I believe that gay people have as much of a "choice" to be gay as you do to not sin

[TinMan]

Not if they are unrepentant, which is kind of what this thread is about. Unrepentant sinners are not children of God, neither in this life nor (certainly) the next.

Grace and peace to you.

are the morbidly obese children of God?

 

[07-07-07]

But why do you not mention the other sins that keep a person separated from God? These days it's all about homosexuality, but there are many others ins that are mentioned in the Bible that are overlooked. I know it's de rigueur to crusade against homosexuality while overlooking many other sins, such as adultery, that people commit that have far worse consequences. Jesus mentioned adultery several times but never mentioned homosexuality. Do you understand sin better than Jesus?

The subject of the thread is about homosexuality, which is the world's craze nowadays, so I addressed it accordingly; but I did also cite Scripture regarding the other sins too.

1 Corinthians 6
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.

 

[Patrick1966]

Sadly, many are dead in this life, and, one day, will (permanently) perish.

That's where you and I have a difference in doctrinal belief.

May God bless you, my brother.

 

[Patrick1966]

Child sexual abuse is almost exclusively a heterosexual thing.

Are you opposed to the sexual abuse of children? I don't have the impression that you are based on your support of the Washington establishment elites that raped all those kids on Epstein Island.

 

[Patrick1966]

what agenda stuff?

That same-sex relationships and transgenderism are ok and normal.

 

[07-07-07]

Hello there,

Are you someone who believes that sin has been paid for all people?

See the way I look at it is, Rahab was a prostitute, yet still had a heart for God.

That has some type of spiritual picture here to look at from her side of the story, do you think?

Its not a good thing to slut yourself around is it?

Yet this person, deemed a harlot, was justified.

Just because God shows a sinner mercy in this life does not mean He condones their sinful lifestyle. To the contrary, in my opinion, it merely reflects His mercy to draw people to Himself and away from their sins. It isn't God's desire that any should perish, but that everyone comes to repentance.

New Testament
2 Peter 3
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Old Testament
Ezekiel 33
10 Therefore, O thou son of man, speak unto the house of Israel; Thus ye speak, saying, If our transgressions and our sins be upon us, and we pine away in them, how should we then live?
11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord God, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

 

[07-07-07]

I like your post and while, hopefully, a "born again" person can resist and reject sin, they cannot totally reject sin, but at least they're trying.

Trying and doing are two different things. One must perform the latter to inherit eternal life. Hell is full of people with good intentions. Jesus came to show us how to walk in the Spirit to overcome and inherit eternal life.

 

[07-07-07]

ALL will come to repentance, my brother, but not necessarily in this lifetime.

I am sure there is much repentance and regret in Hell, but the blood of Jesus' Cross is forever out of reach for them. This breaks my heart, but it's the truth of God's Word.

 

[Patrick1966]

Trying and doing are two different things. One must perform the latter to inherit eternal life. Hell is full of people with good intentions. Jesus came to show us how to walk in the Spirit to overcome and inherit eternal life.

My brother, I understand that Hell is death and that nobody has yet been sent to the Lake of Fire.

Nobody can transform themselves into perfect beings; only Jesus can transform us. Even Paul was unable to avoid sinning and he had direct visits from Jesus and the Holy Spirit.

 

[Patrick1966]

but the blood of Jesus' Cross is forever out of reach for them.

That contradicts 1 Timothy 4:10 and a plethora of other scripture.

 

[PinSeeker]

That's where you and I have a difference in doctrinal belief.

Right, and that's why I said, "We'll agree to disagree"... that's... generally what that means.

But regarding the specific assertion of mine you were referring to here, which was, "many are dead in this life, and, one day, will (permanently) perish, it seems impossible to refute that but still believe the following to be true:

* in speaking to Christians, Paul says, "...even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ..." So naturally, we are all dead, in this life ~ just as Adam and Eve died on the very day they partook of the forbidden tree in the Garden in Genesis 3 ~ until, in the case of Christians, we are made alive with Christ. And second, the strong implication is that there are still many walking among us who remain in that condition, not having been made alive with Christ.

* Jesus said, "...an hour is coming when all who are in the tombs will hear His voice and come out, those who have done good to the resurrection of life, and those who have done evil to the resurrection of judgment."

So, again, many are dead in this life (1) ~ dead in sin [Ephesians 2:5] ~ and one day many of those will permanently perish (2) ~ go away into eternal punishment [Matthew 25:46]. Yes, Peter says in 2 Peter 3 that the Lord is "not wishing that any would perish," but there again, the strong implication is that there are assuredly some who will.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[07-07-07]

My brother, I understand that Hell is death and that nobody has yet been sent to the Lake of Fire.

Nobody can transform themselves into perfect beings; only Jesus can transform us. Even Paul was unable to avoid sinning and he had direct visits from Jesus and the Holy Spirit.

It's true that only Jesus can transform us, but we are the ones responsible for "yielding" to Him. As we yield consistently, and this can take time, He makes us brand new people. I speak from experience, as I don't even recognize the sinful man I use to be, one who could care less about righteousness and holiness.

As to the Apostle Paul, he became a holy vessel for God's use once He met Jesus on the road to Damascus. He was forever changed, and wrote much of the New Testament about God's standards of righteousness and holiness for the Churches. He made it abundantly clear that those who engage in the works of the flesh will not inherit God's Kingdom.

 

[Jim B]

The subject of the thread is about homosexuality, which is the world's craze nowadays, so I addressed it accordingly; but I did also cite Scripture regarding the other sins too.

1 Corinthians 6
9 Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites,
10 nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you. But you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.

But you didn't mention those other sins, even though Paul included them.

 

[Jim B]

Are you opposed to the sexual abuse of children? I don't have the impression that you are based on your support of the Washington establishment elites that raped all those kids on Epstein Island.

"... the Washington establishment elites that raped all those kids on Epstein Island"? Are you okay?

 

[Jim B]

Just because God shows a sinner mercy in this life does not mean He condones their sinful lifestyle. To the contrary, in my opinion, it merely reflects His mercy to draw people to Himself and away from their sins. It isn't God's desire that any should perish, but that everyone comes to repentance.

New Testament
2 Peter 3
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Old Testament
Ezekiel 33
10 Therefore, O thou son of man, speak unto the house of Israel; Thus ye speak, saying, If our transgressions and our sins be upon us, and we pine away in them, how should we then live?
11 Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord God, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

What @MatthewG posted in #313 is right.

 

[07-07-07]

That contradicts 1 Timothy 4:10 and a plethora of other scripture.

The concept of universalism is not taught in the Scriptures. It's a man made doctrine to appeal to the flesh. The reality of eternal damnation is tough to swallow, but it is what is taught in the Scriptures.

Jesus speaking.

Matthew 5
27 You have heard that it was said to those of old, 'You shall not commit adultery.'
28 But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
29 If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.
30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.

Jesus is teaching the crucial fact that we must get the sin out of our lives or face damnation in hell.

 

[Jim B]

Trying and doing are two different things. One must perform the latter to inherit eternal life. Hell is full of people with good intentions. Jesus came to show us how to walk in the Spirit to overcome and inherit eternal life.

Nobody is sinless (with one obvious exception). Eternal life is inherited by accepting Jesus Christ as the Savior whose sacrifice paid for all sin. You don't earn salvation by works.

 

[Jim B]

The concept of universalism is not taught in the Scriptures. It's a man made doctrine to appeal to the flesh. The reality of eternal damnation is tough to swallow, but it is what is taught in the Scriptures.

Jesus speaking.

Matthew 5
27 You have heard that it was said to those of old, 'You shall not commit adultery.'
28 But I say to you that whoever looks at a woman to lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.
29 If your right eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.
30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and cast it from you; for it is more profitable for you that one of your members perish, than for your whole body to be cast into hell.

Jesus is teaching the crucial fact that we must get the sin out of our lives or face damnation in hell.

Read my post #337, immediately above.

Then read this: “For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal life. Indeed, God did not send the Son into the world to condemn the world [unlike yourself] but in order that the world might be saved through him." John 3:16-17

and this...

"For by grace you have been saved through faith, and this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God—not the result of works, so that no one may boast." Ephesians 2:8-9

 

[Patrick1966]

Yes, Peter says in 2 Peter 3 that the Lord is "not wishing that any would perish,"

Yes, God prefers that people accept and follow Jesus in order to avoid death, judgment, and correction in the Lake of Fire.

 

[Patrick1966]

He made it abundantly clear that those who engage in the works of the flesh will not inherit God's Kingdom.

No one in the flesh can inherit the kingdom of God regardless of whether they're born again or living in extreme sin.

1 Corinthians 15:50
I tell you this, brothers: flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.