Remember the Sabbath Day to keep it holy

[GerhardEbersoehn]

I have provided historical evidence that for the first 120 years of Christianity Christians practiced Sunday worship. If you had any knowledge of your Christian history then you would know that any real opposition to Sunday worship didn't begin until the 1500's AD.

Evidence? No evidence on the pages of this discussion so far. Sorry. WRITTEN evidence will be welcome.

But I did not, can you believe, know that 'real opposition to Sunday worship' only began by 'the 1500's AD'. What I also do not understand, is what you mean by 'real opposition'. Do you mean Scriptural 'opposition'? I only wonder what that then could have been if you haven't read about it in the NT yourself.

 

[gadar perets]

The only reason Jesus rose from the dead was, and ‘is’, that "by the Son, God, in these last days, on the day The Seventh Day FROM ALL, HIS, WORKS, RESTED", because the only reason “God on the day The Seventh Day from all, his, works, rested", was, and ‘is’, that Jesus rose from the dead, “ON” it!

Are you saying he rose on the 7th day Sabbath? If so, how does that abolish the Sabbath?

So the only reason why God made the Sabbath a Commandment in the Ten Commandments for Israel, was, and still is, that He brought them up out of the land of darkness and Red Sea grave into the land He promised them to find rest in. Which is the the only and same reason, “IF JESUS GAVE THEM REST, (that) there for the People of God a Sabbath Day’s rest remains”.

If "Jesus" gave them rest, then why does a Sabbath rest remain?

"Therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus and sought to slay Him because He had done these things ON THE SABBATH DAY, but Jesus answered them, My Father …on the Sabbath… hitherto works and I …on the Sabbath… hitherto work. Verily, verily I say unto you, The Son cannot do anything of Himself but all the things He works towards, He sees the FATHER do (work), for what works soever the Father does, THESE works the Son, LIKEWISE towards works… 21 For as the Father RAISES UP AND QUICKENS THE DEAD (JESUS from the dead), EVEN SO, THE SON QUICKENS…".

Spiritual works such as healing, preaching, teaching Scripture, etc., have always been permissible.

Thus the day on which ‘the wave sheaf offering fell to fulfill his resurrection’ and which “the Son as the Father hitherto worked” was “the Sabbath--Day of the Lord” “AFTER the sabbath--great day of sabbath” in ‘that year’ and Jesus’ Last Passover Suffering “once for all”.

I have no idea what you are trying to say.

Not ‘on the first day of the week’, because that is not found in ‘Leviticus 23:10-11’ at all or anywhere else for that matter.

Of course Leviticus does not mention the day of the week to offer the wave sheaf. The fact that Yeshua rose on Abib 16 and that Abib 16 was a Sunday proves he fulfilled it on that day.

And now see the contradiction of your theory IN YOUR OWN STATEMENT:


'on the first day of the week' is impossible 'the day that year' except by rare coincidence. But in principle, it mutually exclusive is an impossibility and contradiction.

Explain further please. If it is rare, then it is not impossible.

 

[gadar perets]

Are you saying, I, 'abolish the holy Sabbath Day' -- holy Sabbath Day "OF THE LORD GOD", my, God?

Schucks, I thought I presented the only real Bible reason for believing "the Seventh Day Sabbath of the LORD GOD", my, God, the Resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead ON IT!

If you are supporting the 7th day Sabbath, then your English is very unclear.

 

[gadar perets]

'As Jesus is our Sabbath Rest...it does not matter a hill of beans.'

I understood this to be you teaching the Sabbath rest is abolished because Yeshua fulfilled it. Am I misunderstanding you? My apologies if you are in support of the 7th day Sabbath.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Dear friend,

I quoted Ignatius. Who are you quoting?

Curious Mary

I think you have our identities mixed up.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

i guess the record of coercing ppl to observe Sunday is still available, took like 100 years and a lot of deaths to get it installed, is what i read?

Maybe there is a misunderstanding here. Please only read what I wrote? I ask you an honest question.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

By saying the Apostles were never accused of breaking the Sabbath is a bit dishonest. Have your read scripture? Did you not read Luke 6:1-2? Do your own research instead of relying on someone else. When you quote someone else without researching what they said it makes YOU look dishonest.

As Paul said, Whatever one accuses another of, of doing, he is guilty of himself.

To be exact. Whom in 'Luke 6:1-2' does Marymog quote who accused Jesus' disciples of breaking the Sabbath?

My advice to anyone would be, Better read the Scriptures 'without researching what they said'. Just read it and if God give, just believe it.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

As CHRISTIANS scripture tells us they practiced Sunday worship.
Love, Mary

In all 'love', Where?!

In all my life I saw 2--TWO--'scriptures', EVER, 'quoted' allegedly in support of the claim, note, claim, 'As CHRISTIANS scripture tells us they practiced Sunday worship.' Two very short phrases against a WHOLE Omnibus of God's Written Word-of-Law.
STAGGERING 'evidence'! Like a drunk staggering! Isaiah 28:7.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

God did command that we keep the Sabbath holy.

"keep the Sabbath holy", alright almost. It's not 'we' - us, who sanctified the Sabbath in the first place; it was God. And it is not 'we' - us, who "keep / guard / protect / save / maintain the Sabbath holy"; IT IS "THE SON OF MAN" Jesus the Christ of God, Isaiah 56 to 58, His Ultimate hallowing / sanctfying of the Seventh Day Sabbath OF THE LORD GOD having been "When God RESTED HIM UP AGAIN" from death's fast (the stumbling block taken out of the way),

14take up the stumblingblock out of the way of my people.
καὶ ἄρατε σκῶλα ἀπὸ τῆς ὁδοῦ τοῦ λαοῦ μου.

15For thus saith The High and Lofty One that inhabiteth eternity,
Τάδε λέγει κύριος ὁ ὕψιστος ὁ ἐν ὑψηλοῖς κατοικῶν τὸν αἰῶνα,

whose Name is The Most Holy Place,
ἅγιος ἐν ἁγίοις ὄνομα αὐτῷ,

The Lord Most High and Holy being rested up again
κύριος ὕψιστος ἐν ἁγίοις ἀναπαυόμενος

Isaiah 57

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Are you saying he rose on the 7th day Sabbath? If so, how does that abolish the Sabbath?

Jesus Christ abolished the Sabbath as all the "damning Law against us" having made "Sacrifice of Himself", being "nailed to the cross" and "TAKEN OUT OF THE WAY". That's how Jesus abolished the Seventh Day Sabbath the "Sabbath OF THE LORD GOD" in fact. How was it possible? Well how do you think was it possible Jesus the Christ of God offered up and laid down his own Life?

BUT, Jesus Christ BY having RAISED from the dead so that "God the Seventh Day RESTED", and "from ALL, HIS, WORKS, RESTED", "MADE the Sabbath", made it "the Lord's Day" in which "THE LORD TRIUMPHED GLORIOUSLY, FOR THE LORD IS A MAN OF WAR", the Son of Man the Son of God "greatly to be exalted"; and... "the Lord's Day", to be invested with holiness and honour it BEFORE DID NOT HAVE.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

If "Jesus" gave them rest, then why does a Sabbath rest remain?

'If "Jesus" gave them rest, then why does a Sabbath rest remain?' is not begging the question, it is putting the answer right in the question! Well done!

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

I have no idea what you are trying to say.

'Be patient and opay the trafficles' as my little Afrikaans daughter told us she was taught at school...

 

[mjrhealth]

Mar_2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

Sabbath was a day of rest, it wanst supposed to be a but religious thing, David proved it as did Jesus, it always the religious that push the point, making it all about works when its supposed to be about rest, besides it was never given to the gentiles and Christ is our rest.

Mat_11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Heb 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
Heb 4:4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
Heb 4:5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
Heb 4:6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
Heb 4:7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
Heb 4:8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Of course Leviticus does not mention the day of the week to offer the wave sheaf. The fact that Yeshua rose on Abib 16 and that Abib 16 was a Sunday proves he fulfilled it on that day.

It's a 'fact that Yeshua rose on Abib 16'. (It's good to hear it from you!)
But it's no more than your --faulty-- assumption and NO 'fact that Abib 16 was a Sunday'.

But I can understand why you believe what you believe. I also believed so until the TRANSLATORS themselves exposed their fraud to me. Yes, it was not I who was so intelligent, it was they who thought they are so intelligent. But they misreckoned people's ATTENTIVENESS and AWARENESS. I refer you to Mark 15:42. Please read the KJV, then NIV, and you will see what I mean.

 

[GerhardEbersoehn]

Mar_2:27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath:

Sabbath was a day of rest, it wanst supposed to be a but religious thing, David proved it as did Jesus, it always the religious that push the point, making it all about works when its supposed to be about rest, besides it was never given to the gentiles and Christ is our rest.

Mat_11:28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Heb 4:3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
Heb 4:4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
Heb 4:5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
Heb 4:6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
Heb 4:7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
Heb 4:8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

I see all this as the most 'religious' issue because it pertains JESUS "THE SON OF MAN LORD OF THE SABBATH DAY" -- "the DAY the SEVENTH Day, Sabbath DAY, OF THE LORD GOD", of the Lord, "your”, God, AND, of worshippers' FAITH in Him.
Nothing could be more 'religious', imo.

 

[GodsGrace]

"keep the Sabbath holy", alright almost. It's not 'we' - us, who sanctified the Sabbath in the first place; it was God. And it is not 'we' - us, who "keep / guard / protect / save / maintain the Sabbath holy"; IT IS "THE SON OF MAN" Jesus the Christ of God, Isaiah 56 to 58, His Ultimate hallowing / sanctfying of the Seventh Day Sabbath OF THE LORD GOD having been "When God RESTED HIM UP AGAIN" from death's fast (the stumbling block taken out of the way),

14take up the stumblingblock out of the way of my people.
καὶ ἄρατε σκῶλα ἀπὸ τῆς ὁδοῦ τοῦ λαοῦ μου.

15For thus saith The High and Lofty One that inhabiteth eternity,
Τάδε λέγει κύριος ὁ ὕψιστος ὁ ἐν ὑψηλοῖς κατοικῶν τὸν αἰῶνα,

whose Name is The Most Holy Place,
ἅγιος ἐν ἁγίοις ὄνομα αὐτῷ,

The Lord Most High and Holy being rested up again
κύριος ὕψιστος ἐν ἁγίοις ἀναπαυόμενος

Isaiah 57

So we don't have to keep the Sabbath holy?
You're one of those that says that Jesus did everything for us so we don't have to do anything?

So I could work and toil on the Sabbath? I could skip church with no worries?
I could treat it just like any other day? So I'm not to keep either Saturday or Sunday as a holy day unto the Lord?

Am I allowed to break the other commandments too, or just this one?

Yes. It's ceremonial, but it is a commandment.
Which is more important?

 

[bbyrd009]

Maybe there is a misunderstanding here. Please only read what I wrote? I ask you an honest question.

ah well as to that i guess the promoters of "Sunday" have some Scripture that they point to, Paul collecting money ("alms") for the Jerusalemites that tried the hippy commune thing in Acts, and failed when Jesus did not come back as they had imagined to rapture them or whatever?

Um, Marymog just quoted it recently; i recall alms in the passage. Not sure if there are any Witnesses/other vv that can be quoted for that or not tbh. Yes, i am aware that i am not providing the fodder you had hoped for here, that convo is back just a couple pages in this thread i guess

ah, i see you found them
imo let Mary believe that passing money to indigents is Holy, and let Sabbath keepers keep the Sabbath. Passing money is service, after all right; of a sort. Who objects to donations to the needy, even on the Sabbath?

imo "they worshipped on _______" (insert whatever day you like) is a fail anyway, but one day is better than no days i guess. sort of

 

[Marymog]

Respectfully Mary,
On several occasions I have sought to engage you in polite conversation, but you have always shown a greater interest in proving my errors and your correctness than in having a friendly discussion to help each other move closer to God.
"Every way of a man is right in his own eyes: but the LORD pondereth the hearts." Prov 21:2
When you have changed your attitude I might consider changing my mind.
Give God the glory!

Dear friend,

You are a very polite person and I appreciate it.

If quoting scripture and putting it in context to show you your errors is wrong of me, I am glad to be wrong. If I am sacrificing our friendship by quoting scripture then I will have to accept it.

To do righteousness and justice is more acceptable to the Lord than sacrifice. Prov 21:3

Good luck on your journey.

Mary

 

[amadeus]

Dear friend,

You are a very polite person and I appreciate it.

If quoting scripture and putting it in context to show you your errors is wrong of me, I am glad to be wrong. If I am sacrificing our friendship by quoting scripture then I will have to accept it.

To do righteousness and justice is more acceptable to the Lord than sacrifice. Prov 21:3

Good luck on your journey.

Mary

Thank you for your honesty.
Give God the glory!

 

[bbyrd009]

i'll thank you for your honesty when you address that Sunday worship was instituted after intense public resistance and many Christian deaths over the span of more than 100 years, by decree of a self-proclaimed pope, bc the people wanted to follow the Commandment