Matthew 19:30

[Fred J]

Hello Fred J,
Jesus preached to the Jews first, they were first told to...
Mark 1:14-15,
- now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God and saying, the time is fulfilled and the kingdom of God is at hand repent ye and believe the gospel

The Jews were the first to hear the new gospel of Christ and the first who were taught about the kingdom of God being ready to be established.

Matthew 15:24,
- then Jesus said to the women I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel

Matthew 10:6,
- Philip and Bartholomew, Thomas and Matthew the publican James the son of Alphaeus and Lebbaeus whose surname was Thaddaeus, Simon the Canaanite and Judas Iscariot who also betrayed Him, these twelve Jesus sent forth and commanded them saying,
Go not into the way of the gentiles and into the city of the samaritans enter ye not:
But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel,

- and as ye go preach saying the kingdom of heaven is at hand, heal the sick cleanse the lepers raise the dead, cast out devils freely ye have received freely give provide neither gold nor silver nor brass in your purses

The Jews were first taught about Jesus and the coming of His kingdom.
Some did believe but not as many as the gentiles that were taught the gospel last.

The rejection of the jews opened access for the gentiles to the new testament gospel,
Acts 13:46,
  - then Paul and Barnabus waxed bold and said it was nessary that the word of God should first have been spoken to you(Jews) but seeing ye put it from you and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life lo we turn to the gentiles

Romans 11:12-15,
- now if the gentiles were enriched because the people of Israel turned down Gods offer of salvation think how much greater a blessing the world will share when they finally accept it

Dear Titus, what's your point?

Thank you

 

[Titus]

i also take note for some of you, it refers to the Jews first and the Gentiles last.

This verse Jesus addressed to the Jews who were leaders of Israel in disbelieve and contending Him in Israel.

And, also those who believe and rejoice merely based on all the glorious things that were done by Jesus in Israel.

That's why He said, when the Master of the house shall be risen up the door will be shut to these in Israel, who've heard and seen already. (verse 25)

Therefore the Gospel will depart from them in Israel, and apparently will go to the Gentiles and Jews outside of Israel, who've not heard and seen.

Since He was addressing to the Jews in Israel, was He not referring to the remnant of Jews saved by grace in Israel shall be first? (Romans 11:6)

Also on the day of Pentecost, there were also devout Jews from east to the west, and north to the south present and were saved added to the remnant as well?

Wasn't Paul a chosen 'instrument' of Christ, who will bear His name before the Gentiles, and kings, and the children of Israel outside of Israel?

Since he is the most wanted fugitive in Israel, where at one time a basket was used to have him escape from Israel?


And, finally until the fullness of Gentiles be come in, and so all Israel shall be saved, aren't they the last?

Again apparently scripturally, when the Gospel is done with the Gentiles and the fullness of them be come in already.

Finally, there'll be 'two witnesses' sent to Israel and will minister to the Jews there during the reign of 'anti-Christ'.

By these, how can we testify the Gentiles are last, when all Israel are last to be saved??

Shalom in the name of Jesus Christ our Lord

- So all Israel shall be saved, Romans 11:26,
Traced back to Romans 11:5
- even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

The Jews were already being saved, Acts 2:38-39
Romans 11:26 states that the Jews not yet saved will be saved the same way they have already been saved,
Romans 11:26,
- and so all Israel shall be saved

Do you believe by Paul's statement that all Jews will be saved, every single jew that ever lived?

The Jews were still given the gospel first and saved first but many rejected the gospel. Acts 2:38
The gentiles were second in hearing, believing and being baptized into Christ, Acts 10

 

[Fred J]

- So all Israel shall be saved, Romans 11:26,

That is until when the destined full number of Gentiles have come in through the Gospel and are saved.

There's no more Gentiles to minister the Gospel after this since is fulfilled.

Then there will be 'two divine witnesses' sent to the nation Israel to minister to the Jews there.

So the Jews will be the 'last' to be saved, as according to Romans 11:26 prophesied by Paul

Traced back to Romans 11:5
- even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

Yes, this remnant includes Jesus' disciples and followers, and the other saved Jews.

Saved from the day of Pentecost onward to the time of Paul's conversion and ministry.

Including himself until He is mentioning this in his epistle to the Roman church.

The Jews were already being saved, Acts 2:38-39
Romans 11:26 states that the Jews not yet saved will be saved the same way they have already been saved,
Romans 11:26,

Yes, the rest of the unsaved Jews will be saved by grace likewise, as how the remnant is saved by grace initially.

- and so all Israel shall be saved

Again at the end, when all the Gentiles destined to be saved have come in.

Do you believe by Paul's statement that all Jews will be saved, every single jew that ever lived?

Yes, Paul prophesied the mystery, that 'all Israel shall be saved' in the end.

Every single 'Jew' meaning, truly they all must be the descendants of Israel/Jacob.

Those who descend from the his 12 sons, the 12 tribes of Israel, 'not' any one who claim to be a Jew.

The Jews were still given the gospel first and saved first but many rejected the gospel. Acts 2:38
The gentiles were second in hearing, believing and being baptized into Christ, Acts 10

And lastly third in hearing, the true Jews in Israel will be saved in the end.

This 'debunks' the speculation the Jews 'first' and the Gentiles 'last'.

When apparently the Jews once again are 'last' to be saved by grace, and then the end will come.

Shalom in the name of Jesus Christ.

 

[Jay Ross]

That is until when the destined full number of Gentiles have come in through the Gospel and are saved.

That is not what Romans 11:25b-26a states.

The Greek states this when translated: -

"When the fulness, with respect to time, of the Gentiles is completed, after that, all of Israel will be saved.​

What you are presenting is the flawed understanding embraced by the Pre-trib theology.

What Paul was pointing to was that when the fulness of the 2,300 years of the Gentiles trampling God's sanctuary and His earthly hosts under the influence and leading of the Little Horn beast will be completed, which will also occur when the visitation of the iniquities of the fathers is visited upon their children and the children's children in the third and the fourth age of the existence of the Israelites is completed.

Both of these events will be completed in around 20 years' time from now which Jesus told His disciples would end around 96 years after the fig tree begins budding leaves once more. The fig tree, i.e. the nation of Israel, began budding leaves in the year 1948 AD and that this would herald the Summer Season of the harvest during the seventh age. This occurred when some of Abraham's descendants returned to the land of Canaan in their own strength during the fourth age of their existence in fulfilment of the Genesis 15:16a prophecy while the fulness of the iniquities of the Amorite people group is coming to its pinnacle of rebelling against God.

Shalom

 

[Fred J]

That is not what Romans 11:25b-26a states.

The Greek states this when translated: -

"When the fulness, with respect to time, of the Gentiles is completed, after that, all of Israel will be saved.​

You need Greek translation, but we have the Holy Ghost and English translation at hand.

Anyway, what's the different, i still understand the same with the KJV translation i have.

What you are presenting is the flawed understanding embraced by the Pre-trib theology.

What Paul was pointing to was that when the fulness of the 2,300 years of the Gentiles trampling God's sanctuary and His earthly hosts under the influence and leading of the Little Horn beast will be completed, which will also occur when the visitation of the iniquities of the fathers is visited upon their children and the children's children in the third and the fourth age of the existence of the Israelites is completed.

Both of these events will be completed in around 20 years' time from now which Jesus told His disciples would end around 96 years after the fig tree begins budding leaves once more. The fig tree, i.e. the nation of Israel, began budding leaves in the year 1948 AD and that this would herald the Summer Season of the harvest during the seventh age. This occurred when some of Abraham's descendants returned to the land of Canaan in their own strength during the fourth age of their existence in fulfilment of the Genesis 15:16a prophecy while the fulness of the iniquities of the Amorite people group is coming to its pinnacle of rebelling against God.

This is your 'flaw' which is 'heresy' and of 'heretics', am not buying it, no thank you.

 

[Jay Ross]

This is your 'flaw' which is 'heresy' and of 'heretics', am not buying it, no thank you.

You are welcome to believe it or not. 20 years is but a short time to see if what I have posted is true.

 

[Davy]

i also take note for some of you, it refers to the Jews first and the Gentiles last.

This is a mystery, but when Jesus said He was not sent but unto the lost sheep of the "house of Israel", He was not referring to the Jews there in the holy land at His 1st coming. The Gospel was indeed preached to those Jews first, but it should be obvious the majority of them were not ordained at that time to accept The Gospel of Jesus Christ, even by Apostle Paul showing in Romans 11 that God had put the "spirit of slumber" upon the majority of those Jews in Judea, which would not be removed until Christ returns. Lord Jesus was actually referring to places where The Gospel would... be accepted by the majority of peoples there. That was in Asia Minor with the first established Christian Churches outside the holy land, and then in Europe. It included members of all 12 tribes scattered abroad too, scattered among the Gentiles. Just why so many believing Jews today leave that Biblical and 'historical' fact out of this, I fail to grasp why they do that.

Furthermore, the title "house of Israel" after God had split the old nation of Israel in Solomon's day, per 1 Kings 11 forward), that title afterwards applied only to the ten northern tribe "kingdom of Israel". And those ten tribes were scattered out of the northern part of the holy land first, the Jews of the southern "kingdom of Judah" being the only ones of Israel left in the southern part of the holy land by the time of Jesus' 1st coming. So Jesus was actually referring to the the scattered ten tribes of Israel as the lost sheep, and they as a people would be the founders of the western Christian nations, fulfilling the prophecy to Ephraim in Genesis 48, that his seed would become "a multitude of nations."

James 1:1
1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.
KJV

This verse Jesus addressed to the Jews who were leaders of Israel in disbelieve and contending Him in Israel.

Not all of those leaders of Israel at Jesus' 1st coming were actual true bloodline Jews of the seed of Israel. The scribes of Israel at that time were the crept in unawares of Canaan, a group called the Kenites (1 Chronicles 2:55). And even though not all the Pharisees were against Jesus, a specific group among the Pharisees that wanted to kill Jesus were shown in John 8 that they were actually Satan's servants that Jesus represented as the "tares" of Matthew 13. (The good wheat represent God's people, but the "tares" represent the enemy that crept in, as real tares looks just like real wheat while growing, but at harvest time the tare emits a black bud on its end, making it easy to identify as a weed, and is thus separated from the wheat.) In the parable Lord Jesus showed to let the "tares" alone, until harvest time when they will be separated. (See Jude 4; Deuteronomy 20:15-18; Judges 2 & 3; 1 Kings 9:20-22; Joshua 9; Ezra 2; Ezra 9)

Therefore the Gospel will depart from them in Israel, and apparently will go to the Gentiles and Jews outside of Israel, who've not heard and seen.

Let's not pump our Jewishness up beyond Scripture and history, please. It was mainly the lost ten tribes and Gentiles that made up the majority of believers of Christ's Church once The Gospel was preached outside the holy land. The Jews who believed when The Gospel went to the Gentiles made up only a small remnant of believers on Jesus Christ, even as it still is to this day, because the majority of today's Jews still reject Lord Jesus. And God has not lost the ten lost tribes He scattered, otherwise the joining of the two symbolic sticks of Ezekiel 37 for the future at Christ's return would not happen. To this day, the children of Israel represent "two nations" like Ezekiel 37 says (Ezekiel 37:22).

Since He was addressing to the Jews in Israel, was He not referring to the remnant of Jews saved by grace in Israel shall be first? (Romans 11:6)

Yes, however, that still does not mean the majority of the seed of the children of Israel, i.e., the ten tribes, were just left out. Otherwise why would Apostle James address the 12 tribes scattered abroad which were not all Jews?

Jews = "house of Judah", southern "kingdom of Judah", "Jerusalem", or just "Judah". The Jewish historian Josephus said that title 'Jew' is what those returning to Jerusalem from their Babylon captivity called their selves. That title did not apply to the ten northern tribes of Israel because they were already gone, scattered out of the holy land before the Jews went captive to Babylon.

Non-Jews = northern ten tribes of Israel, known Biblically after the 1 Kings 11 split as the "house of Israel", or "kingdom of Israel", or just as "Israel", or as "Samaria" their capital city, or as "Ephraim" the head tribe over the other 9 tribes, or as "Joseph" the father of Ephraim and Manasseh.