Original Sin (or sin nature) in the Bible:

[face2face]

This is crucified over a period of time in maturing in Christ. Believers are not supposed to remain in having a sinful nature. Their new nature and God will help them to fight and battle in overcoming their old nature from Adam. They that are Christ’s have crucified the affections and lusts (Galatians 5:24). Jesus said, “And he said to them all, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.” (Luke 9:23). So we are to die daily. 2 Corinthians 7:1 says let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God.

Why would we need to do these things if we were perfect and innocent and good?
Something has tainted mankind. This was Adam, and Christ can set us free from our old life in Adam. This is why we are to offer our bodies as willing sacrifice unto God and be transformed by the renewing of our mind.

This is good Highlighter.

Hebrews 4:15 is a good example.

For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin.

1. We know Christ was weak! he was crucified in weakness "For to be sure, he was crucified in weakness, yet he lives by God’s power. Likewise, we are weak in him, yet by God’s power we will live with him in our dealing with you."

2. This weakness is sin's flesh which Jesus had to have, if he was to represent those who live to crucify the flesh in their lives Gal 5:24-26.

3. It shows Christ's nature was precisely the same as ours "being tempted in all points" means he suffered in his flesh as we do.

The Christian cannot grasp these truths because the trinity removes his sacrifice.

F2F

 

[Aunty Jane]

Romans 5:12 is probably the best verse in defending Original Sin.

This is indisputable proof that one man is responsible for sin entering the world of mankind.
But what is "sin" anyway?

The word "sin" in Greek is "hamartia" and it means....

• to miss the mark
• to err, be mistaken
• to miss or wander from the path of uprightness and honour, to do or go wrong
• to wander from the law of God, violate God's law, sin.

So "to miss the mark" is used in archery when one "misses the target".
Sin is therefore a failure to "hit the target"....or the original perfection of mind, body and spirit with which God created the first humans.
They had no defects at the outset......but they did have free will.

Since a perfect, free willed being can be tempted to "miss the mark" due to a bad decision, based on a failure to look ahead to the consequences, Eve was deceived by one who had already himself "missed the mark". But his temptation came from within himself, whereas Eve's temptation came from an external source.....both, as it turns out, can be equally lethal in their results.

James helps us to appreciate that...
James 1:13-15...
"Let no one say when he is tempted, “I am being tempted by God,” for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one. 14 But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire. 15 Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death."

Its a chain reaction that needs to be stopped at the beginning with the desire itself....not allowing it to lead us to the next steps and ultimately to sin.
Remember that Jesus was tempted by the devil three times, but he stood firm in his determination not to allow anyone to lead him into sin and thereby forfeit his right to redeem mankind. He could only redeem us if he was Adam's equivalent...a perfect sinless human. Christ offered his life for ours.

It is helpful also to understand that there are two kinds of sin....the one we inherit from Adam, and the ones we commit as a result of that inheritance. The first one we have no control over...the second one, we do. The first one Jesus came to give his life for...the second one is our choice.....but because sinfulness is in our inherited nature, we have the option of repentance and forgiveness based on the ransom Jesus provided....of his own free will.

Jesus was a perfect human and he stood against the devil's temptations proving that Adam could have done so as well.

1. Sin came into the world through one human being.
2. Death came through sin.
3. In this way death (sin) spread to all humans.
4. In that all sinned (in the fact that sin (death) spread to all humans by the fact that sin came into the world by one man, Adam).

It's why God sent a Savior.

It has to be something in the genetics because one cannot inherit something physically any other way. Those who understand the nature of genetic inheritance will know that if one parent has a defective gene, there is a 50-50 chance of the gene being passed to the next generation.....if both parents have the defect, the child will inherit it without question.

In our case the defect was in both parents but only Adam was said to be the culprit....why?
Because Adam was not deceived like his wife was...(1 Timothy 2:13-14).....his decision could have introduced an entirely different scenario. The death penalty was only for disobedience, so in her actions Eve would have received the penalty for her own sin...and if Adam had rejected her offer, he would not have been responsible for what she had done. Had he remained obedient, then God would have handled the situation in an entirely different way....perhaps enacting the death penalty for Eve, whilst providing another mate for Adam with the events recorded so that all would learn from Eve that disobedience brings forth death.

Free will makes it possible for a few different scenarios to have played out....each one would have returned God's original purpose for mankind on this earth, just via a different path. (Isaiah 55:11)

 

[Bible Highlighter]

This is good Highlighter.

Hebrews 4:15 is a good example.

For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin.

1. We know Christ was weak! he was crucified in weakness "For to be sure, he was crucified in weakness, yet he lives by God’s power. Likewise, we are weak in him, yet by God’s power we will live with him in our dealing with you."

2. This weakness is sin's flesh which Jesus had to have, if he was to represent those who live to crucify the flesh in their lives Gal 5:24-26.

3. It shows Christ's nature was precisely the same as ours "being tempted in all points" means he suffered in his flesh as we do.

The Christian cannot grasp these truths because the trinity removes his sacrifice.

F2F

I disagree that Christ was tempted internally and that Jesus had a sin nature. This is false thinking. Jesus could not have the spot or stain of any kind of sin or sin nature because He had to be our spotless Lamb to die in our place. Jesus did not have the capacity to even sin because He was the Word (GOD) made flesh. Jesus said He came down from Heaven. Jesus did not say He joined with a sinful human being or took on sinful flesh. That would be going down the road of insanIty to suggest otherwise. What fellowship does light have with darkness? Jesus is the God man. Hebrews 7:26 says of Jesus, “…who is holy, harmless, undefiled, separate from sinners, and made higher than the heavens;”. Jesus was only tempted in an external sense and He was aware of our weaknesses and not that He had the same weaknesses we had. If Jesus could have potentially sinned then He would not be God. God cannot sin anymore than rain could not be wet.

 

[Titus]

In my post #116 you will see Bible Highlighter continuing to ignore the elephant in the room.
Adam sinned with an upright meaning righteous nature, created in the image of God,
Genesis 1:27 ; Ecclesiastes 7:29

Here is my point to Bible Highlighter's intentional unresponsive explanation to the error in his doctrine,
If Bible Highlighter is correct, he believes babies are going to hell.

What Bible Highlighter conveniently overlooks is Adam!
Yes, of course Cornelius commited sin. But he also had a good nature.
True christians sin, Bible Highlighter would have christians to have a sinful depraved nature.
When in fact, King David sinned, yet the Bible says of him, that David WAS A MAN AFTER GODS OWN HEART!!!
1Samuel 13:14,
-But now your(Saul) kingdom shall not continue. The Lord has sought for Himself a man after His own heart, and the Lord has commanded him to be commander over His people, because you have not kept what the Lord commanded you.

Bible Highlighter needs to learn that men can have a heart after God and Not be perfectly sinless!!!

Conclusion, Who sinned first? Adam!
Did Adam when he commited his first sin have a inborn depraved sinful nature? NO!!!
Adam, had a upright meaning RIGHTEOUS nature before he sinned against God!
The Bible teaches NO DEPRAVED SIN NATURE REQUIRED TO SIN!
All men have moments of weakness in our lives and sin.
We all have the exact same nature as Adam. And with that same nature, just like Adam being upright created in Gods image we fall short of the glory of God.

Since Adam did not need this false inborn sinful nature to sin,
It is also true that we do not need this false inborn sinful nature to sin.

Yes, Bible Highlighter ALL CHILDREN GOD LOVES AND WILL SAVE IF THEY DIE BEFORE THEY HAVE KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL.
This is a wicked false doctrine! Bible Highlighter believes God does not save all babies. The only logical conclusion to that thinking is God does not love all babies,

John 3:16,
-For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.

Yes, Jesus loves all babies Bible Highlighter. Calvinism makes folks believe God burns babies who are sinless, innocent. OS, is from satan himself.

Ecclesiastes 7:29,
Truly, this only I have found: That God made man upright(righteous), but they have sought out many schemes.

 

[Titus]

If you are trying to force some meaning on Adams nature as being pure or perfect - this would be a failure on your part

Genesis 1:27,
So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female God created them.

Ecclesiastes 7:29,
Truly, this only I have found; That God made man upright(righteous), But they have sought out many schemes.

Below are face2face irrational ramblings,

"There is no good thing in human nature"

Face2face says There is no good in mans nature then contradicts himself...

Who said the nature was wicked?

The nature of itself is not evil

2Timothy 2:23-25,
-but avoid foolish and ignorant disputes, knowing that they generate strife,.
Proverbs 26:4,5
-do not answer a fool according to his folly, Lest you be like him.
-Answer a fool according to his folly, Lest he be wise in his own eyes.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Uh, the Bible says that in Adam all die (1 Corinthians 15:22). Why are they dying in Adam? Because Adam brought sin upon them. In Adam there is no life. Yet, you appear to be saying otherwise.

Romans 5:19 says:
“For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners,…”

1 Cor 15:22

All die PHYSICALLY (not spiritually) as a CONSEQUENCE of Adam sinning just as all will be made alive physically at the resurrection which Christ made possible. Some raised to eternal life and the rest to eternal condemnation. For v21 states "For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead."

==========

(a) For as in Adam all die
(b) so also in Christ shall all be made alive

If (a) somehow proves "ALL" universally is UNconditionally born in sin due to Adam, so also then (b) must prove that same "ALL" will be universally, UNconditionally saved by Christ. Proponents of OS read their OS biased interpretation into the first part of 1 Cor 15:22; Romans 5:17-19 yet the second half of those verese prove their biased translation of the first half is wrong.

Rom 5:19 says NOTHING at all about men being made sinners UNconditionally just as men are not made righteous UNconditionally. Again, with the faulty interpretation....if 19(a) 'proves' all men are UNconditionally made sinners due to one man Adam, then it is also true in (b) that all men will be UNconditionally made righteous by Christ.

Even Albert Barnes, a proponent of OS, says of 1 Cor 15:22: (my emp)

"All die - All mankind are subjected to temporal death; or are mortal. This passage has been often adduced to prove that all mankind became sinful in Adam, or in virtue of a covenant transaction with him; and that they are subjected to spiritual death as a punishment for his sins. But, whatever may he the truth on that subject, it is clear that this passage does not relate to it, and should not he adduced as a proof text.

For the words “die” and “dieth” obviously and usually refer to temporal death; and they should be so understood, unless there is something in the connection which requires us to understand them in a figurative and metaphorical sense. But there is, evidently, no such necessity here."

 

[Bible Highlighter]

In my post #116 you will see Bible Highlighter continuing to ignore the elephant in the room.
Adam sinned with an upright meaning righteous nature, created in the image of God,
Genesis 1:27 ; Ecclesiastes 7:29

It is not an elephant in the room. Adam was influenced by his wife (Eve) to sin, and Eve was influenced by the serpent to sin.
This influence is similar to our having a sin nature. So we were on the same playing field but in a different way.
I am not saying that one cannot sin with having a good nature like Adam had; But that still does not undo tons of other verses in the Bible on how Adam tainted his descendants by his one time sin (Which included death).

1. In Adam all die (1 Corinthians 15:22).
2. By one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men (Romans 5:12).
3. For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners (Romans 5:19).
4. We.. were by nature the children of wrath (Ephesians 2:3).
5. Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience (Ephesians 2:2).
6. The imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth (Genesis 8:21).
7. What is man, that he could be pure? And he who is born of a woman, that he could be righteous? If God puts not trust in His saints, and the heavens are not pure in His sight, how much less man, who is abominable and filthy, who drinks iniquity like water! (Job 15:14-16).
8. The Lord looks down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there are any who understand who seek God. They have all turned aside, they have together become corrupt; there is none who does good, no, not one. (Psalms 14:2-3).
9. Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin my mother conceived me (Psalms 51:5).
10. Do you indeed speak righteousness, you silent ones? Do you judge uprightly, you sons of men? No, in heart you work wickedness; you weigh out the violence of your hands in the earth. The wicked are estranged from the womb; they go astray as soon as they are born, speaking lies. (Psalms 58:1-5).
11. The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked; who can know it? (Jeremiah 17:9).
12. And you… who were dead in trespasses and sins, (Ephesians 2:1).

Here is my point to Bible Highlighter's intentional unresponsive explanation to the error in his doctrine,
If Bible Highlighter is correct, he believes babies are going to hell.

This is your standard MO (Modus Operandi). I have seen you use this tactic before in other threads. You love to falsely claim towards others a belief that the other person does not actually believe. I don’t believe babies go to hell if they die. I believe they are saved by God’s grace. But babies can potentially die physically thereby showing that the wages of sin is death and also that babies are not entirely innocent (Because of the stain of sin from Adam). For if a baby was 100% innocent, then they should not be able to die (Which is the punishment of sin). The stain of sin has effected the whole human race and we see this with people dying, getting sick, etcetera. These things (death, sickness, etc.) will not exist in the final New Earth.

Ecclesiastes 7:29,
Truly, this only I have found: That God made man upright(righteous), but they have sought out many schemes.

I read this verse as saying:

God made man (Adam) upright, and they (his descendants who are a part of him) sought out many schemes.
Again, you have to read and balance this verse in light of the rest of Scripture (Which says the heart is deceitful, etc.).
But for some odd reason you just don’t like the idea of what the Bible teaches on this topic.
The Scriptures are clear in that we were sinners, and we were corrupted by sin.
No man has not sinned except Jesus Christ.

 

[MarriedCouple]

Adam sinned for himself. Everyone sin for himself. Other person cannot sin for you.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

1 Cor 15:22

All die PHYSICALLY (not spiritually) as a CONSEQUENCE of Adam sinning just as all will be made alive physically at the resurrection which Christ made possible. Some raised to eternal life and the rest to eternal condemnation. For v21 states "For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead."

==========

(a) For as in Adam all die
(b) so also in Christ shall all be made alive

Yes, this is in reference to physical death. Babies can potentially die physically or they will one day die when they grow old as an adult.
If babies were innocent, then death would not come upon them. So this does not help you. For the wages of sin is death. Babies in your view did not sin and yet they will die at some point in time. Why? Because Romans 5:19 says by one man’s disobedience many were MADE sinners. So there is a direct connection between Adam’s disobedience and his descendants being sinners.

If (a) somehow proves "ALL" universally is UNconditionally born in sin due to Adam, so also then (b) must prove that same "ALL" will be universally, UNconditionally saved by Christ. Proponents of OS read their OS biased interpretation into the first part of 1 Cor 15:22; Romans 5:17-19 yet the second half of those verese prove their biased translation of the first half is wrong.

Rom 5:19 says NOTHING at all about men being made sinners UNconditionally just as men are not made righteous UNconditionally. Again, with the faulty interpretation....if 19(a) 'proves' all men are UNconditionally made sinners due to one man Adam, then it is also true in (b) that all men will be UNconditionally made righteous by Christ.

Adam (who is a part of us) met the condition of passing sin upon us (his descendants).
Certain conditions needed to be met in order for a baby to be born (like a man and a woman coming together intimately).
Certain conditions need to be met in order for a baby to survive (by receiving milk, a proper environment, etc.).

The same is true with a believer in Jesus Christ.
We have to meet a condition to be born again.
We have to live by every word of God and not by bread alone.

Yes, our parents met those conditions, but our parents are a part of us.

Anyways, your argument here is faulty because Jesus compares our natural birth with being born again.
Our being born again was a result of God changing us spiritually when we responded to God’s Word.
Yet, we did not choose to be born into this world. So this whole narrative that it needs to be this exact parallel is not needed.
I provided tons of verses already that makes it obvious to the unbiased reader that mankind was tainted by Adam’s one time sin.
Sin would not be in this world if it was not for Adam disobeying God. By one man’s disobedience many were MADE sinners (Romans 5:19). I believe the Bible and not you.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

To all:

Think about it like this. If man was created innocent and pure then by all respects there should be at least one man who existed (Who is not God incarnate) who would be able to not sin and do evil.

Remember, Jesus said a good tree cannot bring forth bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bring forth good fruit.

If all you see in humanity is sin (which leads to death), then that means Adam’s one time disobedience made that possible.
Adam was the cause of our destruction in being sinners. But in Christ, you can be made alive. We need to switch sides to Jesus and not remain in Adam. We need to crucify the old man. The old man is Adam and there is no life there. There is only life in Jesus Christ.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The problem with saying we are innocent at birth is that it denies our need for a Savior.
To say that man can be good on his own without Christ denies the need for a Savior.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Adam sinned for himself. Everyone sin for himself. Other person cannot sin for you.

Isaiah 55:8 says,
“For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.”

I strive to just read the Bible and believe it In what it says and I don’t try to rely on my own thinking that would contradict what the Word plainly says. I would encourage you to simply look at the verses I posted and pray over them and not rely upon your own thoughts.

 

[MarriedCouple]

Isaiah 55:8 says,
“For my thoughts are not your thoughts, neither are your ways my ways, saith the LORD.”

I strive to just read the Bible and believe it In what it says and I don’t try to rely on my own thinking that would contradict what the Word plainly says. I would encourage you to simply look at the verses I posted and pray over them and not rely upon your own thoughts.

This is what exactly God saying:

"But he slew not their children, but did as it is written in the law in the book of Moses, where the LORD commanded, saying, The fathers shall not die for the children, neither shall the children die for the fathers, but every man shall die for his own sin."

 

[Bible Highlighter]

This is what exactly God saying:

"But he slew not their children, but did as it is written in the law in the book of Moses, where the LORD commanded, saying, The fathers shall not die for the children, neither shall the children die for the fathers, but every man shall die for his own sin."

There are things in the Bible that I call exceptions to the rule. We see this with the Canaanite woman and Jesus (Matthew 15:21-28). She wanted her daughter to be healed of demon possession. But Jesus said, “I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.” The thing is that she did not just take that as the end of the story as many today would do. She had faith that was great.

Anyways, the point here is that the verse you mentioned is not the end of the story (anymore than it was the end of the story for the Canaanite woman when she heard the words of Jesus).
In other words, this verse is not in reference to Adam being our Federal Head just as Jesus is our Federal Head. Read the verses in the beginning of my OP. Just read them and believe them in what they say and don’t fight against them because you don’t like what they say.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Yes, this is in reference to physical death. Babies can potentially die physically or they will one day die when they grow old as an adult.
If babies were innocent, then death would not come upon them. So this does not help you. For the wages of sin is death. Babies in your view did not sin and yet they will die at some point in time. Why? Because Romans 5:19 says by one man’s disobedience many were MADE sinners. So there is a direct connection between Adam’s disobedience and his descendants being sinners.


Adam (who is a part of us) met the condition of passing sin upon us (his descendants).
Certain conditions needed to be met in order for a baby to be born (like a man and a woman coming together intimately).
Certain conditions need to be met in order for a baby to survive (by receiving milk, a proper environment, etc.).

The same is true with a believer in Jesus Christ.
We have to meet a condition to be born again.
We have to live by every word of God and not by bread alone.

Yes, our parents met those conditions, but our parents are a part of us.

Anyways, your argument here is faulty because Jesus compares our natural birth with being born again.
Our being born again was a result of God changing us spiritually when we responded to God’s Word.
Yet, we did not choose to be born into this world. So this whole narrative that it needs to be this exact parallel is not needed.
I provided tons of verses already that makes it obvious to the unbiased reader that mankind was tainted by Adam’s one time sin.
Sin would not be in this world if it was not for Adam disobeying God. By one man’s disobedience many were MADE sinners (Romans 5:19). I believe the Bible and not you.

Everyone will physically die (Heb 9:27) at some point in their life, either die young or old, as a consequence of Adam sinning not because of inheriting Adam's sin. People die in auto accidents as a consequence of a drunk driving but they do not inherit the sin of the drunk driver.

Eze 18
"What mean ye, that ye use this proverb concerning the land of Israel, saying, The fathers have eaten sour grapes, and the children's teeth are set on edge? As I live, saith the Lord GOD, ye shall not have occasion any more to use this proverb in Israel. Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die. "
The fathers sinned against God and as a consequence God allowed them to go into captivity, whereby future generations were born into captivity. Those captive generations were trying to justify themselves by blaming their captive misery on the fathers even though they were just as sinful as the fathers if not more so. God here is saying He will put a stop this false proverb for it made God's justice to be unjust in holding those generations responsible for the sins of the fathers. God put a stop to the false proverb by showing each person is responsible for his own sins and not another person's sins. Yet OS proponents still use the false proverb today that men are held responsible for another person's (Adam) sins thereby making God justice unjust.

Again, Romans 5:19 does NOT say many were made sinners UNconditionally just as many are not made righteous UNconditionally. The idea of UNcondtional is being read into the verse. Men are conditionally made sinners when they choose to have sinned (Rom 5:12) just as men are conditionally made righteous who choose to have faith (Rom 5:1-2).

OS proponents can continue to read their biased translation into 19(a) but 19(b) continues to exapose that false, biased interpretation.

Lastly, you post about being "born again". John 3. The word 'again' implies one was born before in order to be born again. The first birth was the physical birth, born AGAIN is the spiritual birth. All are born into this world without sin, therefore when one is born AGAIN, all his sins are cleansed away by the blood of Christ and he reverts back AGAIN as he was when he was physically born....without sin. If men are born sinners, does that mean that when men are born AGAIN they AGAIN revert back to the sinful state they in which they were born? No!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

To all:

People don’t like to see the fact that they are sinners or bad in some way. This is why I believe that they cannot accept those verses in the Bible on this topic. They cannot reconcile the verses in their thinking. But God does not call us to believe what we wish. We have to believe all of God’s Word (even if it may not make sense to you at first).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Everyone will physically die (Heb 9:27) at some point in their life, either die young or old, as a consequence of Adam sinning not because of inheriting Adam's sin. People die in auto accidents as a consequence of a drunk driving but they do not inherit the sin of the drunk driver.

Eze 18
"What mean ye, that ye use this proverb concerning the land of Israel, saying, The fathers have eaten sour grapes, and the children's teeth are set on edge? As I live, saith the Lord GOD, ye shall not have occasion any more to use this proverb in Israel. Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die. "
The fathers sinned against God and as a consequence God allowed them to go into captivity, whereby future generations were born into captivity. Those captive generations were trying to justify themselves by blaming their captive misery on the fathers even though they were just as sinful as the fathers if not more so. God here is saying He will put a stop this false proverb for it made God's justice to be unjust in holding those generations responsible for the sins of the fathers. God put a stop to the false proverb by showing each person is responsible for his own sins and not another person's sins. Yet OS proponents still use the false proverb today that men are held responsible for another person's (Adam) sins thereby making God justice unjust.

Again, Romans 5:19 does NOT say many were made sinners UNconditionally just as many are not made righteous UNconditionally. The idea of UNcondtional is being read into the verse. Men are conditionally made sinners when they choose to have sinned (Rom 5:12) just as men are conditionally made righteous who choose to have faith (Rom 5:1-2).

OS proponents can continue to read their biased translation into 19(a) but 19(b) continues to exapose that false, biased interpretation.

Lastly, you post about being "born again". John 3. The word 'again' implies one was born before in order to be born again. The first birth was the physical birth, born AGAIN is the spiritual birth. All are born into this world without sin, therefore when one is born AGAIN, all his sins are cleansed away by the blood of Christ and he reverts back AGAIN as he was when he was physically born....without sin. If men are born sinners, does that mean that when men are born AGAIN they AGAIN revert back to the sinful state they in which they were born? No!

My point about being born again is the same in relation to Original Sin. We die physically because of Adam’s sin. We are made alive spiritually by Christ. The same is true with regards to our physical birth and our spiritual birth. One is natural and the other is spiritual.

Ezekiel 18 is talking about how the one who sins shall die right away. This is not in reference to how Adam’s sin corrupting mankind with a sin nature and making them to be sinners (with them eventually having a mortal end or death). For Romans 5:19 says by one man’s disobedience many were MADE sinners. I believe that. You don’t believe it. It’s just that simple.

Anyways, I am not hear to convince you. Only God’s Word can do that. I am not going to keep debating back and forth with you on this. I made my case with the Word of God already. Let the reader decide for themselves by looking at the whole counsel of God’s Word and by praying to the LORD on it.

 

[Titus]

Bible Highlighter, I have looked into Gods word and find nowhere Paul teaching we are gulity for another mans sin.
Romans 5:19, must include verse 20
-for by one mans disobedience many were made sinners...
Why does Adam's sin make us sinners?
Paul explains why IN THE NEXT VERSE!
20 -Moreover the law entered that the offense might abound...

Paul said because Adam sinned God instituted His law.

That law is what makes us sinners. Paul never said Adam's sin was imputed to us, therefore all are made sinners in Adam. Paul says because Adam sinned God instituted His law, therefore because of Adam's sin the law makes us all sinners because all break Gods law.

OS advocates mistranslation of Romans 5:19,
-For by one man's (imputed) sin many were made sinners.
PAUL NEVER SAID THIS.

Romans 5:19 on it's own does not explain how Adam's sin made others sinners!
To know how you must read other verses.
To claim Romans 5:19 proves Orginal Sin, is reading into the text your preconceived bias.

No one believes it is justified to impute the sins of a father who commited a crime by drinking and driving, that resulted in another person's death, to his children!
Bible Highlighter knows God would be unjust and immoral to charge another man with Adam's sin, who had nothing to do with Adam's sin.

OS, advocates tell me it is justified to punish the children of the drunk father who killed innocent by standards? You know it is unjust, yet you accuse God of doing this to everyone, and claim that it is morally right. Imputation of Adam's sin on others is an absurd doctrine that turns God into a immoral monster.

If this doctrine be true God is unjust for He charges innocent babies with another man's crimes. Thus babies are going to hell, for what Adam did.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Bible Highlighter, I have looked into Gods word and find nowhere Paul teaching we are gulity for another mans sin.
Romans 5:19, must include verse 20
-for by one mans disobedience many were made sinners...
Why does Adam's sin make us sinners?
Paul explains why IN THE NEXT VERSE!
20 -Moreover the law entered that the offense might abound...

Paul said because Adam sinned God instituted His law.

That law is what makes us sinners. Paul never said Adam's sin was imputed to us, therefore all are made sinners in Adam. Paul says because Adam sinned God instituted His law, therefore because of Adam's sin the law makes us all sinners because all break Gods law.

OS advocates mistranslation of Romans 5:19,
-For by one man's (imputed) sin many were made sinners.
PAUL NEVER SAID THIS.

Romans 5:19 on it's own does not explain how Adam's sin made others sinners!
To know how you must read other verses.
To claim Romans 5:19 proves Orginal Sin, is reading into the text your preconceived bias.

No one believes it is justified to impute the sins of a father who commited a crime by drinking and driving, that resulted in another person's death, to his children!
Bible Highlighter knows God would be unjust and immoral to charge another man with Adam's sin, who had nothing to do with Adam's sin.

OS, advocates tell me it is justified to punish the children of the drunk father who killed innocent by standards? You know it is unjust, yet you accuse God of doing this to everyone, and claim that it is morally right. Imputation of Adam's sin on others is an absurd doctrine that turns God into a immoral monster.

If this doctrine be true God is unjust for He charges innocent babies with another man's crimes. Thus babies are going to hell, for what Adam did.

I don’t agree with your odd interpretations.
I also have already made my case with Scripture. I am not going to beat this dead horse with you continually.
If you don’t agree, we can agree to disagree in love and respect.

May God bless you.

 

[Titus]

I don’t agree with your odd interpretations.
I also have already made my case with Scripture. I am not going to beat this dead horse with you continually.
If you don’t agree, we can agree to disagree in love and respect.

May God bless you.

We can agree to disagree on broccoli. Not on matters that affects ones salvation. You are not the only persons eyes I'm trying to open to calvinist doctrine like inherited sin nature from Adam. Others need to know what you are promoting is unscriptual heresy.

This heresy changes Gods true nature from loving and just to hateful, immoral and unjust.
All that believe in this doctrine need to state that God is condemning innocent babies who do not know right from wrong to hell.

Calvinism has caused more believers to loose their faith and become atheists than any other so called "christian" theology. It is wicked, and from satan's own deceitful mind.

OS can only be traced as far back to Augustine. No 1st. Century christians believed God imputes one mans sins on another. Talk to orthodox Jews, they also do not believe this doctrine is taught in the Torah.

I want to here proponents of Innate sinful nature, OS, tell me it is morally right to punish their children for the crimes they commited. Every one knows this is injustice not justice, yet they proudly proclaim God does this to us. This false doctrine makes God into a immoral monster.