Premillennialism contradicts scripture (1 Corinthians 15:50-54) by having mortal flesh and blood inheriting the kingdom of God when Jesus returns.

[WPM]

Why do you acknowledge that Jesus is the head of His church right now, but you do not acknowledge that all current things are under Him right now when Paul indicated that the timing of all things having been put under Him was the same as the timing of Him being made the head over all things in the church?

Ephesians 1:19 And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, 20 Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places, 21 Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:
22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

His fight is with Scripture, and he knows it. That is why he is so sheepish. That is why he is avoiding the obvious. That is why he wants to run.

 

[WPM]

Don't you know what it means when someone answers the question with a question? I often use this rhetorical technique to shift the discussion and highlight a point that disproves your position.

My question comes from the Parable of the Minas, where Jesus says that he is like the nobleman who will go off to a far country to receive a kingdom. His example comes from history, when Herod the Great went to Rome to receive a kingdom from Rome. While he was in Rome, he didn't rule over Judea. He didn't rule over Judea until he arrived back home.

Your question is a loaded question in that it assumes the point you are defending. I took it as a rhetorical question. I have already answered the question based on my exegesis of the Parable. Just like Herod received authority while he was in Rome, Jesus received authority while he was in heaven. And just as Herod began to rule over Judea after he returned, Jesus will rule over the earth when he returns.

Yes, people do that when their argument is exposed. It is called avoidance. It is what you continually do.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Why would Jesus be granted authority only to not be able to use it at all for another 2,000 years, at least? That's complete nonsense.

Why is that nonsense? He told us that he would be delayed.

You need to answer the question of why you believe that He is now the head of all things in the church but does not now have all things under His rule?

He assigned authority to his apostles so that they would spread his teachings. His followers obey him according to their teachings. And Jesus sent another παράκλητος (paráklētos) to help them.

Paul taught that after He was resurrected and was set at the right hand of the Father it meant that God had "put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church" (Ephesians 1:22). Why do you accept the second part of that verse as being a current reality, but not the first part?

Jesus is not currently around.

 

[CadyandZoe]

His fight is with Scripture, and he knows it. That is why he is so sheepish. That is why he is avoiding the obvious. That is why he wants to run.

If I am so sheepish, then what accounts for the number of my posts in this thread?

We don't have to fight. We can discuss the scriptures objectively.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Yes, you did. Nowhere did you say what you think Jesus is doing right now. That was my question.

And my answer was "What did Herod do in Rome?' That is my answer.

 

[WPM]

Don't you know what it means when someone answers the question with a question? I often use this rhetorical technique to shift the discussion and highlight a point that disproves your position.

My question comes from the Parable of the Minas, where Jesus says that he is like the nobleman who will go off to a far country to receive a kingdom. His example comes from history, when Herod the Great went to Rome to receive a kingdom from Rome. While he was in Rome, he didn't rule over Judea. He didn't rule over Judea until he arrived back home.

Your question is a loaded question in that it assumes the point you are defending. I took it as a rhetorical question. I have already answered the question based on my exegesis of the Parable. Just like Herod received authority while he was in Rome, Jesus received authority while he was in heaven. And just as Herod began to rule over Judea after he returned, Jesus will rule over the earth when he returns.

You are missing the whole thrust of the parable and teaching. It is all about accepting Christ. Christ came unto His own and they rejected Him, Christ then rejected them. Israel was a privileged people. God had given them a possession illustrated here as a vineyard, which they did not keep.

Christ outlines physical's Israel's rejection. The kingdom has been taken from Israel as a nation and given to another nation – the largely Gentile New Testament Church – comprised of all believers (whether Jew or Gentile). This discourse showed these unbelieving religious Jews that because of their wanton rejection of Himself, Christ would extend His mercy to all nations. The near exclusive favour that natural Israel had formerly enjoyed would now be graciously widened to include the previously darkened Gentile people.

In this parable, the vineyard owner or householder (who represents Almighty God) sends a son (representing Christ). He has numerous workers known as the “husbandmen.” who represent the people of Israel. He also has servants who represent the prophets.

The householder (representing God) goes into a “far country.”

Mat 21:33 Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country:
Mat 21:34 And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it.
Mat 21:35 And the husbandmen took his servants (the Old Testament prophets), and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another.
Mat 21:36 Again, he sent other servants more than the first (more Old Testament prophets): and they did unto them likewise.
Mat 21:37 But last of all he sent unto them his son (Christ Jesus), saying, They will reverence my son.
Mat 21:38 But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance.
Mat 21:39 And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him (Calvary).
Mat 21:40 When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?
Mat 21:41 They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.
Mat 21:42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
Mat 21:44 And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.
Mat 21:45 And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them.
Mat 21:46 But when they sought to lay hands on him, they feared the multitude, because they took him for a prophet.

There is no hint or inclination in this parable that the vineyard would then be given back to these Christ rejecting husbandmen (representing the old physical economy that was restricted to natural Israel), but that it would be given to the whosoever believeth of all nations, including repentant Jews.

The Lord then turned to the religious Jews in Matthew 21:40-41 and presented a question, asking, “When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?”

To which they replied, “He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.”

It is then that the Lord asks them, “Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes? Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof. And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder” (Matthew 21:42-44).

In His summing up of His message, Christ predicts, in this vivid parable, the Jews rejection of Himself and His ultimate crucifixion. The kingdom of God has been given to a spiritual nation – the Church – today. This Church would never be based upon or restricted to one nationality, color or geographical location – it would be international and trans-national, incorporating all the peoples of the world.

 

[WPM]

If I am so sheepish, then what accounts for the number of my posts in this thread?

We don't have to fight. We can discuss the scriptures objectively.

Lol. A thread full of avoidance from you! The reader can see that for themselves. There's no reasoning with you. I'm not trying to change your mind. I'm just here to expose your error and avoidance.

 

[WPM]

And my answer was "What did Herod do in Rome?' That is my answer.

More avoidance!

 

[WPM]

And my answer was "What did Herod do in Rome?' That is my answer.

Christ rules as God over all creation. You must reject that because you deny the deity of Christ. That is why you have to reject that. He possesses all authority in heaven and on earth.

Proverbs 21: 1: "The king's heart is in the hand of the LORD, as the rivers of water: he turneth it whithersoever he will."

This is His sovereign control. What more control does He need than that to be ruling over his enemies?

Jeremiah 10:23: "O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps."

This is His sovereign control. What more control does He need than that to be ruling over his enemies?

Revelation 3:7: "And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth."

This is His sovereign control. What more control does He need than that to be ruling over his enemies?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Why is that nonsense? He told us that he would be delayed.

He never said that He would be delayed until He was able to rule.

He assigned authority to his apostles so that they would spread his teachings. His followers obey him according to their teachings. And Jesus sent another παράκλητος (paráklētos) to help them.

Are you aware that the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Christ? Are you aware that He dwells in the hearts of those who belong to Him?

John 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; 17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. 18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

John 14:22 Judas saith unto him, not Iscariot, Lord, how is it that thou wilt manifest thyself unto us, and not unto the world? 23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

Romans 8:9 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. 9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. 10 And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Jesus is not currently around.

This is blasphemous! He is with me dwelling in me right now. For you to say this would suggest that He's not dwelling in you, which is incredibly sad! "Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his". - The Apostle Paul

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

And my answer was "What did Herod do in Rome?' That is my answer.

No, that is a question. A non-answer. Which seems to be all you have to offer.

If you actually answered the question then I would assume your answer would be that you believe Jesus is doing nothing right now, or, at least, nothing of any significance. But, you can't bring yourself to actually say it.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Lol. Hello! The kingdom must already be here for Him to receive it when He comes. Read the text instead of what you have been wrongly taught.

Right. Scripture teaches that He will deliver His kingdom to the Father when He comes at the end of the age (1 Corinthians 15:22-24, Matthew 13:40-43). How can He deliver a kingdom to the Father that He hasn't even ruled over? That obviously makes no sense. No, He will deliver the kingdom that He has been ruling over since His resurrection to the Father when He returns.

 

[WPM]

And my answer was "What did Herod do in Rome?' That is my answer.

That was the last thing that Jesus was thinking about it. You are inventing this theory in order to support your error. That is what you do. You're always taking us on rabbit trails.

 

[Marilyn C]

It is the end. It is the completion. It is the conclusion of a thing The coming of the Lord is the end goal. Hello!

So sad your theology requires you butcher Scripture. But that sums up Dspensationalism.

Remember, people are actually watching on as you manipulate the text to fit your doctrine.

So, we take your word and NOT the Greek meaning which God wrote.

 

[WPM]

Jesus is not currently around.

Where is He then?

 

[Marilyn C]

The end comes at the second coming. Hello! Even Houdini couldn't squeeze out of that.

The end of the Gentiles ruling. (Dan. 7: 27. Luke 21: 24)

 

[Marilyn C]

Where is He then?

Jesus is behind the `veil` in the Holy of Holies with the Father interceding for us. (Heb. 6: 19 & 20. 7: 25. 8: 1 & 2)

 

[Marilyn C]

Why would they need to go to Jerusalem to learn the ways of the LORD God when they can do so while at home wherever they are by reading the Bible?

Because God said that they (a representative) needs to go and give worship to God and then be taught the ways of God. The people in the millennium do not have the Holy Spirit within like we do. They are of the nations, NOT being formed into a Body.

 

[Marilyn C]

He rules over His enemies at the right hand of the Father UNTIL all of His enemies have been made His footstool. You act as if it says He doesn't begin to rule until His enemies are made His footstool, but that is not what scripture teaches!

1 Corinthians 15:24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. 25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

This passage clearly says that He reigns UNTIL all enemies have been put under His feet, including the last enemy, which is death. At that point, He will deliver the kingdom He has been reigning over since His resurrection to the Father.

Ephesians 1:19 And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power, 20 Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places, 21 Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:
22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

Can you see here how He reigns while at the right hand of His Father with "all things under his feet" while being "ar above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named"? Why do you act as if Him being at the right hand of the Father means He is not reigning yet? No, Him being at the right hand of His Father means He has all power in heaven and earth like the Father does (Matt 28:18) and it means He is reigning while at the right hand of the Father. To claim that He is not reigning now would be like saying He is not the head of all things in the church right now and I'm sure you would not try to claim that.

Yes, we know that the Lord has all power now however, God`s word tells us that that before `those who are Christ's at His coming` He is behind the veil, with the Father interceding for us. (Heb. 6: 19 & 20. 7: 25. 8: 1 & 2)

 

[Marilyn C]

They have and do reject Jesus the Messiah. Do you disagree? You must be the only one inside or outside Israel that disagrees.

Mal. 3: 16