It seems to me that up to now you carry on with the “willful sin” when there is none spoken nor conveyed in the topic verse Hebrews 10:26. What is there is not about a willful sin but about sinning willfully. If you will keep ignoring this point, hopes are low at arriving at the correct understanding of v.26
I already pointed out and shown you. I am afraid I don’t know how else I could help you see it. But I’ll give it one more try here.
The result spoken of in verse 26, that “there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins” is not of the willful sinning, much less of some willful sin, but of the once and for all sacrifice by Jesus Christs for sins. Willful sinning has nothing to do with the matter of sacrifices for sins. More so, some “willful sin” has nothing to do with the matter of sacrifices for sins.
Tong
R1416
I was hoping you would explain to me what is so "messy" about what I said. In fact, I was confident that would. You were very eager for me ro answer specific questions (though I believe I did), and thus, I figured you would get right to the point.
But you didn't. You never explained why failing to hold fast to our faith (which according to verse 25 includes not forsaking the assembling of ourselves) and the resultant penalty was so "messy".
Nonetheless, I will continue.
I will attend to new business first: The verse says, "For if we sin wilfully..." There is very little difference in "sin wilfully" and "wilfull sin", if any difference at all. To differentiate between the terms is knit picking.
Next, there is still that phrase, "For if" in the verse, which I have brought up in the majority of my posts, if not all of them. It absolutely joins the thoughts of verses 22-25 to that of 26 and beyond. While you were so steadfast for me to answer your questions, you have failed to address this point.
Next, I was tduly interested in hearing why you thought my theory was "messy" or at least was hoping you would define "messy". Pedhaps I could've tidied it up for you! However, with a lack of an explanation, I am forced to go with my intuition.
People don't like these verses (23-25) bwcause it tells them it comes down to holding fast to the faith, fellowshipping those of the faith and to assemble together. That scares them. But frankly, I don't know why.
Well the shocking part of this is the idea that of assembling... Yes, it includes going to Church but it doesn't say that. Frankly, I don't think people want to hear that they must go to Church... And for most Churches, I don't blame them!
However, it simply says not to forsake the assembling of yourselves. It doesn't say attend a Church service (though I do believe it is important, but that isn't my focus right now). I believe doing so is important today, but in the era it was written, it was vital. This was an infant era of Christianity where there was no KJV, NIV, DARBY or any lther formal Bible. It was a time where a big city may only have 12 other Christians. So you had to meet to get news from circular letters or direct letters from the Apostles and to get/give encouragement from others.
Things are different today, but that need is still present.
The bottom line is if you abandon faith (which does include fellowship and assembling, as I can show throughout the NT) then, yes... There is no more sacrifice for sins. Without faith there IS a fearful looking for of firery indignation and yes... When you abandon faith you have trampled under fokt the son of God and did all the other stuff.
Is that really in despute? I don't think it is! It just so happens that one of the things that faith requires is not forsaking the assembling of yourselves.
I want to bring up a similar verse. One that describes that if something is done, its final, condemning and impossible to reverse:
Hebrews 6:4-6 KJV
For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, [5] And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, [6]
If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
The wording is different between this passage and that of Hebrews 10:23-29, but the concept is the same. We must not fall away and forsake faith. We can slip, we can even doubt but we must not fall away. If we do so, there is no more sacrifice for sin and its impossible to be renewed.
I could give a bunch of other scriptures to back that up, but I will move on.
Tong has provided a rival theory to what he believes is better to than the messy situation of what I have said. His theory is that we can sin, but we just can't do it wilfully. I don't know, but I suppose be believes this is somehow less messy.
It's actually more messy.
Its no secret that people sin every day. But what isn't admitted is that they know they are sinning. Sinning isn't the problem, but knowing better and doing it anyway means nothing more can be done for you. That describes every person on earth! That's much more "messy"!
What I am saying is that if you come to faith, understand it and what is required of it and you walk away from it ir decide not to do it, then yea... Thats it! Hhat Tong is suggesting is that if you sin and know it is a sin and do it anyway, that's it.
Basically, I am saying be faithful and he is saying don't sin if you know it is sin. now you tell me which is more messy and hope I don't rattle off a bunch of Old Testament sins that will mean you can no longer do them!