Is Obedience a Condition of Salvation?
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Yes you do, if you falsely teach that Christ died for everyone, and we know everyone isnt going to be saved, then you dont believe the death of Christ has saving efficacy in and of itself.
When Christ died for them and legally sanctified them, Justified them, and perfected them, they were not yet born, they could not have received Him before they existed, though He could have died for them before they existed. So receiving Him had nothing to do with it.
Yes many will be made righteous, How ? Rom 5:19
19 For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
thelord's_pearl
Well-Known Member
1There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 12Therefore, brethren, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live after the flesh. 13For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live. 14For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God. 15For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father. 16The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: 17And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together. Faith and DeedsJames 2:14-2614 What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them? 15 Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. 16 If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it? 17 In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead. 18 But someone will say, “You have faith; I have deeds.” Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds. 19 You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder. 20 You foolish person, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless[a]? 21 Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. 23 And the scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,”[b] and he was called God’s friend. 24 You see that a person is considered righteous by what they do and not by faith alone. 25 In the same way, was not even Rahab the prostitute considered righteous for what she did when she gave lodging to the spies and sent them off in a different direction? 26 As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead. New International Version | Par ▾ |
Psalms 1–41
Psalm 1
1Blessed is the one
who does not walk in step with the wicked
or stand in the way that sinners take
or sit in the company of mockers,
2but whose delight is in the law of the Lord,
and who meditates on his law day and night.
3That person is like a tree planted by streams of water,
which yields its fruit in season
and whose leaf does not wither—
whatever they do prospers.
4Not so the wicked!
They are like chaff
that the wind blows away.
5Therefore the wicked will not stand in the judgment,
nor sinners in the assembly of the righteous.
6For the Lord watches over the way of the righteous,
but the way of the wicked leads to destruction.
thelord's_pearl
Well-Known Member
Deutoronomy 28
Blessings for Obedience
28 If you fully obey the Lord your God and carefully follow all his commands I give you today, the Lord your God will set you high above all the nations on earth. 2 All these blessings will come on you and accompany you if you obey the Lord your God:3 You will be blessed in the city and blessed in the country.
4 The fruit of your womb will be blessed, and the crops of your land and the young of your livestock—the calves of your herds and the lambs of your flocks.
5 Your basket and your kneading trough will be blessed.
6 You will be blessed when you come in and blessed when you go out.
7 The Lord will grant that the enemies who rise up against you will be defeated before you. They will come at you from one direction but flee from you in seven.
8 The Lord will send a blessing on your barns and on everything you put your hand to. The Lord your God will bless you in the land he is giving you.
9 The Lord will establish you as his holy people, as he promised you on oath, if you keep the commands of the Lord your God and walk in obedience to him. 10 Then all the peoples on earth will see that you are called by the name of the Lord, and they will fear you. 11 The Lord will grant you abundant prosperity—in the fruit of your womb, the young of your livestock and the crops of your ground—in the land he swore to your ancestors to give you.
12 The Lord will open the heavens, the storehouse of his bounty, to send rain on your land in season and to bless all the work of your hands. You will lend to many nations but will borrow from none. 13 The Lord will make you the head, not the tail. If you pay attention to the commands of the Lord your God that I give you this day and carefully follow them, you will always be at the top, never at the bottom. 14 Do not turn aside from any of the commands I give you today, to the right or to the left, following other gods and serving them.
thelord's_pearl
Well-Known Member
Curses for Disobedience
15 However, if you do not obey the Lord your God and do not carefully follow all his commands and decrees I am giving you today, all these curses will come on you and overtake you:16 You will be cursed in the city and cursed in the country.
17 Your basket and your kneading trough will be cursed.
18 The fruit of your womb will be cursed, and the crops of your land, and the calves of your herds and the lambs of your flocks.
19 You will be cursed when you come in and cursed when you go out.
20 The Lord will send on you curses, confusion and rebuke in everything you put your hand to, until you are destroyed and come to sudden ruin because of the evil you have done in forsaking him.[A] 21 The Lord will plague you with diseases until he has destroyed you from the land you are entering to possess. 22 The Lord will strike you with wasting disease, with fever and inflammation, with scorching heat and drought, with blight and mildew, which will plague you until you perish. 23 The sky over your head will be bronze, the ground beneath you iron. 24 The Lord will turn the rain of your country into dust and powder; it will come down from the skies until you are destroyed.
25 The Lord will cause you to be defeated before your enemies. You will come at them from one direction but flee from them in seven, and you will become a thing of horror to all the kingdoms on earth. 26 Your carcasses will be food for all the birds and the wild animals, and there will be no one to frighten them away. 27 The Lord will afflict you with the boils of Egypt and with tumors, festering sores and the itch, from which you cannot be cured. 28 The Lord will afflict you with madness, blindness and confusion of mind. 29 At midday you will grope about like a blind person in the dark. You will be unsuccessful in everything you do; day after day you will be oppressed and robbed, with no one to rescue you.
30 You will be pledged to be married to a woman, but another will take her and rape her. You will build a house, but you will not live in it. You will plant a vineyard, but you will not even begin to enjoy its fruit. 31 Your ox will be slaughtered before your eyes, but you will eat none of it. Your donkey will be forcibly taken from you and will not be returned. Your sheep will be given to your enemies, and no one will rescue them. 32 Your sons and daughters will be given to another nation, and you will wear out your eyes watching for them day after day, powerless to lift a hand. 33 A people that you do not know will eat what your land and labor produce, and you will have nothing but cruel oppression all your days. 34 The sights you see will drive you mad. 35 The Lord will afflict your knees and legs with painful boils that cannot be cured, spreading from the soles of your feet to the top of your head.
36 The Lord will drive you and the king you set over you to a nation unknown to you or your ancestors. There you will worship other gods, gods of wood and stone. 37 You will become a thing of horror, a byword and an object of ridicule among all the peoples where the Lord will drive you.
38 You will sow much seed in the field but you will harvest little, because locusts will devour it. 39 You will plant vineyards and cultivate them but you will not drink the wine or gather the grapes, because worms will eat them. 40 You will have olive trees throughout your country but you will not use the oil, because the olives will drop off. 41 You will have sons and daughters but you will not keep them, because they will go into captivity. 42 Swarms of locusts will take over all your trees and the crops of your land.
43 The foreigners who reside among you will rise above you higher and higher, but you will sink lower and lower. 44 They will lend to you, but you will not lend to them. They will be the head, but you will be the tail.
45 All these curses will come on you. They will pursue you and overtake you until you are destroyed, because you did not obey the Lord your God and observe the commands and decrees he gave you. 46 They will be a sign and a wonder to you and your descendants forever. 47 Because you did not serve the Lord your God joyfully and gladly in the time of prosperity, 48 therefore in hunger and thirst, in nakedness and dire poverty, you will serve the enemies the Lord sends against you. He will put an iron yoke on your neck until he has destroyed you.
49 The Lord will bring a nation against you from far away, from the ends of the earth, like an eagle swooping down, a nation whose language you will not understand, 50 a fierce-looking nation without respect for the old or pity for the young. 51 They will devour the young of your livestock and the crops of your land until you are destroyed. They will leave you no grain, new wine or olive oil, nor any calves of your herds or lambs of your flocks until you are ruined. 52 They will lay siege to all the cities throughout your land until the high fortified walls in which you trust fall down. They will besiege all the cities throughout the land the Lord your God is giving you.
53 Because of the suffering your enemy will inflict on you during the siege, you will eat the fruit of the womb, the flesh of the sons and daughters the Lord your God has given you. 54 Even the most gentle and sensitive man among you will have no compassion on his own brother or the wife he loves or his surviving children, 55 and he will not give to one of them any of the flesh of his children that he is eating. It will be all he has left because of the suffering your enemy will inflict on you during the siege of all your cities. 56 The most gentle and sensitive woman among you—so sensitive and gentle that she would not venture to touch the ground with the sole of her foot—will begrudge the husband she loves and her own son or daughter 57 the afterbirth from her womb and the children she bears. For in her dire need she intends to eat them secretly because of the suffering your enemy will inflict on you during the siege of your cities.
58 If you do not carefully follow all the words of this law, which are written in this book, and do not revere this glorious and awesome name —the Lord your God— 59 the Lord will send fearful plagues on you and your descendants, harsh and prolonged disasters, and severe and lingering illnesses. 60 He will bring on you all the diseases of Egypt that you dreaded, and they will cling to you. 61 The Lord will also bring on you every kind of sickness and disaster not recorded in this Book of the Law, until you are destroyed. 62 You who were as numerous as the stars in the sky will be left but few in number, because you did not obey the Lord your God. 63 Just as it pleased the Lord to make you prosper and increase in number, so it will please him to ruin and destroy you. You will be uprooted from the land you are entering to possess.
64 Then the Lord will scatter you among all nations, from one end of the earth to the other. There you will worship other gods—gods of wood and stone, which neither you nor your ancestors have known. 65 Among those nations you will find no repose, no resting place for the sole of your foot. There the Lord will give you an anxious mind, eyes weary with longing, and a despairing heart. 66 You will live in constant suspense, filled with dread both night and day, never sure of your life. 67 In the morning you will say, “If only it were evening!” and in the evening, “If only it were morning!”—because of the terror that will fill your hearts and the sights that your eyes will see. 68 The Lord will send you back in ships to Egypt on a journey I said you should never make again. There you will offer yourselves for sale to your enemies as male and female slaves, but no one will buy you.
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I also agree with @1stCenturyLady Scriptures.
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
So Jesus Christ is a LIAR?
You guys like to choose ONLY the verses that SEEM to support what you believe, and IGNORE those AGAINST your FALSE views!
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
Hi, if by "God who brings us to repentance and belief", you mean that God the Holy Spirit "convicts" the sinner of their sins and lostness, then this is Biblical. If you mean that God "enables" us to "repent and believe", through the Spirit, then this is not Biblical, as it destroys the FREE WILL that all humans have been given, which is why the Bible says, CHOOSE, as in Joshua 24:15, and John 5:39, where sinners REFUSE to obey the Gospel of salvation in Jesus Christ, etc.
I’ve already posted scripture on repentance...God brings us to repentance as it’s his will for his Born Again Children....
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
which is the same as God repenting and believing for us!
This is modern "Reformed/Calvinistic" unbiblical nonsense!
Sinners are commanded to repent, and if they don't, then they are damned. they have this choice in their beings.
There is not a single verse in the 66 Books of the Bible that say God "enables" us to repent, as this would make us robots/machines
Repentance comes from God....he leads us to repentance...as his living word says?
You can’t lead yourself to repentance...that’s preposterous!!
God also chooses his children...read the scripture above ..scroll up , you should understand what he is saying there, if you are Born Again.....
II Corinthians 7:10 New King James Version (NKJV)
For godly sorrow produces repentance leading to salvation, not to be regretted; but the sorrow of the world produces death.
“Or do you presume on the riches of His kindness and forbearance and patience, not knowing that God’s kindness is meant to lead you to repentance?”
– Romans 2:4
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ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
read what Paul writes here
It is GODLY SORROW from the sinner that produces repentance leading to their salvation. It is NOT God Who does OUR "repenting" for us!
It is because of what God has already done for all sinners, and the convicting of the Holy Spirit in the sinners heart, that "leads" the sinner to repent
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
this is what I wrote last year, let me kn ow your thoughts
The Bible Way of Salvation
This is how I see that Bible’s way for a sinner to get saved. No human being can, in and of themselves, call upon the Lord for their salvation. The Bible is very clear, as Romans 3:11 says: “There is no one who seeks after God”. The natural person would not desire to give their lives to the...
www.christianityboard.com
The New Testament is full of evidence that we cannot lose our salvation. Jesus said that the new life we have is eternal, not temporal, and we will never die (Luke 20:36). He said that no one can snatch us out of His hand (John 10:28–29). Paul tells us that we’ve been sealed with the Holy Spirit (Ephesians 1:13–14) and that our calling will never be revoked (Romans 11:29).
God will never leave us and never forsake us (Hebrews 13:5). We are protected by His power (1 Peter 1:5). God is able to save us completely because He alwayslives to intercede for us for any sins imaginable (Hebrews 7:25).
Why did Jesus so confidently say that of everyone the Father has given Him, He will lose no one (John 6:39)? Because it’s not our dedication, our commitment, or our promise-keeping that maintains our salvation. No, the book of Hebrews actually reveals the polar opposite: it’s God’s promise to Himself that secures our salvation (Hebrews 6:13–20).
The author of Hebrews speaks of a promise secured between “two unchangeable things” that anchor our souls. What are these two unchangeable things? God and God.
In the same way God, desiring even more to show to the heirs of the promise the unchangeableness of His purpose, interposed with an oath, so that by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have taken refuge would have strong encouragement to take hold of the hope set before us. This hope we have as an anchor of the soul, a hope both sure and steadfast and one which enters within the veil. (Hebrews 6:17–19)
It is impossible for God (and God!) to lie. So when God promises God, you can count on it. And that’s the whole point–our salvation is anchored to a promise that God made to Himself: “since He could swear by no one greater, He swore by Himself ” (Hebrews 6:13b).
God will never leave us and never forsake us (Hebrews 13:5). We are protected by His power (1 Peter 1:5). God is able to save us completely because He alwayslives to intercede for us for any sins imaginable (Hebrews 7:25).
Why did Jesus so confidently say that of everyone the Father has given Him, He will lose no one (John 6:39)? Because it’s not our dedication, our commitment, or our promise-keeping that maintains our salvation. No, the book of Hebrews actually reveals the polar opposite: it’s God’s promise to Himself that secures our salvation (Hebrews 6:13–20).
The author of Hebrews speaks of a promise secured between “two unchangeable things” that anchor our souls. What are these two unchangeable things? God and God.
In the same way God, desiring even more to show to the heirs of the promise the unchangeableness of His purpose, interposed with an oath, so that by two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have taken refuge would have strong encouragement to take hold of the hope set before us. This hope we have as an anchor of the soul, a hope both sure and steadfast and one which enters within the veil. (Hebrews 6:17–19)
It is impossible for God (and God!) to lie. So when God promises God, you can count on it. And that’s the whole point–our salvation is anchored to a promise that God made to Himself: “since He could swear by no one greater, He swore by Himself ” (Hebrews 6:13b).
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
I have posted scripture...that God leads us to repentance...I have showed you that scripture time and time again.
If you are trolling ...then I suggest you stop...or I will put you on ignore.
II Corinthians 7:10 New King James Version (NKJV)
For godly sorrow produces repentance leading to salvation, not to be regretted; but the sorrow of the world produces death.
“Or do you presume on the riches of His kindness and forbearance and patience, not knowing that God’s kindness is meant to lead you to repentance?”
– Romans 2:4
ByGraceThroughFaith
Well-Known Member
I repeat for the last time. Paul is CLEAR that GODLY SORROW of the sinner that leads to salvation! It does not say that God leads...
In Romans 2, it is God's KINDNESS in the Gospel that LEADS sinners to repent!
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