Is smoking a sin?

[farouk]

No need to struggle brother.

Just continue in the liberty of the faith that pleases the Lord, even if not all men.

It's only Him and His Word we answer to. Not men and their rules.

Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

@robert derrick Well, exactly...

Look at Spurgeon, for example; he smoked and he was a mighty servant of the Lord.

No need for ppl to bear themselves up....

 

[robert derrick]

Good if ppl can quit. But I struggle with the whole legalism thing.

All the rules of men, that they make for themselves, and falsely preach for doctrine of Christ, are as them that would have others circumcised after their circumcision in order to be saved:

Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

Once we obey them in one point, they will then be thirsting to have us circumcised unto all their rules and points of law, that Jesus never said to His own apostles:

For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

Such circumcision of the flesh by carnal ordinances of men, become the proselytized sign of their obedience to their own church and religion:

Cult circumcision.

Which is why Paul exhorts us to stand fast in the liberty wherewith Christ has made us free, and not to be put into the yoke of bondage of other men's commandments.

Such circumcision is without profit, and is by which we fall from grace.

 

[BarneyFife]

Good if ppl can quit. But I struggle with the whole legalism thing.

But what's legalistic about denying church membership to a person professing to love Christ who is living in open sin?

1 Corinthians 5:5 Parallel: To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

 

[farouk]

But what's legalistic about denying church membership to a person professing to love Christ who is living in open sin?

1 Corinthians 5:5 Parallel: To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

Would you have excommunicated the great preacher Spurgeon because he smoked?

Would you?

 

[BarneyFife]

Look at Spurgeon, for example; he smoked and he was a mighty servant of the Lord.

Look at Solomon. He was an infidel and adulterer. He wrote part of the Bible. He called all of his own shenanigans "vanity." There were people claiming smoking was therapeutic in Spurgeon's time.

 

[BarneyFife]

Would you have excommunicated the great preacher Spurgeon because he smoked?

Would you?

I probably would have been just about as ignorant as he was about tobacco. How would I have known to excommunicate him?

 

[farouk]

I probably would have been just about as ignorant as he was about tobacco. How would I have known to excommunicate him?

This why I don't get the whole guilt manipulation thing that goes with some church 'culture'.

 

[robert derrick]

It's pretty much the same in the Seventh-day Adventist church. It's considered to be a violation of the commandment not to kill as well as the concept of destroying the temple of the Holy Spirit.

Don't forget the anti-caffeine Mormons.

Seriously, once we begin going down that ever-narrowing and winding road of making our own convictions into law of God for all, there really is no end.

The Pharisees perfected it into a religions system, by which they could justify rejecting Jesus as the Messiah.

And I was in a similar group who would do the same, since I know Jesus would not bow down to their 'holiness' rules.

It is a very pernicious and self-righteousness thing, that ends up looking any and everywhere for some sort of 'sin' to condemn, and concludes with spying on any and everyone found committing such 'infractions' against the rules.

Avoiding the appearance of evil no more had anything to do with testimony Christ before the world, but seriously became a mechanism of fear and control, lest any of us be 'found transgressing' some new carnal rule to obey.

I know what I speak of, because I was one of those ministerial spies, that reported to the leadership I was rising up in.

But, as Paul said, I did it ignorantly in unbelief. The unbelief was in not believing the Scriptures as written only, and not holding only to the true Head of the body: Jesus Christ.

 

[BarneyFife]

This why I don't get the whole guilt manipulation thing that goes with some church 'culture'.

It should have nothing to do with manipulation. It's about church discipline and governance, which is biblical. It's no fun, but it's necessary.

 

[farouk]

It should have nothing to do with manipulation. It's about church discipline and governance, which is biblical. It's no fun, but it's necessary.

So you would have wanted Spurgeon to be excommunicated then? because he smoked....

 

[robert derrick]

But what's legalistic about denying church membership to a person professing to love Christ who is living in open sin?

1 Corinthians 5:5 Parallel: To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

But what's legalistic about denying church membership to a person professing to love Christ who is living in open sin?

1 Corinthians 5:5 Parallel: To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

Living in open sin, that is sin indeed according to the Scriptures. is what we are to not keep company with.

Making up sin to then not keep company with the rest of the body of Christ is cultism. The source of all division in the body.

Special little rules for puny little groups.

 

[BarneyFife]

Seriously, once we begin going down that ever-narrowing and winding road of making our own convictions into law of God for all, there really is no end.

It's all becoming more and more lenient in the Adventist church. So no worries.

 

[BarneyFife]

So you would have wanted Spurgeon to be excommunicated then? because he smoked....

Did I not make it clear that I would not have done so?

 

[robert derrick]

Would you have excommunicated the great preacher Spurgeon because he smoked?

Would you?

Of course. Personal rules made into law get very personal with others.

The Mormons was excommunicate him for caffeine.

But, of course, Spurgeon never became a cult follower anyway.

Whether of the anti-smoking, or the anti-caffeine variety.

 

[farouk]

Did I not make it clear that I would not have done so?

Well, okay; maybe we're not communicating so well...

Thanks anyway...

 

[robert derrick]

It's all becoming more and more lenient in the Adventist church. So no worries.

Doesn't matter to me.

I don't spend my time worrying about what self-made outsiders think and do, since Jesus tells us not to:

Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

 

[BarneyFife]

Making up sin to then not keep company with the rest of the body of Christ is cultism. The source of all division in the body.

Special little rules for puny little groups.

The Seventh-day Adventist church is the fastest-growing protestant denomination in the world. It has over 20,000,000 members. The word "cult" is highly subjective. But, alas, I'm used to it.

 

[BarneyFife]

Doesn't matter to me.

I don't spend my time worrying about what self-made outsiders think and do, since Jesus tells us not to:

Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

What is a "self-made outsider?"

 

[robert derrick]

What is a "self-made outsider?"

Those who make up their own rules of carnal ordinance to live by in the flesh, which are not written in Scripture for doctrine and law of Christ.

I.e. Smoking, drinking, caffeine, theatres, women cutting hair, eating fish on Fridays, etc... is sin.

Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances (Touch not; taste not; handle not; Which all are to perish with the using) after the commandments and doctrines of men?

 

[liafailrock]

The Bible does not mention smoking, or other means of using tobacco. However, it contains principles showing that God does not approve of unhealthy and unclean habits and thus views smoking as a sin.

Respect for life. “God . . . gives to all people life and breath.” (Acts 17:24, 25) Since life is a gift from God, we should not do anything that would shorten our life, such as smoking. Smoking is one of the main causes of preventable death worldwide.

Love of neighbor. “You must love your neighbor as yourself.” (Matthew 22:39) Smoking around others does not show love. Those who are routinely subjected to secondhand smoke are at higher risk of some of the same diseases that smokers often suffer from.

The need to be holy. “Present your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and acceptable to God.” (Romans 12:1) “Let us cleanse ourselves of every defilement of flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.” (2 Corinthians 7:1) Smoking is unnatural and incompatible with being holy—that is, clean and pure—because tobacco users intentionally consume toxins that seriously damage their body.

How do you feel about it?

I agree with your biblical analysis. That said, I'm not sure an occasional smoke is wrong, either. The issue is if it's habitual it causes poor health. But then again, those who would condemn smoking may very well be overly fat (gluttony) while not touching a drop of alcohol (that's permitted). So anything overdone is a form of gluttony. Native Americans would live long and yet smoke tobacco because it was sacred. But they had restraint. They were not out on break every 5 minutes smoking a proverbial peacepipe the way you see some people at work. In short, one has to discern if they are smoking because they feel they need it or are they just enjoying life? If they need it then they are in bondage to it. If one wants to smoke, I'd recommend giving up over-the-counter cigarettes which is processed tobacco and much like food, get natural and make your own pipe or whatever. But that's costly some may protest. Well, if one is smoking that much that they feel that way, then they are in the "Need" category. It's not too costly if it's once in awhile.