I don't think Predestination means Salvation

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
Was Judas predestined? If so, unto what was he predestined for?

To fulfill scripture.

Is that to be taken as a yes in answer to the question “was Judas predestined”?

Tong
R3957

 

[KoT]

Even Judas was "chosen." So don't give me chosen as a defense. What we do is our responsibility.

The whole nation of Israel was God's elect, but not all of them were even in Abraham's bosom, nor accepted Jesus.

I have a legitimate question in reply to your statement in your post:
Are you aware that Jesus can even blot your name out of the book of life?

 

[Iconoclast]

I already know that. But he was still chosen for that role to fulfill scripture.

Have you ever noticed that when scripture says the Father GAVE Me, he is only referring to the 12 apostles and not all that followed afterwards?

Jn6:37 shows this to be a falsehood.Why posts such silly ideas rather than believing the truth.
Many passages teach the truth.

 

[Iconoclast]

All of Humanity is predestined for salvation...none are exempt. That's what the good news proclamation is....thats what the angels told the shepherds on Bethlehem's hills said.

Jesus is the second Adam...a winner all round for all people!.....Jesus never said to anyone, you do not qualify. He forgave before being asked because that's what love does.

We (people) are the ones who disqualify ourselves by refusing life....not God....yet we put it on God for cutting people out.....a nice bit of sleight of hand Satan has convinced people of

Example....when a person suicides they can never say, we did not have life.....they had it and chose to throw it away!
All are in the book of Life yet most insist on being removed.....even God weeps!

That is just not what scripture says.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Jn6:37 shows this to be a falsehood.Why posts such silly ideas rather than believing the truth.
Many passages teach the truth.

Iconoclast, when you use words such as "silly" that means it is foolishness to you doesn't it?

 

[CharismaticLady]

I have a legitimate question in reply to your statement in your post:
Are you aware that Jesus can even blot your name out of the book of life?

Yes. Look at Matthew 7:21-23. This is why I'm so thankful for having been baptized in the Holy Spirit and refusing to quench him. I abide in Jesus, and He certainly abides in me.

 

[KoT]

Yes. Look at Matthew 7:21-23. This is why I'm so thankful for having been baptized in the Holy Spirit and refusing to quench him. I abide in Jesus, and He certainly abides in me.

Why do you believe that anyone or anything can quench the Spirit of the living God most High?

 

[CharismaticLady]

Is that to be taken as a yes in answer to the question “was Judas predestined”?

Tong
R3957

Yes. All Jews were predestined, and out of that chosen nation, the apostles were specifically predestined. They were also in God's foreknowledge.

All Gentiles were in the foreknowledge of God, but not predestined. He didn't force anyone to believe in Him, or reject Him, as He does not wish anyone to perish. Some twist that last scripture to mean, none of the elect to perish, but they are not open to the Spirit of God; they are closed minded, locked in a false doctrine of demons.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Why do you believe that anyone or anything can quench the Spirit of the living God most High?

Because Paul commanded us to not quench the Spirit. It doesn't mean quench Him universally, but from inside you.

 

[KoT]

Because Paul commanded us to not quench the Spirit. It doesn't mean quench Him universally, but from inside you.

Let me make sure I understand you correctly...
You believe because of a man whom you have never met
nor know or even if he was the one who wrote what it is said he wrote
that you or anyone else has the power to quench the Almighty Spirit of the living God most High?

Is this correct?

 

[CharismaticLady]

Let me make sure I understand you correctly...
You believe because of a man whom you have never met
nor know or even if he was the one who wrote what it is said he wrote
that you or anyone else has the power to quench the Almighty Spirit of the living God most High?

Is this correct?

That was the Apostle Paul that wrote that. And as I said, we can only quench the Holy Spirit on the inside of us. That means we can willfully sin and sear our own conscience from letting the Spirit guide us. The conscience and mind is where the Spirit would dwell.

That is IF we have been given the Spirit and have Him within us in the first place.

 

[KoT]

That was the Apostle Paul that wrote that. And as I said, we can only quench the Holy Spirit on the inside of us. That means we can willfully sin and sear our own conscience from letting the Spirit guide us. The conscience and mind is where the Spirit would dwell.

That is IF we have been given the Spirit and have Him within us in the first place.

Please answer my question to you as it is written to you:
Let me make sure I understand you correctly...
You believe because of a man whom you have never met
nor know or even if he was the one who wrote what it is said he wrote
that you or anyone else has the power to quench the Almighty Spirit of the living God most High?

Is this correct?

A. Yes this is correct.
B. No it is not correct.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Please answer my question to you as it is written to you:
Let me make sure I understand you correctly...
You believe because of a man whom you have never met
nor know or even if he was the one who wrote what it is said he wrote
that you or anyone else has the power to quench the Almighty Spirit of the living God most High?

Is this correct?

A. Yes this is correct.
B. No it is not correct.

It isn't a fair question. We can never quench God out of the universe, but we CAN quench Him out of us.

 

[KoT]

It isn't a fair question. We can never quench God out of the universe, but we CAN quench Him out of us.

So tell me exactly how is it you know this is true other than reading it from a book?

 

[CharismaticLady]

So tell me exactly how is it you know this is true other than reading it from a book?

I've experienced being baptized in the Holy Spirit, and it caused me to fall madly in love with God. There isn't a sin I would want to commit. But if I let myself run around with bad people and let them influence me, I would hear God's voice, which I hear very clearly now, become fainter and fainter as I grieve the Spirit. But if those friends convince me to willfully sin I could only do that with the Spirit inside me, by quenching Him. Literally kicking Him out of my life.

 

[KoT]

I've experienced being baptized in the Holy Spirit, and it caused me to fall madly in love with God. There isn't a sin I would want to commit. But if I let myself run around with bad people and let them influence me, I would hear God's voice, which I hear very clearly now, become fainter and fainter as I grieve the Spirit. But if those friends convince me to willfully sin I could only do that with the Spirit inside me, by quenching Him. Literally kicking Him out of my life.

Is this hypothetical but yet not experienced first hand?
Is this correct?

 

[CharismaticLady]

Is this hypothetical but yet not experienced first hand?
Is this correct?

Oh is is experiencial. I received the Spirit on 2/9/77. Before that I was attending church for 30 years and sinned up a storm! But I've never quenched the Spirit.

 

[KoT]

Oh is is experiencial. I received the Spirit on 2/9/77. Before that I was attending church for 30 years and sinned up a storm! But I've never quenched the Spirit.

Then what you said is hypothetical. And you contradicted yourself.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Then what you said is hypothetical. And you contradicted yourself.

No, Jesus said we must be born again of the Spirit to belong to Him. I experienced the new birth

 

[KoT]

No, Jesus said we must be born again of the Spirit to belong to Him. I experienced the new birth

I will leave you to yourself. Thank you for the conversation.