OSAS But Be Ready Or Else

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Christ4Me

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No, it's the once faithful who become unfaithful and recant their faith who do not secure salvation.

Jesus Christ is the One that has secured salvation for us for all those that come to & believed in Him are saved.

Not the issue under contention.

But it is when you consider who the vessels unto dishonor that are vessels of wood & earth, that did not depart from iniquity, but still in His House.

2 Timothy 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. 20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. 21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

So when a believer in works that deny Him ( Titus 1:16 ) , He will deny them ( 2 Timothy 2:12 ) for being workers of iniquity ( Matthew 7:21-23 ), but yet even if we believe not, He is faithful for He abides ( 2 Timothy 2:13 )

it is what we build on that foundation that shall be judged, but that foundation is not going anywhere 21 Corinthians 3:10-17 and nether is that seal of adoption Ephesians 4:30 which is why we are to call even former believers and not just carnal believers to depart from iniquity before the Bridegroom comes or else they will be weeping and gnashing of teeth for missing out on the firstfruits of the resurrection as Esau did in giving up his birthright for a meal.

Hebrews 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled; 16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright. 17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.

2 Corinthians 5:7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) 8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. 9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. 10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. 11 Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.
 

GRACE ambassador

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No, it's the once faithful who become unfaithful and recant their faith who do not secure salvation.
For me there is one of many errors there that stands out.
Like a BIG-FAT-SORE thumb?
Likewise you can't get it if God foreknows you will recant.
huh? How can one "recant something that one CAN'T GET"???

How About BIBLE Doctrine Instead?:

Answer to a
Precious friend who believes those UNfaithful believers are
"left behind, at The Great GRACE Departure, but Are Still saved"?:

This would mean that "only the members with good works" would be "Judged At
The Bema Seat," The Body Would be Incomplete, and not "ready for presenting
To The Father."

I believe The Bema Seat Judgment IS For All "members," or else This Passage
makes no sense:

"Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive
his own reward according to his own labour. For we are labourers together with God:
ye are God’s husbandry, ye are God’s building. According To The GRACE Of God Which
Is Given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid The Foundation, and another
buildeth Thereon.

But let every man take heed how he buildeth Thereupon. For other foundation can
no man lay than That Is Laid, Who Is JESUS CHRIST {The Righteous JUDGE!}.
Now if any man build upon This Foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood,
hay, stubble;

Every man’s work
shall be made manifest: for The [ Judgment ] Day Shall Declare it,
because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is. If any man’s work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.

If any man’s work Shall Be Burned, he Shall Suffer Loss: but he himself
SHALL BE SAVED;
yet so as by fire!” (1 Corinthians 3:8-15)

Thus, for ALL "members" in the Complete Body Of Christ, "the risk of going astray from our labouring With God" is not "being left behind," NOR recanting
God's ETERNAL Salvation," but Is "Suffering Loss, even though Saved," At Judgment! Correct?

Conclusion:
So "the righteous" are those that men, with Conditions, declare righteous? OR:

"the ones to whom God IMPUTES HIS Righteousness, God Declaring them
Saved!"? By God's Simple Will!
-----------------------------

Precious friends:
Please Be Richly Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, and Edified!

2 Timothy 2:15; Romans 16:25; Ephesians 3:9 = Grace/Mystery fellowship
{Romans - Philemon}, For ALL “to SEE,” today,? To Be faithful?
 
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Stumpmaster

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huh? How can one "recant something that one CAN'T GET"???
Joh 15:6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. BINGO

Rom 11:22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off. BINGO

Heb 10:35-39 Cast not away therefore your confidence, which has great recompence of reward. (36) For you have need of patience, that, after you have done the will of God, you might receive the promise. (37) For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry. (38) Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him. (39) But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul. BINGO
 

Stumpmaster

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Not true.
Says you, but I agree with the Albert Barnes Commentary on Hebrews 10:38

But if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him - This also is a quotation from Hab_2:4, but from the Septuagint, not from the Hebrew. “Why” the authors of the Septuagint thus translated the passage, it is impossible now to say. The Hebrew is rendered in the common version, “Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him;” or more literally, “Behold the scornful; his mind shall not be happy” (Stuart); or as Gesenius renders it, “See, he whose soul is unbelieving shall, on this account, be unhappy.” The sentiment there is, that the scorner or unbeliever in that day would be unhappy, or would not prosper - לה ישרה lo’ yaasharaah. The apostle has retained the general sense of the passage, and the idea which he expresses is, that the unbeliever, or he who renounces his religion, will incur the divine displeasure. He will be a man exposed to the divine wrath; a man on whom God cannot look but with disapprobation. By this solemn consideration, therefore, the apostle urges on them the importance of perseverance, and the guilt and danger of apostasy from the Christian faith. If such a case should occur, no matter what might have been the former condition, and no matter what love or zeal might have been evinced, yet such an apostasy would expose the individual to the certain wrath of God. His former love could not save him, any more than the former obedience of the angels saved them from the horrors of eternal chains and darkness, or than the holiness in which Adam was created saved him and his posterity from the calamities which his apostasy incurred.
 

Oceanprayers

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Says you, but I agree with the Albert Barnes Commentary on Hebrews 10:38

But if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him - This also is a quotation from Hab_2:4, but from the Septuagint, not from the Hebrew. “Why” the authors of the Septuagint thus translated the passage, it is impossible now to say. The Hebrew is rendered in the common version, “Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him;” or more literally, “Behold the scornful; his mind shall not be happy” (Stuart); or as Gesenius renders it, “See, he whose soul is unbelieving shall, on this account, be unhappy.” The sentiment there is, that the scorner or unbeliever in that day would be unhappy, or would not prosper - לה ישרה lo’ yaasharaah. The apostle has retained the general sense of the passage, and the idea which he expresses is, that the unbeliever, or he who renounces his religion, will incur the divine displeasure. He will be a man exposed to the divine wrath; a man on whom God cannot look but with disapprobation. By this solemn consideration, therefore, the apostle urges on them the importance of perseverance, and the guilt and danger of apostasy from the Christian faith. If such a case should occur, no matter what might have been the former condition, and no matter what love or zeal might have been evinced, yet such an apostasy would expose the individual to the certain wrath of God. His former love could not save him, any more than the former obedience of the angels saved them from the horrors of eternal chains and darkness, or than the holiness in which Adam was created saved him and his posterity from the calamities which his apostasy incurred.
I'll take Jesus word for it. No one will ever take us from his hand. He shall lose none that the father gives him.
 

Taken

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huh? How can one "recant something that one CAN'T GET"???

This is where it can get confusing.
The Gift of Salvation Already was purchased for EVERY PERSON.
The Gift IS ALREADY theirs. Done deal.

John 6
[51] I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and
the bread that I will give is my flesh, <——accomplished
which I will give for the life “OF” the world. <—-accomplished

It matters not, IF one eats....the gift is already theirs.

THE CAVEAT....
IF any man EATS of that bread......
THEN something changes...
he shall live for ever.

IF any man DOES NOT EAT of that bread...
EATING IS the man “Taking / Claiming / Receiving” his gift.
THEN he shall LOSE his gift.

“OF” the world .... “OF” meaning the UNSAVED.
Of “the world”..... “the world” meaning all people.
“IN” the world.... ‘IN’ meaning alive on earth, but not “OF” the world.
(Remember, Warning...Be NOT...”OF” the world)

(It is as if, I were to buy you a gift, bought and paid for it for you. And I say, I have a gift, I bought for you. You could take it, or say eh, no, don’t want it...and not take it. It was still a gift bought for you, whether or not you take it.
God does not force us to TAKE His gift He bought for us, anymore than I could force you to TAKE a gift I brought for you...Point is the gift is yours whether or not you TAKE it.....)

There are other Scriptures that speak of men, “TASTING”. (Not saved)
It’s like a sample, taste, see if you LIKE it. It even has blessing of the Holy Spirit, “with” the man (not IN the man)....
Like it......EAT IT....the HS will come “IN” that man. (Saved)
Don’t like it..SPIT IT OUT...and the HS will depart being with you.
(Not saved.)
 

Taken

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I'll take Jesus word for it. No one will ever take us from his hand. He shall lose none that the father gives him.

Of course. IN His hand, is a man already in agreement who has TAKEN and EATEN their gift, it’s IN them.
 

Oceanprayers

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On a Christian bible discussion forum.
A concentrated effort to insist Christians can't feel secure in Christ because the salvation he died to assure for eternity, eternal salvation, is not.

Some hobby.
 

Lifelong_sinner

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On a Christian bible discussion forum.
A concentrated effort to insist Christians can't feel secure in Christ because the salvation he died to assure for eternity, eternal salvation, is not.

Some hobby.

salvation isnt a hobby first off. Secondly, false converts are a pandemic in our churches today. Why give assurance to those who shouldnt have it??
 

Oceanprayers

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salvation isnt a hobby first off. Secondly, false converts are a pandemic in our churches today. Why give assurance to those who shouldnt have it??
Oh, but anti-salvation types are committed to a hobby.
The rest of your post is lacking in awareness of the bible and gospel good news
 

Desire Of All Nations

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Scripture IS ALL TRUTH.
But ALL SCRIPTURE DOES NOT APPLY TO ALL PEOPLE.

A man born again, IS BORN OF GOD!
He does not sin.
He can not sin.



How does ^ THAT apply to a person, BORN OF GOD?
It doesn’t.
On the contrary, Jesus said man is to live by every word that came from God. That inherently means all scripture applies to all people. If the scriptures didn't apply to all people, the Bible wouldn't exist.
OSAS is Biblical. You cant lose it, once you got it.
Not only is OSAS not biblical, a person would have to willfully twist passages to make the Bible seem like it supports it. The scriptures clearly teach a person has to remain loyal to God to receive salvation. The whole problem with OSAS is that it teaches that God is obligated to give someone eternal life irrespective of their conduct, which completely contradicts everything the Bible teaches about salvation being a gift. This doctrine inherently exposes the fact that the people who subscribe to it doesn't know what salvation is or when it's given to to a Christian, even while they talk so confidently about it.
 

Lifelong_sinner

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On the contrary, Jesus said man is to live by every word that came from God. That inherently means all scripture applies to all people. If the scriptures didn't apply to all people, the Bible wouldn't exist.
Not only is OSAS not biblical, a person would have to willfully twist passages to make the Bible seem like it supports it. The scriptures clearly teach a person has to remain loyal to God to receive salvation. The whole problem with OSAS is that it teaches that God is obligated to give someone eternal life irrespective of their conduct, which completely contradicts everything the Bible teaches about salvation being a gift. This doctrine inherently exposes the fact that the people who subscribe to it doesn't know what salvation is or when it's given to to a Christian, even while they talk so confidently about it.

i think you misunderstand. If a person is reborn, a genuine christian, then that person will remain in the faith. If a person falls away, they were never saved to begin with. OSAS is Biblical because God never fails, and if a person is a true christian, its because God did the work in them. To claim OSAS isnt Biblical is to say God can fail.
 

Taken

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On the contrary, Jesus said man is to live by every word that came from God. That inherently means all scripture applies to all people.

So when man is reading what applies expressly to a female, the man should also apply that to himself? :rolleyes:

eh, no.

If the scriptures didn't apply to all people, the Bible wouldn't exist.

I did not say what you think your heard.

I have clearly said on numerous occasions...
All Scripture IS TRUE.
Not ALL Scripture applies to ALL persons.

Not only is OSAS not biblical ...

False, and Biblically revealed is true.

The scriptures clearly teach a person has to remain loyal to God to receive salvation.

Sure Scripture teaches “A” person has to remain loyal to God “to Receive Salvation” .........Convenient how you do not identify “A” person that that APPLIES to.

Does that APPLY to “A” person....who does NOT believe in God? No.
Does that APPLY to “A” person....who has ALREADY RECEIVED Salvation? No.
Read your own words......” to receive Salvation “....
Why use that as your “premise” Against OSAS, when a Once Saved person IS NOT “waiting to RECEIVE” salvation?

The whole problem with OSAS is ....

You argue against something you clearly reveal you have no understanding of what it means.
 

Timtofly

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On the contrary, Jesus said man is to live by every word that came from God. That inherently means all scripture applies to all people. If the scriptures didn't apply to all people, the Bible wouldn't exist.
Not only is OSAS not biblical, a person would have to willfully twist passages to make the Bible seem like it supports it. The scriptures clearly teach a person has to remain loyal to God to receive salvation. The whole problem with OSAS is that it teaches that God is obligated to give someone eternal life irrespective of their conduct, which completely contradicts everything the Bible teaches about salvation being a gift. This doctrine inherently exposes the fact that the people who subscribe to it doesn't know what salvation is or when it's given to to a Christian, even while they talk so confidently about it.
So you have to earn Salvation? Is being a Christian a probation? Once one reaches a point of trust, then one is given the stamp of approval called Salvation? Then if one cannot muster enough good will, then that person will be cut off, based on their own righteousness, which is just filthy rags?

OSAS does not obligate God to any contract signed between two individuals. God obligated the fact there would be sin, by having a Lamb slain even before creation happened. Any one who can "loose it" without a conscious decision would have to prevent God from the whole plan of creation itself. If one could convince God to leave them out of the plan, they would have had to do that before the Cross, and before creation itself. Otherwise they will have to do it at the GWT judgment. And God already knows they will do it at that point. And at that point God will say, depart from Me, I never knew you. Only at that point it will be as if they never existed. That is not NOSAS. That is never being physically born. And that will be the Condition of all in the Lake of Fire. They will no longer be in the Lamb's book of life.

All born started out in the Lamb's book of life even before creation. So they all were potentially "saved". That is the only reality of once redeemed, but one decided redemption was not good enough from God. They would provide their own Salvation, and the result of that choice is what removes them from the Lamb's book of life and the reward is the Lake of Fire where they can work out their own Salvation.

OSAS is never making the choice that your plan is better than God's plan. If you tell God you want out of the Lamb's book of life, that is it. Your choice removed you from God's gift of Salvation. So the argument is not about works or falling out of Grace. The argument should be how to convince God at the appropriate time you want to be removed from the Lamb's book of life.
 

Davy

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But there are times anger is sin and that’s what I’m talking about.

I had to show the Bible view, because Leftists-Socialist-Communists try to use the anger card against Christians who know how to deal with God's enemies per His Word. And it ain't about turning the other cheek.

What Bible view am I talking about? Luke 22 where Jesus spoke to His disciples in final when sending them out to preach The Gospel. He told them who had script, or extra clothing to go buy a sword. The disciples held up two swords and He said that was enough. So what's the difference between His saying to turn the cheek vs His command to buy a sword in Luke 22?

The turn the other cheek is about preaching The Gospel, and those who want to shame you for it. It is not about a murderer coming at you with a knife, which in that case you have the God-given right to yield arms to defend yourself. This is why the 2nd Amendment to the U.S. Constitution is not to be infringed, because it is a God-given right for this present world.

One of the Bible Truths I mention to those who try to use that anger card is how when Jesus returns, He is not going to be meek as a lamb again. He is going to be wielding the Sword of His Mouth, and it is double-edged. He is coming in power with a rod of iron this next time.
 

Christ4Me

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Likewise you can't get it if God foreknows you will recant.

God foreknew that some will go astray in becoming former believers and deny Him verbally just as God foreknew that many will go astray by religious dead works that are denying Him in one form or another for why He would deny them being workers of iniquity, but He still abides for why they are saved.

Titus 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Think of reprobate as disqualified in running that race for the high prize of our calling to be received by Him as that vessel unto honor in His House to attend the marriage Supper in that kingdom of Heaven.

Paul gave an example of how a saved believer can go astray and yet he says even former believers are still to be called to depart from iniquity so they too can be received by the Bridegroom as that vessel unto honor in His House.

2 Timothy 2:18 Who concerning the truth have erred, saying that the resurrection is past already; and overthrow the faith of some. 19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity. 20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour. 21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

Note how when one departs from iniquity, they are vessels unto honor in His House to partake of the firstfruits of the resurrection as vessels of gold & silver when the Bridegroom comes for the abiding bride of Christ?

Note then how the vessels of dishonor that do not depart from iniquity are still in His House but as vessels of wood & earth? So even though by words and works these former believers and carnal believers are denying him for why He would deny them attendance to the Marriage Supper above, He still abides in them because He is faithful for He shall lose none of all the Father has given Him.

John 6: 37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. 38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. 39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

That is why we are to call even former believers to depart from iniquity so they too can receive the eternal glory that comes with our salvation in being that vessel unto honor in His House.

2 Timothy 2:10 Therefore I endure all things for the elect's sakes, that they may also obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. 11 It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him: 12 If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us: 13 If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself.

There is no casting out of His kingdom of heaven but there is a casting out from attending the Marriage Supper in that kingdom of heaven for not being ready. That is why there are vessels of dishonor in His House just as there is the least in the kingdom of Heaven.

Matthew 5:19 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

That is why in Matthew 25:1-13, the first 2 verses are key in seeing how the ten virgins is the kingdom of heaven but five missed out on the Marriage Supper when the Bridegroom had come, but still in that kingdom of heaven. That is why you have the least i that kingdom of heaven & the vessels unto dishonor, vessels of wood & earth, that are in His House.

So that is how God can foreknew those who are saved that can go astray and deny Him verbally and even deny Him by their religious works or by sowing to the works of the flesh ( which heresy is one of the works of the flesh ).

So that is why He is denying knowing them because they are denying Him, BUT He still abides in them for He is faithful for having saved them still.