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Featured No One Goes to Heaven, and What the Kingdom of God On Earth Will Be Like in the Millennial Shabbath

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by cgneustar, Jun 8, 2019.

  1. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    I don't say the BIBLE say. and two, no contradictions, no Enoch did not see death but tasted it. scripture, Romans 5:14 "Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come". even when the LAW was given men died.
    so after Adam and after the giving of the law by Moses, all men died. well that got ENOCH.
    understand, where Enoch was at that time and place, there was violence in the earth, as a matter of fact full of it. God just moved, or TRANSPORTED/translated him to another part of the planet. as said this was nothing new, as was with Ezekiel he was lifted off the Earth surface and was moved,
    Ezekiel 3:10 "Moreover he said unto me, Son of man, all my words that I shall speak unto thee receive in thine heart, and hear with thine ears.
    Ezekiel 3:11 "And go, get thee to them of the captivity, unto the children of thy people, and speak unto them, and tell them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; whether they will hear, or whether they will forbear.
    Ezekiel 3:12 "Then the spirit took me up, and I heard behind me a voice of a great rushing, saying, Blessed be the glory of the LORD from his place.
    Ezekiel 3:13 "I heard also the noise of the wings of the living creatures that touched one another, and the noise of the wheels over against them, and a noise of a great rushing.
    Ezekiel 3:14 "So the spirit lifted me up, and took me away, and I went in bitterness, in the heat of my spirit; but the hand of the LORD was strong upon me.

    you should read your commentary on the above scriptures.

    so was in the vally of dry bones, Ezekiel 37:1 "The hand of the LORD was upon me, and carried me out in the spirit of the LORD, and set me down in the midst of the valley which was full of bones".


    the Book of Hebrews clearly said all died. that's clear as day. if enoch was an exception the bible would have said so.

    read up on theses two.

    PICJAG.
     
  2. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    It says that he was not; for God took him.

    The Bible did indeed say so.

    But believe what you want to believe about this; it appears to me to be a peripheral issue.

    Luke 16:01 says that if we are faithful in that which is least, we will be faithful also in that which is greater.

    Therefore it is important to seek to be correct even on peripheral issues; and I am correct: but I am also not going to get into a huge contention with you about it. Because me being faithful in that which is least means that I will also be faithful in that which is greater; but you being unfaithful in that which is least also speaks of how you will be when greater doctrines are being discussed.

    But I'm not going to divide with you over what I perceive to be a peripheral issue. But I will hold to the truth of the matter in my own belief and teaching so that if there is any major doctrine that might be affected by this aberration concerning minor doctrine, I will not be captivated by the major aberration that might develop over being unfaithful concerning a minor doctrine.
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2019
  3. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    i know what Rev 1:7 says already jbf, run as fast as you like ok.
    Still havent bothered with that Hegelian thingy either, i see. Just dont figger that applies to you, or what?
     
  4. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    But you don't believe it.

    Because you said that you don't think that every eye will see Him when He returns.
     
  5. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    pretty sure i didnt jbf, and that is not what cg said either, if you go look my friend. Have a nice evening
     
  6. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Pretty sure you did.

     
  7. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    ah, maybe you're right, maybe not; who knows? :)
    i'd get a second opinion tho brah, plenty witnesses herenow
     
  8. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    I think maybe you've been smoking too much mj.
     
  9. charity

    charity Well-Known Member

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    Hello @Enoch111,

    With respect, no I do not believe it is true. All are awaiting the resurrection out from among the dead, otherwise it makes the necessity of resurrection a nonsense. Believers who die in the Lord, are reckoned by God to be 'asleep' in Him. They close their eyes in death, and are awakened to resurrection life, the passage of time unknown.

    Praise God!

    In Christ Jesus
    Chris
     
  10. charity

    charity Well-Known Member

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    Hello @cgneustar,

    There is a heavenly hope as well as one which is upon the earth. The blessings of the Church which is the Body of Christ will be enjoyed far above all heavens where Christ now sits at God's right hand. This is the hope expressed in Ephesians, Philippians and Colossians.

    In Christ Jesus
    Chris
     
  11. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    Ha well you might be right, been about 5 days though, maybe a week. And fwiw i confessed that for a good reason jbf, matter of fact i confessed that just for you apparently. And well i guess Dave too. But Dave's Not Here, see? I'd go with a diff witness myself anyway. So i appreciate your quite revealing comments here jbf...funny what we see and can't see i guess, huh

    So for now i'll stick with "Christ will not be seen by all eyes when He comes" bc no one can Quote that, see, and pardon the slip there @ "returns" if you will, didn't mean to say that, Bc no one can Quote that one either. Stay here for the present, imo :)
     
  12. bbyrd009

    bbyrd009 Groper

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    hey, i'm not denying that that might be possible, ok pEnoch? I said you can't Quote any of that, not a single thing from "immediately upon his death" on down, ok, which see you had to add to the Book to say.
    Wait'll you find out who Stephen reps bro
     
  13. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    Well Charity, I'm sorry to see that you have fallen for the false Soul Sleep doctrine. Where did Stephen go after he specifically said to Christ "Lord Jesus, receive my spirit"? Do you really believe that Jesus ignored Him, or that Jesus is not in Heaven???? That one incident thoroughly refutes Soul Sleep, as does Hebrew 12:22-24.
     
  14. Mal'ak

    Mal'ak Member

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    You are using Jewish Law to explain Christianity and it is true in Old Testament it says no Jew will go to Heaven, as David prophesied that all the righteous Jews would be in Hell in Abraham's Bosom until Jesus died for their sins, since no one can go to Heaven without Jesus' sacrifice as the Lamb of God.

    Acts 2:29 Men and brethren, let me freely speak unto you of the patriarch David, that he is both dead and buried, and his sepulchre is with us unto this day.
    Acts 2:30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;
    Acts 2:31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.

    1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:
    1 Peter 3:19 By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison;
    1 Peter 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

    Jews also believed that paradise was on flesh Earth, but you need to understand that the Old Testament and Jewish Religion was a flesh example of spiritual things to come. "1 Corinthians 10:11 Now all these things happened unto them for examples: and they are written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the world are come." The thousand years on Earth is not paradise, that is just a thousand years while the non-believers are preached the Word of God before the White Throne of Judgement. There will be no flesh in paradise, there will be a new Heaven and new Earth, remade. Heaven and Earth will be connected, open and there will be no flesh Earth as we know it now.

    Revelation 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
     
  15. charity

    charity Well-Known Member

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    Hello @Enoch111,

    Yes, wonderfully, Stephen, like His Lord before him, made the same commitment of His spirit to God the Father. Then he died. as his Lord had died: but His Lord was raised to life on the third day. We are not told this of Stephen. So He still awaits the resurrection. For it is only the resurrection power of God that can raise Him, and all believers, from the dead; then spirit and body (a resurrection body) will be united, and become a living soul once more.

    * The Lord Jesus promised the believer (during the Acts period) resurrection from the dead, 'at His coming'.

    'For as in Adam all die,
    even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
    But every man in his own order:
    Christ the firstfruits;
    afterward they that are Christ's
    at His coming.'

    (1 Corinthians 15:22)

    * Following the Acts period, the hope given to the Church of the One Body was to 'appear' with Christ when He appears in glory (Colossians 3:3-4) . This was, then, Paul's hope also, to be resurrected out from among dead ones (the exanastasis - or 'out resurrection' - out from among dead ones) - (Philippians 3:10-11)

    'That I may know Him,
    and the power of His resurrection,
    and the fellowship of His sufferings,
    being made conformable unto His death;
    If by any means I might attain unto
    the resurrection
    (exanastatis) of the dead.'

    'For ye are dead,
    and your life is hid with Christ in God.
    When Christ, who is our life, shall appear,
    then shall ye also appear with Him in glory.'
    (Colossians 3:3-4)

    Looking for that blessed hope,
    and the glorious appearing
    of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;'
    (Titus 2:13)

    * These verses were written following Israel's final descent into blindness at Acts 28, and salvation being sent to the Gentiles: they reflect the hope then held (received by Paul by Divine revelation). Why would they be looking for the glorious 'appearing' of their great God and Saviour Jesus Christ, if they expected to die and be with Him at death? What point the necessity for resurrection, if they were already with Him in heaven at death?

    * Mortality has to 'put on' immortality, and that happens at resurrection (1 Corinthians 15:54).
    * Also, John said that no man has ascended up into heaven, save Christ only.

    'And no man hath ascended up to heaven,
    but He that came down from heaven,
    even the Son of man which is in heaven.'

    (John 3:13)

    Thank you.
    In Christ Jesus
    Chris




     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
  16. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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  17. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    The quote is out of Revelation 1:7, as I said before (which I think you failed to look up)...

    Rev 1:7, Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
     
  18. cgneustar

    cgneustar Member

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    No one goes to heaven, neither during the existence of this earth, nor in the existence of the next earth. You err in your understanding of the truth.
     
  19. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Nancy likes this.
  20. 101G

    101G Well-Known Member

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    Hold on a sec,that's not what it says exactly,
    2 Corinthians 5:1 "For we know that if our earthly house of this tabernacle were dissolved, we have a building of God, an house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.
    2 Corinthians 5:2 "For in this we groan, earnestly desiring to be clothed upon with our house which is from heaven:
    2 Corinthians 5:3 "If so be that being clothed we shall not be found naked.
    2 Corinthians 5:4 "For we that are in this tabernacle do groan, being burdened: not for that we would be unclothed, but clothed upon, that mortality might be swallowed up of life.
    2 Corinthians 5:5 "Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit.2 Corinthians 5:6 "Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:2 Corinthians 5:7 "(For we walk by faith, not by sight:)
    2 Corinthians 5:8 "We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

    when the Lord return, then we get our new bodies in the resurrection, not at our death. to be present with the Lord is to have a body like his. now how do we know that this new body is at the resurrection and not at our deaths. scripture, 1 John 3:2 "Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is".

    well he haven't appeared yet, not at this writing. so this should end any new clothing/bodies/new tabernacle at the time of our deaths.

    scripture answer scripture.

    PICJAG.
     
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