Postmillenial Partial Preterism...What is it? A Victorious View of the Gospel.

[Iconoclast]

Ronald David Bruno,
I will go over your posts both ,right here;
[No, you implied my ideas were pagan,]


[Now The sun, moon and stars have had many meanings. In ancient civilizations, they were seen as the gods and goddesses.
What the stars meant to ancient civilizations mean something different today.
you laughed at them]

Here is my response, where did I laugh at you?
We are not speaking of the pagan use of Sun, moon, and stars, but rather the biblical uses.
The heaven rolling up like a scroll is not an atomic bomb.
The exact language was used by Isa.,,,lol they had no nuclear weapons.
Here I inserted LOl. because either you did not take the time to read my posts, or you just make things up on the fly.

I had posted this earlier,post52;
The Sun, Moon And Stars Of Matthew 24:29


This Olivet Discourse Deception study is about the meaning of the Sun, Moon and Stars of Matthew 24:29.

The ‘sun, moon and stars’ are symbolic of earthly dignitaries, great political authorities and great lights in the political or religious heavens.

We know this because in Genesis 37:8-10, Joseph had a dream, ..”And this time, the sun, the moon, and the eleven stars bowed down to me. So he told it to his father and his brothers; and his father rebuked him and said to him, “What is this dream that you have dreamed? Shall your mother and I and your brothers indeed come to bow down to the earth before you?” It was symbolic of the power structure.

Here are examples which are clearly not about the literal sun, moon and stars.

Isaiah 13:10 is referring to the Babylonian leaders being removed from power by the Medo-Persians.

“For the stars of heaven and the constellations thereof shall not give their light: the sun shall be darkened in his going forth, and the moon shall not cause her light to shine.“

Isaiah 13:17 confirms this with, “Behold, I will stir up the Medes against them,”

Isaiah 34:3-5 foretold the destruction of the Edomites and other nations which were enemies.

“Their slain also shall be cast out, and their stink shall come up out of their carcases, and the mountains shall be melted with their blood. And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree. For my sword shall be bathed in heaven: behold, it shall come down upon Idumea, and upon the people of my curse, to judgment.”

Ezekiel 32:6-8 points to the Babylonians desolating Egypt, removing the Pharaoh (Sun) and his leaders (moon) from power.

“I will also water with thy blood the land wherein thou swimmest, even to the mountains; and the rivers shall be full of thee. And when I shall put thee out, I will cover the heaven, and make the stars thereof dark; I will cover the sun with a cloud, and the moon shall not give her light. All the bright lights of heaven will I make dark over thee, and set darkness upon thy land, saith the Lord GOD.”

Applying the symbols to Matthew 24:29, we can see that the Jewish leaders having their power structure removed, is clearly indicated.

Why have you and others ignored this???

here is the same exact language used in Isa.34; Isaiah 34:3-5 foretold the destruction of the Edomites and other nations which were enemies.

“Their slain also shall be cast out, and their stink shall come up out of their carcases, and the mountains shall be melted with their blood. And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll: and all their host shall fall down, as the leaf falleth off from the vine, and as a falling fig from the fig tree. For my sword shall be bathed in heaven: behold, it shall come down upon Idumea, and upon the people of my curse, to judgment.”

Was Isa34: describing an atomic bomb??? Do you see how foolish it is to suggest this?



This is go avoid the biblical text.
Stars means stars...
it does not say volcanic eruptions.
The explanations offered by postmillenialism, does not change the language, look to pagans, atom bombs, eclipses, volcanoes, but rather lets scripture speak for itself.

 

[Iconoclast]

Ron, pt2
[and then I showed scripture proving that God will use volcanic eruptions as part of His Judgement, among other physical cataclysmic events.
Start with the line by line interpretation for
Deut. 32:22. & Rev. 8:8 particularly where it mentions mountains???]

I do think what you quoted was all fulfilled in the first Century as part of the Covenant curses coming upon apostate Jerusalem
16 They provoked him to jealousy with strange gods, with abominations provoked they him to anger.

17 They sacrificed unto devils, not to God; to gods whom they knew not, to new gods that came newly up, whom your fathers feared not.

18 Of the Rock that begat thee thou art unmindful, and hast forgotten God that formed thee.

19 And when the Lord saw it, he abhorred them, because of the provoking of his sons, and of his daughters.

20 And he said, I will hide my face from them, I will see what their end shall be: for they are a very froward generation, children in whom is no faith.

21 They have moved me to jealousy with that which is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with those which are not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation.

Paul quotes this in romans 10;
19 But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.

20 But Esaias is very bold, and saith, I was found of them that sought me not; I was made manifest unto them that asked not after me.

21 But to Israel he saith, All day long I have stretched forth my hands unto a disobedient and gainsaying people.

22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.

23 I will heap mischiefs upon them; I will spend mine arrows upon them.

24 They shall be burnt with hunger, and devoured with burning heat, and with bitter destruction: I will also send the teeth of beasts upon them, with the poison of serpents of the dust.

25 The sword without, and terror within, shall destroy both the young man and the virgin, the suckling also with the man of gray hairs.

26 I said, I would scatter them into corners, I would make the remembrance of them to cease from among men:

27 Were it not that I feared the wrath of the enemy, lest their adversaries should behave themselves strangely, and lest they should say, Our hand is high, and the Lord hath not done all this.

28 For they are a nation void of counsel, neither is there any understanding in them.

29 O that they were wise, that they understood this, that they would consider their latter end!

30 How should one chase a thousand, and two put ten thousand to flight, except their Rock had sold them, and the Lord had shut them up?

31 For their rock is not as our Rock, even our enemies themselves being judges.

32 For their vine is of the vine of Sodom, and of the fields of Gomorrah: their grapes are grapes of gall, their clusters are bitter:

33 Their wine is the poison of dragons, and the cruel venom of asps.

34 Is not this laid up in store with me, and sealed up among my treasures?

35 To me belongeth vengeance and recompence; their foot shall slide in due time: for the day of their calamity is at hand, and the things that shall come upon them make haste.

36 For the Lord shall judge his people, and repent himself for his servants, when he seeth that their power is gone, and there is none shut up, or left.

37 And he shall say, Where are their gods, their rock in whom they trusted,

38 Which did eat the fat of their sacrifices, and drank the wine of their drink offerings? let them rise up and help you, and be your protection.

39 See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand.

40 For I lift up my hand to heaven, and say, I live for ever.

41 If I whet my glittering sword, and mine hand take hold on judgment; I will render vengeance to mine enemies, and will reward them that hate me.

42 I will make mine arrows drunk with blood, and my sword shall devour flesh; and that with the blood of the slain and of the captives, from the beginning of revenges upon the enemy.

43 Rejoice, O ye nations, with his people: for he will avenge the blood of his servants, and will render vengeance to his adversaries, and will be merciful unto his land, and to his people.

44 And Moses came and spake all the words of this song in the ears of the people, he, and Hoshea the son of Nun.

45 And Moses made an end of speaking all these words to all Israel:

 

[Iconoclast]

pt3;

[In the Bible, stars are symbolic for angels].
Sometimes, as in rev.12,agree. But the particular uses of Sun , moon, and stars have particular usage.

[The sun, moon and stars had a sense of permanence and so people likened them to God or angels.]
Partly true, yet they were forbidden to do this by law.

[In Joseph's dream, he saw the sun, moon and eleven stars. Jacob understood that to mean his family were to bow down to Joseph. The sun, moon and stars in Rev. 12 describes a women (Israel) and the twelve tribes. Out of comes a child (Jesus)
ok

[Catholics would say the women is Mary.]
not relevant

[The scripture may have multiple meanings - symbolic and literal as well.]
no..

[The point is symbolism evolves. What the stars meant to ancient civilizations mean something different today. ]

no, they mean what God intends them to be

[Joseph's stars were his brothers. But in other scriptures they are angels. And sometimes they means stars. In Revelation, they fall from the sky. Too big to do that so it could be a meteor shower. The sum and moon not giving its light could be the result of the entire middle East at war and burning, smoke blocking out the sun, moon and stars light. And we have seen blood moons, they are orange/redish.]

This is to ignore what we are saying is a specific use of the terms.
because of your dispensational notions you look to fragment the scriptures rather than compare scripture with scripture.



{A literal worldwide earthquake will happen that levels every building on the planet. Hid shakes the world and "the earth moves out if her place"
“It is He who shakes the earth from its place, And its pillars tremble;" Job 9:6
Think about if a super volcanic eruption occurred. How well would you see the sun, moon or stars in that part of the world? Rev. 8:7
Smoke would block them out. describes 1/3 of the planet on fire, trees, grass, etc.

Meteor shower or missiles. These explanations could not be in the Bible, they did not have that knowledge.

A nuclear bomb looks exactly like the clouds roll up like a scroll. A mushroom cloud it's called.
Again a worldwide earthquake is combined with this other event}

Here again, you ignore the biblical language , or change it, to try and fit into a dispensational framework.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Hey Ron you're welcome to try and show where I've Disordered anything " "one of my posts directly and go over line by line and we'll see who's using scripture correctly and who's not

No, no, no, you first. These are only two verses, NOT two full chapters in the Bible. I have spent many hours with you, but I do not care to spoon feed you the meaning of two chapters line by line for you, when I know that your rebuttal will be complete rejection, as you have already demonstrated. Why would I want to invest more hours? Besides, there are other very competent brothers who are refuting your posts - isn't that enough for you to handle?
>>>TWO verses: Deut. 32:22, Rev. 8:8 What is your interpretation? Just a brief one. My pastor used to spend an hour just on one verse. I am not asking that, just briefly, the gist of these verses? Then I will leave you alone.

 

[Iconoclast]

No, no, no, you first. These are only two verses, NOT two full chapters in the Bible. I have spent many hours with you, but I do not care to spoon feed you the meaning of two chapters line by line for you, when I know that your rebuttal will be complete rejection, as you have already demonstrated. Why would I want to invest more hours? Besides, there are other very competent brothers who are refuting your posts - isn't that enough for you to handle?
>>>TWO verses: Deut. 32:22, Rev. 8:8 What is your interpretation? Just a brief one. My pastor used to spend an hour just on one verse. I am not asking that, just briefly, the gist of these verses? Then I will leave you alone.

Hello Ron, post 102 was my answer to you. I will do more on the Deuteronomy passages as I develop this thread, I have only started.
Ron, let me say again, I know the position you and the others are trying to offer. It is not that I reject you, but I am very familiar with the kind of answers you are offering.
I was taught, that if it says it, it will happen as it says it.

If the plain sense makes sense ,seek no other sense.
I found the plain sense does not always get it done.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Volcanoes, earthquakes, meteor showers, have been experienced and they had knowledge of them. Meteor showers to them look like stars falling. If John saw missiles in the vision, then he wouldn't write missiles or a mushroom cloud, he would write something that best described what he saw. They did not have the science.
How do you interpret the demon, scorpion-like, locusts that have faces like man, who sting and torture mankind for five months?
They come out of the Abyss - where demons are released. An angel is given the key to release them and they come out from smoke (as smoke from a furnace)? That furnace caused by God's wrath comes from beneath the existing the earth and sets mountains on fire (as in Deut. 32:22). Chew on that one for a awhile.

These explanations could not be in the Bible, they did not have that knowledge.

Zach. 14:12 describes the effects of a nuclear bomb. Their flesh shall "consume away" (burned, melt, dissolve) while they stand on their feet. I suppose a solar flare could do this or God himself.
Prophets did not always understand what they saw in a vision, so it as described in their language.

You will experience the Great Tribulation soon and the world has already seen the beginning of sorrows. It will be real, exactly what you see and experience , not symbolic for something else. All this ymbolism you've assigned to Revelation as something that already happened will vanish and reality will kick in as the play in the scroll acts out. Experience is always the best teacher!

 

[Zao is life]

lk21;
20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.

21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.

22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.

23 But woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck, in those days! for there shall be great distress in the land, and wrath upon this people.
Jesus spoke this to those in the first century, saying these be the days of vengeance??
he was speaking of the Covenant curses coming upon apostate Israel as spoken of in Deut 28-33, the Song of Moses..
Not one of you premill men have suggested the link to the promise of judgment for Covenant breaking.

I'm someone who leans more toward Pre-mil than anything else (so let's just call me Pre-mil), and I have suggested not the link to "the judgement for covenant breaking" (as you call it here), but the judgment for rejecting the New Covenant in Christ's blood.

Christ's blood of the New Covenant is God's solution for covenant breaking (Jeremiah 31:31-32). They rejected Him, so they were judged.

Also, I'm Pre-mil, but I've seen the events of the Olivet Discourse (at least as recorded by Luke in Luke 21:2-24) as the last days of the kingdom of Judah as being the custodians of the Kingdom of God.

So when you make assumptions about everyone like you did below:

Not one of you premill men have suggested the link to the promise of judgment for Covenant breaking.

then you are spoiling what you are saying. So far, you have been helping me to understand the language of prophecy, and I have been reading your posts (started today Monday August 23rd) carefully.

Wrath vs Judgement vs Tribulation

Each time that the wrath of God has come upon certain peoples and tribes and nations at various times in history, it's a judgment (A judgment) from God.

Tribulation is the experience of human beings, but not always as a result of God's wrath or judgment coming upon them (for example the tribulation Christians experienced under the hand of Nero was not God's wrath or God's judgment coming upon them).

But obviously, each time the wrath of God comes upon any peoples or tribes or nations, such a period will be experienced as a period of great tribulation for them.

So what you have been saying about the meaning of the symbolic language of earthquakes and stars falling and heavens being rolled up and sun and moon etc etc (in the posts I've read so far) makes total sense to me. I'm not saying I will agree with you at the end, but at least I'm learning something from your posts in that your explanation of prophetic language makes total sense (to me, anyway), so thank you.

There is something else that needs to be understood about God's judgement - but I'll get to that maybe in a later post in this thread, because I'm staying on track with your topic.

But please don't spoil it by making assumptions of what Pre-mils believe and don't believe. Each person is an individual. Each person (yourself included) is on a different stage of growth in his understanding of the prophetic scriptures.

 

[Zao is life]

A full preterist is a sincere person who did not know when to put the brakes on.
They claim everything has already happened, even the rapture.

Partial preterists believe many of the events have already taken place or in the process of being completed.
For the most part, rev19-22 is still future.
Dan9:24-27 has been fulfilled, Mt 24, fulfilled lk21 fulfilled.
As we will seek to demonstrate, by letting the bible interpret itself for us, we are drawn to these conclusions.

It's not only Partial Preterists who believe Daniel 9:24-27 and Luke 21 has been fulfilled. I'm Pre-mil and have always believed that.

It's clear by the language of Luke 21:2-24 that it was the wrath of God coming upon the people of the kingdom of Judea who lived during the period AD 66-70.

 

[Zao is life]

And I'll show from the plain reading of Scripture that it hasn't. Jesus returns immediately afterward, and every eye will see Him.

Much love!

I'm still reading this thread (I'm on Pg 3). I can't wait for the part where @Iconoclast gives his explanation of the above, because Matthew 24:9 & 14, & 29-33 is what has prevented me from ever coming to a conclusion about the dating of the fulfillment of the prophecy. Luke 21:20-24 makes it obvious about the dating, but the question asked by the disciples which sparked the Lord's Olivet Discourse is also different as recorded in Luke 21 to the question recorded as being asked in Matthew 24.

 

[Zao is life]

I want to understand what God wants us to understand.

So do we all. Please quit claiming to be unique.

I'm Pre-mil and you've got me listening to, understanding, and agreeing with what you are saying about the meaning of the symbolism used in prophetic language, and why it does not have to be taken literally. So in that sense I'm being enlightened by this thread, and I'm always grateful for any time someone helps me to see what I never saw before.

But stop being critical of the views of others. It's unnecessary and not making a positive contribution to your posts. Just argue the point when someone disagrees with you, sticking to your guns if you believe you are right, but without using "The reason I'm right and you're wrong is because of the following.." type of statements to support your beliefs. Enough about Premils and how they react when they disagree with you - each person is an individual. Not everyone reacts in the same way.

PS: This post I made without feeling anger (at all) but by way of providing some constructive criticism.

 

[Zao is life]

I will bow out and just read..

Pity.

 

[Zao is life]

I believe in partial preterism. For instance I believe Babylon where the precious things are sold and ships standing afar off watching her burn was the Roman city of Pompeii. (Pompeii was destroyed because of the eruption of Mount Vesuvius on August 24, 79 CE. Just after midday on August 24, fragments of ash and other volcanic debris began pouring down on Pompeii, quickly covering the city to a depth of more than 9 feet (3 metres).)

Revelation 18:17 For in one hour so great riches is come to nought. And every shipmaster, and all the company in ships, and sailors, and as many as trade by sea, stood afar off,

Interesting, but it was a natural disaster. The Revelation has its harlot destroyed in one hour by the same ten kings who rule for one hour with the beast. So (if the destruction of the harlot has already occurred) then unless those 10 kings were Roman and the destruction of the harlot was AD70, then no, not Pompeii.

 

[Zao is life]

Notice the premill guys strain to try and force hyper literal fulfillments where none are available. Not one interacts with what was posted as if ignoring it will change what is posted.

That's not true of me. I'm still Pre-mil and to me Pre-mil does not preclude the Olivet Discourse having already been fulfilled and the Olivet Discourse already being fulfilled does not preclude Pre-mil.

I've been reading and reading through this thread to see if this question has already come up and already been answered by you ( so as not to waste your time), but now I'm going to ask it anyway:

Please explain how the verse in bold below fits in with the view that everything written in Matthew 24 has already been fulfilled:

29 And immediately after the tribulation of those days, the sun shall be darkened and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from the heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken.
30 And then the sign of the Son of man shall appear in the heavens. And then all the tribes of the earth shall mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of the heaven with power and great glory.
31 And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather His elect from the four winds, from one end of the heavens to the other.

Please note: I'm not bothered about verses 29-30 because you have already explained how in your view they have been fulfilled, by explaining the symbolic use of this language throughout Biblical prophecy.

I find myself agreeing with what you are saying regarding the symbolic use of this language throughout Biblical prophecy and I have learned from your explanation regarding this (just by the way), but I want to know how you believe the Lord sending out His angels with a great sound of a trumpet and gathering His elect from the four winds etc fits with the view that all of this took place in the period A.D 66-70. The reason I ask, is:-

(1) because of Paul's statement below:

"In a moment, in a glance of an eye, at the last trumpet. For a trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall all be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality." (1 Corinthians 15:52-53).

(2) I also ask because of this statement: "And the seventh angel sounded. And there were great voices in Heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of His Christ. And He will reign forever and ever." (Revelation 11:15).

 

[Iconoclast]

I'm someone who leans more toward Pre-mil than anything else (so let's just call me Pre-mil), and I have suggested not the link to "the judgement for covenant breaking" (as you call it here), but the judgment for rejecting the New Covenant in Christ's blood.

Christ's blood of the New Covenant is God's solution for covenant breaking (Jeremiah 31:31-32). They rejected Him, so they were judged.

Also, I'm Pre-mil, but I've seen the events of the Olivet Discourse (at least as recorded by Luke in Luke 21:2-24) as the last days of the kingdom of Judah as being the custodians of the Kingdom of God.

So when you make assumptions about everyone like you did below:

then you are spoiling what you are saying. So far, you have been helping me to understand the language of prophecy, and I have been reading your posts (started today Monday August 23rd) carefully.

Wrath vs Judgement vs Tribulation

Each time that the wrath of God has come upon certain peoples and tribes and nations at various times in history, it's a judgment (A judgment) from God.

Tribulation is the experience of human beings, but not always as a result of God's wrath or judgment coming upon them (for example the tribulation Christians experienced under the hand of Nero was not God's wrath or God's judgment coming upon them).

But obviously, each time the wrath of God comes upon any peoples or tribes or nations, such a period will be experienced as a period of great tribulation for them.

So what you have been saying about the meaning of the symbolic language of earthquakes and stars falling and heavens being rolled up and sun and moon etc etc (in the posts I've read so far) makes total sense to me. I'm not saying I will agree with you at the end, but at least I'm learning something from your posts in that your explanation of prophetic language makes total sense (to me, anyway), so thank you.

There is something else that needs to be understood about God's judgement - but I'll get to that maybe in a later post in this thread, because I'm staying on track with your topic.

But please don't spoil it by making assumptions of what Pre-mils believe and don't believe. Each person is an individual. Each person (yourself included) is on a different stage of growth in his understanding of the prophetic scriptures.

Welcome to the thread brother.
I am no prophecy expert but rather a work in progress;)
I was a solid premill guy,Things to Come ,by Dwight Pentecost, Walvoord on Matthew, Dallas cassette tapes by S.Lewis Johnson.
sermons by John M etc.
I spent two years studying Hebrews, worked through Jonathan Edwards on the History of Redemption for another two years...found my previous understanding was defective.
Also found it quite unsettling to re
examine what i was taught was truth.
The objections I have seen so far were predictable as I used to say the same responses.
FoG...I am not that smart, but have found many resources of gifted teachers who offer up portions of scripture that work to refine
previous understanding.
I intend to offer more of the OT. language for consideration.
Glad you enjoy the scripture as much as I do.
As long as we are covered by the blood, looking for Jesus, and praying for grace to serve Him fully, we can have a different Calendar.
Keep believing and serving God as a faithful premill person ,until and unless you see a better way. Thanks for your solid post.

ps. because I was premill for years I do not hesitate to come at them a bit, because it reminds me...of me...lol several years ago.
It was not until several men challenged me in a very firm scriptural matter that I had to study it out freshly.
When people question your salvation without considering the scriptures offered, it can provoke a bit of a response,lol

 

[marks]

I'm still reading this thread (I'm on Pg 3). I can't wait for the part where @Iconoclast gives his explanation of the above, because Matthew 24:9 & 14, & 29-33 is what has prevented me from ever coming to a conclusion about the dating of the fulfillment of the prophecy. Luke 21:20-24 makes it obvious about the dating, but the question asked by the disciples which sparked the Lord's Olivet Discourse is also different as recorded in Luke 21 to the question recorded as being asked in Matthew 24.

I've been seeing a lot of posts, "It will be answered later . . .", like that. I also am waiting!

;)

 

[marks]

So do we all. Please quit claiming to be unique.

I'm Pre-mil and you've got me listening to, understanding, and agreeing with what you are saying about the meaning of the symbolism used in prophetic language, and why it does not have to be taken literally. So in that sense I'm being enlightened by this thread, and I'm always grateful for any time someone helps me to see what I never saw before.

But stop being critical of the views of others. It's unnecessary and not making a positive contribution to your posts. Just argue the point when someone disagrees with you, sticking to your guns if you believe you are right, but without using "The reason I'm right and you're wrong is because of the following.." type of statements to support your beliefs. Enough about Premils and how they react when they disagree with you - each person is an individual. Not everyone reacts in the same way.

PS: This post I made without feeling anger (at all) but by way of providing some constructive criticism.

Well said!

Much love!

 

[Iconoclast]

Mar

I've been seeing a lot of posts, "It will be answered later . . .", like that. I also am waiting!

;)

Marks
I am at work and have been getting to it as I can.
Perhaps in the meantime, if you worked through those posts on page 3 that you "skimmed" over, it might give me time yo catch up.
I type and text at turtle speed

 

[marks]

Notice the premill guys strain to try and force hyper literal fulfillments where none are available. Not one interacts with what was posted as if ignoring it will change what is posted.

What do you mean there?

Hyper literal fulfillments? Like that Jesus would be born in Bethlehem? Or that He would die and raise again on the third day? Where is the stain you are talking about? Wouldn't that be if you tried making it something besides what it really says?

Much love!

 

[marks]

A star falling to earth, is a meteor,or shooting star.
that is not going to cause men to be terrified,we used to go outside as kids and watch those for fun.

Job 38:22-23 KJV
22) Hast thou entered into the treasures of the snow? or hast thou seen the treasures of the hail,
23) Which I have reserved against the time of trouble, against the day of battle and war?

Perhaps think in a larger scale . . .

Much love!

 

[marks]

The language of the moon turning to blood, you say it has a temporary color change to red?

The moon turned to blood, yes, "phenomenal" language, that is, language which describe phenomena. The moon does not turn into a giant globule of blood hanging in space, but appears blood red.

Much love!