SATAN, NOT BOUND YET

[WPM]

BRETHREN IN CHRIST: (I do not recognize Spiritual Israelite as a brother in Christ, just so others know).

The actual... context of 2 Peter 3:7-12 is about God's future destruction of this present world by His "consuming fire", and Peter injects a bit of information pointing to Christ's future "thousand years" reign after that "consuming fire" destruction in verses 8 & 9. So when covering the subject of those 2 Peter 3:8-9 verses, those other 7, 10, 11 & 12 verses must be considered along with that. And the order of the subject is...

2 Peter 3:7 - this present world is reserved unto destruction by fire.

verse 8 - but don't be ignorant that to God a 'day' is like a "thousand years".
verse 9 - for God is longsuffering, not wanting that any should perish.
(Those 8 & 9 verses is Peter doing a parenthetical description of Christ's future literal "thousand years" reign which is part of this present world time after His future return.)

verses 10-12 - Peter then picks up the subject from verse 7 about God's "consuming fire" burning man's works off the earth.

What the Biblically illiterate, like Spiritual Israelite, refuses to understand per Bible Scripture as written, is that coming "consuming fire" event on the "day of the Lord" when Jesus returns, will NOT begin God's future Kingdom of the New Heavens and a New Earth, not yet. It will only destroy man's works off the surface of this earth, and those armies that try to come up against His people on the last day of this present world age. Christ's "thousand years" literal reign of Revelation 20 is part of this present world time, but for AFTER Christ's future return.

How do we know then, just when... God's new heavens and a new earth time comes?

Easy, ALL... the wicked that reject Him and His Son, and the abode of hell, and Satan, and even the concept of death, MUST all be destroyed into the "lake of fire" after God's Great White Throne Judgement that happens after Christ's "thousand years" reign (as written in Rev.20). Only then... will God's future Eternity of the new heavens and a new earth happen.

So here is an easy way to KNOW... that God's future new heavens and a new earth has not happened yet. IF... the wicked are not all cast into the "lake of fire", and Satan is not cast into the "lake of fire" yet, and death is not cast into that "lake of fire" yet, then we are still in this present world age.

Now the Amill folks believe all that will happen on the day of Christ's future return, but that is not written simply because Jesus gave the Rev.20 detail. They will try and use Scripture given PRIOR to Christ's Revelation about the wicked being destroyed, but don't fall into that trap, because Lord Jesus UPDATED those things with His Witness in His Book of Revelation, giving us more details.

Your hatred toward Amils is palpable. God have mercy upon you.

And, significantly, do you know answer to the arguments a present. No wonder you are full of bitterness and frustration.

 

[WPM]

When someone moves so far away from Bible Scripture as written, then there is no choice but to think of that person as a 'reprobate' away from Christ. And it's the reprobates that need to REPENT to Christ, not those who keep God's Word.

Are you God? So, if someone disagrees with you then they aren't reprobate? You don't get it do you?

 

[Douggg]

Just like with Job, Satan today is STILL in the heavenly dimension able to accuse us before God's throne. He is still free to move up and down in the earth within that heavenly dimension, like Peter showed in 1 Peter 5:8, seeking whom he may devour.

I don't think Satan is able to freely roam in the third heaven. But if God summons him to appear before God, then Satan in that limited condition, can do so, but only if God summons him.

Back long ago when Satan and a third of the angels rebelled against God, they were kicked out of the third heaven. Currently, Satan and his angels occupy the second heaven, i.e. the cosmos, and earth and its atmosphere.

In Revelation 12:7-9, the war that will take place in heaven (the second heaven of the cosmos), Satan and his angels will be cast down to earth - as God begins dismantling Satan's mystical kingdom called "Babylon the great".

In Ezekiel 28:16-19, the casting down of Satan to earth is prophesied. When Satan is cast down to earth, God is going to expose him to kings of the earth. And bring a fire up in Satan's midst, bringing to ashes, to expose him.

How is that going to happen ? It will be at Jesus's return. Satan will be indwelling the statue image of the beast king, that will be on the temple mount. Jesus is going to cause that image to go up in flames and turned ashes. Exposing Satan there on the temple mount - for all to see that day.

To everyone who had worshiped the statue image, they are going to be shocked when they discover that they had actually been worshiping Satan by doing so. Verse 19.

16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.

17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.

18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

 

[WPM]

Unlike you, I don't base whether someone is in Christ on whether they agree with my end times doctrine or not. So, I would never stoop to your level and claim that you are not in Christ just because you disagree with my understanding of Revelation 20.


Any objective person can see the true context of 2 Peter 3, as I indicated in my previous post. They can also see that you try to change the context to fit your doctrine.

This guy has lost it! These charges are totally out of order.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I think in 2Peter3:8- 9, Peter was responding to scoffers in verse 3, who were saying in verse 4...

3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,

4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

I think the most important part of 2Peter:3:8-9 is....

9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

It may seem like a long time, but the Lord has a reason for it - not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

Right. I agree. Did you think I was saying otherwise?

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

This guy has lost it! These charges are totally out of order.

He lost it long ago already. And he's not the only one who acts as if someone's end times doctrine is a determining factor in one's salvation. For some reason forums like this attract weirdos who have no sense of reality.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

I agree! Something has changed since COVID-19. There is a dark oppression that has come in close on the people of God that has never been there before. The devil is taking liberties at the moment. It seems like the pit has been opened and demons have been released left, right and center. But his time is short.

I sense that as well. We're not just imagining this. There seems to be very little restraint against wickedness at this point.

 

[Davy]

Your hatred toward Amils is palpable. God have mercy upon you.

And, significantly, do you know answer to the arguments a present. No wonder you are full of bitterness and frustration.

That's a stupid statement. I do not hate the people who are deceived, like you are.

I hate the FALSE DOCTRINE of Amillennialism. There's a difference silly.

And by that... you have been REPORTED for making up a lie.

 

[Davy]

I don't think Satan is able to freely roam in the third heaven. But if God summons him to appear before God, then Satan in that limited condition, can do so, but only if God summons him.

Back long ago when Satan and a third of the angels rebelled against God, they were kicked out of the third heaven. Currently, Satan and his angels occupy the second heaven, i.e. the cosmos, and earth and its atmosphere.

In Revelation 12:7-9, the war that will take place in heaven (the second heaven of the cosmos), Satan and his angels will be cast down to earth - as God begins dismantling Satan's mystical kingdom called "Babylon the great".

In Ezekiel 28:16-19, the casting down of Satan to earth is prophesied. When Satan is cast down to earth, God is going to expose him to kings of the earth. And bring a fire up in Satan's midst, bringing to ashes, to expose him.

How is that going to happen ? It will be at Jesus's return. Satan will be indwelling the statue image of the beast king, that will be on the temple mount. Jesus is going to cause that image to go up in flames and turned ashes. Exposing Satan there on the temple mount - for all to see that day.

To everyone who had worshiped the statue image, they are going to be shocked when they discover that they had actually been worshiping Satan by doing so. Verse 19.

16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.

17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.

18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

Well, you reveal you don't really understand what the idea of the 'third heaven' really is. There are only TWO actual heaven types written of in God's creation per Genesis. So the idea of a third heaven must be about... ? Hmmm? What was Peter's main subject in 2 Peter 3?

Cosmos - you don't realize the real meaning of that word either...

That word is about this MATERIAL WORLD, TO INCLUDE THE WHOLE UNIVERSE. The sky around the earth is called a 'heaven', and is part of that.

But the other dimension of existence where God and the angels dwell, is NOT about a material world, not about the universe of material matter. The Heaven where God dwells is made up of SPIRIT, not material matter. You should have learned that from Hebrews 1.

So how are you going to get others to actually believe you know your Bible and what you are talking about if you don't understand this simple matter I mention about the 2 separate dimensions of existence?

 

[Davy]

Are you God? So, if someone disagrees with you then they aren't reprobate? You don't get it do you?

Thus in your... mind, there's no way to tell when someone is NOT following and keeping God's Word as written?? Right! and pull my other leg and it plays Jingle Bells!

 

[WPM]

Thus in your... mind, there's no way to tell when someone is NOT following and keeping God's Word as written?? Right! and pull my other leg and it plays Jingle Bells!

Does your mum know that you are not in bed?

 

[WPM]

That's a stupid statement. I do not hate the people who are deceived, like you are.

I hate the FALSE DOCTRINE of Amillennialism. There's a difference silly.

And by that... you have been REPORTED for making up a lie.

Stop telling lies. The bitterness is oozing out of you.

 

[Douggg]

Well, you reveal you don't really understand what the idea of the 'third heaven' really is. There are only TWO actual heaven types written of in God's creation per Genesis. So the idea of a third heaven must be about... ? Hmmm? What was Peter's main subject in 2 Peter 3?

Cosmos - you don't realize the real meaning of that word either...

That word is about this MATERIAL WORLD, TO INCLUDE THE WHOLE UNIVERSE. The sky around the earth is called a 'heaven', and is part of that.

But the other dimension of existence where God and the angels dwell, is NOT about a material world, not about the universe of material matter. The Heaven where God dwells is made up of SPIRIT, not material matter. You should have learned that from Hebrews 1.

So how are you going to get others to actually believe you know your Bible and what you are talking about if you don't understand this simple matter I mention about the 2 separate dimensions of existence?

2Corinthians12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.

The third heaven is where God's throne is.

The second heaven is the cosmos - i.e the stars you see in the sky at night.

The first heaven is the earth's atmosphere.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

2Corinthians12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.

The third heaven is where God's throne is.

The second heaven is the cosmos - i.e the stars you see in the sky at night.

The first heaven is the earth's atmosphere.

Agree, except I would say that the third heaven IS God's throne rather than saying that is where God's throne is.

Isaiah 66:1 Thus saith the Lord, The heaven is my throne, and the earth is my footstool: where is the house that ye build unto me? and where is the place of my rest?

 

[Davy]

Does your mum know that you are not in bed?

May God rebuke you.

 

[Davy]

2Corinthians12:2 I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth;) such an one caught up to the third heaven.

The third heaven is where God's throne is.

The second heaven is the cosmos - i.e the stars you see in the sky at night.

The first heaven is the earth's atmosphere.

You think I didn't know where you were pulling that "third heaven" idea from?

The "third heaven" Paul was taken to, in the Spirit, is about the future 3rd world earth age that Apostle Peter pointed to in 2 Peter 3. It is about 'time', heavenly ages, not a literal third level... in Heaven.

I strongly suggest you go over Hebrews 11:3 and Romans 1:19-20 about the invisible working of God's creation. Apostle John in John 4 said "God is a Spirit," thus there is a difference between this earthly dimension of material matter, which includes the sky and whole universe, vs. that other dimension made up of Spirit.

Even in John 3:6 Lord Jesus showed this distinction between the TWO separate dimensions when He said, "That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit."

Heb 11:3
3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.
KJV


Rom 1:19-20
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of Him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

What does this mean about Heaven then? It means God's abode, and the abode of the angels, including the abode of hell or hades, are all... in the invisible dimension of Spirit. It is NOT on some far away planet in another galaxy or solar system, for those things are part of our 'earthly' dimension of material matter.

Even our sky around the earth is made up of material matter, so that's not God's Heavenly abode either. Belief that the sky is God's abode is an old superstition created by the simple minded who cannot understand about the 2 different dimensions of existence written of in God's Word.

In 1 Corinthians 15, when Apostle Paul described the Heavenly dimension body, he referred to it as the "image of the heavenly" and with the "spiritual body" he taught there. Paul even declared there that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, because neither does corruption (flesh) inherit incorruption (spirit body).

Many of Judah are still stuck on that Old Testament materialism thinking about the soul and resurrection body when The New Testament reveals our spirit body and soul are of that other dimension of Spirit, and not made up of material matter at all. Really, in Ecclesiastes 12:5-7, it was first revealed how our flesh body is of this earthly dimension, and our spirit is of the heavenly dimension of Spirit where God dwells.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You think I didn't know where you were pulling that "third heaven" idea from?

The "third heaven" Paul was taken to, in the Spirit, is about the future 3rd world earth age that Apostle Peter pointed to in 2 Peter 3. It is about 'time', heavenly ages, not a literal third level... in Heaven.

You just make things up. It's unbelievable. You have quite the imagination.

2 Corinthians 12:2 I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago was caught up to the third heaven. Whether it was in the body or out of the body I do not know—God knows. 3 And I know that this man—whether in the body or apart from the body I do not know, but God knows— 4 was caught up to paradise and heard inexpressible things, things that no one is permitted to tell.

The third heaven is paradise, not "the future 3rd world earth age". Good grief. You just make scripture say whatever you want it to say.

 

[Dash RipRock]

May God rebuke you.

Trying to get the Lord to attack somebody?

 

[Davy]

Trying to get the Lord to attack somebody?

I actually don't have to ask; correction will be forthcoming anyway, of their own doing. You do recall Jesus saying that He rebukes and chastens those whom He loves? (Rev.3:19)

 

[Dash RipRock]

I actually don't have to ask; correction will be forthcoming anyway, of their own doing. You do recall Jesus saying that He rebukes and chastens those whom He loves? (Rev.3:19)

You were wanting the Lord to correct them, or strike them down with cancer or a brain tumor or something?