CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
On the contrary, as Jesus said, someone will not believe the gospel until that individual has been born again or born from above. (John 3) Someone will not come to Jesus unless the Father first draws him. (John 6)
Is the Gift of Salvation nullified by the consequences of refusal?
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Behold
Well-Known Member
You are teaching the lie of Hyper Calvinism.
Notice something.........
If you are born again, so that you can THEN Believe....the gospel.......that means you have no FAITH in Christ YET, and are born again by God, without it.
That can't happen, yet that is the Hyper Calvinism DUNG you are spreading here on the Forum.
See, this Demonic Lie you are teachng, is a Rejection of God's requirement of FAITH........and that is ...>> All who give their Faith in Christ to God... God will accept.
You, like all of Calvin's Dupes....his Deceived, are teaching that God is saving the person, and forgiving the person, BEFORE they have trusted in Christ..
And that is a serious Cross Rejecting Lie.
Listen,
God does not Save anyone, or forgiven anyone until the SINNER gives God their Faith in Christ, and their "FAITH is counted by God".
That's God's requirment that you are omitting, because your Hyper Calvinism is a mind blinding situation, regarding how to understand SALVATiON as GOD Offers it.
Our FAITH.... has to come first, and then, ......God forgives, and THEN God gives them the new birth in Christ.
You are teaching the TULIP... "5 points of Calvinism" - Hyper Calvinism Lie = that God saves the person, and forgives the person, and gives them the new birth BEFORE they have ever trusted in CHRIST by Faith.......and that LIE is one you need to stop selling on a "christian forum"... @CadyandZoe ., and a few others.
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
Have you heard the child's fairytale called "Rumpelstiltskin?" This story illustrates how a name can control some people.
Your logic breaks down because believing the Gospel is the same as having faith in Christ.
Reflect and meditate on why you feel the need to berate people.
I teach what the Bible says. And I support my teaching with evidence from scripture. Try to formulate an objection based on ideas and concepts found in scripture. Then, we can have a productive conversation.
I understand what you are saying. But your view is not found in the scriptures, and it isn't true to real life. Upon quiet contemplation, many have discovered that God was at work in their lives and hearts long before they finally resolved to believe and trust in him. Jesus tells us that an individual can't see or even recognize the kingdom of God until such a person is born again. He likens the new birth experience to the power of the wind.
Belief is not God's requirement; belief is God's gift. Telling someone to believe something that they don't want to consider is like telling someone to fly up to the moon. But when God pours out his spirit upon someone, it is as if God gave them wings. All I can do, all anyone can do, is greet the new day with rejoicing and thankfulness.
Behold
Well-Known Member
God requires our faith in Christ.
Its our Faith, that God accepts to accpet us, as our "FAITH is counted by God".
God does not give us faith, or cause us to have it, as if He did then that is not OUR Belief.
God is looking for OUR faith, as its OUR Faith that God accepts.
So, what you are teaching is the typical demonic Hyper-Calvinism, that says......"you are born again in Sin"... before you are forgiven, so that you can then have faith in Christ.
So, even a 5 yr old can understand that this is crazy theology.........
See, if God gives you the new Birth, that means that God has joined Himself spiritually, to the person, = Spiritual union with God.
And what you are teaching that is a "doctrine of devils" is that Holy God is joining Himself to an UNFORGIVEN SINNER, and after this, they are caused to have Faith.
That will never happen.
Hyper Calvinism is a mind bliding theological insanity, that has God spiritually birthing an unforgiven sinner, so that once this happens, they can then give God what He required that they give him, initially before He will forgive them, and THEN give them the new birth.
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Ritajanice
Born-Again
100% Amen!..Brother, for myself, God gave me the supernatural gift of a Living faith in his Son, it blew my mind, when he regenerated my spirit, my testimony is in the Living Spirit Of God, who testifies to my spirit that it’s Born Again...Praise God.
The Spirit cannot indwell the heart of an unforgiven believer, our sins are forgiven us by God neither can they be Born Again not until God brought me to initially believe in Jesus....no belief in Jesus no rebirth, no one can come to the Father except through the Son, His Name is Jesus.
In my case God did it all...there was no Bible in sight...my miracle birth I call it.
Bible verses don’t testify with our spirit that it’s Born Again, that is a mind blowing supernatural act that only the Living Spirit can perform..
Unfortunately those who believe that they chose God, don’t understand those who were chosen by God and vice versa.....hence all the back and forth arguing.as some as we can see, try and tell us how we became Born Again...
The Living testimony in my spirit will NEVER be denied....all Glory goes to God...
Spirit gives birth to spirit..33 years ago I became Born Of The Spirit.....absolutely mind blowing.....a supernatural event that I will NEVER forget...
None can deny Gods Living Witness, His Living Holy Spirit..
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Ritajanice
Born-Again
Yup!...Amen!..Born Of The Spirit...not a Bible in sight...
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
Remember God's covenant with Abraham as recorded in Genesis 15. God passed through the cuttings alone.
CadyandZoe
Well-Known Member
I suspect that the Spirit may be moving among our youth. Have you noticed this yourself?
Ritajanice
Born-Again
Amen!...the Living Spirit hovers....who knows who will become Born Of The Spirit next....praying for my teenage grandchildren ......he’s drawing those to Jesus by the power of His Living Spirit....mind blowing....
The Living Spirit is everywhere there is nowhere we can go, where he isn’t there....incredible power that our human brain/ thinking could never comprehend.
| Audio Cross Study Comm Heb Verse (Click for Chapter) New International Version Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. New Living Translation The earth was formless and empty, and darkness covered the deep waters. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the surface of the waters. English Standard Version The earth was without form and void, and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters. |
Right.
We aren't saved by the Bible.
We aren't saved by the church.
We aren't saved by baptism.
We aren't saved by doctrine.
Only God can save.
God saves us through a renewed relationship with Him.
Salvation is a relationship with God.
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Taken
Well-Known Member
Is the Gift of Salvation nullified by the consequences of refusal?
Interesting question.
Response:
Yes and No.
Refusal, not defined.
Refusal of what?
Glory to God,
Taken
That is key to the point I'm trying to make. Thanks.
Oftentimes it is the church or "Christianity" with its political slant that is being rejected.
Christians have such a bad reputation in society that no one wants to be associated with them.
This is markedly different than rejecting God.
The church has make themselves out to be the source of the gift of salvation.
I think many have sought God on their own terms instead. And have found Him.
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Taken
Well-Known Member
Salvation of ones Soul … (and spirit “born again”)…
* IS ONLY given a man AFTER “a God Accounted” Bodily Death.
Men wondering…
1 Cor 15:
[35] But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?
Response…
1 Cor 15:
[36] Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:
The sowing…soul Saved
The quickening…spirit Born Again
* First Requires… Belief in God and Jesus rose up from the dead, IN one’s Heart, AT the Time they bodily Die.
God will Search the mans Heart, if his Belief be True, God shall Save his Soul, And his saved living soul shall depart his dead body and be escorted to Heaven with God.
This is Gods’ Saving.
And God shall raise his body in the First Resurrection.
1 Thes 4
[14] For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
First Required…
Belief in God, Belief Jesus rose from the Dead, Belief Jesus IS THE CHRIST …
Call on the Lords NAME…Jesus…Confession to the Lord, Heartful belief…in God, In Jesus’ Resurrection, “THAT Jesus IS the Christ….”
*And Vow their Body unto the Lord…
…ie Crucified WITH Jesus’ Body…
Then CHRIST the Lord will “ RIGHT THEN” , after their bodily “Crucifixion bodily accounted Death”
Spiritually Save their Soul, Quicken their spirit….
And WHY….OSAS applies….Because that mans Natural Body is Spiritually Accounted Dead….his “old natural body can not be again alive…and be without his salvation.”
The Spirit of God enters that man, dwells in that man, keeps that man in Belief forever, by Gods Power.
That man Spiritually dwells IN Jesus’ Risen Glorified body…
Thus that man is called: ‘IN CHRIST’.
It is CHRIST JESUS who saved that man’s soul …
and Christ Jesus who quickened that mans spirit…
and Christ Jesus who will raise up that man’s body, to the Clouds ( manifested in the spirit / glorified)…
and Jesus who will (in the LIKENESS AS A Man) descend and Sit on a White cloud, FOR all men, to See Him.
and with Him is , His angels (unseen by mortal men,)and All IN Christ, risen up in Glorified Bodys ,( unseen by mortal men…)
In brief…
…then CHRIST JESUS, with His Angels, Quickened men, shall Occupy Christ Jesus’ Kingdom….while Remaining Mortals, begin repopulation of the Earth, building, towns, cities, nations.
1 Thes 4:
[15] For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
[16] For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
[17] Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up [RAPTURE] together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
Glory to God,
Taken
Taken
Well-Known Member
They IN Christ:
“ARE” Saved…”ARE” Quickened….NOW.
Ronald David Bruno
Well-Known Member
The gift is contingent on your belief that Jesus died for your sins and rose on the third day. It doesn't cost you anything to believe. Those who reject Jesus aren't offered the gift. Your faith is your gift ... and it appears you have little! Lack of faith prohibits salvation.
Doubts are expected, we have a lot of questions and ignorance when we first receive are introduced to Christ and His Word. As we learn about Him, those doubts dissolve, questions are answered, faith grows, fruit develops. But if one struggles with endless doubts, negativity and does not produce fruit _ as the years go by, you have to ask yourself, do I really believe?
Seed that was scattered on shallow soil may sprout roots, get excited for awhile, but something is missing: a transformation, new life, hunger for nourishment. When the trials and tribulations of life start to get heavy, you fall away, because you never realy had the gift to begin with.
With those who are truly in Christ, they experience a transformation, tje are new creatures, their soil ( hearts) were prepared to receive the seed and they nourished it with water ( the Holy Spirit and rhe Word); and it grew to eventually produce fruit: faith, joy, peace, love, kindness, goodness, self control, patience, gentleness..
Sister-n-Christ
Active Member
Jesus told us,no one comes to him unless the Father leads them there. He also tells us,the Holy Spirit enters into those God calls and lets their natural mind ,otherwise thinking the things of God are foolishness, to understand the things of God and therein receive God's calling.
And once this is done,Jesus said,of all the Father gives him he will lose none,no one.
Believe that.
God is Sovereign and has Dominion over his creation.
God wrote your name in his Lambs Book of Life before the foundation of the world. He knew you before the womb. And he changed your natural mind, and then called you home.
You might think you can leave God. However, God said,he will never lose you. God is Omnipresent.
He sees you. Eternally.
People will sometimes think their will can overcome God's.
"I can lose faith and that's it!"
If they are of and within God,and He within them,that never happens.
You are reborn,regenerated as a new creation when you answer His call.
There's no going back. Those who are truly his,are so forever.
God knows whom he calls.
And he knows whom he has not.
And once this is done,Jesus said,of all the Father gives him he will lose none,no one.
Believe that.
God is Sovereign and has Dominion over his creation.
God wrote your name in his Lambs Book of Life before the foundation of the world. He knew you before the womb. And he changed your natural mind, and then called you home.
You might think you can leave God. However, God said,he will never lose you. God is Omnipresent.
He sees you. Eternally.
People will sometimes think their will can overcome God's.
"I can lose faith and that's it!"
If they are of and within God,and He within them,that never happens.
You are reborn,regenerated as a new creation when you answer His call.
There's no going back. Those who are truly his,are so forever.
God knows whom he calls.
And he knows whom he has not.
Sister-n-Christ
Active Member
And just a small note. Salvation is God's free irrevocable gift. Eternal irrevocable Salvation.
If you encounter any who tell you that is not true,when God said it is, ignore them.
They are of the Devil. A liar from the beginning.
They seek to lead you into unbelief in God's words. And if they succeed,Satan wins. Have no doubts.
If you encounter any who tell you that is not true,when God said it is, ignore them.
They are of the Devil. A liar from the beginning.
They seek to lead you into unbelief in God's words. And if they succeed,Satan wins. Have no doubts.
Agree.
There is nothing we can do to undo what only God can do in the first place.
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