In Daniel 8, 11, and 12, is A4E meant? Or is a future anti-christ meant?

[Spiritual Israelite]

Obviously, you have no grasp of God’s Word. Salvation comes by grace through faith, not by mastering eschatology. If you think one's end-times theories are the gateway to heaven, you’ve already missed the gospel entirely.

You're the one who told him "you’d rather cling to private opinion or men than the Word itself". You didn't clarify that you were only talking about eschatology. Maybe you should try being more clear next time.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Yes, he, and only he, determines that. Somehow.

I am not the only one. There are many others. For one, here are his articles:

Amillennialism: A Word Direct from the Scriptures
An Exposition of Revelation Chapter 20
The 70 Weeks of Daniel 9

 

[TribulationSigns]

You're the one who told him "you’d rather cling to private opinion or men than the Word itself". You didn't clarify that you were only talking about eschatology. Maybe you should try being more clear next time.

Regarding finding God's interpretation on eschatology, moron. Not the interpretation of men.

 

[covenantee]

In all the Bible, there is only ONE event called "the consummation". Dan. 9:27.

In 70AD., the temple and Jerusalem were not destroyed by the consuming fire of God, but the heaven and the earth will be. Luke 17:28-30; 2 Thes. 1:7-10; Heb. 12:29; 2 Peter ch. 3.

In 70 AD, the temple and Jerusalem were destroyed by the Romans and Jews, who were Prince Messiah's agents and instruments of judgment, complete destruction i.e. consummation, and desolation upon apostate Israel.

There is no mention of fire in the Daniel 9:27 definition of consummation.

If Daniel had meant final fire, he certainly could have chosen a word or description communicating that, given its profound significance.

But he didn't.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

In all the Bible, there is only ONE event called "the consummation". Dan. 9:27.

In 70AD., the temple and Jerusalem were not destroyed by the consuming fire of God, but the heaven and the earth will be. Luke 17:28-30; 2 Thes. 1:7-10; Heb. 12:29; 2 Peter ch. 3.

None of those scriptures you referenced refer to "the consummation" (Daniel 9:27 is the only verse in scripture containing the word "consummation") and no scripture says that there can only be one consummation of any kind.

The word "consummation" simply means the act of making something complete. What happened in 70 AD was the consummation of the prophecy relating to the destruction of Jerusalem and its temple buildings. That event marked the consummation or completion of that prophecy. There will also be a consummation or completion of the prophecies relating to the return of Jesus Christ when He will renew the heavens and the earth and do away with sin and death forever by ushering in the new heavens and new earth where only righteousness will dwell (2 Peter 3:10-13).

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Regarding finding God's interpretation on eschatology, moron. Not the interpretation of men.

Ah, I see you have finally completely lost it by resorting to calling me names just because I couldn't read your mind. Yes, call me a name just because you weren't clear. I see how your mind works (not at all). Clearly, all those laughing emojis are fake and you actually are not laughing at all and are losing your temper, as one does when he calls people names.

 

[TribulationSigns]

The word "consummation" simply means the act of making something complete. What happened in 70 AD was the consummation of the prophecy relating to the destruction of Jerusalem and its temple buildings. That event marked the consummation or completion of that prophecy. There will also be a consummation or completion of the prophecies relating to the return of Jesus Christ when He will renew the heavens and the earth and do away with sin and death forever by ushering in the new heavens and new earth where only righteousness will dwell (2 Peter 3:10-13).

Pretty foolish indeed. The desolation of the Old Testament congregation was already sealed with the death of Christ, and at the same time He confirmed a New Covenant for one week with His New Testament congregation. The Second Coming will mark the actual consummation, completing that final week right there in the same verse.

But no, you two have got to play verse-hopscotch, dragging “consummation” into verse 26 just so you can dodge the covenant entirely. That’s not interpretation; that’s theological gymnastics. False doctrine at its finest!

 

[covenantee]

I am not the only one. There are many others. For one, here are his articles:

Amillennialism: A Word Direct from the Scriptures
An Exposition of Revelation Chapter 20
The 70 Weeks of Daniel 9

If they're making the same claims as you, what are the names of their cults?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I am not the only one. There are many others. For one, here are his articles:

Amillennialism: A Word Direct from the Scriptures
An Exposition of Revelation Chapter 20
The 70 Weeks of Daniel 9

Ah, so now we know who brainwashed you. Tony Warren. I remember reading a couple of his articles long ago and remember now that he too ridiculously believes in a thousands of years long 70th week. Thanks for revealing that.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Ah, so now we know who brainwashed you. Tony Warren. Thanks for revealing that.

Wrong again. Tony Warren didn’t “brainwash” me—he’s simply one of many faithful teachers the Lord has used. It is the Holy Spirit Himself who opened my eyes to the truth, and no amount of mockery from you will change that. You can sneer at men all you want, but in the end, your argument is with God, not me.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Pretty foolish indeed. The desolation of the Old Testament congregation was already sealed with the death of Christ, and at the same time He confirmed a New Covenant for one week with His New Testament congregation. The Second Coming will mark the actual consummation, completing that final week right there in the same verse.

But no, you two have got to play verse-hopscotch, dragging “consummation” into verse 26 just so you can dodge the covenant entirely. That’s not interpretation; that’s theological gymnastics. False doctrine at its finest!

Hey, person who thinks he's not a moron, was my question too difficult for you when I asked you if you believe the duration of the other 69 weeks are the same? Yes or no? It's a simple question for a non-moron like you.

 

[TribulationSigns]

If they're making the same claims as you, what are the names of their cults?

You can ask him and find out.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Wrong again. Tony Warren didn’t “brainwash” me—he’s simply one of many faithful teachers the Lord has used.

Hahaha. Sure.

It is the Holy Spirit Himself who opened my eyes to the truth, and no amount of mockery from you will change that. You can sneer at men all you want, but in the end, your argument is with God, not me.

No, my argument is definitely with you and your beliefs that you learned from people like Tony Warren. All of the articules you posted were written by him, so I get the impression that what you believe mostly comes from him.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

If they're making the same claims as you, what are the names of their cults?

Looks like Tony Warren's organization is called The Mountain Retreat which he calls a "Center for Biblical Theology and Eschatology". Hey, @TribulationSigns does he believe in Calvinism like you, too? If so, did you learn Calvinism from him?

 

[TribulationSigns]

Hahaha. Sure.

Not my problem if you doubt. I dare you to go ask to talk with him. You can't claim he is not a faithful teacher if you won't talk with him or even read many of his articles.

No, my argument is definitely with you and your beliefs that you learned from people like Tony Warren. All of the articules you posted were written by him, so I get the impression that what you believe mostly comes from him.

Guess you did not read well. I said one of many faithful teachers. There are many of us out there than you think, instead of accusing me of being the "infallible oracle of truth,." or "sole purveyors of truth".

LOL!!!

 

[TribulationSigns]

Looks like Tony Warren's organization is called The Mountain Retreat which he calls a "Center for Biblical Theology and Eschatology". Hey, @TribulationSigns does he believe in Calvinism like you, too? If so, did you learn Calvinism from him?

No. Go talk with him. Keep researching, bud.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Not my problem if you doubt. I dare you to go ask to talk with him. You can't claim he is not a faithful teacher if you won't talk with him or even read many of his articles.

As if I would be afraid to talk to anyone, including him? I surely am not. But, I don't know where he is located. Are you just talking about emailing him or something? I have read a few of his articles in the past, which I had forgotten about until now. I do recall that what you believe matches up with what I recall him teaching, including the very long 70th week and so on. And I knew he was an Amillennialist. But, you guys just go overboard with spiritualizing as much scripture as you possibly can and I don't buy any of that.

Guess you did not read well. I said one of many faithful teachers.

That's why you only posted articles by him? That suggests that you learned primarily from him. Is that not true?

There are many of us out there than you think, instead of accusing me of being the "infallible oracle of truth,." or "sole purveyors of truth".

LOL!!!

Hey, buddy, You're the only one on this forum who believes a lot of the things you do, so that's what we were going by. I don't know how you are defining "many", though. I doubt it's very many at all who believe like you do.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

No. Go talk with him. Keep researching, bud.

Which question are you answering here, bud? No, he is not a Calvinist or no, you didn't learn Calvinism from him? Am I "bud" to you now instead of "moron"? Have I been promoted?

Also, how do I go talk to him exactly? And why would I want to? Tell him to come here. I'm talking to you because I want to talk to people on this forum, not go and talk to Tony Warren, wherever he is.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

No. Go talk with him. Keep researching, bud.

Hey, buddy, remember when you said that covenantee and I are not true amillennialists like you (LOL!). Well, here's how your mentor Tony Warren describes amillennialism and I agree with everything he said. So, is he not a true amillennialist or were you wrong to say that I'm not a true amillennialist?

Definition of Amillennialism by Tony Warren (TribulationSigns' Mentor):

Amillennialism
"The word millennium is a Latin term meaning one thousand years. It's from the root words [mille], meaning thousand, and [annum], meaning years. In Greek (yes Greek, not Latin), placing the letter "a" before a word negates the word. So a-millennial literally means "no millennium."
However, we should note that contrary to false claims, Amillennialists do in fact believe there is a millennial reign of Christ, but not on an temporal physical throne upon this sin cursed earth. They believe that the Messiah has come to reign upon the throne of David in the Kingdom of heaven. So the word Amillennial itself is literally accurate as it is understood to mean, "no millennial reign on an earthly or worldly throne." Use of this word in any sense other than a "no future earthly kingdom reign," would be a misnomer.

This view of eschatology maintains that the present reign of Christ (Revelation 20:4), began with His ascension to the throne of God, and that this is what the apostle Peter was speaking about in Acts 2:30-32. Christ instituted His kingdom reign by His death, resurrection, and ascension to the throne of David, and it will be fully realized and manifested in heaven at His second coming.

The Amillennial Christian does not support the idea that the Kingdom of Christ is an intangible, but that it is incontrovertibly real, effectual, substantive, factual and essential. The kingdom is of a spiritual, rather than worldly (earthly) or carnal nature. They believe that the Kingdom of Christ on earth is now being extended and advanced through the preaching of the gospel of Christ, by His witnesses."

 

[TribulationSigns]

No, he is not a Calvinist or no,

No.

you didn't learn Calvinism from him? Am I "bud" to you now instead of "moron"? Have I been promoted?

I’ve learned the doctrines of Calvinism from many authors and sources. So tell me—why the sudden obsession with Tony Warren? Did he start charging you rent for living in your head?

"Bud" in a sarcastic way.

Also, how do I go talk to him exactly?

Ever heard of email? [email protected]

And why would I want to?

It is up to you.

Tell him to come here.

Because of his age, he’s not as active as he used to be. He often tells me he’s too busy with other things. As for this forum, I’ll be retiring it soon after I launch my website, forum and YouTube channel later this year.

I'm talking to you because I want to talk to people on this forum, not go and talk to Tony Warren, wherever he is.

Fair enough. I’ve known him for a long time, and I’m aware that most of his free time is now taken up with his studies and his forum. If you’d like to get his opinion, you can email him or join his forum—though unfortunately, it seems to be dominated lately by someone obsessed with politics. That’s all I can say.