Premillennialism contradicts scripture (1 Corinthians 15:50-54) by having mortal flesh and blood inheriting the kingdom of God when Jesus returns.

[CadyandZoe]

I have one question. Why do you lie and say you believe that Jesus is God when you don't actually believe that?

I do believe it.

God created all things. You do not believe that Jesus created all things. Therefore, you do not believe that Jesus is God.

God is all powerful. You do not believe that Jesus is all powerful. Therefore, you do not believe that Jesus is God.

God is omnipresent. You do not believe that Jesus is omnipresent. Therefore, you do not believe that Jesus is God.

Do you have any questions?

It does not follow that since Jesus didn't create all things, he is not God. It doesn't follow that since Jesus isn't omnipotent, omniscient, or omnipresent, that He isn't God. John said that the word became flesh and dwelt among us and that Jesus is the exegesis of God. Paul said that Jesus is the image of God, and that, as a man, he is the exact representation of God.

Study the concept of "sameness" to understand what the Bible says about the relationship between the Father and the Son.

 

[CadyandZoe]

No, you have not.

I did answer them through several posts. To please you I answered them explicitly in a single post.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Congratulations on remaining calm while sharing your heretical beliefs. I'm sure that is impressing everyone here. I mean, God forbid anyone being passionate about what they believe, right? Oh, the horror.

You asked me to share them. You now regret it?

 

[Doug]

In the earthly kingdom…will be mortals?

Mortals “occupy / reside in Christs earthly Kingdom”. ?
No.

Mortals occupying / residing in Nations outside of Christs Kingdom?
Yes.

Mortals from world Nations, pilgrimage, visit, enter in Christs Kingdom?
Yes.

Live there?
No.

The people of the nation goats of Matthew 25 will enter the kingdom if no one else does

They will be led to the Lord by Israel saints.............[Zec 8:23 KJV] 23 Thus saith the LORD of hosts; In those days [it shall come to pass], that ten men shall take hold out of all languages of the nations, even shall take hold of the skirt of him that is a Jew, saying, We will go with you: for we have heard [that] God [is] with you.

They will build houses...................[Isa 65:21 KJV] 21 And they shall build houses, and inhabit [them]; and they shall plant vineyards, and eat the fruit of them.

They will have to go to the feast of tabernacles...........[Zec 14:16 KJV] 16 And it shall come to pass, [that] every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Your rejection of Christ's current sovereign rule emanates from a need to support Premil and from a misconception of what Royal rule actually looks like. In trying to justify your doctrine, you strip Jesus of His supreme authority over all things in heaven and on earth.

The fact that Christ is not currently ruling on earth is self-evident and a matter of fact. Anyone can verify the fact for themselves. Anyone with a fourth grade education can watch the news on TV and see that Christ is not currently in charge.

The FACT that Christ is not currently ruling on earth supports the Premillennial view.

You dethrone Christ from His lofty position enthroned on high.

How so? You and I both admit that he is enthroned on high.

You make man and Satan sovereign, doing as they wish, as Christ watches on helplessly and impotently from a powerless position on His throne, incapable of permitting and forbidding man in his devices, when in fact Scriptures teaches the opposite.

The rule of Satan on the Earth has been evident since the Flood. Paul notes this in his epistles to the Romans and Ephesians. In Romans, Paul notes that God has brought his wrath on mankind because, while they knew about God's existence, they did not act as if they knew it. In Ephesians, Paul notes that today, certain people "walk according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience." When Christ begins to rule on Earth during the millennial period, he will dismantle Satan's rule and power.

The Jesus you perceive is helpless to counteract the wicked schemes of demons and men.

What I said does not logically lead to your conclusion.

He is unable of providing and protecting His children.

Again, what I said does not logically lead to that conclusion.

Kingly rule never suggests wholesale submission to the Monarch's will from every subject.

Yes, it does. If you believe this then you need to check the definition of King.

There are rebels that live under the king's sovereign authority.

Of course. The world is filled with sinners and rebels. These are the sons of disobedience as Paul described. The rule of Christ will be different.

 

[CadyandZoe]

You reject that. That is not true!

When did I reject that Jesus is God?

 

[CadyandZoe]

No you have not! Can you tell the truth for once?

Show us what post you addressed them?

If you were paying attention, and I suppose you weren't, I addressed your questions throughout many posts. Today, I posted the answers in a single post.

 

[WPM]

Do you believe that Jesus currently possesses “All power [Gr. exousia or right, privilege and authority] … in heaven and in earth” (Matthew 28:18).
Jesus says he has been granted all authority. He doesn't say that he has "all power."

Do you believe that “All things that the Father hath are” Christ’s (John 16:15).
In this context, the "all things" under review are truths that God intends to communicate to his people through Jesus.

Do you believe that the Father has indeed given Jesus “power over all flesh” (John 17:2)?
The "all flesh" in this context are the people whom God has given to Jesus, who comprise people from all nations, tongues, and peoples.

Do you believe that “All things are delivered” unto Jesus of His “Father” (Matthew 11:27)
The "all things" in this context are all the teachings that Jesus presented to his people.

or that He has “given all things into his (Christ’s) hand” (John 3:35 and John 13:3)?
In this context, the "all things" refer to Jesus' situations and circumstances. God is working everything that happens to Jesus to his benefit.

Do you believe that the Father has given Jesus “authority to execute judgment … because he is the Son of man” (John 5:26-27)?
Yes, God has granted Jesus authority to judge.

Do you believe that Christ “is the head of all principality and power” (Colossians 2:10)?
In this context, Paul discusses the authority of Jesus to discern what is true and what is false regarding God's will. Jesus not only has the authority to dictate what we believe and what we do, all other spiritual teachers and guides must agree with what he teaches.

Do you believe that “angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him” (1 Peter 3:22 says)?
Peter is telling his readers when Jesus sat down at the right hand of the Father. This took place after angels, authorities and powers had been subjected to him.

Do you believe that Christ is indeed "the archon (or ruler) of the kings of the earth" (Revelation 1:5)?
John is saying that Jesus is the chief among the kings of the Earth. He isn't saying that Jesus is currently enforcing his rule over them.

When does Christ reign? After His enemies are subdued or until His enemies are subdued (1 Corinthians 15:25-28)?
Christ will reign during the millennial period, which Paul calls "the end" when God will place all of Jesus enemies under his feet.

1 Corinthians 15:25-28 tells us that Christ “hath put (aorist active indicative) all things under his feet”
On the contrary, Paul is talking about "the end" when Christ will subdue all of God's enemies. John refers to that time period as the Millennium.

Ephesians 1:20-23 tells us that Christ “hath put (aorist active indicative) all things under his feet”
Paul is talking about the status of Jesus, and it that context, the salient issue is Jesus' right to correct the Jewish authorities. This is one of the spiritual blessings that God gave to the Jews first then to the Greeks. Jesus is the ultimate authority on God's will for mankind.

Hebrews 1:8 tells us that “thou hast put all things in subjection’ (aorist active indicative) under his feet.”
Paul applies this verse to Jesus, which predicts that his throne will go on forever and the critical and essential aspect of his throne will be righteousness. Since we know that Jesus will begin to rule when he returns, his throne will be forever from that moment forward.

How could anyone therefore deny He is sovereignly reigning over His enemies now?
If Jesus' earthly reign had already begun, we would both see it and experience it.

How could anyone then relate this fulfilment to an alleged future age after the second coming?
We don't see him enforcing his rule over the Earth, which is why the Bible speaks about that concept in the future tense.

Do you believe that Christ has become "the ruler of God’s creation" (Revelation 3:14)?
The passage you cite is silent on the subject.

Do you believe that Jesus has already "spoiled principalities and powers ... made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it (the cross)" (Colossians 2:15)?
Yes.

Do you believe that Christ currently “openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth" (Revelation 3:7)?
Yes.

You are such a twister of God's truth. That is why you deny the deity of Christ. You are always looking for a chance to denigrate Christ and exalt Satan. To dismiss Christ's sovereign authority over all "creation" and "all things" (everyone and everything) as just "truths that God intends to communicate to his people through Jesus" or "the teachings that Jesus presented to his people" shows how blinkered, blind and deceitful you are. You must do this to sustain your error.

To suggest that God giving “all things into his (Christ’s) hand” (John 3:35 and John 13:3) "refer to Jesus' situations and circumstances. God is working everything that happens to Jesus to his benefit" is a joke. This typifies how you continually butcher God's truth. No Scripture text is safe with you.

He has been given "power over all flesh" which allows Him to "give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him." This does not negate the fact that He has been given "power over all flesh."

To support your Premillennialism you have to deny Christ is currently reigning over His enemies until He subdues them at the second coming (1 Corinthians 15:25-28). You sidestep the present tense because it exposes your nonsense. Scripture shows "the end" to be the second coming. Again, you reject that! You force the Bible to fit your imaginations.

To say that Christ “hath put (aorist active indicative) all things under his feet” relates to "the Jewish authorities" reinforces the deceitful of your approach to Scripture. No Scripture is safe from your heretical approach.

You mock Christ's current kingship, and sovereign authority, saying, "If Jesus' earthly reign had already begun, we would both see it and experience it." The reason you do not see and experience is because you have swallowed the lie of the enemy. Only enlightened people see. It comes by revolution.

If you believe that Christ currently “openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth" (Revelation 3:7), what does that mean to you?

 

[WPM]

When did I reject that Jesus is God?

1. Is “Jesus Christ” our “great God and our Saviour” (Titus 2:13)?
2. Did Jesus admit that He was “the Almighty” (Revelation 1:8)?
3. Is Jesus Christ “Lord God Almighty … King of saints” (Revelation 15:3)?
4. Is Jesus “the express image of his (God’s) person, who is “upholding all things by the word of his power” (Hebrews 1:2-3)?
5. Is it true that within Christ “dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily” (Colossians 2:9)?
6. Is Christ: “the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature” (Colossians 1:15)?
7. Did Jesus testify to the overcomer “I will be his God”?
8. Does 1 John 5:20 that Jesus Christ … is the true God, and eternal life”?
9. Is Jesus called “Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us” (Matthew 1:23)?
10. Is Jesus “the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords; Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting” (1 Timothy 6:15–16)?

 

[WPM]

If you were paying attention, and I suppose you weren't, I addressed your questions throughout many posts. Today, I posted the answers in a single post.

Avoid the request because you are lying.

 

[WPM]

He already had a spiritual kingdom when he left. He went to heaven in order to receive a political kingdom.

Where is your evidence?

The truth stands on its own and does not depend on the majority.

You invented this imaginary term "political kingdom" - in regard to Christ and you want me to show it in Scripture? What are you like?

The burden of proof is with you to show the biblical evidence for this fantasy term.

 

[Doug]

You are clearly not able to understand anything I say for whatever reason, so it's pointless to continue trying to discuss these things with you. Are you aware of what Amillennialists believe? I'm an Amillennialist.

I examined who would enter the kingdom more and would say the saints that survive the tribulation could be in their mortal bodies or they could be raised at the last day..................[Jhn 6:40 KJV] 40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day................the last day is not defined but could be the end of the tribulation and his coming
It does remain that the sheep of Matthew 25 will enter with mortal bodies

Too bad you deny the millennial reign when scripture clearly says he will reign for a thousand years

 

[CadyandZoe]

You are such a twister of God's truth. That is why you deny the deity of Christ. You are always looking for a chance to denigrate Christ and exalt Satan. To dismiss Christ's sovereign authority over all "creation" and "all things" (everyone and everything) as just "truths that God intends to communicate to his people through Jesus" or "the teachings that Jesus presented to his people" shows how blinkered, blind and deceitful you are. You must do this to sustain your error.

Try to be specific in your critique. I can't answer an emotional reaction. This is the danger in looking for single verses of scripture to support an idea. This effort leads to errors and mistakes. The passages you quoted don't say what you want them to say, because you haven't attempted to understand them in their original context.

 

[CadyandZoe]

1. Is “Jesus Christ” our “great God and our Saviour” (Titus 2:13)?
2. Did Jesus admit that He was “the Almighty” (Revelation 1:8)?
3. Is Jesus Christ “Lord God Almighty … King of saints” (Revelation 15:3)?
4. Is Jesus “the express image of his (God’s) person, who is “upholding all things by the word of his power” (Hebrews 1:2-3)?
5. Is it true that within Christ “dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily” (Colossians 2:9)?
6. Is Christ: “the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature” (Colossians 1:15)?
7. Did Jesus testify to the overcomer “I will be his God”?
8. Does 1 John 5:20 that Jesus Christ … is the true God, and eternal life”?
9. Is Jesus called “Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us” (Matthew 1:23)?
10. Is Jesus “the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords; Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting” (1 Timothy 6:15–16)?

Apparently, you didn't learn anything from your previous mistakes. Taking a single verse out of context allows one to make them say what one wants to hear.

 

[CadyandZoe]

Avoid the request because you are lying.

Your emotional response is revealing. Try to discuss the topic with gentle, sweet reasoning as Paul recommended.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Well the sheep in Matthew 25:32 certainly will go in with mortal bodies because they will have children

It says they will inherit "eternal life" at that time (Matt 25:46). How can they die after they have inherited eternal life?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Apparently, you didn't learn anything from your previous mistakes. Taking a single verse out of context allows one to make them say what one wants to hear.

This is what you call answering questions? Is it too hard for you to just answer at least a few of the questions and show how you think he is taking the verse referenced in them out of context?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Your emotional response is revealing. Try to discuss the topic with gentle, sweet reasoning as Paul recommended.

We are doing as Paul recommended by rebuking you with all authority.

Titus 2:13 while we wait for the blessed hope—the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, 14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and to purify for himself a people that are his very own, eager to do what is good. 15 These, then, are the things you should teach. Encourage and rebuke with all authority. Do not let anyone despise you.

 

[CadyandZoe]

You invented this imaginary term "political kingdom" - in regard to Christ and you want me to show it in Scripture? What are you like?

The burden of proof is with you to show the biblical evidence for this fantasy term.

Inventing terms is very common in human communication. I'm sure you're familiar with that, aren't you? I believe you are. And I can't believe you don't know what I mean by a "political kingdom."

A spiritual kingdom is often understood as a realm or domain that transcends the physical world—one governed by spiritual principles rather than earthly power or material wealth.

A spiritual kingdom is not a physical kingdom with borders but rather a spiritual domain where God's will is followed. A political kingdom has borders, and it is a physical kingdom with subjects that obey the king out of respect.

Jesus was the head of a Spiritual kingdom before he left the earth. Paul describes his kingdom as a kingdom of light, populated by "holy ones." In addition, Jesus taught his disciples that he was going away to a far country to receive a kingdom. We discussed the fact that his parable was based on a historical event, when Herod the Great traveled to Rome to receive his kingship from the Roman Senate. In the same manner, Jesus went to heaven to receive a kingdom from his Father.

This event is described in Daniel chapter 7

 

[CadyandZoe]

We are doing as Paul recommended by rebuking you with all authority.

Do you have the authority to tell me what to think?