Questions For A Catholic

[Anastacia]

My replies to aspen in blue.

I think you are over reacting to my word "silly" and "game." I do apologize.

Accepted.

Thank you.

I only speak of what the Bible says.

As do I. Selene, you and I have been sharing verses for the past 3 hours.

No, you two have been defending the false doctrines of the Catholic Church.

Why would you possibly stumble when you hear some truth about the Catholic Church?

I am not worried about myself. I am also not worried about hearing truth about the Catholic Church, however - no offense, I haven't heard any from you yet. I've heard you reinterpret what the Church teaches. Again, if you said something like, "Some Catholics worship statues" or it sure looks as if the Catholic Church teaches it's people to worship statues - I couldn't argue with you. But to claim that the Church actually teaches this falsehood - a practice it condemns - is going to lead me to correct you. Let's say I noticed that several people in your church had wildly different understandings of one of Christ's teachings and I decided that your minister teaches private interpretation of the scriptures; this would be a falsehood that needed to be corrected. I would be misleading if I asked "why would you possibly stumble when you hear some truth about the church I attend" because it would not be truth, but a distortion of the truth.

Oh yes you have heard the truth from me about the Catholic Church. I think some Catholics don't know the extent of what their church teaches. I have proven to you what the Catholics teach...you just don't want to admit it.
As far as me worrying about anyone else stumbling, I value a justified and sanctifying relationship with Jesus over doctrinal correctness. So, if I run into a person who has a relationship with Jesus, I am not going to jeopardize their relationship or belief in Christ by ripping out the foundation of the doctrine just because I disagree with parts of it. And I have seen it happen many times - Richard Dawkins does it all the time - he under minds people's faith by destroying their doctrinal foundation simply because he finds it to be silly.

I'm not going to stop talking about God's Truth. Anyone can look up in the Bible to see if what I'm saying is true. In fact, I hope that is what they do.

The Catholic Church isn't Jesus. The Catholic Church didn't die for you.

I will not argue that.
Then you shouldn't worry about someone losing faith in Jesus because they found out they were in the wrong religion.

You keep your faith in Jesus. You want to please the Lord, right? So do what the Bible says, and not what the Catholic Church says.

Here's the problem you do not understand; you are proceeding on the assumption that I am indoctrinated by my church and if I simply opened my eyes by leaving the church, I would see the Bible for what it really is - just like you do. Unfortunately, you have no idea that you are also interpreting the Bible according to the tradition of the people who have taught you hermenutics. You also rely on teachers and concordances and commentaries from your own tradition, which claim to teach you the Bible, plainly. This is not true - but they have taught you to believe it - the fact is, you didn't even know that you are a Protestant until I told you. One of the saddest parts of being a Protestant is not learning church history - they have a great tradition of teaching the Bible, but discount the 1500 years between Christ and Luther.
I'm not a Protestant. So no, you didn't teach me anything there.lol You can call me a Protestant over and over if you like. I have the same beliefs as what Jesus and the apostles taught. And they are before Catholics and the Protestant movement. I know you think you are insulting me by calling me a Protestant.


There are a lot of false teachings of the Catholic Church, one of them is that the Pope is called "Holy Father." "Holy Father" is a name only reserved for God. I have a hard time understanding how anyone can stay in a religion that does such things.

The titles of father and teacher are also condemned in the Bible. Catholics rely on Sacred Tradition and the Bible as authoritative. We do what the early church did as long as it it not contradicted in the Bible. Now, I have not heard the Holy Father title, but I have heard others. The Pope is a man. His office is Holy because it was set up by God. Acceptance of the Pope doesn't define you as a Catholic, nor does it interfere with salvation. Catholics venerate the office of Pope, but they will not be damned if they do not. Hardly any Popes have been considered Saints - it is the office, not the man.
There is no such office as "the Pope" that is a made up man doctrine. And maybe you need to do some more searching on what your religion teaches. The pope is called "Holy Father."

If you desire Jesus, and you find yourself in a religion that is not of the truth, then repent and go on.

Indeed. I did that 10 years ago.

You aren't suppose to loose your faith, but your faith should grow when you accept the truth. The Truth should make you feel closer to God. Please keep the communication going. Okay?

I will - as long as they let us talk. There is no comparison between my prayer life as a Protestant and now as a Catholic - it is sublime. It is body and soul - thought, emotion, and action - it is never ending. It is diverse and personal; dynamic and disciplined......alive.

You were in a false religion before, and now you are in a false relgion called "Catholic." How would you know what is better when you were only in Calvinism and Catholicism?

 

[Selene]

Selene, You misunderstand the scriptures. So why wouldn't you mix up what I said? I was talking to aspen about people not losing their faith when truth about the Catholic religion is revealed.

You say no where in the Catholic teaching does it say that the Pope is the head of the church. The Pope is the head of the Catholic Church. The Catholic Church calls the Pope and the Bishops "the vicar of Christ."

I love talking about God's Truth. I also like exposing false doctrines. The Catholic religion has a lot of them.

You keep trying to defend your type of bowing. Just don't bow to the statues, don't bow any kind of bow. It's not hard to understand. And why are you trying to "respect" a statue?

Again, it is unspiritual to bring up dolls and toy trucks when explaining the commands of God. We don't bow to these things either.

My sister, you misunderstand the term "Vicar of Christ." The term actually means "bishop of Rome." A vicar is a servant who stands in place of the real sovereign in some administrative matters of his kingdom, equivalent titles include "representative" or "overseer". A vicar is not God. Vicar refers to "Bishop of Rome" which in this case is the Pope. It does not mean that the Pope is Jesus Christ. This is why he is called the "Vicar OF Christ." It does not say he is called "Christ." Christ is the Head of the Church. The Pope is the servant (Vicar) appointed by Christ to take care of His entire flock just as He told St. Peter (John 21:16-17). Just as St. Peter was appointed to take care of Christ's entire flock (the Church) so is the Pope. That is his duty...to be Bishop of Rome continuing to do the same work as the Apostle Peter.

The fact that you don't bow to statues is irrelevant because the Bible clearly states "Do not MAKE any likeness on earth."

In Christ,
Selene

 

[Anastacia]

Signing off the computer for the night.
God bless.

My sister, you misunderstand the term "Vicar of Christ." The term actually means "bishop of Rome." A vicar is a servant who stands in place of the real sovereign in some administrative matters of his kingdom, equivalent titles include "representative" or "overseer". A vicar is not God. Vicar refers to "Bishop of Rome" which in this case is the Pope. It does not mean that the Pope is Jesus Christ. This is why he is called the "Vicar OF Christ." It does not say he is called "Christ." Christ is the Head of the Church. The Pope is the servant (Vicar) appointed by Christ to take care of His entire flock just as He told St. Peter (John 21:16-17). Just as St. Peter was appointed to take care of Christ's entire flock (the Church) so is the Pope. That is his duty...to be Bishop of Rome continuing to do the same work as the Apostle Peter.

The fact that you don't bow to statues is irrelevant because the Bible clearly states "Do not MAKE any likeness on earth."

In Christ,
Selene

Catholics have a false doctrine called "Apostolic Succession." There is no such thing, It is man made.

I'm signing off the computer now.

Good night.

 

[Selene]

Exodus 20:4 You shall not MAKE for yourself an idol in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below.

Do you see what it says in just this one verse? It says "Do not MAKE any form of anything on the earth." If you are going to judge us of committing idoltry simply because of "bowing" you should also judge yourself of the same thing because you made images of your loved ones and kept them with you. The fact that you don't bow to those images is irrelevant because the Bible DID say not to MAKE any form of anything on earth. Why do defend this part by making the excuse that you don't bow to it?

 

[Selene]

Signing off the computer for the night.
God bless.






Catholics have a false doctrine called "Apostolic Succession." There is no such thing, It is man made.

I'm signing off the computer now.

Good night.

I see....so now that you know that "Vicar OF Christ" refers to as the Bishop of Rome rather than as Christ, you now move on to the next topic, which is "apostolic succession?" And how quick you are to judge our faith as false? Do you see me judging your faith as false, my sister? Why do you constantly keep going off-topic? Let us stick to this one topic in this thread so we don't keep going off-track. The topic under this thread is mainly about the statues and the first commandment of God.

You ignored Exodus 20:4 which states "not to MAKE any likeness on earth." What do you have to say about this in regards to the images of your loved ones in your home? Did you not take pictures of your spouse and children and have them displayed in your home? Good night and God bless!

In Christ,
Selene

 

[aspen]

No, you two have been defending the false doctrines of the Catholic Church.


And we have been providing scripture

Oh yes you have heard the truth from me about the Catholic Church. I think some Catholics don't know the extent of what their church teaches. I have proven to you what the Catholics teach...you just don't want to admit it.
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[font="tahoma][color="#8B0000"]Anastacia - I didn't want to become Catholic. I was working successfully (although not spiritually satisfied) in a Protestant Church - I had to change my whole focus in life. It was not easy and I spent 2 years trying to agrue my way out of it - I really struggled with my misconceptions of Catholic doctrine - believe me. I left no stone unturned.[/color]
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I'm not going to stop talking about God's Truth. Anyone can look up in the Bible to see if what I'm saying is true. In fact, I hope that is what they do.


The Bible is a great source of truth. No one is asking you to stop talking about God's truth.


Then you shouldn't worry about someone losing faith in Jesus because they found out they were in the wrong religion.


I totally disagree with that. Faith is from God - doctrinal understanding is extra. Yet, destroying someone's doctrine - especially a person in a Protestant or postProtestant religion is very damaging. We think we are doing Mormons a favor by pantsing their doctrine and exposing it for what it is.....most Mormons become atheists.....they do not convert - their faith is shattered.

I'm not a Protestant. So no, you didn't teach me anything there.lol You can call me a Protestant over and over if you like. I have the same beliefs as what Jesus and the apostles taught. And they are before Catholics and the Protestant movement. I know you think you are insulting me by calling me a Protestant.


Protestant is not a bad word - I have many Protestant brothers and sisters in Christ. Once again, anyone who accepts the teaching of sola scriptura is a Protestant. I think a lot of people claim to have the same beliefs as the early church........

There is no such office as "the Pope" that is a made up man doctrine. And maybe you need to do some more searching on what your religion teaches. The pope is called "Holy Father."


Protestants attacked the Office of Pope during the Reformation because it stood in the way of their own legitimacy - they had to dismantle the Office of Pope and exalt the teachings of sola scriptura or they would have had no authority.

 

[Thankful 1]

As some of you know, I am a member of the Roman Catholic Church. This fact has not always been so; I was raised as a Calvinist in a conservative Presbyterian Church. I graduated from a Presbyterian College and went on to be a youth director in a Presbyterian Church (USA). The liberalness of the church I worked for was enough to encourage me to look for depth and meaning elsewhere. I soon began reading Philip Yancey and Thomas Merton and began moving towards the Catholic church - I was so intrigued that I wished it was Christian. A few years later, I was working at the church and going to graduate school when I met an educated Catholic; she help me realize that I was in disagreement with a Catholic tradition of my own design, rather than the Roman Catholic Church. After two more years of investigation, I joined RCIA and became a member of the church; that was ten years ago. Two years after joining the church, I joined a Benedictine monastery as a third order Benedictine oblate.

After talking with the admin of this site, I have decided to open up a thread for purposes of dialog between Protestants and myself. Here are some ideas associated with the purpose of this thread:

1. I am not trying to make anyone Catholic. I believe anyone who repents of their sins and believes Jesus Christ died for their sins is a Christian.
2. This is not a search engine for Catholic dogma. I will answer questions based on my understanding of Catholicism and the Bible - if you want to learn Catholic dogma you can refer to the online Catholic Catechism or a good Bible resource site for more knowledge on the scriptures.
3. I may agree with you - it does not mean that you have waged war on the Roman Catholic Church and won - it means that I agree with your assessment of scripture.
4. If you are unclear about my basic beliefs please refer to my post in the welcome section of the site.

Here are a few things to expect from me in relation to this thread:

1. I will answer the questions I want to answer and ignore the ones I want to ignore.
2. If I do not have an answer I will tell you. I will also let you know when I am finish with a discussion we are having - my answer may not satisfy you - tough.
3. Because I am not a professional apologist, I may not have time to give you and answer so I might suggest another source
4. I am sensitive to ad hominen language and will probably ignore any comments or questions I view as personally abusive.
5. I will not discuss the Eucharist (too sacred) or Eschatology ( too vague and open to too much anti-catholic bias - the RC is the Beast power, ect)
6. Finally, I will not respond to posts referring to me as a "Papist, "Romanist", or a follower of 'the great whore' (john hagee).

Hopefully, we can have a good discussion. I believe we share more common ground as Christians than disagreements; if you doubt this, we can at least agree that we both believe the other persons does not truly understand Roman Catholicism! If this thread becomes divisive I trust that admin will close it down.

Peace

Aspen, I was called by Jesus to give a word to his people. I am not in a fight per say, with any denomination. My walk has been for over thirty years now, and is way to long to share on a post.



When I accepted Jesus call, my first question to him was what seminary to attend. I was a Catholic, married to a young wife, with three Children, the third one born blind that Jesus had just healed. My thinking at the time was that Jesus wanted me to be a priest. I did not know how that could be, even though I knew there are married priest in the Catholic Church. Jesus answered my question by telling me: “NO! Don’t read about me. I will teach you about me.”



Jesus started teaching me, and I soon saw that the Church was not teaching the whole truth. This upset me greatly. I was wondering how to stay submitted to the Church, and still do what Jesus wanted me to do. Asking Jesus, he told me to cooperate with, don’t fight. Jesus then relieved me of the Churches headship.



There was a time when I was angry with the Christian Church, because of its failure to teach and live the whole Word of God. After a while I saw that it was not the fault of the people in the Church today. People have been learning about God from people, for so long now, that there is very little acceptance of one who has been taught by God.



My threads and post are about what Jesus has personally taught me. Everything is scriptural, but scripture, not understood the way man has chosen to understand scripture.





I would be happy to share an outline of my story, if you would care to e-mail me.



Yours in Christ,

Bob

 

[aspen]

Aspen, I was called by Jesus to give a word to his people. I am not in a fight per say, with any denomination. My walk has been for over thirty years now, and is way to long to share on a post.



When I accepted Jesus call, my first question to him was what seminary to attend. I was a Catholic, married to a young wife, with three Children, the third one born blind that Jesus had just healed. My thinking at the time was that Jesus wanted me to be a priest. I did not know how that could be, even though I knew there are married priest in the Catholic Church. Jesus answered my question by telling me: “NO! Don’t read about me. I will teach you about me.”



Jesus started teaching me, and I soon saw that the Church was not teaching the whole truth. This upset me greatly. I was wondering how to stay submitted to the Church, and still do what Jesus wanted me to do. Asking Jesus, he told me to cooperate with, don’t fight. Jesus then relieved me of the Churches headship.



There was a time when I was angry with the Christian Church, because of its failure to teach and live the whole Word of God. After a while I saw that it was not the fault of the people in the Church today. People have been learning about God from people, for so long now, that there is very little acceptance of one who has been taught by God.



My threads and post are about what Jesus has personally taught me. Everything is scriptural, but scripture, not understood the way man has chosen to understand scripture.





I would be happy to share an outline of my story, if you would care to e-mail me.



Yours in Christ,

Bob

Hi Bob,

Did you have a question for me?

Peace

 

[Thankful 1]

Hi Bob,

Did you have a question for me?

Peace

Aspen, I haven’t any questions of you about the Catholic Church. I may know as much about the Church as you do. I taught adult information classes for a number of years.



I would remind you of what John said.



(1 John 3:8) “He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work”



Also it may do you wonders to ask Jesus about the following verse.



(Acts 5:1-11) “There was another man, however, called Ananias. He and his wife, Sapphira, agreed to sell a property; but with his wife’s connivance he kept back part of the proceeds, and brought the rest and presented it to the apostles. Ananias, Peter said ‘now can Satan have so possessed you that you should lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the money from the land? While you still owned the land, wasn’t it yours to keep, and after you had sold it wasn’t the money yours to do with as you liked? What put this scheme into your mind? It is not to men that you have lied, but to God. When he heard this Ananias fell down dead. This made a profound impression on everyone present. The younger men got up, wrapped the body in a sheet, carried it out and buried it.



About three hours later his wife came in, not knowing what had taken place. Peter challenged her, ‘Tell me was this the price you sold the land for? ‘Yes,’ she said ‘that was the price.’ Peter then said, ‘So you and your husband have agreed to put the Spirit of the Lord to the test! What made you do it? You hear those footsteps? They have just been to bury your husband; they will carry you out, too.’ Instantly she dropped dead at his feet. When the young men came in they found she was dead, and they carried her out and buried her by the side of her husband. This made a profound impression on the whole Church and on all who heard it.”

 

[aspen]

Aspen, I haven’t any questions of you about the Catholic Church. I may know as much about the Church as you do. I taught adult information classes for a number of years.



I would remind you of what John said.



(1 John 3:8) “He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work”



Also it may do you wonders to ask Jesus about the following verse.



(Acts 5:1-11) “There was another man, however, called Ananias. He and his wife, Sapphira, agreed to sell a property; but with his wife’s connivance he kept back part of the proceeds, and brought the rest and presented it to the apostles. Ananias, Peter said ‘now can Satan have so possessed you that you should lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the money from the land? While you still owned the land, wasn’t it yours to keep, and after you had sold it wasn’t the money yours to do with as you liked? What put this scheme into your mind? It is not to men that you have lied, but to God. When he heard this Ananias fell down dead. This made a profound impression on everyone present. The younger men got up, wrapped the body in a sheet, carried it out and buried it.



About three hours later his wife came in, not knowing what had taken place. Peter challenged her, ‘Tell me was this the price you sold the land for? ‘Yes,’ she said ‘that was the price.’ Peter then said, ‘So you and your husband have agreed to put the Spirit of the Lord to the test! What made you do it? You hear those footsteps? They have just been to bury your husband; they will carry you out, too.’ Instantly she dropped dead at his feet. When the young men came in they found she was dead, and they carried her out and buried her by the side of her husband. This made a profound impression on the whole Church and on all who heard it.”

So you just decided to comment in order to let me know that I am in the wrong church? I realize that many people here believe that Catholics are not Christian, Bob - it is plain to see. This thread was started in order for people to ask questions and get answers from a Catholic perspective - and because according to Bud02, "I think I've said before a faith unworthy of mention for fear of reprisals is surly not worth mention or knowing", right Bud?


It looks like you have a good heart, Bob - if you would like to have a discussion, I welcome it - but if you are simply wanting to share the reason why you left a false church for a relationship with Jesus - I got your point.

 

[Thankful 1]

So you just decided to comment in order to let me know that I am in the wrong church? I realize that many people here believe that Catholics are not Christian, Bob - it is plain to see. This thread was started in order for people to ask questions and get answers from a Catholic perspective - and because according to Bud02, "[font="tahoma]I think I've said before a faith unworthy of mention for fear of reprisals is surly not worth mention or knowing", right Bud?[/font][/color][/size]
[font="tahoma] [/font]
[font="tahoma][size="3"]It looks like you have a good heart, Bob - if you would like to have a discussion, I welcome it - but if you are simply wanting to share the reason why you left a false church for a relationship with Jesus - I got your point.[/font]

Aspen, personally I believe that of the organized churches the Catholic/Orthodox Church is as close tobeing the true church as there is.



For me personally I believethat true Church of God are those people who hear the Word of God, and livethat Word.



(Matthew7:21-23) “It is not those who say to me, ‘Lord, Lord’, who will enter the kingdom of Heaven but the person who does the will of My Father in Heaven. When the day comes many will say to me,‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name,work many miracles in your name?’ ThenI shall tell them to their faces: I have never known you; away from me, youevil men!”





I am not into promoting ordemoting any Christian Church. Now some churches teaching are beyond belief, but my job is just to give a word. I am not expected to convince anyone of anything.



What I believe Jesus expectsfrom what I share, is for people to stop listening to man’s teaching about God,and develop a true relationship with Jesus. Then people will let God teach him or her about God.



(1 Corinthians 2:10-16) “Theseare the very things that God has revealed to us through the Spirit, for theSpirit reaches the depts. Of everything, even the depths of God. After all, the depths of a man can only beknown by his own spirit, not by any other man, and in the same way the depthsof God can only be known by the Spirit of God. Now instead of the spirit of theworld, we have received the Spirit that comes from God, to teach us tounderstand the gifts that he has given us. Therefore we teach, not in the way in which philosophy is taught, but inthe way that the Spirit teaches us: we teach spiritual things spiritually. A spiritual man, on the other hand, is able to judge the value ofeverything and his own value in not to be judged by other men. As scripture says;’ who canknow the mind of the Lord, so who can teach him?’ But we are those who have the mind of Christ.”

 

[aspen]

Aspen, personally I believe that of the organized churches the Catholic/Orthodox Church is as close tobeing the true church as there is.



For me personally I believethat true Church of God are those people who hear the Word of God, and livethat Word.



(Matthew7:21-23) “It is not those who say to me, ‘Lord, Lord’, who will enter the kingdom of Heaven but the person who does the will of My Father in Heaven. When the day comes many will say to me,‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, cast out demons in your name,work many miracles in your name?’ ThenI shall tell them to their faces: I have never known you; away from me, youevil men!”





I am not into promoting ordemoting any Christian Church. Now some churches teaching are beyond belief, but my job is just to give a word. I am not expected to convince anyone of anything.



What I believe Jesus expectsfrom what I share, is for people to stop listening to man’s teaching about God,and develop a true relationship with Jesus. Then people will let God teach him or her about God.



(1 Corinthians 2:10-16) “Theseare the very things that God has revealed to us through the Spirit, for theSpirit reaches the depts. Of everything, even the depths of God. After all, the depths of a man can only beknown by his own spirit, not by any other man, and in the same way the depthsof God can only be known by the Spirit of God. Now instead of the spirit of theworld, we have received the Spirit that comes from God, to teach us tounderstand the gifts that he has given us. Therefore we teach, not in the way in which philosophy is taught, but inthe way that the Spirit teaches us: we teach spiritual things spiritually. A spiritual man, on the other hand, is able to judge the value ofeverything and his own value in not to be judged by other men. As scripture says;’ who canknow the mind of the Lord, so who can teach him?’ But we are those who have the mind of Christ.”

Here is the problem - you are assuming that because I am a Catholic Christian, I do not have a true relationship with Christ. You are mistaken. Please refer to my welcome thread to see my beliefs outlined.

 

[Thankful 1]

Here is the problem - you are assuming that because I am a Catholic Christian, I do not have a true relationship with Christ. You are mistaken. Please refer to my welcome thread to see my beliefs outlined.

Aspen, you may be right in thatI may have made some assumptions. Assumptions can be and often are wrong.



I don’t know your relationshipwith God. What I do know is that youpersonally disagreed with me about sin.



Because you don’t see sin the way Jesus has taught me, I push the idea to a point, that may make people doubt his or her teaching about sin. I have found that often people will not go to Jesus about teachings in which they have not been challenged.



Jesus has personally taught memany things that go against the Christian Churches teachings. So when I meet someone who says he or she has a personal relationship with Jesus, I wonder how he or she can still believe as the Church teaches.



Jesus personally told me thatwe were not to hurt/harm anyone for any reason. The Early Church also taught that very same thing.



Jesus personally sat next to meand had me open the bible to scripture that tells us that Christians are dead to sin. Jesus also explained those scriptures to me. Jesus also explained how it was possible for one to live sinless.



Jesus has shown me spirituality that none of the people I know of or have met, have shared.



Jesus has taught me that one should not store up for one’s future. He has taught me that we are not to have possessions.



Jesus even taught me that it isdangerous to be called father, or to call another man here on earth his or herfather.



Now I know the CatholicChurches teachings, and its teaching do not agree with what Jesus has taughtme. Because of that when one says he orshe is Catholic, I assume they are following in the Churches teachings. Then I wonder how if Jesus is personally teaching him or her, they can co-exist with the Church?



By the way the Holy Spirit alsotold me that the Eucharist is truly the Body and Blood of Jesus.



Jesus has personally told me heis God, and also that the Bible is the written Word of God.



Love,

Bob

 

[bud02]

(Acts 5:1-11) “There was another man, however, called Ananias. He and his wife, Sapphira, agreed to sell a property; but with his wife’s connivance he kept back part of the proceeds, and brought the rest and presented it to the apostles. Ananias, Peter said ‘now can Satan have so possessed you that you should lie to the Holy Spirit and keep back part of the money from the land? While you still owned the land, wasn’t it yours to keep, and after you had sold it wasn’t the money yours to do with as you liked? What put this scheme into your mind? It is not to men that you have lied, but to God. When he heard this Ananias fell down dead. This made a profound impression on everyone present. The younger men got up, wrapped the body in a sheet, carried it out and buried it.



About three hours later his wife came in, not knowing what had taken place. Peter challenged her, ‘Tell me was this the price you sold the land for? ‘Yes,’ she said ‘that was the price.’ Peter then said, ‘So you and your husband have agreed to put the Spirit of the Lord to the test! What made you do it? You hear those footsteps? They have just been to bury your husband; they will carry you out, too.’ Instantly she dropped dead at his feet. When the young men came in they found she was dead, and they carried her out and buried her by the side of her husband. This made a profound impression on the whole Church and on all who heard it.”

The price Ananias asked was the truth in your heart you now hold, that the RCC is the message of salvation.
You come before the elect presuming to add to the body of Christ by sharing the price of salvation you have received, but you have lied to the Holy Spirit holding back the true price you have received from the RCC.

You all come here and nod your heads thats yes thats how salvation is found. Now it may in the form of works of some kind or another but you ALL distinctly leave out all the other requirements that must be met buy your church. Your church teaches that those out side the catholic faith are not in a state of salvation. So any statement from any true Catholics speaking of salvation but failing to mention the requirements of their churches faith is what?

The reason for the question should be obvious, how do you divide the word of God?
You have answered that question, He, therefore, is orthodox, whose faith coincides with the teachings of the Catholic Church.
Now you and I both know you don't teach the catholic doctrine openly.

As I pointed out above I want an honest dialog that represents your belief. You hide behind this rule to avoid professing your faith.

Sell your land Aspen and join the elect, the price has already been paid. All thats left is for you to sell all that you own, and follow Jesus.

 

[Templar81]

Aspen!

I sw this thread for the first time today. It's very interesting and I hope it is of use to people debunking some of the misconceptions people ahve about Catholics.

What do you do as an oblate? I presume you are not cloistered.

 

[aspen]

The price Ananias asked was the truth in your heart you now hold, that the RCC is the message of salvation.
You come before the elect presuming to add to the body of Christ by sharing the price of salvation you have received, but you have lied to the Holy Spirit holding back the true price you have received from the RCC.Sell your land Aspen and join the elect, the price has already been paid. All thats left is for you to sell all that you own, and follow Jesus.

Did you have a question, Bud?

 

[bud02]

Did you have a question, Bud?

http://www.christianityboard.com/topic/12962-questions-for-a-catholic/page__view__findpost__p__92935

 

[aspen]

Aspen!

I sw this thread for the first time today. It's very interesting and I hope it is of use to people debunking some of the misconceptions people ahve about Catholics.

What do you do as an oblate? I presume you are not cloistered.

Thanks Templar - I hope so too



Oblates are third order monastics - my wife is Franciscan. We are committed to serving our Franciscan parish and my monastery - we serve the poor in our city - we pray the Liturgy of the Hours and lead a contemplation group. It has really been an exciting calling for both of us. I am pretty sure Anglicans have Benedictine monasteries and you could look into getting involved. Actually, you do not need to be Catholic to be Benedictine.


Peace

 

[Anastacia]

My sister, you misunderstand the term "Vicar of Christ." The term actually means "bishop of Rome." A vicar is a servant who stands in place of the real sovereign in some administrative matters of his kingdom, equivalent titles include "representative" or "overseer". A vicar is not God. Vicar refers to "Bishop of Rome" which in this case is the Pope. It does not mean that the Pope is Jesus Christ. This is why he is called the "Vicar OF Christ." It does not say he is called "Christ." Christ is the Head of the Church. The Pope is the servant (Vicar) appointed by Christ to take care of His entire flock just as He told St. Peter (John 21:16-17). Just as St. Peter was appointed to take care of Christ's entire flock (the Church) so is the Pope. That is his duty...to be Bishop of Rome continuing to do the same work as the Apostle Peter.

The fact that you don't bow to statues is irrelevant because the Bible clearly states "Do not MAKE any likeness on earth."

In Christ,
Selene

I do not misunderstand the title "vicar of Christ." Don't you know "Pope" means "Father"? This goes against the commands of Jesus. Not only is the Pope called "Father," but he is also called "Holy Father." Jesus called God "Holy Father." Holy Father is a name only to be used to God in heaven!

Here is the meaning of vicar.

From dictionary.net

Vicar \Vic"ar\ (v[i^]k"[~e]r), n. [OE. vicar, viker, vicair, F. vicaire, fr. L. vicarius. See Vicarious.]

1. One deputed or authorized to perform the functions of another; a substitute in office; a deputy. [R.]

[1913 Webster]


The Catholic Pope is not a vicar of Christ. Jesus did not leave us as orphans....believers are given the Holy Spirit.


Why do you act as if it s completely normal to exalt a man? Why does it not cut you to the heart to hear a man called "Holy Father"?

 

[aspen]

I do not misunderstand the title "vicar of Christ." Don't you know "Pope" means "Father"? This goes agains the commands of Jesus. Not only is the Pope called "Father," but he is also called "Holy Father." Jesus called God "Holy Father." Holy Father is a name only to be used to God in heaven!

Here is the meaning of vicar.

From dictionary.net

Vicar \Vic"ar\ (v[i^]k"[~e]r), n. [OE. vicar, viker, vicair, F. vicaire, fr. L. vicarius. See Vicarious.]

1. One deputed or authorized to perform the functions of another; a substitute in office; a deputy. [R.]

[1913 Webster]


The Catholic Pope is not a vicar of Christ. Jesus did not leave us as orphans....believers are given the Holy Spirit.


Why do you act as if it s completely normal to exalt a man? Why does it not cut you to the heart to hear a man called "Holy Father"?

Here is the answer, once again Anastacia

Catholics call the pope "Holy Father" not as an acknowledgement of his personal state of soul but as an expression of respect for his office as successor to Peter and head of the Church on earth. His is a holy office.
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[font="arial]I am sorry if it is not satisfying - it is the answer.[/font]
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[font="arial]Peace
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