dragonfly said:
Hi williemac,
The very definition of a sin is that it is something that separates a person from God, or removes him from fellowship with God.
That is nowhere near the definition of sin. And for the record, it does not seperate anyone from God from His perspective. He has always been in contact with, conversation with, and interactive with, sinners. It is the sinner who hides from God, not the other way around. God seeks out the sinner, pursues the sinner, loves the sinner.
dragonfly said:
Hi williemac,
T
The issue is nothing to do with forgiveness, but about understanding what God Himself means by REPENTANCE; and by repenting with such a whole-hearted, single-minded desire to be freed from the power of 'the sin' (Romans 5:12) that we receive our petitiion from the Lord when we truly repent. Yes, there may be many other moments of repentance subsequent to this one, but the principle desire to be freed from sin is satisfied by an experience of real repentance. This may not be the first encounter a person has with repentance, but it is a vital milestone in gaining victory over sin.
Secondly, there is no reference in scripture that teaches repentance from sin as a requirement for salvation. Notice I said repentance
from sin. The word repentance comes from two Greek terms, namely "meta" (change) and "noya" (mind). Whenever the word repent is used, it is not automatic that is in reference to sin, unless the context says so. One can repent from any number of theings such as pride, rebellion, unbelief, etc. The word repent does not mean to quit sinning. But don't take my word for that. Check it out for yourself.
dragonfly said:
We then KNOW we have made an eternal choice, because He gives us this knowledge in response to our repentance, and we know He will help us to make good these desires in our three-dimensional lives. This concept was first taught by the apostles. Our intention becomes the mortification the flesh - the ceasing from sins - which war against the Spirit.
Anyone who has consciously identified with Christ's death, wherein the power of sin was broken, knows they can have victory over any sin which attracts them. The power of Christ's resurrection life (through the Holy Spirit) enables the person whose eyes are fixed on Christ, to keep themselves in the love of God, abiding in the true Vine, bearing fruit unto God. If they are doing all that, then they are not serving sin.
John 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.
There is nothing in the teachings of Christ which remotely imply it's impossible to cease from sin. That teaching comes from man; from men/women who would rather look at themselves than Christ; who would rather do what they want instead of what God wants, and who justify indulging themselves despite - or in defiance of - the power of the cross.
Whether this is true or not is not the point. I have no argument with the possibility that sin can be overcome in a believer's life. But this is not a black and white subject. For some, sin can be overcome in an instant. For others, it may take a lifetime. As well, there may be cases where many sins have been overcome in a person's life but they still have one or two areas where they struggle.
The reality is that God is well aware of our humanity and the varying issues and strongholds that beset His chidren. He is not surprised by these. He had a solution. The cross. This gave us forgiveness. It is a starting point in our new life with Him. But is is not fickle or conditional to our own ability. We have this treasure in earthen vessels (2Cor.4:7). Some are stronger than others. Some are weaker than others. Does He break a bended reed? Does He snuff out a smouldering wick? No. He has compassion; something many fellow brothers are shy of.
There is a prevailing focus in the church on the sin issue, as though this is still something that is an issue between man and God for salvation sake. I have news for those people who think this: WRONG! I quoted from Rom.7 for a reason. It is there for our information. With the proper mindset, we can be in a position of no condemnation IN SPITE OF ANY SIN THAT MAY BE PRESENT IN OUR LIVES. This goes for the homosexual as well. Does anyone think for a moment that these gays who come to the Lord for forgiveness would refuse His work in their heart to take away their homosexual desires? Think of the struggle each one was facing when these desires reared their ugly head in their lives in the first place.
They were faced with the very thing that the law was given to show us....WE CANNOT CHANGE OURSELVES. Some stay in the closet, ashamed and afraid of their dilema. Others give in and give up. These poor people have suffered a horrible and tragic heart wrenching mental anguish over that which they could not control. And then what do they get from Christianity? Condemnation rather than compassion and forgiveness.
You know waht happens next? They find friends who accept them, take them in, and comfort them and support them. And when they have a choice to make as to who they will align their lives with, its no wonder they march in gay pride parades.
And to top this off, the few that come to the Lord do so at a great risk of being shunned, ridiculed, condemned, and rejected. Sure there are victories in many lives. With God all things are possible. He can take the desires away under the right conditions, and even under impossible conditions. But this does not always happen. In many cases the struggles persist and the damage is deep and devistating. Does God blame and condemn His children for their struggles? Or does He offer grace?
I have a piece of advice for many who may be reading this. In no way, shape, or form, can you climb into the minds or hearts of another man or woman and even come close to knowing what he or she may be going through or thinking...or what kind of shame and pain is holding on to their hearts. The best we can do is to come along side and be a friend, as Jesus was the friend of sinners. Because one thing that is sure; healing will not happen outside of love and acceptance.
This is precisely why the gospel assures us that forgiveness is real and sincere. It is not fickle. Jesus solved the things that He encountered while on earth. The covenant of grace did not begin until after His death and resurrection. However, it is a beginning, not an end. There will be a resurrection for all believers; a day when we will all be changed. So here's the deal; If there is a further change coming, then maybe we should show a little patience, because in the case of every last one of us.. further change is needed.