Kenosis False Teaching

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

ChristisGod

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2020
6,908
3,859
113
64
California
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
If kenosis says Jesus was born with a carnal nature, then I am the opposite, but you won't acknowledge that. Open your mind! You only believe what you want to believe, and nothing else, making you very closed minded. Bye for now.
kenosis heresy is the His emptying Himself of Divine Attribute like you teach. I've been in apologetics all my life with the Trinity, Deity of Christ and the Bodily Resurrection, Ascension and 2nd Coming of Christ. So I'm well aware of all the heretical teachings on those topics and can spot them a mile away by ones comments and asking a clarifying question or two.

hope this helps !!!
 

Taken

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Encounter Team
Feb 6, 2018
24,586
12,994
113
United States
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Kenosis False Teachin
OP^

No intent to dally over a term or meaning.

My text reads.

Phil 2:
[7] But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

One would have to know His Reputation, to know what was NOT Revealed.
 

CharismaticLady

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2019
7,784
3,150
113
76
Tennessee
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
kenosis heresy is the His emptying Himself of Divine Attribute like you teach.

I believe Jesus was God with us, no less God than the Father. However, for a short time in eternity He had to become man of flesh with a divine Spirit, and live perfectly, to be our example, and also to be able to die. God can't die, nor did Jesus' spirit. Just like true Christians live sinless forever in the Spirit, even though our body will die also.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nancy

Enoch111

Well-Known Member
May 27, 2018
17,688
15,997
113
Alberta
Faith
Christian
Country
Canada
The biblical truth is that Jesus Christ fully possessed both a divine nature and a human nature, and the two natures co-existed in what is often called the hypostatic union.
This is correct. Christ was fully divine and fully human at one and the same time. This is the "Mystery of God and Christ", who is called "the great God and our Savior" by Paul.

The theory of kenosis is based simply upon an improper interpretation of one word ἐκένωσεν (ekenōsen) by making a literal translation. While this word literally means "emptied" it must be properly interpreted as without recognition, perceived as valueless (Phil 2:7).

And that is exactly what we find in the King James Bible:
But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:

Once again we see that the modern versions such as the ESV, the Berean Study Bible, HCSB, ISV, NET Bible, ASV, RV, etc CANNOT BE TRUSTED, since they make a literal translation (which in this case is misleading). Christ DID NOT empty Himself of His divinity. That would be absurd.

In what sense did Jesus of Nazareth make Himself "of no reputation"? The very fact that He came from Nazareth made Him of no reputation. Nazareth was despised by the religious leaders in Jerusalem. Therefore Jesus was despised by them.

In what sense did Christ take "the form of a servant"? Jesus placed Himself TOTALLY under the authority and will of God the Father, and became "the Servant of Jehovah or Yahweh". Therefore He said in Gethsemane "Not my will but thine be done".

This corresponds to what is stated in Isaiah 52:13-15, which also prophesied that Christ would ultimately be exalted after His passion.


13 Behold, my Servant [Jesus of Nazareth] shall deal prudently, He shall be exalted and extolled, and be very high.
14 As many were astonied at thee [it was astonishing that the Son of God would die the death of a common criminal]; His visage was so marred more than any man, and His form more than the sons of men: [Note: this speaks of the crucifixion of Christ]
15 So shall He sprinkle [with His blood] many nations; the kings shall shut their mouths at Him [since Christ will be King of kings]: for that which had not been told them shall they see [the glory and majesty of Christ as King of kings and Lord of lords]; and that which they had not heard shall they consider. [that He shall reign forever and ever].
 

ChristisGod

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2020
6,908
3,859
113
64
California
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I believe Jesus was God with us, no less God than the Father. However, for a short time in eternity He had to become man of flesh with a divine Spirit, and live perfectly, to be our example, and also to be able to die. God can't die, nor did Jesus' spirit. Just like true Christians live sinless forever in the Spirit, even though our body will die also.
sounds good but now you are disguising kenosis to make it sound biblical.
 

Nancy

Well-Known Member
Apr 30, 2018
16,820
25,479
113
Buffalo, Ny
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
The term kenosis refers to the doctrine of Christ’s “self-emptying” in His incarnation. The word comes from the Greek of Philippians 2:7, which says that Jesus “emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men” (ESV). The word translated “emptied” is a form of kenoó, from which we get the word kenosis.

Kenoticism, also known as kenotic theology or kenotic Christology, is an unbiblical view of Christ’s nature. Kenoticism teaches that the divinity of the Son of God was somehow lost or lessened when the Lord took on human flesh and entered our world.

The word kenoticism comes from the Greek word kenoó, a form of which is translated “emptied” in some translations of Philippians 2:7. Writing about Christ, Paul says, “Who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied [ekenōsen] Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men” (Philippians 2:6–7, NASB).

Kenotic theology or kenotic Christology, first introduced in the late 1800s by German theologian Gottfried Thomasius (1802—75), is based on the idea that Jesus actually laid aside some of His divinity in order to be more like human beings. Philippians 2:6–7 is used as the proof text for this idea. Jesus “emptied” Himself, according to kenoticism, of His divine attributes.

The biblical truth is that Jesus Christ fully possessed both a divine nature and a human nature, and the two natures co-existed in what is often called the hypostatic union. Kenoticism is an attempt to redefine the nature of Christ. Interestingly, it is only the divine nature of Christ that kenoticism calls into question, not His human nature. Most people can easily accept the reality of Jesus’ humanity. Few would argue with the fact that Jesus was born, lived, and died as a human being. What is harder to accept is that He was born, lived, and died—and rose again—as God incarnate.

If Jesus divested Himself of some of His divine attributes, as some teach, then we have some theological problems. First, emptying Himself of any part of His divinity would render Jesus less than fully divine. If He had temporarily laid aside His omniscience, omnipotence, etc., He would have ceased being the divine Son of God. But God cannot stop being God, even for a moment.

Another significant problem with kenotic Christology involves the eternal destiny of all who follow Christ. No mere human being can fulfill the role of Savior. If Jesus were not the infinite second Person of the triune God, His sacrifice would be insufficient. If Christ were not divine, if He had given up His divinity at any point in time, the efficacy of His sacrifice on the cross would be nullified. To be the Savior, Jesus was at every moment both fully God and fully man.

How, then, do we understand Philippians 2:6–7, which says that the Son of God “emptied” Himself as He took on the form of a servant? In what way did Jesus “empty” Himself? We begin with context. Verses 1—5 describe the attitude believers should adopt, one that “was also in Christ Jesus.” Believers are to exhibit humility and lowliness of mind, having the same self-sacrificial mindset that Jesus had. He didn’t use His equality with God to His own advantage; rather, He took on the form of a servant. Believers are to emulate Christ by becoming humble and obedient. Believers do not put off their human attributes and become something else, any more than Jesus put off His divine attributes. Rather, they look to Jesus as their example and subjugate their impulses and desires for the sake of others.

Christ’s “emptying” of Himself was the laying aside of the privileges of divinity, not divinity itself. In heaven, the Son of God possessed infinite honor and glory and adoration. But He chose to leave that position of honor, and He “made himself nothing” (Philippians 2:7). When He came to earth, He veiled His glory and chose to occupy the position of a slave. The kenosis spoken of in Philippians 2:7 was a self-renunciation but not an emptying of deity. Jesus never ceased to be God, and He did not exchange deity for humanity.

What Jesus did was set aside His heavenly glory. And He voluntarily refrained from using His divinity to make His way easier. His miracles were not done to benefit Himself but to help others. During His earthly ministry, Christ completely submitted Himself to the will of the Father (John 5:19). John Walvoord explains it this way: “The act of kenosis . . . may . . . be properly understood to mean that Christ surrendered no attribute of Deity, but that He did voluntarily restrict their independent use in keeping with His purpose of living among men and their limitations” (Jesus Christ Our Lord, p. 144).

At times, Jesus intentionally veiled His attributes that at other times were fully on display. When He healed the sick, walked on water, fed the 5,000, and raised Lazarus from the dead, Jesus’ divine nature was fully evident. When He allowed Himself to be hungry, thirsty, beaten, abused, and crucified without retaliating, He was intentionally restricting His divine power. He did not give up His power; rather, He chose to subjugate it for a greater good. But at no time during His life was Christ ever without the fullness of divinity (see Colossians 2:9).

Discussions of kenoticism are complicated by the fact that sometimes the term kenosis is used as a synonym for kenoticism. The Bible teaches the kenosis of Christ, but it does not teach that Jesus gave up any divine attributes. Kenosis must be understood within the larger context of the whole of Scripture. And when teachers speak of kenosis, we must be sure to understand how they are using the term. Kenoticism is a heresy that takes the biblical concept of kenosis too far.got?

hope this helps !!!
"What Jesus did was set aside His heavenly glory. And He voluntarily refrained from using His divinity to make His way easier. His miracles were not done to benefit Himself but to help others. During His earthly ministry, Christ completely submitted Himself to the will of the Father (John 5:19). John Walvoord explains it this way: “The act of kenosis . . . may . . . be properly understood to mean that Christ surrendered no attribute of Deity, but that He did voluntarily restrict their independent use in keeping with His purpose of living among men and their limitations” (Jesus Christ Our Lord, p. 144)."

Say's it all right here :) He was always divine, He just left the wonderful joys of heaven with The Father to become a servant in the likeness of human flesh. Amen!
 

ChristisGod

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2020
6,908
3,859
113
64
California
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
"What Jesus did was set aside His heavenly glory. And He voluntarily refrained from using His divinity to make His way easier. His miracles were not done to benefit Himself but to help others. During His earthly ministry, Christ completely submitted Himself to the will of the Father (John 5:19). John Walvoord explains it this way: “The act of kenosis . . . may . . . be properly understood to mean that Christ surrendered no attribute of Deity, but that He did voluntarily restrict their independent use in keeping with His purpose of living among men and their limitations” (Jesus Christ Our Lord, p. 144)."

Say's it all right here :) He was always divine, He just left the wonderful joys of heaven with The Father to become a servant in the likeness of human flesh. Amen!
You nailed it sister :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nancy

CharismaticLady

Well-Known Member
Jun 13, 2019
7,784
3,150
113
76
Tennessee
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
sounds good but now you are disguising kenosis to make it sound biblical.

I'm telling you what I believe. Seeing as I don't know the kenosis teaching, and how much is true, and how much may be false, I'm not "disguising" anything. It could be you just don't completely understand it, and just like how you were painting me, you are painting the kenosis doctrine with a false witness brush.
 

ChristisGod

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2020
6,908
3,859
113
64
California
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I'm telling you what I believe. Seeing as I don't know the kenosis teaching, and how much is true, and how much may be false, I'm not "disguising" anything. It could be you just don't completely understand it, and just like how you were painting me, you are painting the kenosis doctrine with a false witness brush.
read Nancy's post
 

Ronald Nolette

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2020
12,712
3,779
113
69
South Carolina
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
The term kenosis refers to the doctrine of Christ’s “self-emptying” in His incarnation. The word comes from the Greek of Philippians 2:7, which says that Jesus “emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men” (ESV). The word translated “emptied” is a form of kenoó, from which we get the word kenosis.

Kenoticism, also known as kenotic theology or kenotic Christology, is an unbiblical view of Christ’s nature. Kenoticism teaches that the divinity of the Son of God was somehow lost or lessened when the Lord took on human flesh and entered our world.

The word kenoticism comes from the Greek word kenoó, a form of which is translated “emptied” in some translations of Philippians 2:7. Writing about Christ, Paul says, “Who, although He existed in the form of God, did not regard equality with God a thing to be grasped, but emptied [ekenōsen] Himself, taking the form of a bond-servant, and being made in the likeness of men” (Philippians 2:6–7, NASB).

Kenotic theology or kenotic Christology, first introduced in the late 1800s by German theologian Gottfried Thomasius (1802—75), is based on the idea that Jesus actually laid aside some of His divinity in order to be more like human beings. Philippians 2:6–7 is used as the proof text for this idea. Jesus “emptied” Himself, according to kenoticism, of His divine attributes.

The biblical truth is that Jesus Christ fully possessed both a divine nature and a human nature, and the two natures co-existed in what is often called the hypostatic union. Kenoticism is an attempt to redefine the nature of Christ. Interestingly, it is only the divine nature of Christ that kenoticism calls into question, not His human nature. Most people can easily accept the reality of Jesus’ humanity. Few would argue with the fact that Jesus was born, lived, and died as a human being. What is harder to accept is that He was born, lived, and died—and rose again—as God incarnate.

If Jesus divested Himself of some of His divine attributes, as some teach, then we have some theological problems. First, emptying Himself of any part of His divinity would render Jesus less than fully divine. If He had temporarily laid aside His omniscience, omnipotence, etc., He would have ceased being the divine Son of God. But God cannot stop being God, even for a moment.

Another significant problem with kenotic Christology involves the eternal destiny of all who follow Christ. No mere human being can fulfill the role of Savior. If Jesus were not the infinite second Person of the triune God, His sacrifice would be insufficient. If Christ were not divine, if He had given up His divinity at any point in time, the efficacy of His sacrifice on the cross would be nullified. To be the Savior, Jesus was at every moment both fully God and fully man.

How, then, do we understand Philippians 2:6–7, which says that the Son of God “emptied” Himself as He took on the form of a servant? In what way did Jesus “empty” Himself? We begin with context. Verses 1—5 describe the attitude believers should adopt, one that “was also in Christ Jesus.” Believers are to exhibit humility and lowliness of mind, having the same self-sacrificial mindset that Jesus had. He didn’t use His equality with God to His own advantage; rather, He took on the form of a servant. Believers are to emulate Christ by becoming humble and obedient. Believers do not put off their human attributes and become something else, any more than Jesus put off His divine attributes. Rather, they look to Jesus as their example and subjugate their impulses and desires for the sake of others.

Christ’s “emptying” of Himself was the laying aside of the privileges of divinity, not divinity itself. In heaven, the Son of God possessed infinite honor and glory and adoration. But He chose to leave that position of honor, and He “made himself nothing” (Philippians 2:7). When He came to earth, He veiled His glory and chose to occupy the position of a slave. The kenosis spoken of in Philippians 2:7 was a self-renunciation but not an emptying of deity. Jesus never ceased to be God, and He did not exchange deity for humanity.

What Jesus did was set aside His heavenly glory. And He voluntarily refrained from using His divinity to make His way easier. His miracles were not done to benefit Himself but to help others. During His earthly ministry, Christ completely submitted Himself to the will of the Father (John 5:19). John Walvoord explains it this way: “The act of kenosis . . . may . . . be properly understood to mean that Christ surrendered no attribute of Deity, but that He did voluntarily restrict their independent use in keeping with His purpose of living among men and their limitations” (Jesus Christ Our Lord, p. 144).

At times, Jesus intentionally veiled His attributes that at other times were fully on display. When He healed the sick, walked on water, fed the 5,000, and raised Lazarus from the dead, Jesus’ divine nature was fully evident. When He allowed Himself to be hungry, thirsty, beaten, abused, and crucified without retaliating, He was intentionally restricting His divine power. He did not give up His power; rather, He chose to subjugate it for a greater good. But at no time during His life was Christ ever without the fullness of divinity (see Colossians 2:9).

Discussions of kenoticism are complicated by the fact that sometimes the term kenosis is used as a synonym for kenoticism. The Bible teaches the kenosis of Christ, but it does not teach that Jesus gave up any divine attributes. Kenosis must be understood within the larger context of the whole of Scripture. And when teachers speak of kenosis, we must be sure to understand how they are using the term. Kenoticism is a heresy that takes the biblical concept of kenosis too far.got?

hope this helps !!!

I think it has more to do with the glory that is inherent in Jesus that was emptied. He performed miracles and had knowledge beyond man. Scripture says He emptied HImself. So Jesus did! What He emptied, how much and all that Scripture is silent on and we should be as well! We do know that when He emptied Himself and died. And we should have that mind as well. I just know that in human form Jesus was true God and true man.
 

ChristisGod

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2020
6,908
3,859
113
64
California
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I think it has more to do with the glory that is inherent in Jesus that was emptied. He performed miracles and had knowledge beyond man. Scripture says He emptied HImself. So Jesus did! What He emptied, how much and all that Scripture is silent on and we should be as well! We do know that when He emptied Himself and died. And we should have that mind as well. I just know that in human form Jesus was true God and true man.
Colossians 1:19 and 2:9 declare all the fulness of Deity dwelled in Him during His earthly ministry. So His Deity or Attributes were not emptied.

Lets look at the syllogisms from the text in Philippians 2.

The phrase “form of God” in verse six does not mean “less than God” because of the phrase “equality with God" in the prior passage.

It goes to reason in the same way with the 2 phrases in the “form of a servant” and in the “likeness of man” in verse seven do not mean that Jesus was any “less than human,” but instead means He was the same or “equal with all humans.”

That is how the passage reads and how it is to be understood in its " CONTEXT ".


Colossians 1:19-20
For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.

In Colossians 2:9 the Apostle Paul said, For in HIM (CHRIST) ALL of the fullness of deity dwells bodily. Did Paul use the word fullness there to mean partially? NO as Jesus did not empty Himself of His Deity. Jesus Divinity is FULL, complete lacking in nothing. The ENTIRE Fullness of Deity dwells(is present) bodily in Jesus. So what was emptied was His privilege's to use those Attributes that were rightly His to use and voluntarily gave up those rights in submission to do the Fathers will. His Glory as God was veiled intentionally. On a few occasions He let His disciples see His Glory. For we beheld His Glory the Glory of the only begotten Son(monogenes).

hope this helps !!!
 

Ronald Nolette

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2020
12,712
3,779
113
69
South Carolina
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Colossians 1:19 and 2:9 declare all the fulness of Deity dwelled in Him during His earthly ministry. So His Deity or Attributes were not emptied.

Lets look at the syllogisms from the text in Philippians 2.

The phrase “form of God” in verse six does not mean “less than God” because of the phrase “equality with God" in the prior passage.

It goes to reason in the same way with the 2 phrases in the “form of a servant” and in the “likeness of man” in verse seven do not mean that Jesus was any “less than human,” but instead means He was the same or “equal with all humans.”

That is how the passage reads and how it is to be understood in its " CONTEXT ".


Colossians 1:19-20
For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him, 20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.

In Colossians 2:9 the Apostle Paul said, For in HIM (CHRIST) ALL of the fullness of deity dwells bodily. Did Paul use the word fullness there to mean partially? NO as Jesus did not empty Himself of His Deity. Jesus Divinity is FULL, complete lacking in nothing. The ENTIRE Fullness of Deity dwells(is present) bodily in Jesus. So what was emptied was His privilege's to use those Attributes that were rightly His to use and voluntarily gave up those rights in submission to do the Fathers will. His Glory as God was veiled intentionally. On a few occasions He let His disciples see His Glory. For we beheld His Glory the Glory of the only begotten Son(monogenes).

hope this helps !!!

Which is what I said! His glory was not veiled but emptied for HIs mission to die! His deity was intact, that is why I mentioned the hypostatic union in christ! As for teh kenosis, that is theologians all arguing more on their own theories rather than the level of what Scripture says!
 

ChristisGod

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2020
6,908
3,859
113
64
California
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Which is what I said! His glory was not veiled but emptied for HIs mission to die! His deity was intact, that is why I mentioned the hypostatic union in christ! As for teh kenosis, that is theologians all arguing more on their own theories rather than the level of what Scripture says!
I must of missed your comment on the H.U. otherwise I would not of needed to reply in that way. Anyone who adheres to the H.U. automatically rejects the kenosis heresy. Thanks for the clarification Ronald !
 

Ronald Nolette

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2020
12,712
3,779
113
69
South Carolina
Faith
Christian
Country
United States

justbyfaith

Well-Known Member
Jun 28, 2018
21,740
4,114
113
51
San Pedro
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Jesus, in taking on an added nature of humanity, obviously stopped being Omnipresent; because all the fulness of Deity dwells in bodily form in the Person of the Son...all of the nature of God was condensed into the form of a singular human being.

This singular human being also had a finite human brain...so He divested Himself of His Omniscience. This can be seen in verses where Jesus says that only the Father knows the day of His return; but the Son does not know that day or hour.

He may have also divested Himself of His Omnipotence, as it may have been the case that He fully relied on prayer to do His miracles so that it was the Father who was doing those miracles in answer to His prayers. It is interesting to note that after Jesus rose from the dead, He told the disciples that all authority in heaven and on earth had been given to Him. That word "authority" can be translated as power; though it doesn't carry the exact same connotation as dunamis which is the word for "power" that we find in Acts of the Apostles 1:8..
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: marks

ChristisGod

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2020
6,908
3,859
113
64
California
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I must of missed your comment on the H.U.
from Post #30
I put this together a while ago. Let me know what you think Ronald.

Hypostatic Union

1. Jesus is a person. (1 Tim 2:5)

2. Jesus, the Person, has two natures- Divine and human (John 1:1, 14, 1 Timothy 3:16): Divine and human. This is the Hypostatic Union.( Col 2:9, Heb 1:3,2:16)

3. The Communicatio Idiomatum (Communication of the Properties) states that the attributes of His Divine nature and human nature are both ascribed to the one Person of Jesus. So Jesus can exhibit attributes of Divinity (Omnipresence, Omniscience, Omnipotence, . John 2:23, 3:13, 8:58, He was prayed to in Acts 7:59, John 14:13, He was is worshiped Matt 2:2:11, Rev 5:13-14) and at the same time exhibit attributes of His humanity( He was tempted, ate, prayed,wept, grew in wisdom and stature,was anointed,was baptized, the Father was greater, didn’t know the day or the hour of His Return, He cried My God my God why has Thou forsaken Me, He died etc.). The communicatio idiomatum does not mean that any part of the Divine nature was communicated to the human nature.

4. The Man(anthropos) Jesus is what we perceive (if we were there 2000 years ago in Israel) and through the Man we encounter the Divine nature (Jesus knowing all things, is on earth while in heaven, answers prayer, forgiving sins, etc.).

5. The Person of Jesus will always be both Divine and human. (John 1:1,14,20:28, 1 John 5:20, 1 Timothy 2:5) Those who deny this fact are the spirit of antichrist. (1 John 4:1-4,2 John 7)

6. The Divine Nature is within the Trinity.(Father, Son and Holy Spirit)

7. Since the Person of Jesus claims the attributes of Divinity(John 3:13,8:58,Matthew 9:2,12:8), then the Person of Jesus is a member of the Trinity.( John 14-16, Math 28:19)

Anything said of either of Christ's two natures applies to the one Person of Christ, so that is how it is said that Christ died on the cross. The term "hypostatic union" refers to the two natures united in the one Person, so anything said of those two natures in the one Person applies to the whole Person. So we see that the Person of Christ is both God and man. The phrase hypostatic union was adopted by the fifth general council at Constantinople, 533 AD. That council declared that the union of two natures is real (against Arius), not a mere indwelling of God in a man (against Nestorius), with a rational soul (against Apollinaris), and that in Christ’s Divine nature remains unchanged (against Eutyches).

hope this helps !!!
 

ChristisGod

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2020
6,908
3,859
113
64
California
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Jesus, in taking on an added nature of humanity, obviously stopped being Omnipresent; because all the fulness of Deity dwells in bodily form in the Person of the Son...all of the nature of God was condensed into the form of a singular human being.

This singular human being also had a finite human brain...so He divested Himself of His Omniscience. This can be seen in verses where Jesus says that only the Father knows the day of His return; but the Son does not know that day or hour.

He may have also divested Himself of His Omnipotence, as it may have been the case that He fully relied on prayer to do His miracles so that it was the Father who was doing those miracles in answer to His prayers. it is interesting to note that after Jesus rose from the dead, he told the disciples that all authority in heaven and on earth had been given to Him. That word "authority" can be translated as power; though it doesn't carry the exact same connotation as dunamis which is the word for "power" that we find in Acts of the Apostles 1:8..
Then you are espousing the kenosis heresy as well. You are denying Jesus was fully God for 33 years.
 

Nancy

Well-Known Member
Apr 30, 2018
16,820
25,479
113
Buffalo, Ny
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Kenosis is something I thought of simply as emptying oneself to allow God to work in and through you. As far as Christ and kenosis goes, He never gave up His divinity but, He did the will of The Father being in human form with all the emotions and temptations that come along with being human.

"For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin...." Hebrews 4:15

6 "Who, existing in the form of God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, 7but emptied Himself, taking the form of a servant, being made in human likeness. 8And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to death—even death on a cross.…"
Philippians
2: 6-8

Christ's "human" will when praying in the garden of Gethsemane was to have the cup passed but" ...not my will but yours be done." His humanity was sweating as drops of blood, yet His Spirit was willing. :) JM2C
 
  • Like
Reactions: ChristisGod

Ronald Nolette

Well-Known Member
Aug 24, 2020
12,712
3,779
113
69
South Carolina
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I put this together a while ago. Let me know what you think Ronald.

Hypostatic Union

1. Jesus is a person. (1 Tim 2:5)

2. Jesus, the Person, has two natures- Divine and human (John 1:1, 14, 1 Timothy 3:16): Divine and human. This is the Hypostatic Union.( Col 2:9, Heb 1:3,2:16)

3. The Communicatio Idiomatum (Communication of the Properties) states that the attributes of His Divine nature and human nature are both ascribed to the one Person of Jesus. So Jesus can exhibit attributes of Divinity (Omnipresence, Omniscience, Omnipotence, . John 2:23, 3:13, 8:58, He was prayed to in Acts 7:59, John 14:13, He was is worshiped Matt 2:2:11, Rev 5:13-14) and at the same time exhibit attributes of His humanity( He was tempted, ate, prayed,wept, grew in wisdom and stature,was anointed,was baptized, the Father was greater, didn’t know the day or the hour of His Return, He cried My God my God why has Thou forsaken Me, He died etc.). The communicatio idiomatum does not mean that any part of the Divine nature was communicated to the human nature.

4. The Man(anthropos) Jesus is what we perceive (if we were there 2000 years ago in Israel) and through the Man we encounter the Divine nature (Jesus knowing all things, is on earth while in heaven, answers prayer, forgiving sins, etc.).

5. The Person of Jesus will always be both Divine and human. (John 1:1,14,20:28, 1 John 5:20, 1 Timothy 2:5) Those who deny this fact are the spirit of antichrist. (1 John 4:1-4,2 John 7)

6. The Divine Nature is within the Trinity.(Father, Son and Holy Spirit)

7. Since the Person of Jesus claims the attributes of Divinity(John 3:13,8:58,Matthew 9:2,12:8), then the Person of Jesus is a member of the Trinity.( John 14-16, Math 28:19)

Anything said of either of Christ's two natures applies to the one Person of Christ, so that is how it is said that Christ died on the cross. The term "hypostatic union" refers to the two natures united in the one Person, so anything said of those two natures in the one Person applies to the whole Person. So we see that the Person of Christ is both God and man. The phrase hypostatic union was adopted by the fifth general council at Constantinople, 533 AD. That council declared that the union of two natures is real (against Arius), not a mere indwelling of God in a man (against Nestorius), with a rational soul (against Apollinaris), and that in Christ’s Divine nature remains unchanged (against Eutyches).

hope this helps !!!

Good explanation on the high theological level. that would be awesome as part of a paper for amasters.

I took all that high theological terminology after I graduated from my final degree so many years ago. And tucked them away in the deep recesses of the back of my mind. Just remember a post liek this is awesome for talking with high theologically minded individuals , but to communicate with the masses, where the rubber meets the road, KISS-Keep It Simple Saint!
 
  • Like
Reactions: ChristisGod