Jesus already came, but you did not see him - explained Daniel 7

[Timtofly]

Your private hallucinations aren't mine.

So find someone else to share them with.

Yet you seem to take ownership every time you respond to my post instead of a back and forth normal conversation.

Your reply is on your own terms and conditions set up in your own imagination.

 

[Timtofly]

@Timtofly

Here is what you said in post #25 …





Now you’re saying this …




Which kingdom is the parable of the weeds referring to? I thought you had the millennial kingdom taking place after the second coming. Do you have another kingdom taking place in between the second coming and the millennium?

This parable is about the final harvest.

Your interpretation is about an ongoing kingdom. That is my point. The final harvest is between the time the church was removed from the earth, and the 7th Trumpet. The Millennial Kingdom is the time frame after the 7th Trumpet.

There is no kingdom during the final harvest.

The parable is about the Second Coming in preparation for the Millennial Kingdom.

There is no need to have tares in the Millennial Kingdom. That is why this parable is not about the Millennial Kingdom. It is not a harvest at the end of the Millennial Kingdom, so not about the Millennial Kingdom.

You claim it is about the heavenly kingdom of God, that was established during the Babylonian captivity, and was being prepared for the arrival of Jesus as Messiah. I pointed out it was not about the first coming, but the Second Coming. It is still not about the Millennial Kingdom, but a harvest prior to the start of the Millennial Kingdom.

Is the wheat about the Millennial Kingdom? Sure, that is who lives on the earth for a thousand years. The parable is not as a whole about a kingdom, but a harvest for a kingdom. These people are not in the kingdom until after the harvest is over.

If these people are not part of a kingdom how can this be about a kingdom? No there is no "intermediate kingdom" set up by Jesus.

When you use the term "about", I can only assume you would be referring to an ongoing kingdom. Since some posters here are Amil it is not about their Millennial Kingdom either, as that would end at the Second Coming, and many claim it is the judgment that separates the saved from the lost of all time.

This final harvest is only during a short time span. It is not the end result of a kingdom. It is not about judging an existing kingdom. It is in preparation for the coming kingdom. But it is not about anything that will happen during the Millennial Kingdom.

 

[MatthewG]

Hello @Timtofly,

Thank you for sharing you post. To respond to the first sentence. The reason I framed it the way I did in my post prior was because I believe Jesus stated about the Jewish people having become the synagogue of Satan. The rest of the post I’m not sure what to make out of it. Revelation 2:9 suggest they are they synagogue of satan, Revelation 3:9 suggest Jesus says he will make them of the synagogue of satan. The reason for that was do their obstinance faithlessness and turning to other things like the LAW as God, and not Yahavah himself. Is my best guess which could be right or wrong.

 

[Davidpt]

Hello @Timtofly,

Thank you for sharing you post. To respond to the first sentence. The reason I framed it the way I did in my post prior was because I believe Jesus stated about the Jewish people having become the synagogue of Satan. The rest of the post I’m not sure what to make out of it. Revelation 2:9 suggest they are they synagogue of satan, Revelation 3:9 suggest Jesus says he will make them of the synagogue of satan. The reason for that was do their obstinance faithlessness and turning to other things like the LAW as God, and not Yahavah himself. Is my best guess which could be right or wrong.

Here's what the passage actually says in context.

Revelation 3:9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.


Jesus is the speaker here. And in regards to them that are the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie, meaning Jesus didn't/doesn't make them become this, thus they were already this, that He will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that He has have loved thee. No one ever seems to want to deal with this part, as if Jesus never even said this---behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

Make who come and worship before thy feet? These of course---them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie. The main questions are, when will He do this and how will He do this? IMO, Isaiah 60, for one, maybe answers these questions since Isaiah 60:14 appears to maybe be meaning the ones meant in Revelation 3:9.

 

[MatthewG]

Hello @Davidpt,

Thank you for your mentions would you consider what Paul mentions in Romans 2(29), also part of the equation? Paul’s letter to the people in Rome, he mentions how a true Jew is one of the heart and not of the bloodline of Israelites.

 

[Davidpt]

Hello @Davidpt,

Thank you for your mentions would you consider what Paul mentions in Romans 2(29), also part of the equation? Paul’s letter to the people in Rome, he mentions how a true Jew is one of the heart and not of the bloodline of Israelites.

I get where you are coming from since Romans 2(29) does tend to explain this part in Revelation 3:9---them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie--- but how does Romans 2(29) help explain this part in Revelation 3:9 though---behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee? IOW, what will it look like when He makes them do that?

Also, factoring in, when does He make them do that? And why does He make them do that, and once again, what will it look like once he makes them do that? I'm not seeing how Romans 2(29) might be helpful in regards to this last portion in Revelation 3:9. But I can see how Isaiah 60 might be helpful, though. But even so, not everyone interprets Isaiah 60 in the same manner throughout. Then you have that issue to deal with, what is the correct way to interpret Isaiah 60 throughout? This assuming there is a connection between Isaiah 60:14 and Revelation 3:9.

 

[MatthewG]

Hello @Davidpt

Later on Paul writes a long winded section from Romans 9-11 concerning his outlook on his fellow brethren. From perspective this all has to come into play somehow, can I explain it currently: no. I still stand on the first post (#43) which I had wrote to Timtofly, which the tares was the Jewish people who basically became Satan, in which lead them to being vessels of destruction. I’m a big believer in Satan no longer being around today for sure. I’m not so sure about Isaiah 60. I haven’t read it in a while.

 

[covenantee]

Yet you seem to take ownership every time you respond to my post instead of a back and forth normal conversation.

Your reply is on your own terms and conditions set up in your own imagination.

Was the Reformers' liberation of the True Church imagination?

 

[Timtofly]

Was the Reformers' liberation of the True Church imagination?

The redeemed do not need to be liberated by theology. The Reformers were part of the apostate church, until they decided to walk away. The Reformers did not walk away from God's redeemed nor did they liberate God's redeemed.

Perhaps you need to re-phrase the question?

 

[covenantee]

The redeemed do not need to be liberated by theology. The Reformers were part of the apostate church, until they decided to walk away. The Reformers did not walk away from God's redeemed nor did they liberate God's redeemed.

Perhaps you need to re-phrase the question?

That kind of nonsense is the reason I reject any discussion with you.

Are you a papist?

 

[Timtofly]

That kind of nonsense is the reason I reject any discussion with you.

Are you a papist?

No; a redeemed soul, neither a Protestant Reformer, nor an orthodox or catholic religious adherent.

Is pointing out that Jesus liberated the true church, as your lingo resonates, nonsense? Perhaps your lingo is too theological instead of biblical?

How can humans liberate anything?

"set (someone) free from a situation, especially imprisonment or slavery, in which their liberty is severely restricted."

How did "your true church" ever come under such theological morass to begin with?

Seems there would be some on earth who never associated with groups who became corrupt to begin with, no?

 

[covenantee]

No; a redeemed soul, neither a Protestant Reformer, nor an orthodox or catholic religious adherent.

Is pointing out that Jesus liberated the true church, as your lingo resonates, nonsense? Perhaps your lingo is too theological instead of biblical?

How can humans liberate anything?

"set (someone) free from a situation, especially imprisonment or slavery, in which their liberty is severely restricted."

How did "your true church" ever come under such theological morass to begin with?

Seems there would be some on earth who never associated with groups who became corrupt to begin with, no?

Nonsense and waste of time confirmed.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

Once Saved you truly know Christ Jesus is ! period ! regarless of the second coming ! Such a one can not be born again twice !

All of the People who are Saved knew Christ Jesus, right from the first Jews who got the mesage when Jesus went to Heaven ! They all hold the Key ! each one of the truly Saved Souls hold the Keys.
At the Second comming all will get the mesage, but the deceptions and delusions will have to be burnt up first for them to come to understand ? for they will not have such to dominate over them. for they are to weak in this world ! that is Full of Delusions and Deceptions.

The Kingdom of God will come, but the delusions and deceptions that are cast upon you all have power over you all !
See a Priest that will give in to this world is not Saved in fact ! for he is of this world in fact, he may know of a Jesus but he is not Christ Jesus. for if a true Priest of Christ Jesus would not be bothered with this world or give into such !

 

[Davy]

Don't be deceived brethren about the identity of the "tares" and those Jesus mentioned in Revelation 2:9 and 3:9 as the "synagogue of Satan".


Rev 3:9
9 Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
KJV

The above "synagogue of Satan" is not... about deceived unbelieving Judah. It is about the children of darkness, Satan's own workers ordained under him for this present world...

Matt 13:38-39
38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
KJV

The devil's own is who Jesus was pointing to, not to bloodline Jews of the tribe of Judah that are deceived and still reject Him. That is why Jesus said those of the "synagogue of Satan" CLAIM to be Jews, but lie, and are not. That means they HIDE as Jews among true Judah.

They are the "crept in unawares" of the Book of Jude...

Jude 4
4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.
KJV

Those who try and apply those to just any Jew today that rejects Jesus are deceived as to who those "tares" really are. They crept in among Judah long, long ago back in Old Testament history when Israel failed to destroy the nations of Canaanites which He named in Deuteronomy 20. They were made bondservants in Israel, and some of them eventually worked their way into Israel's priesthood and office as scribes. This is why certain ones among the Pharisees and scribes sought to murder Lord Jesus.

In Christ's future... "thousand years" reign of Revelation 20, He will make those tares come to worship Him at the feet of His elect, as per Rev.3:9 and Isaiah 60:14. The unsaved nations will still exist in that future time, and Zechariah 14 even reveals that leftovers of the armies that will come up against Jerusalem on the last day of this world will be made to come and worship The KING in that future time, and keep the feast of tabernacles.

Men's traditions of Amillennialism instead falsely claims all the wicked are destroyed at Jesus' future 2nd coming.

Thus men's theories of Amillennialism ARE NOT BIBLICAL.

 

[Davidpt]

In Christ's future... "thousand years" reign of Revelation 20, He will make those tares come to worship Him at the feet of His elect, as per Rev.3:9 and Isaiah 60:14. The unsaved nations will still exist in that future time, and Zechariah 14 even reveals that leftovers of the armies that will come up against Jerusalem on the last day of this world will be made to come and worship The KING in that future time, and keep the feast of tabernacles.

I'm not convinced the tares are meant here. For one, I apparently don't take the tares to be meaning who you take them to be meaning. I believe NOSAS is Biblical and that the tares are simply those in the church that have fallen away. Everything else I quoted from your post above, I pretty much agree with you about. The future millennium is obviously the only logical place this in Revelation 3:9 can fit---behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

Amils turn that part into a false prophecy though, thus making Jesus a liar, since they allow no time period for this to be fulfilled during. Apparently, Amils have these in Revelation 3:9 being cast into the LOF during the 2nd coming rather than allowing Jesus to do what He plainly said He was going to do---behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. Can't do that if they are in the LOF, now can they? Has He already done that? I don't think so. There you go then. This has to be fulfilled or Jesus lied in Revelation 3:9, take your pick.

 

[Davy]

I'm not convinced the tares are meant here. For one, I apparently don't take the tares to be meaning who you take them to be meaning. I believe NOSAS is Biblical and that the tares are simply those in the church that have fallen away.

Per Jesus in Matthew 13, the "tares" existed prior... to the time of any 'falling away' from Christ, for when He gave that parable He had not died on the cross yet. Thus men's doctrines again (influenced by the devil no doubt), hide a major but deeper Biblical doctrine about the origin of the spiritual seed of the serpent of Genesis 3:15. Afterall, Jesus did say the devil sowed them per His explanation of the parable.

Gen 3:15
15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.
KJV

Jude 4 also reveals that the crept in unawares represent a certain group of workers on this earth that were 'ordained' to work against Christ. In the Old Testament, they are referred to as the "workers of iniquity", and Apostle Paul referred to them as the "mystery of iniquity", and John referred to them as the "many antichrists". This is the reason I am convinced that the "tares" represent a literal seed upon this earth that are 'owned' by Satan, his elect one might say. And I believe it began with Cain. I also believe Sargon 1 who was a Semite that first appeared among the ancient Sumerians was Cain. Sargon started the first idol worship in ancient Sumer-Babylon that is written of in the cuneiform clay tablets. The Sumerians called Sargon 'son of Bel' (or son of the dragon). See Bristowe's Sargon The Magnificent.

Everything else I quoted from your post above, I pretty much agree with you about. The future millennium is obviously the only logical place this in Revelation 3:9 can fit---behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

Yep.

Amils turn that part into a false prophecy though, thus making Jesus a liar, since they allow no time period for this to be fulfilled during. Apparently, Amils have these in Revelation 3:9 being cast into the LOF during the 2nd coming rather than allowing Jesus to do what He plainly said He was going to do---behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee. Can't do that if they are in the LOF, now can they? Has He already done that? I don't think so. There you go then. This has to be fulfilled or Jesus lied in Revelation 3:9, take your pick.

Yes, I think what you are saying is obvious. Those who first pushed the Amill position in the 2nd century A.D. I believe were Gnostics. So they don't really care that they distorted God's written Word. Problem today is many Amill's don't know that old Gnostic history.