Questions For A Catholic

[aspen]

All YOUR "early church fathers" writings are not in the Bible.

Heres the problem:

You claim to follow the same church as the early Christians, but you dismiss the teachings of the early church theologians. You cannot have it both ways.
And, according to your explanation, Jesus really meant: Do not call anyone on earth Father, unless they really are worthy to be called that. Jesus told his disciples not to call anyone on earth Father----that they were "brothers"!

So do you call your father, brother?

The Catholic parishioners not only call their priests "Father," the priests call each other "Father"! Again, Jesus says they are "brothers."

Luke 11:11
“Which of you fathers, if your son asks for a fish, will give him a snake instead?

Luke 14:26
“If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters—yes, even their own life—such a person cannot be my disciple.

So is Jesus sinning by calling them fathers rather than brother?

[sup]Acts 7[/sup]
[sup]2[/sup] To this he replied: “Brothers and fathers, listen to me! The God of glory appeared to our father Abraham while he was still in Mesopotamia, before he lived in Harran. [sup]3[/sup] ‘Leave your country and your people,’ God said, ‘and go to the land I will show you.’[sup][a][/sup]


[sup][/sup]Is Stephen sinning?

I guess you think man's commands and rules are better than Jesus'?

Do you really believe this statement?

 

[TexUs]

My questions.

Worship.
Luke 22:19, is done in remembrance of someone. Are you not remembering Mary or any of the other saints?
Strong's has worship being translated as bow, obedience, reverence, fall down, stoop, crouch. Are not people that bow before a statue of Mary participating in worship to an idol (Lev 26:1)?
I believe you'd state the idol you bow down to as needing to be "alive" or "more than an image" but every single time I read references to idols, the people worshiping them made no such distinction. The Idol to an Unknown God wasn't even an image to anything and yet it was condemned?
2 Chron 33:7, pretty well speaks against putting images of anything in the house of God, how do you reconcile this?

Prayer to Saints
1 Timothy 2:5, only one mediator between God and man, so I ask, even if this is innocent, what's the point?
Why do you not pray to, say... Judas? Romans 2 tells us there's no favoritism among sinners and in other letters we obviously know that all are evil, unclean sinners.
The only time I see Biblically where a saint is spoken to (Samuel) it seems he was rather mad about the whole deal and was not in God's favor during this time. I also see any other time when speaking with the dead is mentioned, it is always condemned as witchcraft, etc?
Hebrews 4:6, are there two thrones to be approached? I guess this ties to my first question of what's the point?

The Saints Attributes
This ties to above... What makes Mary more special? Indeed it'd seem you'd have to add to what the Bible tells us about Mary so how do you take 1 Cor 4:6 about not adding to Scripture?

You
Where do you draw the line between "tradition" and "written" in accountability to the Roman Catholic Church? You cannot deny the practice, as stated in an earlier post (I haven't read them all) of a Father not marrying... Nor the reasoning behind the Papacy. So when do you draw the line and stand up and say, "Yes, this represents what Roman Catholics do!" and "No, that should be condemned". And at what point do the things that need to be condemned amount to enough to denounce the work of the RCC?

 

[Thankful 1]

Here is the problem:

1. We all call our dads, father (who is sent up as the spiritual head of the household).
2. We all take pictures of our love ones - creating images of people who will or already are in heaven.

So, does that mean we are all sinning? Or that God may have meant something more subtle when He warned us against using these terms?
I believe the warning against calling people father or teacher is a warning against assigning authority to people who are not worthy. It is sort of like a good parent warning a child not to join a cult when they go off to college, or to not drop out of school completely to go follow the grateful dead around the country.

Here are three early church fathers that believed in Apostolic succession:

Clement of Rome​

Our Apostles knew through our Lord Jesus Christ that there would be strife for the office of bishop. For this reason, therefore, having received perfect foreknowledge, they appointed those who have already been mentioned, and afterwards added the further provision that, if they should die, other approved men should succeed to their ministry (Letter to the Corinthians 44:1 [A.D. 95]).​

Ignatius of Antioch​

You must all follow the bishop as Jesus Christ follows the Father, and the presbytery as you would the Apostles. Reverence the deacons as you would the command of God. Let no one do anything of concern to the Church without the bishop. Let that be considered a valid Eucharist which is celebrated by the bishop, or by one whom he appoints. Wherever the bishop appears, let the people be there; just as wherever Jesus Christ is, there is the Catholic Church (Letter to the Smyrnaeans 8:1 [A.D. 110]).​

Irenaeus​

It is possible, then, for everyone in every Church, who may wish to know the truth, to contemplate the tradition of the Apostles which has been made known throughout the whole world. And we are in a position to enumerate those who were instituted bishops by the Apostles, and their successors to our own times: men who neither knew nor taught anything like these heretics rave about. For if the Apostles had known hidden mysteries which they taught to the elite secretly and apart from the rest, they would have handed them down especially to those very ones to whom they were committing the self-same Churches. For surely they wished all those and their successors to be perfect and without reproach, to whom they handed on their authority (Against Heresies 3:3:1 [A.D. 180-199]).​

Now, before you dismiss these early leaders of the church because they are not found in scripture, remember you claim that you follow the same practices as the early church. These men taught in the early church.​

You can believe anything youwant to believe, but the fact is Jesus said: (Matthew23:8-9) “You, however must not allow yourselves to be called Rabbi, since youhave only one Master, and you are all brothers. You must call no one on earth your father, since you have only one Father, andhe is in heaven.”



Jesus told us we were all brothers, No onebetter then another. Calling one’sparent father is only describing a physical relationship. He is one’s physical father. My earthly father was not my spiritualfather. And no priest was my spiritualfather. Jesus is my spiritual father, alongwith the Holy Spirit, and my Heavenly father.



Jesus personally told me it is dangerous tocall another man father and to be called father.



Even if Jesus had not told me the written Word of God did tell me, and why can’t people just do as they are told?

Remember tradition cannot contradict the written Word of God. If the Holy Spirit had wanted an early tradition to be obeyed, he would have had it included in the written Word of God.

 

[aspen]

You can believe anything youwant to believe, but the fact is Jesus said: (Matthew23:8-9) “You, however must not allow yourselves to be called Rabbi, since youhave only one Master, and you are all brothers. You must call no one on earth your father, since you have only one Father, andhe is in heaven.”


Yet, our earthly fathers are supposed to be the head of the household and our spiritual leaders in the home.

Jesus told us we were all brothers, No onebetter then another. Calling one’sparent father is only describing a physical relationship. He is one’s physical father. My earthly father was not my spiritualfather. And no priest was my spiritualfather. Jesus is my spiritual father, alongwith the Holy Spirit, and my Heavenly father.


It is funny watching people explain away there behaviors as if they are 'nothing' and 'obviously common sense!', but condemning the same behaviors in others. Your earthly father is the spiritual head of your home - he is going to be answerable to God for raising you and you call him father.


What about Paul in 1 Timothy 5:1


Do not rebuke an older man harshly, but exhort him as if he were your father. Treat younger men as brothers,


And Galatians 1:14


I was advancing in Judaism beyond many of my own age among my people and was extremely zealous for the traditions of my fathers.


And Romans 4:16

Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham’s offspring—not only to those who are of the law but also to those who have the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.



Or James: James 2:21


Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar?


Jesus personally told me it is dangerous tocall another man father and to be called father.


Sure is - if they are not providing you with Christian leadership

Even if Jesus had not told me the written Word of God did tell me, andwhy can’t people just do as they are told?


Seriously?!? I never thought I would hear a Protestant telling a Catholic that they wished people would do what they were told - hilarious!! Look, this issue was targeted by people who wanted to target differences between Catholics and Protestants - it is not argued by professional apologists because they no it has not real merit. If you were really interested in doing what you are told you would imitate a 1st century jewish or Greek convert.

 

[aspen]

 

[truthquest]

I have a question. Do Catholics believe that the Catholic Church is the only true church?

 

[Thankful 1]

You can believe anything youwant to believe, but the fact is Jesus said: (Matthew23:8-9) “You, however must not allow yourselves to be called Rabbi, since youhave only one Master, and you are all brothers. You must call no one on earth your father, since you have only one Father, andhe is in heaven.”

Yet, our earthly fathers are supposed to be the head of the household and our spiritual leaders in the home.

Jesus told us we were all brothers, No onebetter then another. Calling one’sparent father is only describing a physical relationship. He is one’s physical father. My earthly father was not my spiritualfather. And no priest was my spiritualfather. Jesus is my spiritual father, alongwith the Holy Spirit, and my Heavenly father.

It is funny watching people explain away there behaviors as if they are 'nothing' and 'obviously common sense!', but condemning the same behaviors in others. Your earthly father is the spiritual head of your home - he is going to be answerable to God for raising you and you call him father.

What about Paul in 1 Timothy 5:1

Do not rebuke an older man harshly, but exhort him as if he were your father. Treat younger men as brothers,

And [font="Verdana][b][url="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Galatians+1:14&version=NIV"]Galatians 1:14[/url][/b][/font]
[font="Verdana]
[/font][/color][/color][/size][/font]
[font="Arial"][font="Verdana]I was advancing in Judaism beyond many of my own age among my people and was extremely zealous for the traditions of my [b]father[/b]s.[/font][/color][/size][/font]
[font="Arial"]
[font="Verdana][size="2"]And Romans 4:16[/font]
[font="Verdana][size="2"] Therefore, the promise comes by faith, so that it may be by grace and may be guaranteed to all Abraham’s offspring—not only to those who are of the law but also to those who have the faith of Abraham. He is the father of us all.[/font]

[font="Verdana]
[/font][/color][/size]
[size="3"] [font="Verdana]Or James: [b] [url="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=James+2:21&version=NIV"]James 2:21[/url][/b][/font][font="Verdana][size="3"]
[font="Verdana]
[/font]
[font="Verdana][color="#000080"]Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar?
[/font][/size][/font]

Jesus personally told me it is dangerous tocall another man father and to be called father.


Sure is - if they are not providing you with Christian leadership

Even if Jesus had not told me the written Word of God did tell me, andwhy can’t people just do as they are told?


Seriously?!? I never thought I would hear a Protestant telling a Catholic that they wished people would do what they were told - hilarious!! Look, this issue was targeted by people who wanted to target differences between Catholics and Protestants - it is not argued by professional apologists because they no it has not real merit. If you were really interested in doing what you are told you would imitate a 1st century jewish or Greek convert.

First I am not a protestant. I do not believe in anyman’s theology. I only believe whatJesus has personally taught me. I donot believe in any protestant church. They have more wrong then the Catholics, in my opinion. You really should take seriously what Paul said about anyone preaching a different Gospel then what he taught.



You would also do well if instead of making fun, try to answer some of my points.





(Galatians 1:7-9) “Not that there can be more than one Good News;it is merely that some troublemakers among you want to change the Good News ofChrist; and let me warn you that if anyone preaches a version of the Good Newsdifferent from the one we have already preached to you, whether it by ourselvesor an angel from heaven, he is to be condemned. I am only repeating what we told you before; if anyone preaches aversion of the Good News different from the one you have already heard, he isto be condemned.”



For starters the Catholic Church not longer teaches: (Matthew5:39) “You have learnt how it was said: ‘Eye for eye and tooth for tooth.’ ButI say this to you: offer the wicked man no resistance.”



So you have to see that theCatholic Church teaches a different version of the Good News.



Also look into usury, and see how the Church has twisted that evil.

 

[Anastacia]

My latest replies to aspen in green.

All YOUR "early church fathers" writings are not in the Bible.

Heres the problem:

You claim to follow the same church as the early Christians, but you dismiss the teachings of the early church theologians. You cannot have it both ways.

I don't have a problem, you do. I told you I claim the same beliefs that Jesus and the apostles of the Bible taught. And you believe in all the writings of the "early church Fathers." You can sin by calling them that, but I choose not to. I don't know or care to read about what all your early church "Fathers" wrote---it is not in the Bible.


And, according to your explanation, Jesus really meant: Do not call anyone on earth Father, unless they really are worthy to be called that. Jesus told his disciples not to call anyone on earth Father----that they were "brothers"!

So do you call your father, brother?

Do you really not know the difference between that which is spiritual and that which is not?

The Catholic parishioners not only call their priests "Father," the priests call each other "Father"! Again, Jesus says they are "brothers."

Luke 11:11
“Which of you fathers, if your son asks for a fish, will give him a snake instead?

Luke 14:26
“If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters—yes, even their own life—such a person cannot be my disciple.

So is Jesus sinning by calling them fathers rather than brother?

Do you really think that Jesus is talking about a biological son and father? Or do you believe that Jesus is talking about a Catholic priest and a parishoner?


[sup]Acts 7[/sup]
[sup]2[/sup] To this he replied: “Brothers and fathers, listen to me! The God of glory appeared to our father Abraham while he was still in Mesopotamia, before he lived in Harran. [sup]3[/sup] ‘Leave your country and your people,’ God said, ‘and go to the land I will show you.’[sup][a][/sup]


[sup][/sup]Is Stephen sinning?

Do you think Stephen was talking to actual fathers and their sons? Or do you think Stephen was talking to apostles as "fathers" and the other believers as "brothers'? Never.

I guess you think man's commands and rules are better than Jesus'?

Do you really believe this statement?

You better believe I believe you take man's word over God's Word.

When you are shown God's word, and then practice something else......and when you defend that which is against God's word.

 

[Foreigner]

I find that may Catholics are Christians IN SPITE of their church, not because of it.


There are so many things the church does that run contrary to the simplicity of a relationship with Jesus.


And yes, I speak from experience. I was an altar boy for years and grew up going to Catholic school.


I remember being told that Mary had Jesus and then she had no more kids. (This in spite of what the scriptures say.)


Was also told that she was raised bodily into heaven, although there is nothing in the scriptures to support that.


There is also nothing in the scriptures about praying and asking Mary (or any of the other church-appointed saints to pray for us.


I remember getting in trouble BIG TIME in class in roughly 5th grade because I asked why, if Jesus is supposed to be our very best friend as He intercedes to His Father on our behalf, why we would need to ask Mary to intercede for us?


I also got in trouble for refusing to kiss the feet of Mary's statue when they trooped all of us to the front of Chapel to do so.


As I got into Jr. High and High School and asked more questions, the more disappointed I got in the answers.


I said that if Jesus truly died once and for all for our sins, why would we continue to have to eat and drink what we were taught is His actual body and blood every week.
He said to eat and drink in remembrance of Him but not that it would actually BE Him.
The implication is that He must continue to die over and over and over and over... -- Yeah, I got in trouble for that.


And as far as confession goes, I pointed out that while James 5:16 does say we should confess our sins to one another, it was meant literally to do so and see forgiveness from those we have hurt.
There is nothing in the Bible that grant priest the ability to say that a person's sins are forgiven.
And the danger for the person dumb enough to believe it is that they may not truly be sorry but since the priest said they are forgiven then the sin is forgiven.


Also, whenever I would finish confession I was told to say 20 'Our Father's" and 25 "Hail Mary's" .
I said that Matt 6:7 says we should not "use vain repetition" (KJV) or "do not keep babbling like pagans" (NIV).
Simply reciting a prayer over and over and over has no value whatsoever. So why wouldn't just saying the prayer one time with heartfelt seriousness be enough.

I also pointed out that there was nothing in scripture that supports me saying in prayer "Hair Mary full of grace" or "Holy Mary mother of God pray for us now and at the hour of our death."


Again, I got in big trouble.


Also, there is nothing scripturally - unless you parse very hard, like with most Catholic justifications for a specific practice - to support the idea of purgatory.


The more I probed, the less explanation and more hostility I received until I realized that with these practices there is simply no 'there' there.

 

[aspen]

Aspen

I have a confession to make

I am not Catholic, but I feel like I am in confessional. Never been there before. .... Here goes.

Hey Aspen .... it is not as bad as you think .... First I confess I have read the first few the pages of your thread. Mostly I want to confess that I am busy , and have not read the last few pages. Please forgive me. Amen.

I wish to thank you for the tone of your thread , and the tone of all your posts. You have a nice style that tends to avoid confrontation. You also have well thought out replies. Sometimes you reply so quick , it makes me think it came from your own words and mind. I respect people who have an internal understanding that can be typed out on a keypad. Not many people do .

Now that I have you all warmed up , and I am pretending to be in a Catholic confessional and all , here is my true experience with the Catholic church.

I became a christian outside of the church system. I belong to no denomination , no church , and never intend to change. I attend at random many church services. I heard a lot of Catholic bashing. I heard about all the golden candlesticks, the rituals , Mary , and Mary , and Mary. I heard they do not read from the bible. So on and so forth.. I heard it all.

Some days I was considering finding a robe , polishing myself up real good , and walk into a Catholic church like I owned the place or something. I love walking into places like I own them or something. I wanted to set them all straight. After all , I knew everything. I was a born again non-Catholic full of the Holy Spirit christian. It doesnt get any better than that right ? . Just ask around.

I am not a phony , I do not fake things with any degree of success , I do not have a robe , and besides , I knew the moment I set foot inside their door , they would spot me. I needed a better strategy. I decided to paint a car.

My younger brother was also a car guy like me. He had a friend named Danny. Danny was also a car guy who also wanted to play music. While getting a car ready to paint Danny dropped by and invited me to hear him sing next Sunday morning at his church , which of course was catholic , which of course I was quick to tell him I was not a catholic , and not interested in going there.

Then he asked me again. This time I listened carefully. Turns out he mostly wanted me to hear his music. Mostly he wanted some friends in the audience. To perform in front of a crowd can be intimidating. If he was bold enough to get on stage , I figured I was bold enough to come watch him. I said yes.

It was one of the most christian church services I have ever attended. And they read scripture . And taught scripture. And they did not worship Mary. And nobody wore robes. It disarmed me completely. Never again will I go by somebody else's opinion on something they really know nothing about. I am talking about Protestant Christians bashing Catholics.. I fall under the label of protestant Christian. I no longer bash that which I do not know. I was humbled. I snooped around a bit and found they ran the only soup kitchen for the homeless and hungry in that small city for almost a hundred years. If you were not homeless and hungry you would never know about the charity they had. They did not advertise it. They just provided.

By the way , come to think of it I also liked Dan's music.

My friend Dan Dionne has been working in Northern Canada since I last saw him in the 1980's He is associated with the Oblate Youth Ministries and still plays his music. I keep asking his family when he is coming home for a visit. His dad told me that when he gets holidays , he is so exhausted from all the work he does , he sometimes stays just stays home to rest on his holidays.

True confession.
Forgive me Lord for not helping the needy like Dan does.

I found his picture
I think he is in St. Albert ,
Alberta Canada

Arnie said to say hi and God bless you Dan
and everything you strive to do.

Martin W.

Thanks for the post Martin. It is really good to hear your message - I was shocked to when I went to my fist Mass - so much scripture! Thanks for taking the time to talk with me - your kindness is unique and very much appreciated.

 

[Thankful 1]

Why don’t you read what Jesus said? (Matthew 23:8-9) “You, however must not allow yourselves to be called Rabbi, since you have only one Master, and you are all brothers. You must call no one on earth your father, since you have only one Father, and he is in heaven.”



Now notice that he said: “You must call no one on earth your father.” Another words don’t address anyone as your father. Your father!



You should know that just to not in anyway disobey Jesus I would not even address my dad as father if he were alive. I know Jesus did not mean not to call one’s own dad father, but for those weak in faith I would not want to mislead him or her.

 

[aspen]

I have a question. Do Catholics believe that the Catholic Church is the only true church?

The Catholic Church teaches that we have the fullness of the gospel, but we recognize the Protestant churches baptism and we believe they teach enough of the truth to be Christian. It is difficult because this idea often makes people outside the church mad - the weird thing about it is that often the people who get the most upset do not believe the Catholic Church is Christian at all.

I just pray for unity - I think the shattered church is not pleasing to God and requires everyone to put their egos aside and work things out.

 

[truthquest]

The Catholic Church teaches that we have the fullness of the gospel, but we recognize the Protestant churches baptism and we believe they teach enough of the truth to be Christian. It is difficult because this idea often makes people outside the church mad - the weird thing about it is that often the people who get the most upset do not believe the Catholic Church is Christian at all.

I just pray for unity - I think the shattered church is not pleasing to God and requires everyone to put their egos aside and work things out.

Does that mean that the Catholic Church teaches that other churches don't have the fullness of the gospel? What is your definition of a Protestant?

 

[Anastacia]

Why don’t you read what Jesus said? (Matthew 23:8-9) “You, however must not allow yourselves to be called Rabbi, since you have only one Master, and you are all brothers. You must call no one on earth your father, since you have only one Father, and he is in heaven.”



Now notice that he said: “You must call no one on earth your father.” Another words don’t address anyone as your father. Your father!



You should know that just to not in anyway disobey Jesus I would not even address my dad as father if he were alive. I know Jesus did not mean not to call one’s own dad father, but for those weak in faith I would not want to mislead him or her.

Thankful 1, Notice that aspen says it is wrong then to call anyone "Father"? I guess since the Catholics feel that calling their own dad "father" is a sin, then they think they might as well go all the way and sin even more by calling their priests "Father." What kind of reasoning is that?!

 

[aspen]

I find that may Catholics are Christians IN SPITE of their church, not because of it.


There are so many things the church does that run contrary to the simplicity of a relationship with Jesus.


And yes, I speak from experience. I was an altar boy for years and grew up going to Catholic school.


I remember being told that Mary had Jesus and then she had no more kids. (This in spite of what the scriptures say.)


Was also told that she was raised bodily into heaven, although there is nothing in the scriptures to support that.


There is also nothing in the scriptures about praying and asking Mary (or any of the other church-appointed saints to pray for us.


I remember getting in trouble BIG TIME in class in roughly 5th grade because I asked why, if Jesus is supposed to be our very best friend as He intercedes to His Father on our behalf, why we would need to ask Mary to intercede for us?


I also got in trouble for refusing to kiss the feet of Mary's statue when they trooped all of us to the front of Chapel to do so.


As I got into Jr. High and High School and asked more questions, the more disappointed I got in the answers.


I said that if Jesus truly died once and for all for our sins, why would we continue to have to eat and drink what we were taught is His actual body and blood every week.
He said to eat and drink in remembrance of Him but not that it would actually BE Him.
The implication is that He must continue to die over and over and over and over... -- Yeah, I got in trouble for that.


And as far as confession goes, I pointed out that while James 5:16 does say we should confess our sins to one another, it was meant literally to do so and see forgiveness from those we have hurt.
There is nothing in the Bible that grant priest the ability to say that a person's sins are forgiven.
And the danger for the person dumb enough to believe it is that they may not truly be sorry but since the priest said they are forgiven then the sin is forgiven.


Also, whenever I would finish confession I was told to say 20 'Our Father's" and 25 "Hail Mary's" .
I said that Matt 6:7 says we should not "use vain repetition" (KJV) or "do not keep babbling like pagans" (NIV).
Simply reciting a prayer over and over and over has no value whatsoever. So why wouldn't just saying the prayer one time with heartfelt seriousness be enough.

I also pointed out that there was nothing in scripture that supports me saying in prayer "Hair Mary full of grace" or "Holy Mary mother of God pray for us now and at the hour of our death."


Again, I got in big trouble.


Also, there is nothing scripturally - unless you parse very hard, like with most Catholic justifications for a specific practice - to support the idea of purgatory.


The more I probed, the less explanation and more hostility I received until I realized that with these practices there is simply no 'there' there.

Sounds like you got in a lot of trouble as a kid - that is too bad. I am glad that I have had a much different experience in the Catholic Church then you did. Although this was not a question you ask - I think it is important to remember that we are not saved by our churches or the Bible or even doctrine - we are saved by God's Grace - AMEN

Does that mean that the Catholic Church teaches that other churches don't have the fullness of the gospel? What is your definition of a Protestant?

My definition of a Protestant is a person who retains the Catholic teachings of the closed cannon of scripture, the Trinity, and the doctrine of the Incarnation, but also believes in Sola Scriptura, sola fide, and sola gratia. So Mormons are not Protestant, but Baptists are.


Yes. It means that other churches do not have the fullness of Christ's message. Many Protestants believe they have the fullness of the gospel and Catholics have added paganism and distorted the gospel beyond recognition. I, of course, reject this idea.

 

[Foreigner]

And it is God's grace with basically null and voids the need to do the other things that we were required to do.

It makes me sad because the Catholic Mass can be such a beautiful thing that holds some of the reverence I have found is missing in some of the other denominational worship services.

 

[Templar81]

Foreginer,
Jesus said, "take eat this is my body." He said the bread was his body, not it is like his body. I can't explain how the bread and wine become Jesus' body and blood because it is a mystery but Aquinas tells us that the substances of the bread and wine become CHrist's actual body and blood, though the accidents or appearance still stay the same as it would be unpaletaqble for us and improper to recieve them in such a way. we still share the Eucharist in rememberance of him but what we recieve is his body and blood.

 

[Anastacia]

And it is God's grace with basically null and voids the need to do the other things that we were required to do.

It makes me sad because the Catholic Mass can be such a beautiful thing that holds some of the reverence I have found is missing in some of the other denominational worship services.

I mean this, really---no offense, but I don't envy anything about such a sinful religion.

 

[truthquest]

My definition of a Protestant is a person who retains the Catholic teachings of the closed cannon of scripture, the Trinity, and the doctrine of the Incarnation, but also believes in Sola Scriptura, sola fide, and sola gratia. So Mormons are not Protestant, but Baptists are.
Yes. It means that other churches do not have the fullness of Christ's message. Many Protestants believe they have the fullness of the gospel and Catholics have added paganism and distorted the gospel beyond recognition. I, of course, reject this idea.

What is Sola Scriptura, sola fide and sola gratia?

 

[aspen]

Thankful 1, Notice that aspen says it is wrong then to call anyone "Father"? I guess since the Catholics feel that calling their own dad "father" is a sin, then they think they might as well go all the way and sin even more by calling their priests "Father." What kind of reasoning is that?!

If you are into strange reason how about claiming that calling anyone but God father or teacher and then doing it anyway.