JESUS, the Holy Spirit, the Only True God.

[Heart2Soul]

We see the Christ(God the Son) being baptized, God the Spirit coming down upon Him, and God the Father saying “This is My Son, in whom I am well pleased.”

In John 17, the Christ was praying to His Father.

God is a triune Godhead.

Thank you for sharing this....it was what entered my thoughts as well....in the Garden of Gethsemane Jesus was praying to the Father and asking if it be possible let this cup pass by me....but nevertheless let Thy Will Be Done...…
When Jesus was speaking to the disciples telling them He must go but He will send ANOTHER in His place...the comforter, the Holy Spirit....
I just don't get how it can be interpreted as Jesus sending Himself back because He is sitting at the right hand of the Father in heaven...waiting for the time of the seals to be broken.

 

[101G]

We see the Christ(God the Son) being baptized, God the Spirit coming down upon Him, and God the Father saying “This is My Son, in whom I am well pleased.”

In John 17, the Christ was praying to His Father.

God is a triune Godhead.

GINOLJC, to all.

second, thanks for you concern, but please post scripture that states that the voice from heaven here, is the voice of the one whom you calls the "Father"? book, chapter and verse please. the scriptures states "A" Voice. and the bible clearly states voices that comes from heaven are not nessary God's own voice. we have many scriptures that clearly shows that the angel of the Lord spoke from heaven.

we just assume that the voice came from heaven here, is God's voice. but we cannot assume nothing. this is where many a christian are decieved at, in "assumption".

but I do take your concern serious, but also consider what we had said also.

now, to your second part of the question. "the Lord Jesus praying "TO" his Father?".

let us enlighten you, the Lord Jesus "pray" the Father, not pray "to", see the difference, and in a case when he intercede for someone else did he pray "to", otherwise he pray the Father. example, John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever". notice, it didn't say "I will pray TO the father.

in pray is communication. speaking to one another. now the Holy Spirit pray and he is the ONLY PERSON in the Godhead. Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
Romans 8:27 "And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
now this, 1 Corinthians 2:10 "But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

see the Spirit, the Holy Spirit is GOD himself. remember God is a "Spirit".

so the act of PRAYING is communication or talking with our GOD. that term "TO" is only directional not lesser, directional, because (for us in our limited thinking) he is above us.

so, in either case, it changes nothing.

Hope this helped.

PICJAG

 

[101G]

Thank you for sharing this....it was what entered my thoughts as well....in the Garden of Gethsemane Jesus was praying to the Father and asking if it be possible let this cup pass by me....but nevertheless let Thy Will Be Done...…
When Jesus was speaking to the disciples telling them He must go but He will send ANOTHER in His place...the comforter, the Holy Spirit....
I just don't get how it can be interpreted as Jesus sending Himself back because He is sitting at the right hand of the Father in heaven...waiting for the time of the seals to be broken.

first thanks for the reply. second, may we something here.

what happen in the Garden of Gethsemane finished what was started in the Garden of Eden.

The Lord Jesus is our example. what was started in the Garden of Eden was to Spiritually cultivate, or spiritually development of a right relationship, and Fellowship with our CREATOR.

this is what in essance the written word, or the bible is all about to us who are in the FALLEN line of the First Adam.

Jesus came to fulfilled, and regain for us what was lost for us in the Garden of Eden. the tree to the KNOWLEDGE of Good and Evil is for our development. yes it takes Good and evil to LIVE Right or in righteousness with God in his WAY. this is what the "PLANTING" or the cultivation of the Garden of Enden is all about.

Just like in my Previous answer to SovereignGrace, we don't know how we should pray God.

just like in this topic, it's not about how much one know the scriptures, it how much you UNDERSTAND about the little scripture that you do know. and every man is not based on how much he or she knows, but about what he or she understands in what he or she knows. one must GROW or be cultivated in the LOVE of God. and that is based on the "right relationship, and Fellowship with our CREATOR".

you can't chose to LOVE God without KNOWLEDGE of him. that's why he said, "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children". Hosea 4:6.

see, deception is one of the main tools the devil use to divide and conquer us.
if one knows, then one cannot be decieved. which is true, because LIGHT cast out DARKNESS. this is why we have debates. truth cast out lie.

that's why our Lord was in the Garden. to show us the TRUTH, the way, the LIFE.
but we have ... closed our eyes to God, (who is eternal), and open them to the way of the world, which is (temporal).

PICJAG.

 

[101G]

You would make the Modalists blush with your depiction of God being a split personality, and then trying to call it "Diversified Oneness". At least they depicted God as sane, only pretending to be the Father at times, and pretending to be the Son or Holy Spirit at times. And as crazy as they are, you beat them hands down. With your "split personality" attempt at explaining the trinity whom you know to exist. Or you wouldn't oppose God so much trying to explain him away.

dave I leave you to yourself, all talk about nothing and no substance. ....

PICJAG.

 

[SovereignGrace]

GINOLJC, to all.

second, thanks for you concern, but please post scripture that states that the voice from heaven here, is the voice of the one whom you calls the "Father"? book, chapter and verse please. the scriptures states "A" Voice. and the bible clearly states voices that comes from heaven are not nessary God's own voice. we have many scriptures that clearly shows that the angel of the Lord spoke from heaven.

we just assume that the voice came from heaven here, is God's voice. but we cannot assume nothing. this is where many a christian are decieved at, in "assumption".

but I do take your concern serious, but also consider what we had said also.

now, to your second part of the question. "the Lord Jesus praying "TO" his Father?".

let us enlighten you, the Lord Jesus "pray" the Father, not pray "to", see the difference, and in a case when he intercede for someone else did he pray "to", otherwise he pray the Father. example, John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever". notice, it didn't say "I will pray TO the father.

in pray is communication. speaking to one another. now the Holy Spirit pray and he is the ONLY PERSON in the Godhead. Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
Romans 8:27 "And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
now this, 1 Corinthians 2:10 "But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

see the Spirit, the Holy Spirit is GOD himself. remember God is a "Spirit".

so the act of PRAYING is communication or talking with our GOD. that term "TO" is only directional not lesser, directional, because (for us in our limited thinking) he is above us.

so, in either case, it changes nothing.

Hope this helped.

PICJAG

In Matthew 3...
And there came a voice from heaven:

This is My beloved Son.
I take delight in Him![vs 17]

Surely an angel does not claim to best the Christ’s Father, does he?

And also in John 12...

Father, glorify Your name.” Then a voice came out of heaven: “I have both glorified it, and will glorify it again.”

Here we see the Christ speaking to His Father, and says to glorify His name. Then the Father speaks accordingly.

The Christ was not speaking to Himself.

 

[Dave L]

dave I leave you to yourself, all talk about nothing and no substance. ....

PICJAG.

You are making an idol from isolated fragments of scripture. Unlike anything heretics have ever done before. Double talk and all. You say in so many round about ways that God has a "Split personality". And you mask by calling it "Diversified Oneness"? Yikes. Even the Modalists would blush being even remotely connected to you.

 

[SovereignGrace]

John 14:16...

16 I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever;[NASB]

16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper, to be with you forever,[ESV]

And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever—[NIV]

16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever--[NKJV]

16 And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Counselor to be with you forever.[CSB]

16 and I will ask the Father, and another Comforter He will give to you, that he may remain with you -- to the age;[YLT]

These texts prove the Christ was speaking to His Father, not an angel or another being.

 

[101G]

John 14:16...

16 I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever;[NASB]

16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper, to be with you forever,[ESV]

And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever—[NIV]

16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever--[NKJV]

16 And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Counselor to be with you forever.[CSB]

16 and I will ask the Father, and another Comforter He will give to you, that he may remain with you -- to the age;[YLT]

These texts prove the Christ was speaking to His Father, not an angel or another being.

ok, let's see, question who sent the Holy Spirit the comforter? was it the Father or the Son? which one

PICJAG

 

[SovereignGrace]

ok, let's see, question who sent the Holy Spirit the comforter? was it the Father or the Son? which one

PICJAG

Who do you think? The Father.

The Christ was not speaking to an angel or another created being. He was not pschizo.

 

[Dave L]

ok, let's see, question who sent the Holy Spirit the comforter? was it the Father or the Son? which one

PICJAG

Are you saying God goes into another personality split and now thinks he's the Holy Spirit?

 

[101G]

Who do you think? The Father.

The Christ was not speaking to an angel or another created being. He was not pschizo.

first thanks for the response, second, it matter not what I think, but it matters what the SCRIPTURES states. listen,
John 14:26 "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you”.

John 15:26 "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me”.

now, dave and SovereignGrace study both of those two scriptures and tell us who sent the Holy Spirit.

now after that, I want you both to read this, John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
John 14:17 "Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
John 14:18 "I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

OK, who came to them?. ......

PICJAG

 

[SovereignGrace]

first thanks for the response, second, it matter not what I think, but it matters what the SCRIPTURES states. listen,
John 14:26 "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you”.

John 15:26 "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me”.

now, dave and SovereignGrace study both of those two scriptures and tell us who sent the Holy Spirit.

now after that, I want you both to read this, John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
John 14:17 "Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
John 14:18 "I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

OK, who came to them?. ......

PICJAG

Again, God is triune. 23 Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him.[John 14]

When One comes, they all come.

 

[SovereignGrace]

From Acts 2...

33 Therefore having been exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He has poured forth this which you both see and hear.

The Christ is not sitting on the right side of Himself, but His Father.

 

[Heart2Soul]

first thanks for the reply. second, may we something here.

what happen in the Garden of Gethsemane finished what was started in the Garden of Eden.

The Lord Jesus is our example. what was started in the Garden of Eden was to Spiritually cultivate, or spiritually development of a right relationship, and Fellowship with our CREATOR.

this is what in essance the written word, or the bible is all about to us who are in the FALLEN line of the First Adam.

Jesus came to fulfilled, and regain for us what was lost for us in the Garden of Eden. the tree to the KNOWLEDGE of Good and Evil is for our development. yes it takes Good and evil to LIVE Right or in righteousness with God in his WAY. this is what the "PLANTING" or the cultivation of the Garden of Enden is all about.

Just like in my Previous answer to SovereignGrace, we don't know how we should pray God.

just like in this topic, it's not about how much one know the scriptures, it how much you UNDERSTAND about the little scripture that you do know. and every man is not based on how much he or she knows, but about what he or she understands in what he or she knows. one must GROW or be cultivated in the LOVE of God. and that is based on the "right relationship, and Fellowship with our CREATOR".

you can't chose to LOVE God without KNOWLEDGE of him. that's why he said, "My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will also reject thee, that thou shalt be no priest to me: seeing thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I will also forget thy children". Hosea 4:6.

see, deception is one of the main tools the devil use to divide and conquer us.
if one knows, then one cannot be decieved. which is true, because LIGHT cast out DARKNESS. this is why we have debates. truth cast out lie.

that's why our Lord was in the Garden. to show us the TRUTH, the way, the LIFE.
but we have ... closed our eyes to God, (who is eternal), and open them to the way of the world, which is (temporal).

PICJAG.

Your argument is valid and I have no problem with what you have used to support your understanding....however I can use this very same argument word for word to back up and support my understanding.
What I really want to know is what does it benefit me to believe in the Trinity, Triune, or Oneness doctrines? What do I gain that I don't already have with what I understand by the Holy Spirit....I pray to the Father, I ask in Jesus Name, a follow the leading of the Holy Spirit, I study His Word and seek His truth and even His Hidden Wisdom and the Mysteries of God....
Oh and I confess Jesus as my Lord and Saviour.

I really do not want to be ignorant in anything that would be a hindrance or stumbling block to my spiritual walk with God. So I do my best to seek to be corrected if I am in error.

 

[101G]

Again, God is triune. 23 Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him.[John 14]

When One comes, they all come.

but who sent who? that is the QUESTION

and two, who dwells in us, a. the Spirit, b. the Son, or c. the Father?

ps now you're correct he dwells in us who holds all the titles, but it's only one PERSON who dwells in us.

so now back to my first question who sent the comforter? well..... thanks in advance fro your coming answer.

PICJAG.

 

[SovereignGrace]

Your argument is valid and I have no problem with what you have used to support your understanding....however I can use this very same argument word for word to back up and support my understanding.
What I really want to know is what does it benefit me to believe in the Trinity, Triune, or Oneness doctrines? What do I gain that I don't already have with what I understand by the Holy Spirit....I pray to the Father, I ask in Jesus Name, a follow the leading of the Holy Spirit, I study His Word and seek His truth and even His Hidden Wisdom and the Mysteries of God....
Oh and I confess Jesus as my Lord and Saviour.

I really do not want to be ignorant in anything that would be a hindrance or stumbling block to my spiritual walk with God. So I do my best to seek to be corrected if I am in error.

Remember, we are to pray to the Father in the name of Jesus.

Here’s a good diagram of the Trinity...

 

[101G]

What I really want to know is what does it benefit me to believe in the Trinity, Triune, or Oneness doctrines? What do I gain that I don't already have with what I understand by the Holy Spirit

first thanks for the reply. good question, but you answered your own question.

but let me ask you a question before we answer yours. do you believe in a person call the "father" who is separate and distinct from another person who is called the "Son". once you answer me this, then we can answer you that... your question.

and thanks for the question.

PICJAG.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Remember, we are to pray to the Father in the name of Jesus.

Here’s a good diagram of the Trinity...

Thanks for the visual....as I have said I believe in the Trinity as it was taught and as I understand scripture to mean....I also think it a fruitless argument when debating whether He is one being or 3....it has no bearing on how I worship God or how I pray or how I study scripture.....I rely quite heavily on the Holy Spirit to teach me and guide me into all truth so gotta have Him for sure....can't be saved without my Lord and Saviour Jesus so definitely gotta keep Him.....and who has loved me unconditionally and desires nothing but the best for me but my Father who I pray to and who sees to it that all my needs are met.

 

[Heart2Soul]

first thanks for the reply. good question, but you answered your own question.

but let me ask you a question before we answer yours. do you believe in a person call the "father" who is separate and distinct from another person who is called the "Son". once you answer me this, then we can answer you that... your question.

and thanks for the question.

PICJAG.

I believe God is my Father, Jesus is His son, and the Holy Spirit is his manifested power.

 

[101G]

Remember, we are to pray to the Father in the name of Jesus.

Here’s a good diagram of the Trinity...

that's fine if that's what you believe. and from your diagram the Father is not the Son, and the son is not the Father,... correct. ok, you said the Father sent the Holy Spirit. well in John 15:26 the Lord JESUS the Son said he sent the HOLY SPIRIT. "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me”.

ok, basic bible FACT. JESUS cannot LIE, right.... right. the Lord Jesus, (the Son) said that he will send the Comforter, and then he said the Father will send the comforter.

now is the Lord Jesus lying? NO. so what is he saying? he and the Father is the SAME one PERSON, which contridict your diagram you posted.

so should I believe you, (MAN), or should I believe GOD, (his Holy Word?). that i don't need to think about. I BELIEVE GOD.

now concering John 14:16 - 18, read it first and tell us who the Spirit of TRUTH, the COMFORTER is?". we'll be looking for your answer.

PICJAG.