Is the Word of God only found in scripture?

[Ronald Nolette]

The deuterocanonicals were formally canonised in 382 along with the rest of the OT as I showed in my quotes.

From a Protestant source:
A council probably held at Rome in 382 under St. Damasus gave a complete list of the canonical books of both the Old Testament and the New Testament (also known as the 'Gelasian Decree' because it was reproduced by Gelasius in 495), which is identical with the list given at Trent. (The Oxford Dictionary of the Christian Church, 2nd ed., p. 232)

From the Catholic Encyclopedia
Two documents of capital importance in the history of the canon constitute the first formal utterance of papal authority on the subject. The first is the so-called "Decretal of Gelasius", de recipiendis et non recipiendis libris, the essential part of which is now generally attributed to a synod convoked by Pope Damasus in the year 382. The other is the Canon of Innocent I, sent in 405 to a Gallican bishop in answer to an inquiry. Both contain all the deuterocanonicals, without any distinction, and are identical with the catalogue of Trent.

In addition, the list proclaimed including the deuterocanonicals was confirmed by the Synods of Hippo in 383 and Carthage in 397 and 419.

The attempt by Protestants to fix the canon to Trent is because they can't admit that they removed the deuterocanonicals from the canon but to claim the Catholic Church added them.

Well then correct teh Catholic encyclopedia and tell them they are wrong as well as teh references wikipdia used to show the deuterocanonical books were formally canonized in the 16 the century.

And the word deuteroconanonical means "other canon". Jews also included in their scrolls many non canonized works like "the wars of the Lord", book of Enoch" etc.

 

[Mungo]

Well then correct teh Catholic encyclopedia and tell them they are wrong as well as teh references wikipdia used to show the deuterocanonical books were formally canonized in the 16 the century.

And the word deuteroconanonical means "other canon". Jews also included in their scrolls many non canonized works like "the wars of the Lord", book of Enoch" etc.

The Catholic Encyclopedia is not wrong. Nor is The Oxford Dictionary of the Christian Church, a Protestant publication - much as you would like it to be.

I'm not a big fan of Wikipedia but since you mention it, Wikepedia also says the deuterocanonical books were included in the Council of Rome in 382
According to Decretum Gelasianum, which is a work written by an anonymous scholar between 519 and 553, the Council of Rome (AD 382) cites a list of books of scripture presented as having been made canonical. This list mentions all the deuterocanonical books except Baruch and the Letter of Jeremiah as a part of the Old Testament canon.

Wikipedia also says:
The deuterocanonical books (from the Greek meaning "belonging to the second canon") are books and passages considered by the Catholic Church, the Eastern Orthodox Church, the Oriental Orthodox Churches and the Assyrian Church of the East to be canonical books of the Old Testament.

Note that the Oriental Orthodox Churches split off from the Catholic Church after the Council of Chalcedon in 451 some 1100 years before the Council of Trent yet consider the deuteros as canonical.

The deuterocanonical books were also included in the Greek LXX Old Testament.

Regarding the term deuterocanonical the Catholic Encyclopaedia says
The terms protocanonical and deuterocanonical, of frequent usage among Catholic theologians and exegetes, require a word of caution. They are not felicitous, and it would be wrong to infer from them that the Church successively possessed two distinct Biblical Canons. Only in a partial and restricted way may we speak of a first and second Canon. Protocanonical (protos, "first") is a conventional word denoting those sacred writings which have been always received by Christendom without dispute. The protocanonical books of the Old Testament correspond with those of the Bible of the Hebrews, and the Old Testament as received by Protestants. The deuterocanonical (deuteros, "second") are those whose Scriptural character was contested in some quarters, but which long ago gained a secure footing in the Bible of the Catholic Church.

Also note it says: It should be noted that protocanonical and deuterocanonical are modern terms, not having been used before the sixteenth century.

 

[Wrangler]

Is the Word of God only found in scripture?

Having received a revelation from the Holy Spirit, I am a witness to this question.

In my case, the Words I received were for individuals, not the world.

So, while my Revelations were for specific people, I believe Scripture is meant for man universally. Hope you understand what I’m saying here.

 

[Illuminator]

They were judged as not meeting the requirement to be in scripture.

The Protestants attempt to defend their rejection of the deuterocanonicals on the ground that the early Jews rejected them. However, the Jewish councils that rejected them (e.g., School of Javneh (also called “Jamnia” in 90 – 100 A.D.) were the same councils that rejected the entire New Testament canon. Thus, Protestants who reject the Catholic Bible are following a Jewish council that rejected Christ and the Revelation of the New Testament.

DEUTEROCANONICAL BOOKS IN THE NEW TESTAMENT - Scripture Catholic

 

[Michiah-Imla]

All must be tested by the word of God.

Any teaching adding or taking away from the written word should be ignored.

Especially in these last days.

"What thing soever I command you, observe to do it: thou shalt not add thereto, nor diminish from it." (Deuteronomy 12:32)

 

[Mungo]

All must be tested by the word of God.

Any teaching adding or taking away from the written word should be ignored.

Especially in these last days.

"What thing soever I command you, observe to do it: thou shalt not add thereto, nor diminish from it." (Deuteronomy 12:32)

And did Moses write all this down, hand it out and say this is from God, read it and follow it.

Or did Moses pass this on orally?
Here are a few of clues:
Dt 5:1 And Moses summoned all Israel, and said to them, “Hear, O Israel, the statutes and the ordinances which I speak in your hearing this day, and you shall learn them and be careful to do them.
Not read O Israel.

Dt 6:4 “Hear, O Israel..
Not read O Israel

Dt 7:12 “And because you hearken to these ordinances, and keep and do them"
Hearken (listen) to these ordinances - not read these ordinances

Dt 9:1 “Hear, O Israel; "
Not read O Israel

Also note:
Dt 8:1 “All the commandment which I command you this day you shall be careful to do"
D t10:13 keep the commandments and statutes of the Lord, which I command you this day for your good
Dt 11:8 “You shall therefore keep all the commandment which I command you this day
DT 12:38 Everything that I command you you shall be careful to do
Not read this and work out yourselves what you should be doing.

The only written words of God were the Ten Commandments written on tablets of stone. Everything else was passed on orally from God to Moses and orally from Moses to the people.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Hear, O Israel..
Not read O Israel

"So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God." (Romans 10:17)

@Mungo are you going to argue that the Holy Bible is not the word of God?

What’s your problem man?

With all the wickedness and false doctrines out there these days we need the pure uncorrupted word of God more than ever!

"Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world." (1 John 4:1)

Trying the Catholic Church by the word of God exposes many false teachings that go on unchecked because of blind followers like yourself.

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

1. When the Bible mentions the word of God coming to someone, it usually means God was revealing information to the person or was commanding them to perform certain tasks(ex. Gen. 15:1-4, Isa. 39:5-8, Eze. 12:1-6) What it doesn't mean is that God was giving that person information that contradicts or overrules what was already established. John the Baptizer was a prophet, and God definitely did not give him revelation that contradicted any of the inspired writings.

2. 1 Cor. 11:23 also does absolutely nothing to support your claim. If you look at verses 24-25, Paul proceeded to quote what Christ said in Luk. 22:19-20. This information had to be revealed to Paul via the Holy Spirit because he wasn't present at Christ's final Passover observance as a human being when it occurred.

3. As far as you asking where does Christ say all divine truths are in Scripture, the answer is Deut. 8:3 and Matt. 4:4:

“So He humbled you, allowed you to hunger, and fed you with manna which you did not know nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man shall not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds from the mouth of the LORD."

"But He answered and said, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.’ ”

 

[theefaith]

No, but the Bible is the only book that contains the Inspired Word of God.

ever read the faith story of Susana dan ch. 13?

 

[theefaith]

There is many private revelations. god warns and guides us, but He will never contradict His Word!

and no th
church does not decide what is SCripture. God decides what is SCripture and simply used the church to select which books He wanted and then close th ecanon of Scripture.

where does the scripture say that?
The apostles the church have Christ’s authority Matt 16:18 18:18 Jn 20:21-23 they decide
Ever read the faith story of Susana dan ch. 13?

 

[theefaith]

What you need to realize is the apocryphal books were not canonized by Rome until the mid 16th ce3ntury. This was done as one of the actions against the reformation. Just like in Judaism who has the pseudepigrapha. They are writings but not SCripture. So too with the a[pocryphal books. They are writings but do not rise to the level of Scripture.

when something is cannonized is not an issue the apostles have authority from Christ till he returns

 

[theefaith]

There is many private revelations. god warns and guides us, but He will never contradict His Word!

and no th
church does not decide what is SCripture. God decides what is SCripture and simply used the church to select which books He wanted and then close th ecanon of Scripture.

ferris bueller says Each believer decides for himself

 

[Mungo]

"So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God." (Romans 10:17)

@Mungo are you going to argue that the Holy Bible is not the word of God?

Certainly not. Where did you get that idea from?

The issue is not what is the word of God but how is it propagated and preserved.

What’s your problem man?

I don't have a problem but it seems you do.

With all the wickedness and false doctrines out there these days we need the pure uncorrupted word of God more than ever!

"Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world." (1 John 4:1)

And your point is what?

Trying the Catholic Church by the word of God exposes many false teachings that go on unchecked because of blind followers like yourself.

There are no false doctrines.
No Catholic doctrine (properly understood) contradicts Scripture (properly interpreted).

 

[Mungo]

1. When the Bible mentions the word of God coming to someone, it usually means God was revealing information to the person or was commanding them to perform certain tasks(ex. Gen. 15:1-4, Isa. 39:5-8, Eze. 12:1-6) What it doesn't mean is that God was giving that person information that contradicts or overrules what was already established. John the Baptizer was a prophet, and God definitely did not give him revelation that contradicted any of the inspired writings.

2. 1 Cor. 11:23 also does absolutely nothing to support your claim. If you look at verses 24-25, Paul proceeded to quote what Christ said in Luk. 22:19-20. This information had to be revealed to Paul via the Holy Spirit because he wasn't present at Christ's final Passover observance as a human being when it occurred.

3. As far as you asking where does Christ say all divine truths are in Scripture, the answer is Deut. 8:3 and Matt. 4:4:

“So He humbled you, allowed you to hunger, and fed you with manna which you did not know nor did your fathers know, that He might make you know that man shall not live by bread alone; but man lives by every word that proceeds from the mouth of the LORD."

"But He answered and said, “It is written, ‘Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.’ ”

Yes, EVERY word that proceeds from the moth of God. Not just those written in Scripture.

Dt 8:3 and Mt 4:4 do NOT say that every word that proceeds from the mouth of God is written in Scripture.
Scripture alone is a false doctrine and contradicts Scripture (2Thess 2:15, 1Cor 11:34, 2Tim 2:2)

 

[Michiah-Imla]

No Catholic doctrine (properly understood) contradicts Scripture (properly interpreted).

Every false religion and cult uses this tactic to control its followers.

Break free from man’s control my friend!

 

[Mungo]

Every false religion and cult uses this tactic to control its followers.

Break free from man’s control my friend!

Tactic?
It's the truth.

 

[theefaith]

They were judged as not meeting the requirement to be in scripture.

By what authority?

only the apostles have authority from Christ

tradition of men! None of those so called reformers were apostles or had any authority

 

[theefaith]

Having received a revelation from the Holy Spirit, I am a witness to this question.

In my case, the Words I received were for individuals, not the world.

So, while my Revelations were for specific people, I believe Scripture is meant for man universally. Hope you understand what I’m saying here.

public verses private

 

[Ronald Nolette]

The Catholic Encyclopedia is not wrong. Nor is The Oxford Dictionary of the Christian Church, a Protestant publication - much as you would like it to be.

I'm not a big fan of Wikipedia but since you mention it, Wikepedia also says the deuterocanonical books were included in the Council of Rome in 382
According to Decretum Gelasianum, which is a work written by an anonymous scholar between 519 and 553, the Council of Rome (AD 382) cites a list of books of scripture presented as having been made canonical. This list mentions all the deuterocanonical books except Baruch and the Letter of Jeremiah as a part of the Old Testament canon.

Wikipedia also says:
The deuterocanonical books (from the Greek meaning "belonging to the second canon") are books and passages considered by the Catholic Church, the Eastern Orthodox Church, the Oriental Orthodox Churches and the Assyrian Church of the East to be canonical books of the Old Testament.

Note that the Oriental Orthodox Churches split off from the Catholic Church after the Council of Chalcedon in 451 some 1100 years before the Council of Trent yet consider the deuteros as canonical.

The deuterocanonical books were also included in the Greek LXX Old Testament.

Regarding the term deuterocanonical the Catholic Encyclopaedia says
The terms protocanonical and deuterocanonical, of frequent usage among Catholic theologians and exegetes, require a word of caution. They are not felicitous, and it would be wrong to infer from them that the Church successively possessed two distinct Biblical Canons. Only in a partial and restricted way may we speak of a first and second Canon. Protocanonical (protos, "first") is a conventional word denoting those sacred writings which have been always received by Christendom without dispute. The protocanonical books of the Old Testament correspond with those of the Bible of the Hebrews, and the Old Testament as received by Protestants. The deuterocanonical (deuteros, "second") are those whose Scriptural character was contested in some quarters, but which long ago gained a secure footing in the Bible of the Catholic Church.

Also note it says: It should be noted that protocanonical and deuterocanonical are modern terms, not having been used before the sixteenth century.

he Apocrypha were formally canonized by the Roman Catholic 'Church' on April 8, 1546 A.D. at the Council of Trent. The Council of Trent was actually a series of 3 Church councils held between 1545 and 1563 A.D. and dominated by the newly-formed
The Apocrypha
watch.pairsite.com/apocrypha.html

1. 6. The Apocrypha, The Septuagint LXX, and the Canon
   6. The Apocrypha, The Septuagint LXX, and the Canon
   Not until 1546
   

Question:
Again I question your dates. You say that the Catholic Church added the "Apocryphal" books to the Bible in 1546 AD. I'm assuming you are talking about the Council of Trent, the Church's response to the Reformation.

You are correct in saying that the Church affirmed that the "Apocryphal" books are Scripture. However, you are incorrect to say that these were not considered Scripture or were not in the Bible before this date. The Gutenberg Bible, which was printed in the 1450's, contained these extra books. The Council of Rome in 382 declared the Greek Septuagint (Greek translation of the Old Testament) to be Scripture, this included those extra books. At this same council they declared the 27 books of the New Testament that we have to be Scripture. Not to mention that the Orthodox Church uses the "Apocryphal" books, and they were separated from the Catholic Church a few hundred years before the Council of Trent in 1546. So how did they get the books? I also point to the evidence that the early Christian church used the Greek Septuagint as their scriptures. The Apostles and Christ quoted from the Septuagint. So did many Church fathers.

I guess this is where we differ. the Roman church used the Septuagint while others used the Hebrew text. The Hebrew bible does not contain these books and were affirmed as Scripture at Trent. The Septuagint is a translation and also several copies contained some the psudipigrapha of the jews which were rejected by Rome. the early church did not recognize thiese books as much. It wasn't until the church was "gentlized" and greek took over Hebrew that the apocryphal books took on their high popularity.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

where does the scripture say that?
The apostles the church have Christ’s authority Matt 16:18 18:18 Jn 20:21-23 they decide
Ever read the faith story of Susana dan ch. 13?

You misapply Matt. 16:18

Matt. 18:18 is for church discipline- not making doctrine or deciding what is or is not. thje Apostles are bound by God, they had no free reign.

Once again you misapply John 20- that also is for church discipline.

when one receivesd Christ as Savior-- all their sins are forgiven eternally. no one can take back the forgiveness of sin that jesus gives a believer. those sins are forever removed even the futrure ones.

when something is cannonized is not an issue the apostles have authority from Christ till he returns

not to add, subtract or create new doctrines apart from the work of the Spirit.

ferris bueller says Each believer decides for himself

Last I looked ferrisbueller is not God.