Is Man Mortal or Immortal?
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“but to us did God reveal [them] through His Spirit, for the Spirit all things doth search, even the depths of God, for who of men hath known the things of the man, except the spirit of the man that [is] in him?
so also the things of God no one hath known, except the Spirit of God. And we the spirit of the world did not receive, but the Spirit that [is] of God, that we may know the things conferred by God on us, which things also we speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Holy Spirit, with spiritual things spiritual things comparing, and the natural man doth not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for to him they are foolishness, and he is not able to know [them], because spiritually they are discerned; and he who is spiritual, doth discern indeed all things, and he himself is by no one discerned; for who did know the mind of the Lord that he shall instruct Him? and we — we have the mind of Christ.”
1 Corinthians 2:10-16 YLT98
so also the things of God no one hath known, except the Spirit of God. And we the spirit of the world did not receive, but the Spirit that [is] of God, that we may know the things conferred by God on us, which things also we speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Holy Spirit, with spiritual things spiritual things comparing, and the natural man doth not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for to him they are foolishness, and he is not able to know [them], because spiritually they are discerned; and he who is spiritual, doth discern indeed all things, and he himself is by no one discerned; for who did know the mind of the Lord that he shall instruct Him? and we — we have the mind of Christ.”
1 Corinthians 2:10-16 YLT98
Davy
Well-Known Member
You are mixing pagan philosophy with small parts of Apostle Paul's Epistle 1 Corinthians 15 where he used seed germination as a symbol for God sowing the different bodies.
Apostle Paul gave great detail about what type of body the resurrection is, in 1 Corinthians 15. I suggest you study it.
1stCenturyLady
Well-Known Member
I don't think I have to explain what our body is, but this is what I believe about our spirit and soul.
1 Thes. 5:23
Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you completely; and may your whole spirit, soul, and body be preserved blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
The spirit is our mind. We have been given the mind of Christ 1 Cor. 2:16.
Romans 7:25 shows the battle between mind and law, and flesh and law for those who do not have the mind of Christ, but are still under the law.
Galatians 5:17 with the correct small "s", spirit, instead of Spirit (publisher's error), correlates the mind and spirit. Therefore the soul is our heart/conscience.
I doubt that you have a problem with our immortality, but may about sinner's mortality instead of immortality. I'm glad I will never have to find out!!!
Do you even know that both "destroy" and "perish" actually mean "eternally damned" or "eternal damnation"? So when a person (or a spirit being like Satan) is cast into the Lake of Fire (Gehenna = Hell) he is eternally damned and in eternal torment. And here is the proof: And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever. (Rev 20:10)
One of the best biblical examples to prove that souls are imperishable is found in Luke 16:22,23, which are actually the words of Christ (who knows exactly what happens in both Hades and Gehenna): And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; And in [HADES] he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. [Note: the KJV incorrectly substitutes "hell" for "Hades" in that verse]
So what did Jesus reveal here?
1. The body dies and is buried in the grave.
2. The souls of the righteous dead went to Sheol/Hades (specifically to "Abraham's Bosom")
3. The souls of the unrighteous dead also went to Hades but to a different section (separated by a great "gulf" or chasm.
4. The souls DID NOT perish but were fully conscious as "people" in Hades.
Now if you wish to call Jesus a liar, you can answer to Him. Or you can tell all the others on this forum that you have been (a) seriously deceived, and (b) are in error, and (c) repent of your folly.
Pagan is religion that rises from indigenous people. What philosophy. Also, you mistake the turning of pagan idols to serve Christ as mixed in with truth.
Moses used pagan symbols to express divine revelation. Is his expression of truth adulterated too? The pagans are no more. Where is there an indigenous religion that should be feared rather than turned to Christ?
amigo de christo
Well-Known Member
The lake of fire is real . And if we also read in revelation .
We see satan gets cast into it at the end of the thousand years , the FP and beast were cast in alive
before it and if we keep reading it says that satan too will end up there , where also the beast and the FP have been
They had been there already a thousand years when satan arrives . And its a place for all who rejected JESUS too .
That is a fact . Its real and not one soul would want to go there . SO people need to stop
trying to Air condition or omit the lake of fire , and instead preach the gospel which saves . YEAH . PREACH JESUS CHRIST .
Now let all that draws breath praise the glorious Lord . WE ought to behold both the severity and the goodness of GOD .
Let no man add to nor take from that book , or His words . Many folks have added to the book of revelation
by trying to AC the lake of fire , or by saying it dont even exist , thus omitting . My advice is folks better
reread it . Caus GOD says what he will do to the soul that adds to or takes from that book . Exactly my friend .
Davy
Well-Known Member
Actually no. I've heard of that idea that prior to Adam and Eve sinning, that their flesh was immortal. Sorry, that's a lie which those who want to keep their flesh forever have dreamed up. When Lord Jesus returns in our near future, ending this present world, this world of being in flesh bodies will be over. The type body of the world to come will be a "spiritual body" per Paul in 1 Corinthians 15.
Paul also shows the difference between our flesh and our spirit in Romans 7, that our flesh is what causes most of our sin, and is ordained to perish. So God taking dust of the earth and placing Adam's soul in it made sure that when the tempting came by that old serpent, that sin of the flesh would happen and be attributed to all men, making it a requirement for all born in the flesh to believe on Jesus Christ to have eternal life.
Davy
Well-Known Member
Actually no. I've heard of that idea that prior to Adam and Eve sinning, that their flesh was immortal. Sorry, that's a lie which those who want to keep their flesh forever have dreamed up. When Lord Jesus returns in our near future, ending this present world, this world of being in flesh bodies will be over. The type body of the world to come will be a "spiritual body" per Paul in 1 Corinthians 15.
Paul also shows the difference between our flesh and our spirit in Romans 7, that our flesh is what causes most of our sin, and is ordained to perish. So God taking dust of the earth and placing Adam's soul in it made sure that when the tempting came by that old serpent, that sin of the flesh would happen and be attributed to all men, making it a requirement for all born in the flesh to believe on Jesus Christ to have eternal life.
Davy
Well-Known Member
Like JESUS showed in Matthew 10:28, the soul CAN PERISH IN THE FUTURE LAKE OF FIRE AT THE "SECOND DEATH"!
Davy
Well-Known Member
You poor deceived soul. You show you don't even know the difference between paganism and The Word of God. Pagan religion arose from the Devil himself. And the very first example of that event was in ancient Sumer with Sargon I, a Semite that appeared among those peoples that started idol worship among them, and built their first city, and gave them knowledge of canal building and agriculture. From there, all pagan religion migrated from.
Pagans are no more??? You deceived and untruthful soul!
There are more pagan organizations existing in the world today than ever before, because in earlier centuries the Church knew better than to allow them to exist among them, so the pagans had to go in hiding. Witchcraft is very alive and well today thanks to the pagans that have crept into western governments in the Christian nations.
I even recall one of the heads of Proctor & Gamble which was discovered to be a Satanist, a member of the church of Satan. An interviewed Christian said they would push for a boycott on Proctor & Gamble until they got rid of the guy. The Satanist said no matter, because there weren't enough true Christians today to make a difference.
The Bible says God alone is immortal.
1 Tim 6:15,16
15which the blessed and only Sovereign One—the King of kings and Lord of lords—will bring about in His own time. 16He alone is immortal and dwells in unapproachable light. No one has ever seen Him, nor can anyone see Him. To Him be honor and eternal dominion! Amen.
John 3:16.......that whosoever believeth shall not perish but had everlasting life." The gift of God is eternal life, only for believers. Eternal life is not a given--it is a gift.
If you are "burning in Hell" then you are not dead--you are dying.
Eze 18:4 'Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die."
1 Tim 6:15,16
15which the blessed and only Sovereign One—the King of kings and Lord of lords—will bring about in His own time. 16He alone is immortal and dwells in unapproachable light. No one has ever seen Him, nor can anyone see Him. To Him be honor and eternal dominion! Amen.
John 3:16.......that whosoever believeth shall not perish but had everlasting life." The gift of God is eternal life, only for believers. Eternal life is not a given--it is a gift.
If you are "burning in Hell" then you are not dead--you are dying.
Eze 18:4 'Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die."
But that is not all that the Bible says. The saints will also be immortal after their resurrection (which is in the future): For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. (1 Cor 15:53,54)
Why don't people pay attention to what is in the whole Bible, instead of promoting error? Souls are imperishable, yet we have people FOOLISHLY asserting that they are not imperishable. The term "mortality" applies to the body, which will eventually "put on" immortality. That chapter is all about the bodily resurrection.
I already explained that in the Bible the words "perish" and "destroy" mean "damned". The Second Death = Eternal Damnation. And the context of Revelation 20 (as well as Revelation 14) makes this crystal clear.
"And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever."
Revelation 14:11 mentions that “the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever.” The thought is the same here in verse 10. The “smoke” (the memory of what happened to the beast and the false prophet) will rise up forever, as will the memory of the fate of Satan and the dragon civil power. Verse 10 states, “And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone [into Second Death, from which there can be no resurrection], where the beast and the false prophet are, and [they plural] shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.” Since the beast and the false prophet are symbols of false religious institutions, and not living entities, how can they be tormented? Furthermore, “the dead praise not the Lord, neither any that go down into silence” (Psa. 115:17); and “the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing. . . . Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished” (Eccles. 9:5,6). Since the expression “for ever and ever” signifies literal perpetuity, could this not mean that a true-to-life audiovisual representation or record of the humiliation, fate, and manner of destruction of these enemies of God will be preserved as a witness to all posterity (past, present, and future) lest in some one of the ages to come of eternity, the circumstances surrounding these events be lost to memory? No doubt all history has been filmed under divine supervision, including this scene, which will be a painful reminder of the practices of these evil systems. In other words, there will forever be a showing of the history of mankind—both the good and the evil—so that the memory of these systems, as well as the memory of Jesus’ death, what he endured, and how loyal he was to the Heavenly Father, will be perpetuated. These showings will not be seen constantly by every individual every moment in every place, but when all the different times and seasons of future inhabited planets throughout the universe are considered, the showings will be ceaseless. Sometime, somewhere, a showing will be going on. Hence the torment will be a painful visual memorial rather than nonending physical suffering actually being inflicted and endured throughout eternity
You do realize this is a parable and not literal!
Since you didn't address any of the concepts and ideas I put on the table and proceeded to make claims as if you had.....I'll just say that if you are able to comprehend what I wrote you will find your response refuted. You projected onto me the defects you deny about yourself. What you think is pagan arises from a postchristian culture. It is not an indigenous religion with it's own unbroken myth tradition. You really can't discern the difference?
Witchcraft today is a world view of a man named Lewellen and a book he wrote. I believe it's spelled right. You assume so much with so little information.
How would you convert pagans being as afraid of them as you are, that is if there were any.
I can't believe you ignored a statement about Moses' writing like the one in my post.
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Davy
Well-Known Member
You reveal yourself to me as a non-Christian, even though you put Christian in your avatar. Just what little you've said reveals your thinking does not align with The Word of God.
You don't actually engage in dialogue do ya? Or just not with me? You sling mud at me and call it good eh. My thinking doesn't align with your word. I see you aren't discerning the Spirit of God from your own.
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