Letter of the Law vs. Spirit of the Law

[Blue Dragonfly's]

Hi Everyone,

Since I'm feeling a bit..."inspired", I thought I would take it upon a suggestion from another thread, that perhaps a thread about this subject is due.

I'm not trying to 'lead' this thread, but to put thoughts 'out there', that may make for a decent discussion.

I was a paralegal for a number of years. Yes, a Christian, to boot. And I can say, honestly, that my legal training actually helped me, in my spiritual journey.

We are already aware, that secular laws are mostly made up of statutes. Those statutes are not so much about what we should do, but what will happen if we don't do 'it'. "Thou shall not travel more than 75 miles per hour on an interstate highway" is not a statute. What IS a statute is to say that, "If you DO travel more than 75 miles per hour on an interstate highway, the penalty will be 6 months in jail, losing your license and a $1000 dollar fine, for a first offense."

But does that mean that EVERY time, ANYONE who travels more than 75 miles an hour on an interstate highway, WILL or SHOULD go to jail for 6 months, lose their license and get a $1000 dollar fine?

According to the Pharisees, yes. After all, that person broke the law!

But Jesus, didn't seem to see it the same way. After all, there are exceptions to the law.

Apparenty, there is punishment in breaking the law. But I think that Jesus taught us...or at least, tried to do so....that there is also mercy woven into it. And wisdom...and discernment...

After all, if I was traveling at 80 mpg, because my child was in the back seat, choking on a chicken bone...and I was trying to get to a hospital...does the law REALLY apply in that matter?

The less merciful ones, would say 'yes'. Would Jesus?

How can we read the bible, without thinking about any of this?

Thoughts?

Great post.
Prayerfully I'll not have to use it however, if I ever get pulled over for speeding I may be tempted to refer to the spirit of the law behind that speed limit sign. Could be fun.

Note, if you don't read me posting for awhile after that, it wasn't.

 

[quietthinker]

Hi Everyone,

Since I'm feeling a bit..."inspired", I thought I would take it upon a suggestion from another thread, that perhaps a thread about this subject is due.

I'm not trying to 'lead' this thread, but to put thoughts 'out there', that may make for a decent discussion.

I was a paralegal for a number of years. Yes, a Christian, to boot. And I can say, honestly, that my legal training actually helped me, in my spiritual journey.

We are already aware, that secular laws are mostly made up of statutes. Those statutes are not so much about what we should do, but what will happen if we don't do 'it'. "Thou shall not travel more than 75 miles per hour on an interstate highway" is not a statute. What IS a statute is to say that, "If you DO travel more than 75 miles per hour on an interstate highway, the penalty will be 6 months in jail, losing your license and a $1000 dollar fine, for a first offense."

But does that mean that EVERY time, ANYONE who travels more than 75 miles an hour on an interstate highway, WILL or SHOULD go to jail for 6 months, lose their license and get a $1000 dollar fine?

According to the Pharisees, yes. After all, that person broke the law!

But Jesus, didn't seem to see it the same way. After all, there are exceptions to the law.

Apparenty, there is punishment in breaking the law. But I think that Jesus taught us...or at least, tried to do so....that there is also mercy woven into it. And wisdom...and discernment...

After all, if I was traveling at 80 mpg, because my child was in the back seat, choking on a chicken bone...and I was trying to get to a hospital...does the law REALLY apply in that matter?

The less merciful ones, would say 'yes'. Would Jesus?

How can we read the bible, without thinking about any of this?

Thoughts?

Thoughts?....yeahhhh.....the law was introduced to increase the trespass.
We have choices; we can major on accusation, condemnation and a holier than thou trajectory relegating mercy to the back seat or we can take a feather out of Jesus' cap and hear the unparalleled revealing of God's major. What might we think that is?

 

[Enoch111]

To me, the spirit is more lenient and forgiving. It's the letter that's more exacting.

There is no conflict between the letter of the Law and the spirit of the Law. The Law came from God, who is a Spirit. and who calls the Law holy, just, and good (through Paul).

The problem arose because of how the Pharisees perverted the Law, so that the spirit of the law was set aside.

MARK 7: THE HYPOCRISY OF THE SCRIBES AND PHARISEES
6 He [Jesus] answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
7 Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8 For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9 And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10 For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11 But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12 And ye suffer [allow] him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13 Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.

 

[Bob Estey]

lol.....I know, my question puts you on the spot, however 'trying' does not qualify as stopped my friend.

For certain, repentance is a good thing....so continue which I'm sure you do. Repentance at least is a response to the Spirit telling us we are out of order......and we have this promise 'there is therefore no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus'

Isn't it wonderful that inspite of ourselves we have a glorious hope.

I've discontinued doing those things I know to be sin.

 

[Reggie Belafonte]

Yes, but until you do something evil, you haven't done anything evil, it doesn't seem to me.

My wife was the Bank manager and had millions of Dollars cash etc she could of stole, she must of thought about it just once or so ? guilty as charged ! according to my religious nut case mate who claims the Bible is all literal. as to him such is the same Sin if you did it or not ! He is a nut case.

A man looks at a woman and thinks she is hot ! so what ! she is ! and one can appreciate such, but that has nothing at all to do with that one wants to take advantage of her or anything apart from appreciating that she looks appealing, but that does not mean that you like her at all or have respect her just because she looks good. she may be a awful person etc etc.

Just as with a Car, one may admire the look of the car etc but that does not mean that you want it at all !

One may have a car that is whatever and they show me it and I do not think much of that type of car for myself but I do appreciate why he likes that car and I understand why he admires that car.

I have a mate that loves little cars 4 cyl and little 6 cyl that's not my bag but I understand were he is coming from and I don't bag him for such, some like old cars some only like new, some do not appreciate old cars at all, but I like and understand and appreciate the era for what they are. It does not have to be the latest and the greatest as that is all nonsense.

At the end of the day shallow people will miss read the Bible intent and run with such nonsense of a degenerate ! old mat does not even understand what the virgin Mary means, his take is that of any degenerate atheist brat kid. same level ! depraved ignorant and will not bother to listen to any reason. because ignorance is their bliss.

 

[quietthinker]

I've discontinued doing those things I know to be sin.

good on you Bob......but I bet there's a truck load that you are not aware of or that you justify......which you will become aware of when it is revealed.

 

[Desire Of All Nations]

This argument is just chock full of false doctrines and false reasoning. Speeding doesn't give you or anyone else a license to disregard God's commandments by putting someone else in harm's way.

Just because people stand on what the Bible has to teach about a woman's role in marriage, it does not mean in any way that they're saying women are second class citizens. The Bible plainly teaches that the husband is supposed to lead and the woman is supposed to obey and support the husband(obviously within reason). The perverse brand of "marriage" you seem to be in support of is the upside down marriages that are so common in the West where the woman is supposed to be "equal". Western nations may call them "50/50" marriages, but God says the women rule in the marriages(Isa. 3:12).

Another thing that makes this argument entirely deceptive and evil is that it attempts to lump tithing and the biblical view of marriage in with the Pharisaical tradition of washing one's hands before eating. In Matt. 23:23, Christ can clearly be seen saying tithing is something that they were supposed to do. Furthermore, in Matt. 5:17, Jesus can also clearly be seen saying that no one was to even think that He came to water down, contradict, or abolish the OT writings in any way.

Isa. 42:21 says the Messiah would magnify the law, not contradict it, not preach against it, not water down its authority. And since the Messiah magnified the law like He was supposed to, no honest person would make any argument that Jesus would be perfectly fine with putting other people in danger by speeding.

 

[quietthinker]

This argument is just chock full of false doctrines and false reasoning. Speeding doesn't give you or anyone else a license to disregard God's commandments by putting someone else in harm's way.

Just because people stand on what the Bible has to teach about a woman's role in marriage, it does not mean in any way that they're saying women are second class citizens. The Bible plainly teaches that the husband is supposed to lead and the woman is supposed to obey and support the husband(obviously within reason). The perverse brand of "marriage" you seem to be in support of is the upside down marriages that are so common in the West where the woman is supposed to be "equal". Western nations may call them "50/50" marriages, but God says the women rule in the marriages(Isa. 3:12).

Another thing that makes this argument entirely deceptive and evil is that it attempts to lump tithing and the biblical view of marriage in with the Pharisaical tradition of washing one's hands before eating. In Matt. 23:23, Christ can clearly be seen saying tithing is something that they were supposed to do. Furthermore, in Matt. 5:17, Jesus can also clearly be seen saying that no one was to even think that He came to water down, contradict, or abolish the OT writings in any way.

Isa. 42:21 says the Messiah would magnify the law, not contradict it, not preach against it, not water down its authority. And since the Messiah magnified the law like He was supposed to, no honest person would make any argument that Jesus would be perfectly fine with putting other people in danger by speeding.

Jesus was well aware of the Law. It's not like he is taken by surprise.....he nevertheless declares, 'neither do I condemn you'

Could it be that the 'mystery of God' is mysterious to us fallen creatures because it is contrary to everything we conclude as 'fair and normal'

Paul shares/tells us in Romans 5; information which is revealed to him, how God sees and deals with the problem of sin and rebellion. It is a view that none of the Old Testament characters saw let alone understood....the which is highlighted in Abrahams response to God's promise. It says, 'Abraham believed God and it was counted to him for righteousness'

Who can understand this or is it that it goes right over the top?

 

[ScottA]

Hi Everyone,

Since I'm feeling a bit..."inspired", I thought I would take it upon a suggestion from another thread, that perhaps a thread about this subject is due.

I'm not trying to 'lead' this thread, but to put thoughts 'out there', that may make for a decent discussion.

I was a paralegal for a number of years. Yes, a Christian, to boot. And I can say, honestly, that my legal training actually helped me, in my spiritual journey.

We are already aware, that secular laws are mostly made up of statutes. Those statutes are not so much about what we should do, but what will happen if we don't do 'it'. "Thou shall not travel more than 75 miles per hour on an interstate highway" is not a statute. What IS a statute is to say that, "If you DO travel more than 75 miles per hour on an interstate highway, the penalty will be 6 months in jail, losing your license and a $1000 dollar fine, for a first offense."

But does that mean that EVERY time, ANYONE who travels more than 75 miles an hour on an interstate highway, WILL or SHOULD go to jail for 6 months, lose their license and get a $1000 dollar fine?

According to the Pharisees, yes. After all, that person broke the law!

But Jesus, didn't seem to see it the same way. After all, there are exceptions to the law.

Apparenty, there is punishment in breaking the law. But I think that Jesus taught us...or at least, tried to do so....that there is also mercy woven into it. And wisdom...and discernment...

After all, if I was traveling at 80 mpg, because my child was in the back seat, choking on a chicken bone...and I was trying to get to a hospital...does the law REALLY apply in that matter?

The less merciful ones, would say 'yes'. Would Jesus?

How can we read the bible, without thinking about any of this?

Thoughts?

This is a huge topic...of which "the law" is just the establishment of God's terms.

Following the biblical chronology one might say that the law was a reaction to sins, or even given as a guide for staying on the path; and certainly that is how it came to many along the way. However, there is a greater explanation that takes away the chronology and that type of rationale, which is only eluded to in the scriptures--and not at all understood by most...which is the idea and reality of all that took place (past tense) "before the foundation of the world."

You see, if our very lives exist "in Christ" who "was slain before the foundation of the world", "who is and who was and who is to come"...then the chronology is the greatest of stumbling blocks to fully understanding the nature of God and such matters of what is and what is not at any point between the beginning and the end. Better read that again. But then also understand that the beginning and the end is rather the Beginning and the End: Christ.

The point is...in our lives and from the perspective of living at a particular time in history--is like flipping open a book to a single page and trying to correctly assess the context. Even if you have read the pages that came before, it is all skewed by the trajectory of your current position. Which of course, is not God's perspective of the overall, and therefore offers very little to an overall understanding. But back to the point--the point is, Christ "was"...and this is all just the Revelation of the details leading up to what history has and will lay out before and after what was not even an event in Time...except that it "was" written and is being revealed.

Thus, the letter of the law is the wrong perspective because it is but a slice of understanding, and only the Spirit is all. Therefore "the words must be spiritually discerned."