My take on the Baptism in the Spirit...

[quietthinker]

Well when you have walked the walk it is natural to pass on the key elements.

So many teach but not from first hand experience.

Experience has its place and is useful, however if our experience results in a 'how to' message, a distortion has been introduced.

 

[Carl Emerson]

Experience has its place and is useful, however if our experience results in a 'how to' message, a distortion has been introduced.

I could respond to that, but it leads to a philosophical exchange and that is not my intent.

 

[quietthinker]

I could respond to that, but it leads to a philosophical exchange and that is not my intent.

what is your intent Carl?

 

[Carl Emerson]

what is your intent Carl?

To encourage folks to walk in celebration of His purpose - there is an exciting life to be lived in Him and sadly many miss it.

I have just started a testimony thread, I have waited 40 years before sharing about what I have seen and now is the time.

 

[marks]

@marks

Could you kindly explain yourself further?

I believe that the Bible is given to us that we can know God, and trust in Him. I believe that as we commit ourselves to the Scriptures, that is, when we are determined that what they say is what we will do, as this is God's Word to us. This is the design for our lives being explained to us by our Creator, and our Savior.

When Paul wrote to the Roman Christians, he gave God's explicit teaching (not just Romans, just for example) about the New Testament believing person, now being reborn, something unknown before Jesus' resurrection. God teaches us very plainly about law and sin and grace and justification and faith and all these. What being reborn specifically is. Who we are now. What our nature is now. What our relationship to God is now.

Of course we assemble these teachings from across many places.

What I mean is this. Yes, we can know the statements made in the Bible frontwards and backwards, and maybe not be changed by them. What I'm talking about is then having our thoughts patterned after those Scriptures. That when the wife does something irritating, the mind responds in the intent to be slow to anger. When the unexpected bill arrives, not a flash of worry, but "Jesus, this just came, I don't know what I'm going to do, Here you go!" Never thinking that Jesus has left me or "dilluted" Himself to me, because He has promised, I will never leave you nor forsake you.

Maybe what I'm trying to describe is a mind that doesn't respond except with Scripture, and thoughts based in, formed around Scripture, and the truths it teaches. A mind that believes in the God Who parted the sea, to give miraculous deliverance, and destruction of the enemy.

I recommend to people, pick a book of the Bible, and read it over and over for a month. Two months. Colossians is absolutely filled with treasures for NT Christians (don't get me wrong, all the Bible is) and you can read it in 20 minutes, 30 if you go slowly. What will happen if you read it in the morning before work, on your lunch break, when you get home one or two or three more times. If you listen to the audio in your car as you drive. You can easily fit this little book 5, 6, 7 times into a day. At 5 times a day, thats 35 per week, or about 150 times in a month.

Imagine 150 times of back to back reading/hearing of God's detailed revelations of life and redemption and our new life in Christ!

I've seen the power of this in my life as the sheer repetion builds neural pathways later to be used by the mind as we process our thoughts. Rewriting your brain with the Bible as your schematic.

God's truths become an unmoveable Rock, Christ in you. The mind of Christ imprinted from His Holy Word. As we live out those things, we further build and strengthen those neural pathways in our brains that support faithful living. In this way, as we make choices according to God's Word, we participate in our restoration, working out what God works in, so we can see Him reflected in ourselves, and we see how we are becoming like Him.

Much love!

 

[marks]

When we receive fully our reconciliation to God in Jesus Christ, we are free to trust Him fully for the abundant life He gives by His Spirit, and that life becomes manifest in us.

Much love!

 

[Carl Emerson]

Ohh Carl, do I smell another 'how to' thread?

Actually, I might say that often

I believe that the Bible is given to us that we can know God, and trust in Him. I believe that as we commit ourselves to the Scriptures, that is, when we are determined that what they say is what we will do, as this is God's Word to us. This is the design for our lives being explained to us by our Creator, and our Savior.

When Paul wrote to the Roman Christians, he gave God's explicit teaching (not just Romans, just for example) about the New Testament believing person, now being reborn, something unknown before Jesus' resurrection. God teaches us very plainly about law and sin and grace and justification and faith and all these. What being reborn specifically is. Who we are now. What our nature is now. What our relationship to God is now.

Of course we assemble these teachings from across many places.

What I mean is this. Yes, we can know the statements made in the Bible frontwards and backwards, and maybe not be changed by them. What I'm talking about is then having our thoughts patterned after those Scriptures. That when the wife does something irritating, the mind responds in the intent to be slow to anger. When the unexpected bill arrives, not a flash of worry, but "Jesus, this just came, I don't know what I'm going to do, Here you go!" Never thinking that Jesus has left me or "dilluted" Himself to me, because He has promised, I will never leave you nor forsake you.

Maybe what I'm trying to describe is a mind that doesn't respond except with Scripture, and thoughts based in, formed around Scripture, and the truths it teaches. A mind that believes in the God Who parted the sea, to give miraculous deliverance, and destruction of the enemy.

I recommend to people, pick a book of the Bible, and read it over and over for a month. Two months. Colossians is absolutely filled with treasures for NT Christians (don't get me wrong, all the Bible is) and you can read it in 20 minutes, 30 if you go slowly. What will happen if you read it in the morning before work, on your lunch break, when you get home one or two or three more times. If you listen to the audio in your car as you drive. You can easily fit this little book 5, 6, 7 times into a day. At 5 times a day, thats 35 per week, or about 150 times in a month.

Imagine 150 times of back to back reading/hearing of God's detailed revelations of life and redemption and our new life in Christ!

I've seen the power of this in my life as the sheer repetion builds neural pathways later to be used by the mind as we process our thoughts. Rewriting your brain with the Bible as your schematic.

God's truths become an unmoveable Rock, Christ in you. The mind of Christ imprinted from His Holy Word. As we live out those things, we further build and strengthen those neural pathways in our brains that support faithful living. In this way, as we make choices according to God's Word, we participate in our restoration, working out what God works in, so we can see Him reflected in ourselves, and we see how we are becoming like Him.

Much love!

Yes.. well said, and I resonate with this of course.

What you have presented pertains to progressively being redeemed in character by the renewing of the mind.

However my focus is on the matter of walking in the spirit.

We are not counselled to walk in the mind.

This is what I have been privileged to learn and it has opened up a whole new aspect of life as He leads me in ways the mind cannot comprehend.

The Spirit communicates with our spirit so like Jesus we can see what the Father is doing.

This opens the way to walking in the specific will of God doing the works appointed in His purpose.

Being led to strangers at the right time with the right Word or a prayer of healing - seeing lives change in front of your eyes is blessing beyond words.

This dimension of Christian service is opened up through the Baptism of the Spirit.

 

[marks]

Actually, I might say that often


Yes.. well said, and I resonate with this of course.

What you have presented pertains to progressively being redeemed in character by the renewing of the mind.

However my focus is on the matter of walking in the spirit.

We are not counselled to walk in the mind.

This is what I have been privileged to learn and it has opened up a whole new aspect of life as He leads me in ways the mind cannot comprehend.

The Spirit communicates with our spirit so like Jesus we can see what the Father is doing.

This opens the way to walking in the specific will of God doing the works appointed in His purpose.

Being led to strangers at the right time with the right Word or a prayer of healing - seeing lives change in front of your eyes is blessing beyond words.

This dimension of Christian service is opened up through the Baptism of the Spirit.

As we walk in the Spirit the mind is renewed. No, we are not counseled to walk in the mind as you say, the mind is simply a tool we use. We are not our minds. We are the spirit children of God, living in the flesh body of a man born from Adam.

As we walk in the Spirit, this is to live our spirit child life, through that flesh body. The flesh body houses the brain, corrupted by sin. Walking in the Spirit removes us completely from that fleshy life, overcoming all things. I think the majority of Christians move in and out of the Spirit walk, and that consistency in the Spirit is our chief lack.

When we can consistently walk in the Spirit, our life is revolutionized.

Lord lift me up, and let me stand, by faith on heaven's table land! A higher plane, than I have found, Lord plant my feet on higher ground!

I've come to know that by fully trusting in Jesus having reconciled us to God opens the way for us to have the faith that we can stand by grace, and to the extent that we will trust Him, we will walk in His Spirit, and He trains us in so doing.

Much love!

 

[marks]

This is what I have been privileged to learn and it has opened up a whole new aspect of life as He leads me in ways the mind cannot comprehend.

I understand.

Much love!

 

[Ancient]

Baptism in the spirit is not an optional extra for some but an essential empowering for anyone who truely seeks to walk in the purposes of Jesus fruitfully.

The reason for this is that the empowering of the Holy Spirit upon you and the manifestation of what gifts you need to serve effectively where you are planted will follow this important gift of Grace.

I will start with contextualising the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. Broadly speaking the Empowering of the Spirit upon God's servants in the old covenant was temporary for a task. Further I don't believe in the OC the saints were indwelled as we are.

So being born again means permanent indwelling, however He can be grieved by our lack of communion with Him and His presence can dissipate. We then need fresh infilling after repentance...

It seems to me that the born again experience is at a time when He gives the Grace to make the decision to be fully surrendered to His Will.

But the BHS experience is in His time - not our decision but His.

Now a critical matter to understand is that JB was given a sign to recognise Messiah.

He baptising in the Jordan and was told to watch out for the ONE on whom the Spirit would come upon and remain upon.

All others would receive a temporary blessing of the presence of the Spirit but Jesus received this permanently.

It should be noted that Jesus was indwelled with the Spirit from birth, but this Baptism in the Spirit that He received as He was coming up out of the water was a permanent empowering upon Him for ministry.

It is important to note that JB was also told the Jesus would Baptise in the Holy Spirit and that what JB saw was in fact the very first occasion on which any human was baptised in the Spirit.

The BHS is not always given by the laying on of hands - many, like myself testify to receiving BHS quite independently.

In scripture when BHS was received at the time of laying on of hands, the apostles must have been hearing from the Spirit and been in sync with God's timing.

That is one of the reasons there has been confusion - leaders laying on hands without really knowing it is God's time for the individual.

Combine this with the insistence that every individual must speak in tongues and you have serious mix of half truth.

I received the Baptism in the Spirit in a church that didnt even believe in it - listening to a sermon in a Brethren Church I suddenly saw the chasm between His Holiness and my pitiful state. I was in tears for about an hour, in deep repentance, and it seemed as if my mind was being pulled apart and put back together. I had no idea what was happening. The next day Jesus made it clear that I had been baptised in the Spirit.

He is a good God with good gifts - we don't need a hand in it to help Him along.

So how do we know we have been blessed this way...

There is a fresh and permanent enabling to fulfil what we are called to do and gifts are manifest to accomplish this.

How do we get it ?

Ask and you shall receive - but in His time.

Given the challenge in this age to stand for Jesus in a hostile and deceptive world, you certainly need it.

'Seeing' what is going on spiritually is critical.

I used to help run an open home and as soon as a trouble maker stepped onto the property day or night He would alert me in the Spirit.

It is a 'plateau' experience - your whole perception of spiritual matters will permanently change.

Like Elijah's servant being shown the army in the spirit realm.

However the control of such gifts is in His hands not ours, He turns them on when needed.

If you receive a gift, always ask for wisdom in its use and give it back to Him.

So I pray according to "if we ask anything according to His Will He hears us and if we know he hears us we know that He grants the request that we ask"

So is it Gods will for you to be empowered for ministry ?

Then ask with certain confidence.

Questions welcome.

Blessings and Shalom

 

[Carl Emerson]

Blessings and Shalom

Would you like to summarise the stance the video takes in general terms please.

 

[NayborBear]

To encourage folks to walk in celebration of His purpose - there is an exciting life to be lived in Him and sadly many miss it.

I have just started a testimony thread, I have waited 40 years before sharing about what I have seen and now is the time.

(I was looking for 1 of your posts to reply to that I might seek your opinion or insight on an item or 2, without simply adding a post/question that was not addressed to anyone specifically.)

?) Would you say we are in these days?
Matthew 24:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. (Sure seems that we are, to me anyways)

?) What or who/whom do you believe this verse is referring to?
Matthew 24:
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
(Might Jesus be referring to denomination/alism?)

and finally?
?) True of false:
Any time a man thinks it weakens the faith?

Thank you for any insight/s or opinions you may have to offer.

 

[quietthinker]

Baptism in the spirit is not an optional extra for some but an essential empowering for anyone who truely seeks to walk in the purposes of Jesus fruitfully.

The reason for this is that the empowering of the Holy Spirit upon you and the manifestation of what gifts you need to serve effectively where you are planted will follow this important gift of Grace.

I will start with contextualising the Baptism of the Holy Spirit. Broadly speaking the Empowering of the Spirit upon God's servants in the old covenant was temporary for a task. Further I don't believe in the OC the saints were indwelled as we are.

So being born again means permanent indwelling, however He can be grieved by our lack of communion with Him and His presence can dissipate. We then need fresh infilling after repentance...

It seems to me that the born again experience is at a time when He gives the Grace to make the decision to be fully surrendered to His Will.

But the BHS experience is in His time - not our decision but His.

Now a critical matter to understand is that JB was given a sign to recognise Messiah.

He baptising in the Jordan and was told to watch out for the ONE on whom the Spirit would come upon and remain upon.

All others would receive a temporary blessing of the presence of the Spirit but Jesus received this permanently.

It should be noted that Jesus was indwelled with the Spirit from birth, but this Baptism in the Spirit that He received as He was coming up out of the water was a permanent empowering upon Him for ministry.

It is important to note that JB was also told the Jesus would Baptise in the Holy Spirit and that what JB saw was in fact the very first occasion on which any human was baptised in the Spirit.

The BHS is not always given by the laying on of hands - many, like myself testify to receiving BHS quite independently.

In scripture when BHS was received at the time of laying on of hands, the apostles must have been hearing from the Spirit and been in sync with God's timing.

That is one of the reasons there has been confusion - leaders laying on hands without really knowing it is God's time for the individual.

Combine this with the insistence that every individual must speak in tongues and you have serious mix of half truth.

I received the Baptism in the Spirit in a church that didnt even believe in it - listening to a sermon in a Brethren Church I suddenly saw the chasm between His Holiness and my pitiful state. I was in tears for about an hour, in deep repentance, and it seemed as if my mind was being pulled apart and put back together. I had no idea what was happening. The next day Jesus made it clear that I had been baptised in the Spirit.

He is a good God with good gifts - we don't need a hand in it to help Him along.

So how do we know we have been blessed this way...

There is a fresh and permanent enabling to fulfil what we are called to do and gifts are manifest to accomplish this.

How do we get it ?

Ask and you shall receive - but in His time.

Given the challenge in this age to stand for Jesus in a hostile and deceptive world, you certainly need it.

'Seeing' what is going on spiritually is critical.

I used to help run an open home and as soon as a trouble maker stepped onto the property day or night He would alert me in the Spirit.

It is a 'plateau' experience - your whole perception of spiritual matters will permanently change.

Like Elijah's servant being shown the army in the spirit realm.

However the control of such gifts is in His hands not ours, He turns them on when needed.

If you receive a gift, always ask for wisdom in its use and give it back to Him.

So I pray according to "if we ask anything according to His Will He hears us and if we know he hears us we know that He grants the request that we ask"

So is it Gods will for you to be empowered for ministry ?

Then ask with certain confidence.

Questions welcome.

I wonder why Jesus made so few words on the subject yet men feel they need a dissertation?

 

[Carl Emerson]

(I was looking for 1 of your posts to reply to that I might seek your opinion or insight on an item or 2, without simply adding a post/question that was not addressed to anyone specifically.)

?) Would you say we are in these days?
Matthew 24:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. (Sure seems that we are, to me anyways)

?) What or who/whom do you believe this verse is referring to?
Matthew 24:
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
(Might Jesus be referring to denomination/alism?)

and finally?
?) True of false:
Any time a man thinks it weakens the faith?

Thank you for any insight/s or opinions you may have to offer.

Questions 1 and 2 I can't answer because I am not gifted to speak on end times.

Q3 Paul speaks of a war between the un-regenerate mind and the Spirit.

However, faith comes from hearing the Word of Christ, and if the mind agrees to obedience, there is no problem.

So the degree to which your mind is redeemed you faith will be strong.

But faith is not a mindset - it is a gift we accept and believe in or reject in unbelief.

 

[Carl Emerson]

I wonder why Jesus made so few words on the subject yet men feel they need a dissertation?

We don't know what Jesus spoke about many things.

In Acts we see the BHS was central to the extension of the Kingdom as the Church exploded.

This is a lost focus in the modern church.

The harvest is ripe but the workers are few.

The Lord of the Harvest wants to empower those who seek to join with Him on the edge of the Kingdom.

The BHS is how He does it.

 

[quietthinker]

We don't know what Jesus spoke about many things.

In Acts we see the BHS was central to the extension of the Kingdom as the Church exploded.

This is a lost focus in the modern church.

The harvest is ripe but the workers are few.

The Lord of the Harvest wants to empower those who seek to join with Him on the edge of the Kingdom.

The BHS is how He does it.

could it be that his brevity is deliberate?

 

[Hidden In Him]

could it be that his brevity is deliberate?

Carl might have his own take here, Quiet, but I believe part of the reason for brevity on a number of subjects in scripture is because the Lord intended for His church to walk in the teaching of the Holy Spirit rather than in volumes upon volumes of the written word, with everything spelled out in writing. The more we would have been prone to look for all the answers in writing, the more miffed I believe we would have become when some detail wasn't there, and I don't think there is any way God could have recorded the answer to every question we could have come up with in writing. So the Lord set things up so that we would be dependent upon the Holy Spirit as our Teacher in all things, particularly details regarding the operations of the Spirit not specifically given in scripture.

 

[marks]

could it be that his brevity is deliberate?

Instead of thinking of the Word being with "brevity", I think of it more as being succinct. I don't think brevity really fits anyway, in that there is so much repetition of teachings.

Much love!

 

[Carl Emerson]

could it be that his brevity is deliberate?

We don't know that He was brief and He certainly inspired the Apostles to present the BHS as central to evangelism.

 

[marks]

The Lord of the Harvest wants to empower those who seek to join with Him on the edge of the Kingdom.

This is the best . . . ask the Lord of the harvest to send His workers, and be ready to be sent, if He sends you.

Much love!