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Barrd

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Jul 27, 2015
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ATP said:
God's seed remaining in us is not a scam. Think before you post Barrd.

1 John 3:9 NIV No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.
Back to John 3:

So we are all sinners....and all condemned.
Which is why Jesus came to us.

1Jn 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.

Yes...but before you go shouting "halelujah", there are a couple of things you need to know:

1Jn 3:6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
1Jn 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
1Jn 3:8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

There are two groups of people in this passage...those who "abideth in Him" and those who "hath not seen Him, neither known Him."
John tells us not to be deceived...those who do righteousness are righteous, even as He is righteous....
But those who sin are of the the devil.

Now, be careful here. Remember that it was only a few pages ago that John told us

1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

to be continued...
 

Barrd

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Jul 27, 2015
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justaname said:
Again the 10 are contained in the 613...they never were separated in the way you claim...

Christians are not held to the 10 any more than they are held to the 613...

Perhaps you should reread when the Israelites undertook the Covenant administered through Moses...the ten were apportioned to the entire covenant...its called the Mosaic Covenant...
You don't see that there was a major difference in the way they were recorded, and in the way they were stored?

The Ten Commandments:
Exo 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

The Law of Moses:
Deu 31:9 And Moses wrote this law, and delivered it unto the priests the sons of Levi, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and unto all the elders of Israel.

God spoke the Ten Commandments:
Deu 4:36 Out of heaven he made thee to hear his voice, that he might instruct thee: and upon earth he shewed thee his great fire; and thou heardest his words out of the midst of the fire.

And He did not add to them:
Deu 5:22 These words the LORD spake unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: and he added no more. And he wrote them in two tables of stone, and delivered them unto me

This makes it obvious that God puts a difference between the Ten Commandments and the rest of the law, because He did give Moses statutes, precepts, judgments, and ordinances afterwards. If the Mosaic law was part of the Ten Commandments, there would be a contradiction here, because it seems that God did add more to this law.
But we know that the Bible does not contradict itself, right?
Therefore, it is obvious that God considered the Ten Commandments to be a separate Law.

And again....which of those Ten Commandments are Christians not held to?
Yes, you may eat pork, if you like...
But does that mean it is okay to commit adultery?
You can go without bathing....if you can stand your own stink.
But does that make it okay to murder?

Honestly, sometimes I worry about you OSASers....
It's as if a part of your brain is disconnected or something.

I mean, it is obvious, Justaname, that you are intelligent, and well educated, and I believe you are sincere.
It is also obvious that users like ATP and Mjrhealth are your ardent admirers and devout followers. For that reason alone, you really need to think this stuff through.
I mean, I, also, believe and trust in the eternal security of the believer. But I also know that there is the real possibility that a believer can fall and be lost. There are too many examples in the Bible of people that did just that...starting with Adam and Eve.
I believe in Grace, and I praise God for it. But I also know that we must obey His commandments.

What bothers me the most about OSAS is that it is used as a shelter for sin.
I've heard too many Baptists who have divorced and remarried talking about how they know that it is a sin...they are committing adultery....but it's okay, because they are "saved". Perhaps, if they hadn't been taught this damnable doctrine of devils, they would have worked to save their marriage....and their kids might still have both of their parents.
Worse, yet, others use this same tactic to excuse themselves from having the spouse....and a lover or two on the side. After all, they are "saved" and they can't sin any more, so what the heck? It's all been "paid for".
And now, we have the gay community. Is homosexuality a sin? You betcha. Will the devout homosexual Christian involved in an active homosexual relationship die for his infraction? Nah....because, you see, he is covered by the blood....

ATP actually told me that a born again Christian could actually indulge himself in the sin of child molesting. He could continue it for years, but he would still go to heaven when he dies....because he is "safe in the arms of Jesus".

Yeah....you guys have a lot to answer for. Don't mind me, sidling away, here. I just don't want to be standing too close when the lightning strikes....
 

ATP

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The Barrd said:
Yes, ATP, that too.
But it is all the rest of it that makes Him Who He is.
And Who He is is Lord.
I agree.

The Barrd said:
Mat 5:22 But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

It's pretty self-explanatory. Jesus says that whosoever shall say "thou fool" shall be in danger of hell fire.
Seems pretty clear to me.
Yes, God can and will send someone to hell for mocking and belittling others.
Jesus was also mocked and belittled. Don't you think He feels it when His followers are also mocked as He was?
Well, not really. Do you believe some scriptures are more complex than others and involve a deeper study?

How can Jesus send believers to hell for calling someone a fool when the seed of God remains in them forever? :wacko:

1 Pet 1:23 NIV For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.
1 John 3:9 NIV No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.
2 John 1:2 NIV because of the truth, which lives in us and will be with us forever:

justaname said:
What is interesting is I said Christians are not under the Law...then you accuse me of trying to put "us" under the Old Covenant...
I noticed that too. ;)

The Barrd said:
1Jn 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Have you ever commited a sin, ATP? No, you don't have to answer that...the fact is that the Bible says that all have sinned and fallen short of God's glory. All would include you. Yes, it includes me, too.
Seems there is a bump or two on the road to purity, eh?

to be continued...
You're basically proving my point. Thank you Barrd. Yes, we all have sinned and have fallen short. That is why we are covered in the blood of Jesus and the seed of God.

The Barrd said:
Being "under Grace" is not a license to
"A license to sin" is actually an incorrect term and poor exegesis. God is against sin Barrd. Rather, God's grace teaches, disciplines and sanctifies us.

The Barrd said:
1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

to be continued...
Very good Barrd. It seems like you are finally coming around and understanding grace towards our sin nature.
 

ATP

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The Barrd said:
And again....which of those Ten Commandments are Christians not held to?
Yes, you may eat pork, if you like...
But does that mean it is okay to commit adultery?
You can go without bathing....if you can stand your own stink.
But does that make it okay to murder?

Honestly, sometimes I worry about you OSASers....
It's as if a part of your brain is disconnected or something.
Disconnected? I'm not sure that we are the ones disconnected Barrd. Maybe you should take a rest...

1 Pet 1:23 NIV For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.
1 John 3:9 NIV No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.
2 John 1:2 NIV because of the truth, which lives in us and will be with us forever:
 

Barrd

His Humble Servant
Jul 27, 2015
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ATP said:
God's seed remaining in us is not a scam. Think before you post Barrd.

1 John 3:9 NIV No one who is born of God will continue to sin, because God's seed remains in them; they cannot go on sinning, because they have been born of God.
And back to 1 John 3

You know, ATP, there is another verse right after the one you've been quoting for the last few days:

1Jn 3:10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

So, evidently, there are things you must do if you wish to be considered one of the children of God. It would follow, then, that if you stop doing these things, you are no longer considered to be a child of God.

1Jn 3:11 For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.

Yes, this is the commandment that Jesus gave to us. Notice that He did not phrase it as a suggestion, nor did He send it along to us as a message....He very clearly said that it is a commandment. Further, He said that His disciples would be recognized by that love.
No love for others=not a disciple.

Careful. In God's lexicon, the word "love" is a verb....that is, it is an action word.

1Jn 3:17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
1Jn 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.
1Jn 3:19 And hereby we know that we are of the truth, and shall assure our hearts before him.

Whoa....is John preaching a "works salvation" here? Hmmmm....

1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.
1Jn 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.
1Jn 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.

We need to keep His commandments, ATP, if we expect to see heaven.
You may call it "works salvation" if you just insist on it.
It isn't...we obey Him because we have been saved. Our obedience is the evidence that we have received the Holy Spirit. It is not the other way around.
 

ATP

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The Barrd said:
We need to keep His commandments, ATP, if we expect to see heaven.
No, you have that backwards. We need to keep His commandments if we expect to see Grace in our lives. If we fall short, which we do every day, the seed of God will still remain in us, to teach us, discipline us and sanctify us. What does imperishable mean here...

1 Pet 1:23 NIV For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.
 

justaname

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The Barrd said:
You don't see that there was a major difference in the way they were recorded, and in the way they were stored?

The Ten Commandments:
Exo 31:18 And he gave unto Moses, when he had made an end of communing with him upon mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God.

The Law of Moses:
Deu 31:9 And Moses wrote this law, and delivered it unto the priests the sons of Levi, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and unto all the elders of Israel.

God spoke the Ten Commandments:
Deu 4:36 Out of heaven he made thee to hear his voice, that he might instruct thee: and upon earth he shewed thee his great fire; and thou heardest his words out of the midst of the fire.

And He did not add to them:
Deu 5:22 These words the LORD spake unto all your assembly in the mount out of the midst of the fire, of the cloud, and of the thick darkness, with a great voice: and he added no more. And he wrote them in two tables of stone, and delivered them unto me

This makes it obvious that God puts a difference between the Ten Commandments and the rest of the law, because He did give Moses statutes, precepts, judgments, and ordinances afterwards. If the Mosaic law was part of the Ten Commandments, there would be a contradiction here, because it seems that God did add more to this law.
But we know that the Bible does not contradict itself, right?
Therefore, it is obvious that God considered the Ten Commandments to be a separate Law.

And again....which of those Ten Commandments are Christians not held to?
Yes, you may eat pork, if you like...
But does that mean it is okay to commit adultery?
You can go without bathing....if you can stand your own stink.
But does that make it okay to murder?

Honestly, sometimes I worry about you OSASers....
It's as if a part of your brain is disconnected or something.

I mean, it is obvious, Justaname, that you are intelligent, and well educated, and I believe you are sincere.
It is also obvious that users like ATP and Mjrhealth are your ardent admirers and devout followers. For that reason alone, you really need to think this stuff through.
I mean, I, also, believe and trust in the eternal security of the believer. But I also know that there is the real possibility that a believer can fall and be lost. There are too many examples in the Bible of people that did just that...starting with Adam and Eve.
I believe in Grace, and I praise God for it. But I also know that we must obey His commandments.

What bothers me the most about OSAS is that it is used as a shelter for sin.
I've heard too many Baptists who have divorced and remarried talking about how they know that it is a sin...they are committing adultery....but it's okay, because they are "saved". Perhaps, if they hadn't been taught this damnable doctrine of devils, they would have worked to save their marriage....and their kids might still have both of their parents.
Worse, yet, others use this same tactic to excuse themselves from having the spouse....and a lover or two on the side. After all, they are "saved" and they can't sin any more, so what the heck? It's all been "paid for".
And now, we have the gay community. Is homosexuality a sin? You betcha. Will the devout homosexual Christian involved in an active homosexual relationship die for his infraction? Nah....because, you see, he is covered by the blood....

ATP actually told me that a born again Christian could actually indulge himself in the sin of child molesting. He could continue it for years, but he would still go to heaven when he dies....because he is "safe in the arms of Jesus".

Yeah....you guys have a lot to answer for. Don't mind me, sidling away, here. I just don't want to be standing too close when the lightning strikes....
The way it was recorded has no bearing on weather or not the 10 are attached to the 613. You are beginning with a false premise and you don't even see it...

Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word from the mouth of God...


so then to the rest of the story in the Deuteronomy passage...

22 “These words the Lord spoke to all your assembly at the mountain from the midst of the fire, of the cloud and of the thick gloom, with a great voice, and He added no more. He wrote them on two tablets of stone and gave them to me.
23 “And when you heard the voice from the midst of the darkness, while the mountain was burning with fire, you came near to me, all the heads of your tribes and your elders.
24 “You said, ‘Behold, the Lord our God has shown us His glory and His greatness, and we have heard His voice from the midst of the fire; we have seen today that God speaks with man, yet he lives.
25 ‘Now then why should we die? For this great fire will consume us; if we hear the voice of the Lord our God any longer, then we will die.
26 ‘For who is there of all flesh who has heard the voice of the living God speaking from the midst of the fire, as we have, and lived?
27 ‘Go near and hear all that the Lord our God says; then speak to us all that the Lord our God speaks to you, and we will hear and do it.
28 “The Lord heard the voice of your words when you spoke to me, and the Lord said to me, ‘I have heard the voice of the words of this people which they have spoken to you. They have done well in all that they have spoken.
29 ‘Oh that they had such a heart in them, that they would fear Me and keep all My commandments always, that it may be well with them and with their sons forever!
30 ‘Go, say to them, “Return to your tents.”
31 ‘But as for you, stand here by Me, that I may speak to you all the commandments and the statutes and the judgments which you shall teach them, that they may observe them in the land which I give them to possess.’
32 “So you shall observe to do just as the Lord your God has commanded you; you shall not turn aside to the right or to the left.
33 “You shall walk in all the way which the Lord your God has commanded you, that you may live and that it may be well with you, and that you may prolong your days in the land which you will possess.


repeat...

31 ‘But as for you, stand here by Me, that I may speak to you all the commandments and the statutes and the judgments which you shall teach them, that they may observe them in the land which I give them to possess.’
32 “So you shall observe to do just as the Lord your God has commanded you; you shall not turn aside to the right or to the left.
33 “You shall walk in all the way which the Lord your God has commanded you, that you may live and that it may be well with you, and that you may prolong your days in the land which you will possess.



In full context Moses is administering the covenant and this is his conversation with the nation people of Israel...the 10 are apportioned to the 613...ask any good Jew...SMH
 
B

brakelite

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There is a huge difference between the laws of Moses and the laws of God. Note the following verse...19 ¶ Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. ....now the apostle John says that sin is transgression against the law. Above we see a law added because of sin. If sin therefore is against a law, and we have another law added because of it, then surely simple logic screams that hey!!! we have two different laws!!!! How simple is that? So because of sin, sin or transgression against God's laws, (laws by the way that existed eons prior to Adam and Eve for even Lucifer sinned against those very laws being a liar and a murderer, besides likely many other things as well) another law was added in order to correct the problem. That is the law of Moses, added because of transgression against the law of God. The law of Moses was for Israel the gospel. For Israel it was God's means (through the sanctuary) to bring Israel back into His favor. All accomplished through a priesthood that acted as mediators. When Jesus came, He took over the role as Mediator, and the laws that pertained to the sanctuary became obsolete, or redundant. To claim these laws are the same sounds like a desperate attempt to avoid recognition of God's laws today.
 

Barrd

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justaname said:
The way it was recorded has no bearing on weather or not the 10 are attached to the 613. You are beginning with a false premise and you don't even see it...

Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word from the mouth of God...


so then to the rest of the story in the Deuteronomy passage...

22 “These words the Lord spoke to all your assembly at the mountain from the midst of the fire, of the cloud and of the thick gloom, with a great voice, and He added no more. He wrote them on two tablets of stone and gave them to me.
23 “And when you heard the voice from the midst of the darkness, while the mountain was burning with fire, you came near to me, all the heads of your tribes and your elders.
24 “You said, ‘Behold, the Lord our God has shown us His glory and His greatness, and we have heard His voice from the midst of the fire; we have seen today that God speaks with man, yet he lives.
25 ‘Now then why should we die? For this great fire will consume us; if we hear the voice of the Lord our God any longer, then we will die.
26 ‘For who is there of all flesh who has heard the voice of the living God speaking from the midst of the fire, as we have, and lived?
27 ‘Go near and hear all that the Lord our God says; then speak to us all that the Lord our God speaks to you, and we will hear and do it.
28 “The Lord heard the voice of your words when you spoke to me, and the Lord said to me, ‘I have heard the voice of the words of this people which they have spoken to you. They have done well in all that they have spoken.
29 ‘Oh that they had such a heart in them, that they would fear Me and keep all My commandments always, that it may be well with them and with their sons forever!
30 ‘Go, say to them, “Return to your tents.”
31 ‘But as for you, stand here by Me, that I may speak to you all the commandments and the statutes and the judgments which you shall teach them, that they may observe them in the land which I give them to possess.’
32 “So you shall observe to do just as the Lord your God has commanded you; you shall not turn aside to the right or to the left.
33 “You shall walk in all the way which the Lord your God has commanded you, that you may live and that it may be well with you, and that you may prolong your days in the land which you will possess.


repeat...

31 ‘But as for you, stand here by Me, that I may speak to you all the commandments and the statutes and the judgments which you shall teach them, that they may observe them in the land which I give them to possess.’
32 “So you shall observe to do just as the Lord your God has commanded you; you shall not turn aside to the right or to the left.
33 “You shall walk in all the way which the Lord your God has commanded you, that you may live and that it may be well with you, and that you may prolong your days in the land which you will possess.



In full context Moses is administering the covenant and this is his conversation with the nation people of Israel...the 10 are apportioned to the 613...ask any good Jew...SMH
You skipped quite a bit of the text.

Deu 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.
Deu 4:14 And the LORD commanded me at that time to teach you statutes and judgments, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go over to possess it.

There is obviously a difference here. There are the Ten Commandments, which "He commanded you to perform"....and then there are the statutes and judgements, which "the Lord commanded me....to teach you". Notice, too, that Moses is careful to mention those stone tablets.
Justaname, have you ever heard the phrase "engraved in stone"?
What does it mean?

The last person I'd ask to explain God's will to me would be a Jew. Didn't they reject their King?
 

Barrd

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brakelite said:
There is a huge difference between the laws of Moses and the laws of God. Note the following verse...19 ¶ Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. ....now the apostle John says that sin is transgression against the law. Above we see a law added because of sin. If sin therefore is against a law, and we have another law added because of it, then surely simple logic screams that hey!!! we have two different laws!!!! How simple is that? So because of sin, sin or transgression against God's laws, (laws by the way that existed eons prior to Adam and Eve for even Lucifer sinned against those very laws being a liar and a murderer, besides likely many other things as well) another law was added in order to correct the problem. That is the law of Moses, added because of transgression against the law of God. The law of Moses was for Israel the gospel. For Israel it was God's means (through the sanctuary) to bring Israel back into His favor. All accomplished through a priesthood that acted as mediators. When Jesus came, He took over the role as Mediator, and the laws that pertained to the sanctuary became obsolete, or redundant. To claim these laws are the same sounds like a desperate attempt to avoid recognition of God's laws today.
Once again, thank you, Brakelite.
You have said it better than I could.
 

Barrd

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ATP said:
No, you have that backwards. We need to keep His commandments if we expect to see Grace in our lives. If we fall short, which we do every day, the seed of God will still remain in us, to teach us, discipline us and sanctify us. What does imperishable mean here...

1 Pet 1:23 NIV For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.
Almost there kiddo!
 

Phoneman777

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ATP said:
Uh no, what I am preaching is that we no longer keep on sinning because the seed of God remains in us forever. You're almost there kiddo.
No, bro, what you are preaching is what the majority of Christians believe today. So, to claim that your message is only embraced by the "few who seek the truth" is just plain idiotic.
 

Phoneman777

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The Barrd said:
There is nothing hard about your doctrine.

You forget, I live in Southern Alabama...there is a big Baptist church right up the road from me, and another about two blocks from here...another huge one near the courthouse....and several more peppered through this little town.
And all of them....all of them teach this doctrine.
I just never paid it much attention before, any more than I pay much attention to the even more popular "charismatic movement".
Such things hold absolutely no attraction for me.
Why would they? I've told you....I fell in love with Jesus many, many years ago....what do I need with the phony glitz and glamour when I have the real deal?
Can you imagine him claiming that his doctrine is "hard"? LOL He calls it hard!

What the flip is so difficult about the idea that "I may sin as much as I like and still fully expect to be granted eternal life."

You are right, it is downright sad... :(
 

justaname

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brakelite said:
There is a huge difference between the laws of Moses and the laws of God. Note the following verse...19 ¶ Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. ....now the apostle John says that sin is transgression against the law. Above we see a law added because of sin. If sin therefore is against a law, and we have another law added because of it, then surely simple logic screams that hey!!! we have two different laws!!!! How simple is that? So because of sin, sin or transgression against God's laws, (laws by the way that existed eons prior to Adam and Eve for even Lucifer sinned against those very laws being a liar and a murderer, besides likely many other things as well) another law was added in order to correct the problem. That is the law of Moses, added because of transgression against the law of God. The law of Moses was for Israel the gospel. For Israel it was God's means (through the sanctuary) to bring Israel back into His favor. All accomplished through a priesthood that acted as mediators. When Jesus came, He took over the role as Mediator, and the laws that pertained to the sanctuary became obsolete, or redundant. To claim these laws are the same sounds like a desperate attempt to avoid recognition of God's laws today.
This is false.

God's law is love...ordinances came because love was broken through the fall. Jesus restores us back to the original law without statutes or ordinances.


May God's Love and understanding rest upon your soul.

Shalom!
 

justaname

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The Barrd said:
You skipped quite a bit of the text.

Deu 4:13 And he declared unto you his covenant, which he commanded you to perform, even ten commandments; and he wrote them upon two tables of stone.
Deu 4:14 And the LORD commanded me at that time to teach you statutes and judgments, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go over to possess it.

There is obviously a difference here. There are the Ten Commandments, which "He commanded you to perform"....and then there are the statutes and judgements, which "the Lord commanded me....to teach you". Notice, too, that Moses is careful to mention those stone tablets.
Justaname, have you ever heard the phrase "engraved in stone"?
What does it mean?

The last person I'd ask to explain God's will to me would be a Jew. Didn't they reject their King?
Deuteronomy 4:13-14 is stating the 10 commandments are included in the Mosaic covenant...


Why would I be concerned with commands engraved in stone, when His laws are engraved on my heart?
 

Phoneman777

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justaname said:
Again the 10 are contained in the 613...they never were separated in the way you claim...

Christians are not held to the 10 any more than they are held to the 613...

Perhaps you should reread when the Israelites undertook the Covenant administered through Moses...the ten were apportioned to the entire covenant...its called the Mosaic Covenant...

Here homosexuality is OK they way you put it also...
Justaname, I've challenged other liberals here who believe that Christians are not obligated to keep the Ten Commandments to publicly declare that we are at liberty to freely break them - so far, no one has been courageous enough to do so.

In a stunning turn of events, Uppsaladragby actually attempted to argue that "we are not obligated to keep the Ten Commandments but we are not at liberty to act contrary to them".

Until recently, this was the most shocking example of "religious doublespeak" that I'd ever heard.
 

Phoneman777

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justaname said:
This is false.

God's law is love...ordinances came because love was broken through the fall. Jesus restores us back to the original law without statutes or ordinances.


May God's Love and understanding rest upon your soul.

Shalom!
The most glaring example of the Biblical distinction between the Mosaic Law and the Ten Commandments is that it is not a sin to disregard the former (1 Corinthians 7:19 KJV) but it is fully sin to disregard the latter (James 2:10-12 KJV).
 

Barrd

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Phoneman777 said:
Can you imagine him claiming that his doctrine is "hard"? LOL He calls it hard!

What the flip is so difficult about the idea that "I may sin as much as I like and still fully expect to be granted eternal life."

You are right, it is downright sad... :(
It's ridiculous, as is this idea that the Ten Commandments are a part of the Old Covenant Mosaic Law.
I mean, the Ten Commandments are timeless. They are the basic laws that we must live by. I can't imagine any Christian who would dare to claim that we might break those laws with impunity....I don't think your challenge is going to get any takers, PM...
 

justaname

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The Barrd said:
Which laws would those be, Justaname?
I'm frankly curious, here....
The laws in my signature...

The Royal Law...

Love
 
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