Wrangler
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Are you sure you aren't being figurative?
Jesus is not God as Jesus literally died. God cannot die. See the literal difference?
Proof that Jesus is God
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Jesus is not God as Jesus literally died. God cannot die. See the literal difference?
Cooper
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I do not know why someone who claims to be a Christian but denies the very foundation of Christianity, is allowed to remain posting their anti-Christ beliefs on a Christian only forum.
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BroRando said: ↑
No but rather Jesus is "the Christ the son of the living God." (Matthew 16:16)
If Jesu was God then Jesus and God would be interchangeable. You could easily insert God for Jesus... Look at the scriptures and see that they are alive and spit out the trinity doctrine.
IF Jesus is God, Can we assume GOD cried out My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?
About the ninth hour, Jesus called out with a loud voice, saying: “Eʹli, Eʹli, laʹma sa·bach·thaʹni?” that is, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” (Matthew 27:46)
Can you not understand that God is Spirit who put on flesh, like a solder puts on a uniform? When on the battlefield in foreign lands, he has a job to do the same as Jesus had, but when at home he is a different person. In reality, he is One even though you wouldn't think so sometimes.
Hello Cooper,
I thought you were a trinitarian? So I am thinking you no longer ascribe to the three separate persons makes up one God theory? It is a study of theology that tends to fail. Look at the following scripture:
For even though there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth, just as there are many “gods” and many “lords,” there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him. (1 Corinthians 8:5-6)
Stay Safe.
No but rather Jesus is "the Christ the son of the living God." (Matthew 16:16)
If Jesu was God then Jesus and God would be interchangeable. You could easily insert God for Jesus... Look at the scriptures and see that they are alive and spit out the trinity doctrine.
IF Jesus is God, Can we assume GOD cried out My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?
About the ninth hour, Jesus called out with a loud voice, saying: “Eʹli, Eʹli, laʹma sa·bach·thaʹni?” that is, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” (Matthew 27:46)
Can you not understand that God is Spirit who put on flesh, like a solder puts on a uniform? When on the battlefield in foreign lands, he has a job to do the same as Jesus had, but when at home he is a different person. In reality, he is One even though you wouldn't think so sometimes.
Hello Cooper,
I thought you were a trinitarian? So I am thinking you no longer ascribe to the three separate persons makes up one God theory? It is a study of theology that tends to fail. Look at the following scripture:
For even though there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth, just as there are many “gods” and many “lords,” there is actually to us one God, the Father, from whom all things are and we for him; and there is one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things are and we through him. (1 Corinthians 8:5-6)
Stay Safe.
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As I read the Cambridge Bible comment I understood it to mean that there was no word 'Lord' in the original Greek manuscript of Hebrews 1:10. It was not saying that there was no word 'Lord' in the LXX - that's the opposite of what it says - so the comment is not relying on the LXX manuscript, it's implying the LXX must be wrong! I don't think any English translation of Psalm 102:25 has the word lord or Yahweh/Jehovah in it, so Paul would/should not have included the word Lord in his quote of it.
Psalm 102:12 says, "But you, Yahweh, will remain forever; your renown endures to all generations". Paul doesn't quote that verse. I see no reason to assume Paul was drawing upon any other verses than what he quoted. Psalm 102:24 says, "I said, “My God, don’t take me away in the middle of my days. Your years are throughout all generations", and verse 25 is a continuation of that prayer to God, so it is referring to God, and Paul is implying that this verse can be applied prophetically to Jesus, but that doesn't mean that Paul is implying that Jesus is God.
Likewise Matthew 4:6 has Satan saying to Jesus, "“If you are the Son of God, throw yourself down, for it is written, ‘He will command his angels concerning you.’ and, ‘On their hands they will bear you up, so that you don’t dash your foot against a stone.’”", which is a quote from Psalm 91:
9) Because you have made Yahweh your refuge, and the Most High your dwelling place,
10) no evil shall happen to you, neither shall any plague come near your dwelling.
11) For he will put his angels in charge of you, to guard you in all your ways.
12) They will bear you up in their hands, so that you won’t dash your foot against a stone.
10) no evil shall happen to you, neither shall any plague come near your dwelling.
11) For he will put his angels in charge of you, to guard you in all your ways.
12) They will bear you up in their hands, so that you won’t dash your foot against a stone.
Psalm 91 is adressed to Israel (and cannot be referring to Yahweh/Jehovah), but Satan realised that Israel was a type of Christ so it also prophetically applied to Jesus, but Satan wasn't implying that Jesus was Israel! Similarly, verses addressed to Yahweh/God can also be prophetically applied to Jesus, but don't mean that Jesus was Yahweh.
In that reply you asked:
God's name (Jehovah/Yahweh) had already been removed, or modified, in the Old Testament manuscripts that the New Testament writers were quoting from. The Israelites had decided they should not pronounce God's name but instead say "adonai", which means 'lord'. Therefore the New Testament writers chose a suitable Greek word to translate the word "adonai", and they used the word kurios, which means lord, master, or sir.
No, I wasn't making a big deal about it not using Jehovah in the Psalm, as I mentioned above. You misunderstod the Cambridge Bible comment. I had also started my reply with "FYI" - For Your Information - so I wasn't making a big deal about it!
Is that why you didn't read it carefully? ;)
A total misunderstanding of Christianity, and the Bible. Christianity and the Bible teaches that humanity died, not divinity. No wonder you are in the error you are in.
Cooper
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All things are from the Father, and all things are through Christ. One God through whom are all things. It is a common mistake to think Trinitarians believe in three gods.
Meditate on my signature.
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Which is true? A or B?
A. Trinitarians claim God died for our sins.
B. Christians claim Christ died for our sins.
For Christ died once for all time for sins, a righteous person for unrighteous ones, in order to lead you to God. He was put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit. (1 Peter 3:18)
Finally Cooper!!! Jesus said: “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.” (John 14:6)
The Word is called Him.
John 1:1-4 (KJV)
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. 4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
Wrangler
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LOL. Another sad trinitarian Appeal to Dualism. Jesus died and that’s how you know he is not God.
Jesus does not even have the authority to decide who sits next to him. See Matthew 20:23. Not all powerful. Not God almighty.
Wrangler
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Oy vey. Not in John 6:60. The word is properly called "this."
Beyond that, the "Him" of the Word is God, not Jesus. John 12:49 I don’t speak on my own authority. The Father who sent me has commanded me what to say and how to say it.
Cooper
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Jesus is more than the way the truth and the life, He is our Saviour (Act 16:31) and, wonder of wonders, He is: Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace. (Isaiah 9:6) While all the time, the omnipresent ONE GOD who humbled himself on earth for our sake.
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Don't you mean trinitarian Bibles that removed God from certain scriptures? Like (Rev 1:8). Trinitarians not only removed God's Name but removed GOD from the passage. Replacing it with LORD because that's what they did.... and that deception did not go far enough so they took LORD and made it into a little Lord. Whoa!
Being Deceptive does not beget Salvation. Purchase Divine Name King James Bible
Read Online I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the LORD (God Jehovah Isa 44:6; Gen 17:1; Exo 6:3 ), which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. (Rev 1:8)
A VERY ignorant comment considering Jesus raised Himself from the dead.
John 10:17-18 (NKJV)
17 Therefore My Father loves Me, because I lay down My life that I may take it again.18 No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again.
No, I mean Kingdom Hall who twists nearly every verse in the Bible to mean something different.
Thomas said you're wrong. He said Jesus is God. I agree with Thomas who knew Jesus personally! Even your NWT says you're WRONG!
Jesus was begotten not omnipresent. (John 3:16) I'll chalk that up to you being a novice...
However, Jehovah’s angel said to him: “Why are you asking about my name, seeing that it is a Wonderful one?” (Judges 13:18)
Judges 13:18 in Hebrew.
Have you ever read the Bible? Stop listening to Kingdom Hall lies!
John 3:13 (NKJV)
13 No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven.
Another trinitarian lie. Thomas never stated Jesus is God. You're misquoting as usual. Look into the Greek in what he said.
In answer Thomas said to him: “The Lord of me and the God of me!” (John 20:28) He doubted that Jesus Christ was resurrected. Also note "No man has seen God at any time;" (John 1:18) He never stated Jesus is God nor shouted You are God which is what trinitarians are trying to twist.
The very same title was given to Moses who many people HAVE SEEN. "And the Lord said to Moses: Behold I have appointed thee the God of Pharao: and Aaron thy brother shall be thy prophet." (Exodus 7:1) Does that make Moses God? The answer is in the negative. Why? "No man has seen God at any time;" (John 1:18)
The Word of God appeared to Moses in the burning bush. Yet the scriptures state that Moses spoke with God face to face. Since "No man has seen God at any time;" (John 1:18) The Word of God is Not God himself but the Chief Messenger of the true God. "Then Jehovah’s angel appeared to him in a flame of fire in the midst of a thornbush. As he kept looking, he saw that the thornbush was on fire, and yet the thornbush was not consumed. (Exodus 3:2)
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Taken
Well-Known Member
Hi Wrangler~
I see your point, but disagree, because of it's carnal understanding.
In Brief~
The word of God is Absolute Truth.
Men in the OT, were given Gods word, to thereafter give to other men.
An issue arose, during men giving other men, Gods word (for other men to "hear".)
The issue is as old as mankind...and continues today..."seeing is believing"...
"hearing is nearly always challenged".
God called men, STIFFNECKED, who were "hearing" the word of God, but complaining, "they wanted to see" God.
Scripture taught over and over, hear the word of God, and wait to see IF what His word said, thereafter Happens. (Comes to pass).
That was mans method to Trust, Gods word be True. Foretelling, Prophecy, revealed in Gods word, and then SEE it come to pass.
Men were still impatient, so God gave a Prophecy, HE would walk among men ON Earth.
THAT ^ was an astounding expectation. God with power, and riches, and an army, and Kingship, and a Kingdom....wow, wow, men anticipated, hoped, waited, watched for...
And WHEN He arrived...uh, not at all what they expected.
No power, no riches, no army, no king, no kingdom....
So WHAT exactly arrived ON Earth, and from exactly WHERE did it come?
Scripture tells us.
* God was IN Heaven.
* Gods word came forth out of Gods mouth.
* God prepared a Body for His word.
* God sent His word in the Body He prepared
TO: a (very particular) virgin womans womb.
* the virgin woman....had not had flesh sexual intercourse; was Jewish; was descended (by flesh seed), from Abraham, Isaac and Jacob; was betrothed according to Jewish Law; the woman's betrothed (Joseph) was descended (by flesh seed), from Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Jacob was also, directly descended from DAVID (ie the House of David).
The importance of David, is he was Gods chosen as the "King of ISRAEL", and seated on a Throne, God established as an "everlasting" Throne.
So - For God Himself to BE the everlasting KING of "Heaven and Earth"... He must LAWFULLY Be "qualified" TO SIT as King of Heaven....no issue. Heaven IS Gods Throne.
And Earth....issue. God is NOT an Earthling.
The only one "legally qualified" to Sit as King OVER ISRAEL...IS a man from one of the Tribes of ISRAEL.
WHEN God prepared a BODY, for His word, and sent His word to the earth, to the virgin womb of a Jewish woman betrothed to a man of the House of David....the moment Gods word came forth from the virgins womb:
* By Jewish Law, By Gentile Law, that Babe, was LAWFULLY....Jewish, of the tribe of Judah,
A Lawful descendant of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, A Lawful descendant of David, ...and fully legally qualified to Sit on king Davids Everlasting Throne; King of Israel.
* You use the "name" Wrangler on this forum.
You chose that name. That name represents you, your word, your thoughts, your speech.
You have a BODY, from which your word comes forth out of you. If you have "other" Names, or titles, that apply to you, your word...It is still ONLY you, and comes forth out from you, while your word "Remains" in you. If you text, or phone another person 10 thousands miles away, (and the other person ONLY Hears you, but does not SEE your body,
it does not CHANGE one iota, that your word, is still you.)
* It is no different with God. His word is God, is Him, is in Him, comes forth out from Him, Remains in Him. God Himself, established a Name for His word, Titles for His Word, Has Sent His word, by Speech, Sound, Visions, a Prepared Body, From Heaven TO Earth, for the express purpose of Earthly men to Hear, and the Body, for men to See face to face.
(Because...for that little "stiffnecked" thingy..
AND for God to Fulfill Prophecy, that a LAWFUL King Shall be seated in king David's Everlasting Earthly throne.
* Additionally, Abraham was promised "LAND". And Abrahams "promised LAND", was also extended TO: Abrahams Faithful "descendants".
* Jesus' fulfillment of "mans Law", Entitles Jesus' to Inherit Abraham's Land.
All pretty amazing, since;
Jesus' fulfilled the Law, to Rightfully and Legallly RULE over ... LAND and A THRONE "on Earth"....for His future Kingdom to be manifested.
God calling His Word Jesus, does not undermine the fact Gods word IS God, any more that you calling your word "Wrangler", undermines the fact, you have multiple names and titles, that are you.
Isa 55:
[11] So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth: it shall not return unto me void, but it shall accomplish that which I please, and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.
John 16:
[27] For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God.
[28] I came forth from the Father, and am come into the world: again, I leave the world, and go to the Father.
Heb 10:
[5] Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:
John 6:
[51] I am the living bread which came down from heaven if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
John 1:
[1] In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
God Bless,
Taken
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