King of Tyre or a Supernatural Creature of Darkness

[face2face]

What is the broader context of Ezekiel 28?

Ezekiel 28:1 The word of the Lord came to me: of Tyre, ‘This is what the sovereign Lord says:“ ‘Your heart is proud and you said, “I am a god;

Ezekiel 28:11 The word of the Lord came to me: a lament for the king of Tyre, and say to him, ‘This is what the sovereign Lord says:

So the anointed cherub is identified in the passage (and context), not to be a rebel angel but the "king of Tyrus". Again, a high degree of honestly is required to honor the context and it's primary reading. In addition to this fact Ezekiel 26 & 27 are prophecies concerning the coming destruction of the city of Tyre.

I've heard it said by a fellow Christian that King of Tyre is not a man but actually Satan himself disguised as the King of Tyre. This is the first time I've heard this "theory" so thought it best to use this section as a means of teaching Christians how to interpret the Bible text rather than forcing ideas and notions upon it.

First and most obvious point is the words satan, fallen angel and devil are nowhere found in the chapter so straight away from a satan believers viewpoint their argument is inferred.

However, there is some beautiful imagery in the chapter which we need to explore if we are to open its light.

 

[face2face]

The first point I'd like to make is the literal nature of the prophecy in that chapters 26 and 27 of Ezekiel's prophecy speak to the destruction of Tyre, which is seen in the site of ancient Tyre today. It like the top of a rock and a place to spread nets upon and has never been rebuilt. (Ezekiel 26:14)

So we can lock this away rather quickly as being a literal event on a real city with a man as it's King.

I don't think I've ever witnessed a Christian deny the authenticity of the destruction of Tyre

 

[face2face]

From Ezekiel 28:2 and Ezekiel 28:9 we see this anointed cherub is called a man. And not only a man, but one who traffics in riches - gold and silver? (Ezekiel 28:4, Ezekiel 28:5). I am sure those who wish to force satanic notions on this chapter would also struggle to suggest a supernatural creature of darkness has some reason to concern himself with human wealth? But we know divine beings have no need of human riches.

Of course all of these facts will lead us to that highly figurative language which is commonly twisted into fallen angel theology.

 

[face2face]

The truth about this man, the King of Tyre, is his heart was lifted up because of the riches he amassed. Ezekiel 28:5

What's important when dealing with hard to understand text, such as Ezekiel 28:13-15 is we first must read the surrounding story and grasp the context of that story before trying to apply an interpretation to it. The danger is to import non Biblical ideas which are not present in the text.

You were in Eden, the garden of God. Every precious stone was your covering, the ruby, topaz, and emerald, the chrysolite, onyx, and jasper, the sapphire, turquoise, and beryl; your settings and mounts were made of gold. On the day you were created they were prepared. guardian cherub; you were on the holy mountain of God; you walked about amidst fiery stones.

So lets begin with a question.

Where have you read the blue text before in the Bible? What's the allusion?

 

[Skovand1075]

I would say that it’s solely about the human king Tyre. After all, you won’t really find any Jewish scholars ( faith not lineage ) to promote
The concept of Satan as a enemy. What I see is symbolism being used to link back to the general concept of rebellion in the creation tale. They are hyperlinking back to the earlier folklore.

with that said I think they are also sharing prophecies about the rebellion that’s kicking up in the heavens. Such as when we read it Michael battling the “princes” of other nations. Lot of this ties into the heavenly host and how Yahweh set up angels to help govern the lands. It’s a pretty in-depth study that I don’t have time for at the moment to dive into but there is a lot of fantastic info out there.

 

[FHII]

I do believe the King/Prince of Tyre was a real life man. Tyre is a city in Lebanon. I originally thought the city was an island just off the coast, but I may have to back off of that.

Nebuchadnezzar laid seige to the city for 13 years, forcing it into tribute. Some historians say it was a failed campaign, but Tyre certainly didn't succeed. What is interesting is that if you study Isaiah 13 and 14, "Lucifer" is actually Nebuchadnezzar. That is explained in the book of Daniel.

My point is neither the prophecies of Isaiah 14 nor Ezekiel 28 are talking about Satan. Lucifier defeated the King of Tyre, and Jesus said Satan cannot cast out Satan.

So what about Eden the Garden of God? Maybe figurative language, but realize that the was a city or region at the time that was called "Eden". And it had a market and merchants. Look at the 27th chapter.

I really don't recall the place where Adam, Eve and the serpent was having an economy.

Bottom line: the king of Tyre and Lucifer were MEN, and not Satan. If one wants to liken them to Satan, fine. The are similarities. History shows that Lucifer conquered Tyre, so neither of them were Satan.

 

[Skovand1075]

I do believe the King/Prince of Tyre was a real life man. Tyre is a city in Lebanon. I originally thought the city was an island just off the coast, but I may have to back off of that.

Nebuchadnezzar laid seige to the city for 13 years, forcing it into tribute. Some historians say it was a failed campaign, but Tyre certainly didn't succeed. What is interesting is that if you study Isaiah 13 and 14, "Lucifer" is actually Nebuchadnezzar. That is explained in the book of Daniel.

My point is neither the prophecies of Isaiah 14 nor Ezekiel 28 are talking about Satan. Lucifier defeated the King of Tyre, and Jesus said Satan cannot cast out Satan.

So what about Eden the Garden of God? Maybe figurative language, but realize that the was a city or region at the time that was called "Eden". And it had a market and merchants. Look at the 27th chapter.

I really don't recall the place where Adam, Eve and the serpent was having an economy.

Bottom line: the king of Tyre and Lucifer were MEN, and not Satan. If one wants to liken them to Satan, fine. The are similarities. History shows that Lucifer conquered Tyre, so neither of them were Satan.

one thing to consider is that it’s almost strictly the KJV that says Lucifer. The actual word there is “helel” shinning one is a reference to Venus, the morning star. Morning star is repeatedly used for kings.

 

[Aunty Jane]

What is the broader context of Ezekiel 28?

Ezekiel 28:1 The word of the Lord came to me: of Tyre, ‘This is what the sovereign Lord says:“ ‘Your heart is proud and you said, “I am a god;

Ezekiel 28:11 The word of the Lord came to me: a lament for the king of Tyre, and say to him, ‘This is what the sovereign Lord says:

So the anointed cherub is identified in the passage (and context), not to be a rebel angel but the "king of Tyrus". Again, a high degree of honestly is required to honor the context and it's primary reading. In addition to this fact Ezekiel 26 & 27 are prophecies concerning the coming destruction of the city of Tyre.

I've heard it said by a fellow Christian that King of Tyre is not a man but actually Satan himself disguised as the King of Tyre. This is the first time I've heard this "theory" so thought it best to use this section as a means of teaching Christians how to interpret the Bible text rather than forcing ideas and notions upon it.

First and most obvious point is the words satan, fallen angel and devil are nowhere found in the chapter so straight away from a satan believers viewpoint their argument is inferred.

An interesting passage of scripture when you read it with understanding as to the historical aspects.
Addressed to the King of Tyre, I believe that it is a veiled description of the one whom this King emulated by his conduct.

The anonymous king of Tyre, was residing in the city claiming to be “perfect in prettiness,” was himself “full of wisdom and perfect [adjective related to Heb. ka·lalʹ] in beauty,” and “faultless [Heb., ta·mimʹ]” in his ways from his creation onward until unrighteousness was found in him. (Ezekiel 27:3; Ezekiel 28:12, 15) The first or direct application of the dirge in Ezekiel may be to the line of Tyrian rulers rather than to any one specific king.
The early course of friendship and cooperation followed by the Tyrian rulership during the reigns of Kings David and Solomon, when Tyre even contributed toward the building of Jehovah’s temple on Mount Moriah would indicate that at first, there was no fault to be found in the official Tyrian attitude toward God’s people, Israel.

Later kings, however, departed from this “faultless” course, and Tyre came in for condemnation by God’s prophets Joel and Amos, as well as Ezekiel. (Joel 3:4-8; Amos 1:9-10)

Interesting to note is that the word "created" is used here in the description of this King.
No human is said to be "created" so the implication involving a 'created being' starts there I believe.

It continues...
"You were in Eʹden, the garden of God.
You were adorned with every precious stone. . . .
They were prepared on the day you were created.


14 I assigned you as the anointed covering cherub.

You were on the holy mountain of God, and you walked about among fiery stones.

15 You were faultless in your ways from the day you were created
Until unrighteousness was found in you."

Your heart became haughty because of your beauty.
You corrupted your wisdom because of your own glorious splendor.
I will throw you down to the earth.
I will make you a spectacle before kings." (Ezekiel 28:13-17)

Cherubs are usually assigned as guardians in the scriptures. We see them first mentioned after the defection of Adam and his wife and their eviction from the garden of Eden. But before that the spirit creature who became satan the devil was the "covering cherub", overseeing the conduct of the humans in the garden. It was why he was there, observing the worship that these intelligent creatures would give to the Creator and it was then that he followed the chain of events mentioned in James 1:13-15. He wanted worship for himself.

Genesis 3:19-22-24....sentencing Adam God said....
"By the sweat of your face
You shall eat bread,
Until you return to the ground,
Because from it you were taken;
For you are dust,
And to dust you shall return. . . . .”

22 Then the Lord God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil; and now, he might reach out with his hand, and take fruit also from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever”— 23 therefore the Lord God sent him out of the Garden of Eden, to cultivate the ground from which he was taken. 24 So He drove the man out; and at the east of the Garden of Eden He stationed the cherubim and the flaming sword which turned every direction to guard the way to the tree of life." (NASB)

This description of the King of Tyre fills in some interesting details about the devil that a reading of Genesis does not reveal. Until I read Ezekiel, I had no idea where the devil had come from.

 

[face2face]

It continues...
"You were in Eʹden, the garden of God.
You were adorned with every precious stone. . . .
They were prepared on the day you were created.


14 I assigned you as the anointed covering cherub.

You were on the holy mountain of God, and you walked about among fiery stones.

15 You were faultless in your ways from the day you were created
Until unrighteousness was found in you."

Your heart became haughty because of your beauty.
You corrupted your wisdom because of your own glorious splendor.
I will throw you down to the earth.
I will make you a spectacle before kings." (Ezekiel 28:13-17)

Cherubs are usually assigned as guardians in the scriptures. We see them first mentioned after the defection of Adam and his wife and their eviction from the garden of Eden. But before that the spirit creature who became satan the devil was the "covering cherub", overseeing the conduct of the humans in the garden. It was why he was there, observing the worship that these intelligent creatures would give to the Creator and it was then that he followed the chain of events mentioned in James 1:13-15. He wanted worship for himself.

It's a common mistake many make when dealing with this beautiful section of Scripture. I am glad for one you acknowledge the Cherub is referencing the King of Tyre (which is the context!).

The issue seems to be the highly figurative text. If you apply non Biblical notions/concepts in addition to a literal reading of the text, you fail to see what God is doing here!

Example:

Every precious stone was your covering, the ruby, topaz, and emerald, the chrysolite, onyx, and jasper, the sapphire, turquoise, and beryl; your settings and mounts were made of gold.

Where have you seen this before Jane?

 

[face2face]

Interesting to note is that the word "created" is used here in the description of this King.
No human is said to be "created" so the implication involving a 'created being' starts there I believe.

When I see little remarks like this I prefer not to let them slip through to the keeper .

You reference the word "Bara" which is used in a variety of ways throughout Scripture; to mean formed, prepared like that of the creation of a people as in Psalms 102:18 & Ezekiel 21:30 (speaking of the Ammonites).

As we shall see there is no premise for a fallen angel in this text...its true meaning to too stunning to ignore!

I will leave it there as there are more beautiful lessons to come from this section which doesn't include mythological beings.

F2F

 

[Aunty Jane]

It's a common mistake many make when dealing with this beautiful section of Scripture. I am glad for one you acknowledge the Cherub is referencing to the King of Tyre (which is the context!).

The issue seems to be the highly figurative text. If you apply non Biblical notions/concepts in addition to a literal reading of the text, you fail to see what God is doing here!

"Non biblical notions"? I see them as entirely biblical.....it fits perfectly with what occurred in Eden, providing details that Genesis does not. But in no way are these details out of harmony with what the scriptures tell us about satan and why he tempted the humans to abandon their Creator.

Example:

Every precious stone was your covering, the ruby, topaz, and emerald, the chrysolite, onyx, and jasper, the sapphire, turquoise, and beryl; your settings and mounts were made of gold.

Where have you seen this before Jane?

Are you referring to Babylon the great?

 

[face2face]

"Non biblical notions"? I see them as entirely biblical.....it fits perfectly with what occurred in Eden, providing details that Genesis does not. But in no way are these details out of harmony with what the scriptures tell us about satan and why he tempted the humans to abandon their Creator.

As we move through the text you will see why I say non Biblical ...I think it will become evident.

Are you referring to Babylon the great?

I was leading you to Exodus 39:10-14

Do you know why they are referred to as stones of fire?

 

[Aunty Jane]

I was leading you to Exodus 39:10-14

Do you know why they are referred to as stones of fire?

Where is the reference to "stones of fire" in those verses?

 

[Aunty Jane]

I will leave it there as there are more beautiful lessons to come from this section which doesn't include mythological beings.

I need you to clarify this statement as well..... what "mythological beings"? Are you SDA?

 

[face2face]

This is the text we will be focusing on for here on in as this text is where many Christians stumble.

Ezekiel 28:13 You were in Eden, the garden of God. Every precious stone was your covering, the ruby, topaz, and emerald, the chrysolite, onyx, and jasper, the sapphire, turquoise, and beryl; your settings and mounts were made of gold. On the day you were created they were prepared. guardian cherub; you were on the holy mountain of God; you walked about amidst fiery stones (Stone's of Fire).

I will use this post as a template in discussing the true meaning which I am sure will become apparent in time. One thing is for sure the way God sees things is not how man see things!

 

[face2face]

Where is the reference to "stones of fire" in those verses?

Or fiery stones...

 

[face2face]

I need you to clarify this statement as well..... what "mythological beings"? Are you SDA?

No.
satanic notions have their roots in mythology not in Scripture, as we shall see. This thread is one of many I will work on to inform Christians not only is fallen angel theology flawed, but the true richness of a right understanding of the text is extremely rewarding.

 

[face2face]

Where is the reference to "stones of fire" in those verses?

It's important you acknowledge the allusion back to Exodus 39:10-14 as the stones which were set in the breastplate of the high priest of Israel.

Very important!

 

[Aunty Jane]

It's important you acknowledge the allusion back to Exodus 39:10-14 as the stones which were set in the breastplate of the high priest of Israel.

Very important!

Unless you can produce the "fiery stones" connection....there isn't one.

 

[Aunty Jane]

satanic notions have their roots in mythology not in Scripture, as we shall see. This thread is one of many I will work on to inform Christians not only is fallen angel theology flawed, but the true richness of a right understanding of the text is extremely rewarding.

Can I ask if these are your personal beliefs, or if you are a collective 'brotherhood' who all share the same ideas and practices?
The "fallen angel theology" is a theme carried throughout all of the scriptures, from the fall in the garden, right through to the rule of the Kingdom over redeemed mankind.

The fulfillment of Revelation 21:2-4 is meaningless without the removal of the first rebel and all whom he is able to mislead. He is the cause and the reason why Christ had to come and bail us out of this mess.

This is important, because unless we belong to a brotherhood who are found in all nations on earth, and who all accept the same truth, there is no point in continuing.....there are no Christians in isolation from a like-minded brotherhood. Collectively, they make up the true Christian congregation, which is global, not local.

There is no room for "I think" in Christianity.....the truth unifies God's people......falsehoods divide them. God "draws" only those in whom he finds a willing and obedient heart. He is the one who then issues an invitation to enter his family. (John 6:44; John 6:65)

"I think" is an opinion and we've all got one. That is where the divide comes from.