Parable Of The Unmerciful Servant

[Episkopos]

I'm talking about that's how Law works.

Ezekiel 18:24 gives an example of this:

“But if a righteous person turns from their righteousness and commits sin and does the same detestable things the wicked person does, will they live? None of the righteous things that person has done will be remembered. Because of the unfaithfulness they are guilty of and because of the sins they have committed, they will die."

This is speaking of conversion....or reversion. This happens a few times in one's life. Like Zacchaeus who gave back the money he stole from people as a tax collector. Jesus said...salvation is come here. Or the thief on the cross. Same law of righteousness.

You need to study what righteousness is more...away from religious indoctrination you get in churches these days telling us how special and saved we are.

But a recipient of God's grace has received Jesus' righteousness apart from works, and therefore is not affected by works.

The idea that someone who is righteous in Christ becomes unrighteous from their flesh is not Biblical.

Again, you are showing no understanding of what grace is.

Why did Peter sink when he walked on water? What did God take away from Him? What had Jesus given to Him? What work did Peter do or undo to sink?

Do more study on grace in the bible.

There is no such thing as a permanent salvation ahead of time before the race is finished. Of course God knows who will finish....but we don't. In a great house there are vessels of honour AND dishonour. Grace can be deceitful (actually the bible says grace IS deceitful)

But the solution is to become wise and fear the Lord.

 

[marks]

The soul that sins, it shall die....now has THAT law been rescinded?

I've already died in Christ. That law was fulfilled on my behalf. So I don't have to. That's grace!

Much love!

 

[Episkopos]

@Episkopos

I think episkopos' version of grace turns us into lawkeepers hoping we can keep at it. And if we don't . . . fallen from grace.

I'll leave it to him to correct me if I'm wrong about his understanding.

Much love!
mark

I said you have it backwards...and you keep speaking that way....so you aren't listening anyway. But grace keeps the law. If you cannot stop sinning then you are NOT under grace but under the law. Sin shows our distance from God. But grace places us into God's bosom.

Turn your ideas inside out and find more truth.

 

[Episkopos]

I've already died in Christ. That law was fulfilled on my behalf. So I don't have to. That's grace!

Much love!

That's indoctrination my friend. You read that in a book. If I read a pamphlet about a trip to Greece....that doesn't make me a tourist. If you just read the bible and claim all the good stuff for yourself...then you are just a spoiled sinner.

Look deeper.

 

[CoreIssue]

@Episkopos

I think episkopos' version of grace turns us into lawkeepers hoping we can keep at it. And if we don't . . . fallen from grace.

I'll leave it to him to correct me if I'm wrong about his understanding.

Much love!
mark

I call him Gnostic because if you think about what he say it proclaims himself as one who sees secret things we do not in the Bible.

Yes, the Bible contains layers of knowledge that we see as we learn more. But it never ceases to be in harmony with what we already have learned and does not require a special relationship with God to see.

We we learn with the guidance of the Holy Spirit who helps us see more and more of what the literal words say.

Learning about ancient history aids in that learning greatly.

Denominational Doctrine does not.

 

[Episkopos]

No one is under grace AND in their own strength. One displaces the other. One precludes the other. I think at least half the people on this board have never experienced anything beyond their own power, ideas and opinions. And these have been indoctrinated into believing whoppers about themselves based on the bible....but not in THEIR reality yet. So then these have become inoculated away from the truth by the bible verses that are showing them what they haven't received yet. They lie by saying...I have it!

The Pharisees were condemned because they claimed to be able to see...Jesus said...your sin remains.

So then the ones who cry out the loudest to be under grace...are really just fooled into believing so. There is no depth there....no truth, no reality....just vain religion.

Will these listen to reason and humble themselves? For their own good? Almost never. The bigger the lie....the easier it is to believe.

 

[marks]

This is speaking of conversion....or reversion. This happens a few times in one's life.

No. This is speaking of the keeping of the OT Law.

Ezekiel 18:19-21
Yet say ye, Why? doth not the son bear the iniquity of the father? When the son hath done that which is lawful and right, and hath kept all my statutes, and hath done them, he shall surely live. The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him. But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.

This is what happens if you want to live under the Law.

Grace and love!
Mark

 

[marks]

There is no such thing as a permanent salvation ahead of time before the race is finished.

1 John 5:13
These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

I guess John didn't get it either.

On the other hand . . . do you know you have eternal life?

Much love!
mark

 

[marks]

No one is under grace AND in their own strength.

Straw Man.

Who is asserting that we are under grace AND in our own strength?

 

[CoreIssue]

This is speaking of conversion....or reversion. This happens a few times in one's life. Like Zacchaeus who gave back the money he stole from people as a tax collector. Jesus said...salvation is come here. Or the thief on the cross. Same law of righteousness.

You need to study what righteousness is more...away from religious indoctrination you get in churches these days telling us how special and saved we are.


Again, you are showing no understanding of what grace is.

Why did Peter sink when he walked on water? What did God take away from Him? What had Jesus given to Him? What work did Peter do or undo to sink?

Do more study on grace in the bible.

There is no such thing as a permanent salvation ahead of time before the race is finished. Of course God knows who will finish....but we don't. In a great house there are vessels of honour AND dishonour. Grace can be deceitful (actually the bible says grace IS deceitful)

But the solution is to become wise and fear the Lord.

The Bible does not teach reversion.

Peter sank due to lack of faith.

The Bible does not say grace is deceitful.

Proverbs 31:30 New International Version (NIV)
30 Charm is deceptive, and beauty is fleeting;
but a woman who fears the Lord is to be praised.

The KJV says grace in place of charm. But it is talking about a charming and beautiful woman, not God's grace.

 

[marks]

(actually the bible says grace IS deceitful)

Where is that? I can't think of the place just now.

?

 

[CoreIssue]

1 John 5:13
These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God.

I guess John didn't get it either.

On the other hand . . . do you know you have eternal life?

Much love!
mark

Romans 8 and James 2 also refute Episkopos.

 

[marks]

I said you have it backwards...and you keep speaking that way....so you aren't listening anyway. But grace keeps the law. If you cannot stop sinning then you are NOT under grace but under the law. Sin shows our distance from God. But grace places us into God's bosom.

Turn your ideas inside out and find more truth.

Law is what empowers sin.

Reference Romans 7.

Living under Law is setting yourself up to sin.

We don't have to sin because we are under Law, but under Grace.

Grace and love!
Mark

 

[marks]

I think at least half the people on this board have never experienced anything beyond their own power, ideas and opinions.

Are you certain it's not "all but for 1"?

 

[Hidden In Him]

This is a good thread. Makes one think!
Although, how do we reconcile what you said here: "My contention, however, is that there are certain actions that we can take which God considers serious enough as to cancel out that grace, or as I described in the OP, rescind it." With Mark 3:28,29? Truly I tell you, people can be forgiven all their sins and every slander they utter, but whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; they are guilty of an eternal sin." Just a thought

Yes. Taking the mark, denying Christ, blaspheming the Holy Spirit, abusing the church in leadership, and refusal to forgive. Those are the five I see listed that can annul grace.

 

[Hidden In Him]

There is a price to pay, but not of salvation.. praying the price of torment...and the loss of "a good and faithful servant. " Hell indeed.

I do think this is a type of torment. But He addressed that last servant as "you wicked and slothful servant." I don't think he was referring to a saint there.

 

[CoreIssue]

Yes. Taking the mark, denying Christ, blaspheming the Holy Spirit, abusing the church in leadership, and refusal to forgive. Those are the five I see listed that can annul grace.

The born-again will never deny Christ or blaspheme the Holy Spirit.

Even God conditions forgiveness on repentance. But nowhere does the Bible say it is a condition of salvation.

Romans 8 James 2 are solid OSAS.

Nowhere does the Bible say grace is only for the saved. It is for whoever God wishes to give it.

 

[Episkopos]

Yes. Taking the mark, denying Christ, blaspheming the Holy Spirit, abusing the church in leadership, and refusal to forgive. Those are the five I see listed that can annul grace.

Again this seeing grace as a commodity. We can easily grieve the Spirit. When the Spirit is chased away...the grace goes too. You can't have a non-spiritual grace that has no presence of God.

Grace isn't like a coin we put in our pockets. Nobody owns grace. Grace is how God puts us into a spiritual race...how He equips us to overcome sin and the world.

But we can easily fail grace...just by treating His gift as a commodity. We can easily frustrate the purpose of God by trying to exploit His gifts.

If we have taken wrongly the time when we received grace....taking it for ourselves ...we can become a monster of sorts. A spoiled sinner.

Grace is God's way with us through Christ. Better to learn to be as He is rather than selfishly claim good things for ourselves. A gift of God is never to us but meant to work THROUGH us to others.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Well, maybe ask God about the above quote here.
You may find it is not so after all.

Well, I don't see it as an issue for me, honestly. Just like an earthly king could rescind his grace, I believe the King of kings can as well if He deems someone to have walked unworthy of it.

 

[Helen]

I do think this is a type of torment. But He addressed that last servant as "you wicked and slothful servant." I don't think he was referring to a saint there.

Okay..then why is He telling this story at all??
It seems a waste of His breath.
And why did this thread spin off on to your- 'can God's people lose their salvation?' thread?

Just wondering here.