Are these some of the attributes/characteristics of God that we can all agree on? Do you limit God Almighty? My personal belief is that God is all of the above...and more-He is ALL. Any biters, lol?
Omniscience, Omnipresence, Omnipotence, Omnibenevolence.
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"The eyes of the LORD are in every place, beholding the evil and the good." Prov 15:3 : Omniscience, omnipresence
"Doth not he see my ways, and count all my steps?" Job 31:4 : Omniscience, omnipresence
"But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible." Matt 19:26 : Omnipotence
"The LORD knoweth the days of the upright: and their inheritance shall be for ever." Psalm 37:18 : Ominiscience
"Shall not God search this out? for he knoweth the secrets of the heart." Psalm 44:21 : Omniscience
"Be not ye therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, before ye ask him." Matt 6:8 : Ominiscience
"For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things." I John 3:20 : Ominiscience
"And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." Mark 10:18 : Omnibenevolence
Then maybe a little of more than one in these verses:
"O LORD, thou hast searched me, and known me.
Thou knowest my downsitting and mine uprising, thou understandest my thought afar off.
Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquainted with all my ways.
For there is not a word in my tongue, but, lo, O LORD, thou knowest it altogether.
Thou hast beset me behind and before, and laid thine hand upon me.
Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it.
Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?
If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;
Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me." Psalm 139:1-10
"Doth not he see my ways, and count all my steps?" Job 31:4 : Omniscience, omnipresence
"But Jesus beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with God all things are possible." Matt 19:26 : Omnipotence
"The LORD knoweth the days of the upright: and their inheritance shall be for ever." Psalm 37:18 : Ominiscience
"Shall not God search this out? for he knoweth the secrets of the heart." Psalm 44:21 : Omniscience
"Be not ye therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, before ye ask him." Matt 6:8 : Ominiscience
"For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things." I John 3:20 : Ominiscience
"And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God." Mark 10:18 : Omnibenevolence
Then maybe a little of more than one in these verses:
"O LORD, thou hast searched me, and known me.
Thou knowest my downsitting and mine uprising, thou understandest my thought afar off.
Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquainted with all my ways.
For there is not a word in my tongue, but, lo, O LORD, thou knowest it altogether.
Thou hast beset me behind and before, and laid thine hand upon me.
Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it.
Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?
If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;
Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me." Psalm 139:1-10
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Omnibenevolence is not one of the omni's.
I like to say God is all-good.
As I've said many times...He is
LOVE 1 John 4:8
MERCIFUL Ephesians 2:4-5
JUST Deuteronomy 32:4
What else??
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"I like to say God is all-good.." Well, that's exactly what Omnibenevolent means. You will not find the other 3 attributes worded that way in script either but, plenty of scripture pans all of them out.
I like to say He is ALL in ALL.
And yes, He IS Love, He is Merciful, He is Just...He is many things: Jealous, Holy, Eternal, Unchanging, Gracious, Sovereign, and more.
"What else??" Nothing at all "else", Amadeus pretty much covered the scriptures I had been looking at anyhow
.
But something people sometimes bring up on this is because God is omnipotent He can override our will, but I don't believe that. Our will, our free will if you want to put it that way as expressed in Joshua 24:15 and other places is given to us by God's Word until our allotted time is finished. God limited Himself by His own Word. Only when we permit it or when our time is at an end could even God intervene in our walk. Most people, I believe, never give Him permission. Some people, I believe, after giving Him permission withdraw it. This is our free will in action."I like to say God is all-good.." Well, that's exactly what Omnibenevolent means. You will not find the other 3 attributes worded that way in script either but, plenty of scripture pans all of them out.
I like to say He is ALL in ALL.
And yes, He IS Love, He is Merciful, He is Just...He is many things: Jealous, Holy, Eternal, Unchanging, Gracious, Sovereign, and more.
"What else??" Nothing at all "else", Amadeus pretty much covered the scriptures I had been looking at anyhow
Agreed. I have been praying hard for God to take away the anger I feel with anything tulip, esp, Individual Selection. It totally takes away ANY freedom from us to "choose this day whom you will serve". And yep, when God makes a promise, He cannot lie as that is His nature...regardless of His Omnipotence.
Harvest 1874
Well-Known Member
God is omnipresent. What does that mean? Are there scriptures that further explain or qualify that which is set forth in Psa 139:7-12?
“Where can I go from Thy Spirit? Or where can I flee from Thy presence?” (Psa 139:7)
"It is assumed upon this scripture and several others that God is omnipresent, the question should be is this scriptural?
Whenever through curiosity or any other reason our hearts or minds remove to any other foundation than that which is laid for us in the word of God, our entire Christian faith and its rest are more or less shaken. And this should alarm us, but our adversary is adroit, and we are handicapped by the errors received from the “dark ages” and by the subtlety of the argument that to deny the omnipresence of God would be to seriously dishonor Him.
The creeds handed down to us from the dark past declare that God is everywhere present—omnipresent. This is as unthinkable as it is foolish and unscriptural. Taking advantage of this error of “orthodoxy,” the Adversary has turned many away from a belief in a personal God. He who is everywhere is nowhere. The result is the absurd view, which has taken hold on some otherwise intelligent people, to the effect that good and God are synonymous.
This unscriptural declaration has been fruitful of much confusion and error; it seemingly honors God, but in reality paves the way to His dishonor and to the confusion of His people. As an illustration of the confusion that may come from this false doctrine of the omnipresence of God and Christ, note the absurdity built upon it by the theosophists, Christian Scientists and, to some extent, by others, errors to which those are liable who receive this doctrine of omnipresence as scriptural.
The argument as used by some of those referred to is that God is everywhere present, therefore, He is in this stone, He is in that piece of wood, He is in that piece of metal, He is in my body, He is in the horse or the sheep, He is everywhere. Such absurdity! Who could believe it, do you say? We answer that many people have twisted and warped their minds gradually to the acceptance of these absurdities. These now proceed to say, in what way is God in the wood, in the stones, in the iron, or in the trees, in the sheep or in the dog? And they answer their own question, saying, God merely signifies good, and in one sense of the word good is useful; hence, to say that God is in the wood is merely to say that there is something useful in that wood. It can either be used in the construction of buildings or furniture or as fuel; there is something good in it. The same way the argument applies to animals, metals, minerals; they are all good for something, and if good means God, then God is in them all.
If to some one this appears a harmless kind of error, let him not conclude that he is right without further investigation; he will then perceive that by the time he has reduced God to signifying merely good he has destroyed his conception of God as a being, as a personality. Or, if it be Christ that is thought of as being omnipresent, then the personality of Christ is thus blotted from the mind and instead of God and of Christ we merely have principles of goodness and justice and love. What a fearful loss this is to any one who has ever had a personal God and a personal Savior.
Thus we object entirely to the expression, omnipresent person, because the thought of personality is in direct conflict with the thought contained in the word omnipresent. The word “omnipresent” means to be present everywhere.
The standard definition for “person” is "Any being having life, intelligence, will, and separate, individual existence." Separate existence means, apart from other things—not in everything and everywhere.
Our text, (Psa 139:7) misunderstood, is supposed to teach Divine omnipresence, whereas it really teaches Divine omniscience and Almighty power. The Lord’s presence, as represented in His intelligence and power, are everywhere. Nowhere could we go beyond His reach and beyond his knowledge. Were this thought thoroughly impressed upon every human mind, what a vast difference it would make in human conduct. But really the undermining of faith in the God of the Bible has been accomplished largely by the misrepresentation of the Bible’s teaching. Our text for instance, is supposed to teach that God is in heaven with the saintly, rejoicing with them and enjoying their pleasure and that He also is in hell with the evil, looking upon their sufferings and tortures and planning with devils for their everlasting continuance. Thinking minds are rejecting such nonsense, but, alas, they are rejecting the Bible, too, hence have no foundation for a better, truer faith.
Continued on next post
Harvest 1874
Well-Known Member
The Scriptures do not teach Divine Omnipresence, as some have assumed and others have declared. Not a word in the Bible from first to last makes any such statement or gives ground for any such inference. What it does teach is much more reasonable and consistent in every way; namely, that God is not everywhere present, but that Heaven is His Throne; that our Lord Jesus is not everywhere present, but that He has sat down with the Father in His Throne of Heavenly glory. But the Scriptures plainly teach that both the Father and the Son are representatively present in believers through the Holy Spirit--the holy influence, the power of God, which is everywhere present.
That the eyes of the Lord are in every place, beholding the evil and the good, is unquestionable. "The Word of God is a discerner of [even] the thoughts and intents of the heart: neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight, but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do." (Prov 15:3; Heb 4:12, 13)
Now on the surface if we were to merely accept the teachings of orthodoxy these scriptures would seem to support the theory that God is everywhere present, but bear in mind what it means to be omnipresent, to be omnipresent means to be physically present everywhere at the same time, these passages similar to that of Psa 139:7 do not teach omnipresence, but rather omniscience. God sees everywhere but is not Himself everywhere. The notion that God is omnipresent is a concept from ancient Greek and eastern belief systems and did not originate with Jewish or early Christian faiths.
Let us examine a few texts
“And the Spirit of God came upon Azariah the son of Oded: And he went out to meet Asa, and said unto him, Hear ye me, Asa, and all Judah and Benjamin; The LORD is with you, while ye be with him; and if ye seek him, he will be found of you; but if ye forsake him, he will forsake you. Now for a long season Israel hath been without the true God, and without a teaching priest, and without law.” (2 Chron 15:1-3)
God had withdrawn Himself from them. If God can withdraw Himself from someplace this would imply that He is was no longer in that particular place, therefore He is not omnipresent.
“Know therefore this day, and consider it in thy heart, that the LORD he is God in heaven above, and upon the earth beneath: there is none else.” (Deut 4:39)
Now this scripture seems to support the theory of God’s omnipresence does it not? No it merely states that God is God everywhere, it doesn’t say that God, Himself, is everywhere.
So one asks then, what are we to make of our opening text? (Psa 139: 7-12)
"Whither shall I go from thy spirit [power--to escape or be hidden from divine power], or whither shall I flee from thy presence? If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell [sheol, oblivion] behold, thou art there." Psa. 139:7, 8
According to the prevalent idea, this would mean that God is a permanent resident of the awful torture chamber, which sheol is represented to be. On the contrary, the Prophet is taking a large view of the divine power, and telling us the result of his researches, that there is no place in the entire universe that is not accessible to divine power. Even the oblivion of death is subject to our Lord, who declares,
"I have the keys of death and of Hades [oblivion]." It is our confidence in God--in his omnipotence--that constitutes the basis of our faith in a resurrection of the dead.
What about the scripture, which states, “The eyes of the Lord are in every place” (Prov 15:3)
The same principle applies; the eyes referred to are not the Lord’s literal eyes, but rather his intelligence, his power exercised through his vast resources supervising all things. The Lord has innumerable agencies in which to draw his intelligence, myriads upon myriads of spiritual beings, at his beck and call.
In Matt 18:10 it is stated in regards to the Lord’s true sheep, “Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, that in heaven their angels do always behold the face (i.e. they have access to or immediate communication with) my Father which is in heaven.”
If the Lord were indeed omnipresent (everywhere present) what need would he have of these “ministering spirits”?
We know very little in regards to spirit beings and their capabilities, but we are sure that they are not subject to the same natural laws which govern men, it is however stated that they are able to “come and go as the wind” (John 3:8) at what speed they may travel it is not stated, possibly the speed of thought, who knows? It is best not to go beyond that which is written, but merely to accept only that which is scripturally sound.
That the eyes of the Lord are in every place, beholding the evil and the good, is unquestionable. "The Word of God is a discerner of [even] the thoughts and intents of the heart: neither is there any creature that is not manifest in his sight, but all things are naked and opened unto the eyes of him with whom we have to do." (Prov 15:3; Heb 4:12, 13)
Now on the surface if we were to merely accept the teachings of orthodoxy these scriptures would seem to support the theory that God is everywhere present, but bear in mind what it means to be omnipresent, to be omnipresent means to be physically present everywhere at the same time, these passages similar to that of Psa 139:7 do not teach omnipresence, but rather omniscience. God sees everywhere but is not Himself everywhere. The notion that God is omnipresent is a concept from ancient Greek and eastern belief systems and did not originate with Jewish or early Christian faiths.
Let us examine a few texts
“And the Spirit of God came upon Azariah the son of Oded: And he went out to meet Asa, and said unto him, Hear ye me, Asa, and all Judah and Benjamin; The LORD is with you, while ye be with him; and if ye seek him, he will be found of you; but if ye forsake him, he will forsake you. Now for a long season Israel hath been without the true God, and without a teaching priest, and without law.” (2 Chron 15:1-3)
God had withdrawn Himself from them. If God can withdraw Himself from someplace this would imply that He is was no longer in that particular place, therefore He is not omnipresent.
“Know therefore this day, and consider it in thy heart, that the LORD he is God in heaven above, and upon the earth beneath: there is none else.” (Deut 4:39)
Now this scripture seems to support the theory of God’s omnipresence does it not? No it merely states that God is God everywhere, it doesn’t say that God, Himself, is everywhere.
So one asks then, what are we to make of our opening text? (Psa 139: 7-12)
"Whither shall I go from thy spirit [power--to escape or be hidden from divine power], or whither shall I flee from thy presence? If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell [sheol, oblivion] behold, thou art there." Psa. 139:7, 8
According to the prevalent idea, this would mean that God is a permanent resident of the awful torture chamber, which sheol is represented to be. On the contrary, the Prophet is taking a large view of the divine power, and telling us the result of his researches, that there is no place in the entire universe that is not accessible to divine power. Even the oblivion of death is subject to our Lord, who declares,
"I have the keys of death and of Hades [oblivion]." It is our confidence in God--in his omnipotence--that constitutes the basis of our faith in a resurrection of the dead.
What about the scripture, which states, “The eyes of the Lord are in every place” (Prov 15:3)
The same principle applies; the eyes referred to are not the Lord’s literal eyes, but rather his intelligence, his power exercised through his vast resources supervising all things. The Lord has innumerable agencies in which to draw his intelligence, myriads upon myriads of spiritual beings, at his beck and call.
In Matt 18:10 it is stated in regards to the Lord’s true sheep, “Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, that in heaven their angels do always behold the face (i.e. they have access to or immediate communication with) my Father which is in heaven.”
If the Lord were indeed omnipresent (everywhere present) what need would he have of these “ministering spirits”?
We know very little in regards to spirit beings and their capabilities, but we are sure that they are not subject to the same natural laws which govern men, it is however stated that they are able to “come and go as the wind” (John 3:8) at what speed they may travel it is not stated, possibly the speed of thought, who knows? It is best not to go beyond that which is written, but merely to accept only that which is scripturally sound.
"Prov 15:3 "The eyes of the LORD are in every place, beholding the evil and the good."
Psalm 139:1-12 King James Version (KJV)
1O lord, thou hast searched me, and known me.
2 Thou knowest my downsitting and mine uprising, thou understandest my thought afar off.
3 Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquainted with all my ways.
4 For there is not a word in my tongue, but, lo, O Lord, thou knowest it altogether.
5 Thou hast beset me behind and before, and laid thine hand upon me.
6 Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it.
7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?
8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;
10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me.
12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee..
"Our text, (Psa 139:7) misunderstood, is supposed to teach Divine omnipresence, whereas it really teaches Divine omniscience and Almighty power. <---- "...whither shall I flee from thy presence? And, why would you even use a common dictionary definition for "person" when speaking of God Almighty? God possesses personality but, He is not a person like WE are. I see nothing that separates our "personal" relationship with Him. Bottom line is, He sees everything and knows every thought...nobody can hide from Him. He is All Powerful so, why is it so hard to see in the scriptures that He is in all places at all times?? Or, if you prefer, there is NOTHING He does not see Is He not able to do this? I find it comforting. Does not God dwell in the Temple of our bodies?
Psalm 139:1-12 King James Version (KJV)
1O lord, thou hast searched me, and known me.
2 Thou knowest my downsitting and mine uprising, thou understandest my thought afar off.
3 Thou compassest my path and my lying down, and art acquainted with all my ways.
4 For there is not a word in my tongue, but, lo, O Lord, thou knowest it altogether.
5 Thou hast beset me behind and before, and laid thine hand upon me.
6 Such knowledge is too wonderful for me; it is high, I cannot attain unto it.
7 Whither shall I go from thy spirit? or whither shall I flee from thy presence?
8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou art there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, thou art there.
9 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea;
10 Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
11 If I say, Surely the darkness shall cover me; even the night shall be light about me.
12 Yea, the darkness hideth not from thee; but the night shineth as the day: the darkness and the light are both alike to thee..
"Our text, (Psa 139:7) misunderstood, is supposed to teach Divine omnipresence, whereas it really teaches Divine omniscience and Almighty power. <---- "...whither shall I flee from thy presence? And, why would you even use a common dictionary definition for "person" when speaking of God Almighty? God possesses personality but, He is not a person like WE are. I see nothing that separates our "personal" relationship with Him. Bottom line is, He sees everything and knows every thought...nobody can hide from Him. He is All Powerful so, why is it so hard to see in the scriptures that He is in all places at all times?? Or, if you prefer, there is NOTHING He does not see Is He not able to do this? I find it comforting. Does not God dwell in the Temple of our bodies?
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Miss Hepburn
Well-Known Member
The dust floating in a sun beam would not exist if not for God...this He showed me...with
my mouth dropped. Hahaha...sounds like I was stoned....Nope!!!!
Love the topic, Nancy. Praise God Praise God.
Oh no, you did not recite Ps 139 one of the 3-4 verses that changed my life!
Revelation 22:13
"I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end."
my mouth dropped. Hahaha...sounds like I was stoned....Nope!!!!
Love the topic, Nancy. Praise God Praise God.
Oh no, you did not recite Ps 139 one of the 3-4 verses that changed my life!
Revelation 22:13
"I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end."
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I don't disapprove of men's philosophy unless it tends to confuse people about God. God really is effectively everywhere. When a person rejects God or does not believe in Him or acknowledge Him that person simply becomes completely blind to the things of God and may be used to accomplish the work of the left hand of God. It does not mean that God is not there. Such blind people have no perception [no vision, no hearing, no taste, no touch, no smell] of God except perhaps a small glimmer of Hope if they should look in the right direction and decide to pursue that Light. This small glimmer is seen here:
"That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world." John 1:9
Notice that verse says the Light lighteth effectively every man born of woman. This light is not salvation, but a glimmer of hope for every man. If it is pursued it will lead a person to the Light, which is Jesus which is the Way to salvation.
Moving toward the Light is going with the right hand [the sheep] of God. Going away from the Light is going with the left hand [the goats] of God, which is a hopeless direction, the direction of death, the direction of never seeing the face of God.
"And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:" Matt 25:32-34
"Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:" Matt 25:41
Arguing against the omnipresence of God as I understand it simply needlessly confuses things and our God is not the God of confusion. We need to know that no matter where we are, God is there for us, whether we avail ourselves of Him or not.
"That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world." John 1:9
Notice that verse says the Light lighteth effectively every man born of woman. This light is not salvation, but a glimmer of hope for every man. If it is pursued it will lead a person to the Light, which is Jesus which is the Way to salvation.
Moving toward the Light is going with the right hand [the sheep] of God. Going away from the Light is going with the left hand [the goats] of God, which is a hopeless direction, the direction of death, the direction of never seeing the face of God.
"And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:" Matt 25:32-34
"Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:" Matt 25:41
Arguing against the omnipresence of God as I understand it simply needlessly confuses things and our God is not the God of confusion. We need to know that no matter where we are, God is there for us, whether we avail ourselves of Him or not.
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Miss Hepburn
Well-Known Member
As a brother in God...why would you spend 1 second on such a person? Please tell me.
He rejects and doesn't believe in God...why bring him up in conversation?
We are soaring in God's love...if these folks do not want to recognize him after all these years....ok, fine.
So be it.
Is it a bad thing I don't care about them right now?
2000 yrs have gone by and they still ridicule God?
Why bring them up?
Is our focus to be on them? Tell me...really. I find them to be intellectual idiots, lost in their
wordly logic.
I want to talk to lovers of God....Am I a bad person?
Pls, tell me.
It's just that they are all around me...and It's too much already...I am overloaded with their intellectual doubts and arguments...
I guess I need a spiritual retreat with lovers of God.
A moment of weakness surrounded by Mind, aka ego, aka devil,
aka the enemy. Too much time on forums with doubters.
Oy vey, already.
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Stumpmaster
Well-Known Member
The Omnipresence Of God who is not bound by time and space:
Isa 57:15 For thus says the high and lofty One that inhabits eternity, whose name is Holy; I dwell in the high and holy place, with him also that is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite ones.
Isa 57:15 For thus says the high and lofty One that inhabits eternity, whose name is Holy; I dwell in the high and holy place, with him also that is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite ones.
Unfortunately some of those have been some of ours. At one time they were our friends or our natural family or they are people who were seemingly without hope but in their wasted walks come to see how empty they are. In that seeing God sends them to you or to me to give them something that God has given to us to share with them when and if they come to recognize the need.
Most of them will never change. I know that but even they may have children or friends who will but are held back by those carnal attachments. Jesus made it clear about such attachments here:
"For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.
He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me." Matt 10:35-38
You and I may know what that means, but many do not and God may send us to them or them to us to give them understanding of who and what are the first things with God.
Those who have really finally chosen that wrong way are as you would say... out of it. But if mixed in among the tares there are a few kernels of wheat, who is it that God will send to harvest them? He may not require it of us, but if He does should we not be prepared to follow where He leads us... even though it may well be into a painful experience? What was the pain of Jesus who at no time did anything worthy of such suffering?
Only when it is needed to accomplish God's work through us for someone who really may be hungry and thirsty for God's righteousness. If we are paying attention and the need is there, will He not direct us? If there is no hope left for them or He is not directing us that way, then of course you would be correct. As Jesus put it:
"...Follow me; and let the dead bury their dead." Matt 8:22
You stay close to God as you have been doing. Listen to Him as you have been doing. In the listening He may direct you toward this one or that one and then you would need to get involved... but wait on the Lord. We cannot and should not force ourselves on anyone even though we know we have something good to share. You are not wrong to want to be around real people of God rather than pretenders or devils but remember also these words written by Apostle Paul:
"Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves." Phil 2:3
That verse speaks of where Jesus always was and where God wants us to be. People were all born selfish. Jesus alone was always selfless. Jesus alone loved others more than himself. Are we not to like Him?
"Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is." I John 3:2
We all need to be with God and with those who love Him... but there are really few of those around. In some places it seems we cannot find even one. But God also knows our needs. He knows that sometimes we need a physical person to give us encouragement. Is He not always able and willing to provide our needs?
9Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake. 10And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another. 11And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. 12And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold. 13But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. 14And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. 15When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand.
Your post put into mind the above verse, and I am starting to believe the underlined part is also speaking of Christians...I have met several "cold fish", not approachable or, if approached, not so kind. Meh, I pray for them (and my attitude against them) and go on my merry way, kicking the dust off my shoes
bbyrd009
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bc that is our...milieu?
bc believers are even worse, generally speaking? So he may even be rejecting religion, and not God at all
bbyrd009
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but now you are talking about proselytizing, right, not manifesting Christ to ppl IRL per se.
understand the judgement implied in even the way i'm sure you went about this, with empathy, etc.
A better way to perceive that is maybe to see how one implies being in a superior position in proselytizing, like, um, Nancy, i see that you believe Jesus is physically returning for you at some point, so i am here to lead you to Christ, yay!
You coming, or not
ps i dunno about omnibenevolence, even if i think i get the point trying to be made; benevolence is a perspective that may not be shared by all, and imo this concept is covered in "if you do this, I will do that; but if you do that, I will do this."
Iow God can also be perceived as one's worst nightmare too, God will put you in a position of having to contemplate eating your own children even, etc, and He does not even appear to be shy about plainly stating the possibility
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Miss Hepburn
Well-Known Member
Next day ...I'm over it. Thank you all.
I read everything. xo
God bless people whatever station in life they are.
I can always smile and go my merry way, if they are too much for me.
I read everything. xo
God bless people whatever station in life they are.
I can always smile and go my merry way, if they are too much for me.
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