, I don't know how else to explain. My hope is though these things stay in mind, and you can use them to get victory in your own life, as well as others.

Jesus Is Lord.

You are unable to explain because I don't believe what you teach is correct. Thank you for your time.

 

[Brother Mike]

WhirlWind...............................It would be helpful if you read my post carefully.

Your reading into things I am not saying. I never said the sins of the father are carried to the Children. There are some so called Deliverance ministries that believe this. I gave you scripture where God did not impute sin on those 20 years and younger.

I said, the Parent is spiritually responsible for the Child. I said nothing about God getting the Child, or punishing the Child for something the parents did. What the parents believe about God can give the child victory or death. I am not sure how this is getting mixed up...

Be blessed.

Jesus Is Lord.

 

[whirlwind]

WhirlWind...............................It would be helpful if you read my post carefully.

Your reading into things I am not saying. I never said the sins of the father are carried to the Children. There are some so called Deliverance ministries that believe this. I gave you scripture where God did not impute sin on those 20 years and younger.

I said, the Parent is spiritually responsible for the Child. I said nothing about God getting the Child, or punishing the Child for something the parents did. What the parents believe about God can give the child victory or death. I am not sure how this is getting mixed up...

Be blessed.

Jesus Is Lord.

You wrote....

Num 14:28 Say unto them, As truly as I live, saith the LORD, as ye have spoken in mine ears, so will I do to you:

So, sin was not imputed on the children 20 and younger. They saw the promise land. As the scripture I have given, God is not looking at the child, but the parents. The above scripture was a promise of the promised land, or a foreshadow of Heaven.

Satan can't touch them if the parents have knowledge of what belongs to them in Christ Jesus. The children are sanctified by the BELIEVING parent.

As children are "sanctified by the believing parent" then are you not also saying that sickness in children is because they don't have believing parents? How could another conclusion be drawn? If it is indeed the wrong conclusion please explain, without all the extra verbage, exactly why children are sick. If you say sin causes sickness in adults then what causes sickness in children...knowing that child has believing parents. Even if a child doesn't have believing parents then what causes the sickness?

Of course...seeing the promised land has NOTHING to do with being sick when one sees it. <_< So, to get back on track....do you not understand that there are MANY, MANY, MANY, sick children with believing parents? To say that illness (on adults) is caused by sin is simply WRONG for there are MANY, MANY, MANY sick believing people. To say that our Father inflicts pain and sickness on children because their parents aren't believers is also wrong and offensive. Please consider....

Matthew 5:45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for He maketh His sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

Luke 13:4 Or those eighteen, upon whom the tower in Siloam fell, and slew them, think ye that they were sinners above all men that dwelt in Jerusalem?​

As His good things fall on the good and the evil....do not problems also fall on the good and the evil. It's just part of this flesh life. Now....that has nothing to do with KNOWING He also heals.