Saved, which means what?

[Enoch111]

We may know in this moment that we are walking with Him, but we do not know what we will be doing at the end of our course.

There is no such uncertainty in Scripture. Just as a baby cannot be unborn and return to his mother's womb, a child of God cannot be unborn. At the same time Christians are exhorted to GROW IN GRACE and in the knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ.

All those who think that their eventual salvation is in their hands do not really understand what God has done in Christ for the sake of His people.

 

[ChristisGod]

wadr you surely interpret 1Cor15 to suit yourself, and your bargain with death will be annulled
i guess

What you sow does not come to life unless it dies.

"buried with Him in death, raised to new life in Him"

Paul is hard to understand
16 He writes this way in all hisletters, speaking in them about such matters. Some parts of his letters are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
17Therefore, beloved, since you already know these things, be on your guard so that you will not be carried away by the error of the lawless and fall from your secure standing...

i dont know, ok, but i underwent a little emo experience in getting "saved" and "baptized" in a 501c3 "church," and then we went and had a celebration afterward, no "death" involved at all yeh, and i suspect that you prolly underwent the same Club Initiation and now believe...ha, well, what they told us i guess, which was designed to tickle eh

so believe in the kingdom that comes by observation, tomorrow, for as long as you want to, no sin in that, and i dont even blame you. But imo dont forget that the Bible says when the overwhelming scourge passes through, you will be trampled

I'm not suiting myself Paul says we will have immortality in the resurrection.

1 Cor 15:51-54
Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52 in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53 For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality. 54 When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.

hope this helps !!!

 

[amadeus]

There is no such uncertainty in Scripture. Just as a baby cannot be unborn and return to his mother's womb, a child of God cannot be unborn. At the same time Christians are exhorted to GROW IN GRACE and in the knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ.

All those who think that their eventual salvation is in their hands do not really understand what God has done in Christ for the sake of His people.

No such uncertainty? Which man was so certain that he could and would never fail? Paul recognized his frailty as a man and fought to do what? Consider what he writes here:

"I therefore so run, not as uncertainly; so fight I, not as one that beateth the air:
But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway." I Cor 9:26-27

 

[bbyrd009]

I'm not suiting myself Paul says we will have immortality in the resurrection.

so go with that then, but i think its even obvious that Paul does not ever say directly that you will become an immortal? That even violates other Scripture?

 

[marks]

I'm not suiting myself Paul says we will have immortality in the resurrection.

1 Cor 15:51-54
Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed— 52 in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed. 53 For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality. 54 When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.

hope this helps !!!

I'd say that's pretty clear, unless someone wants to argue, though it SAYS that, it doesn't MEAN that, which I do hear a lot!

Much love!

 

[Philip James]

Saved, which means what?

Rescued from death and invited to
Unity with the One Who is Life!

Peace be with you!

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Are we consuming mammon or God... or are we trying to consume them both in order to retain/obtain the best of both worlds: The world of the old man and the world of the new man?

maybe. Yet, is it possible to have the best of both? James 1:6-8 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed. [7] For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord. [8] A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.

 

[amadeus]

maybe. Yet, is it possible to have the best of both? James 1:6-8 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed. [7] For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord. [8] A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.

For a period of time God may allow us to get away with things that are really, like double mindedness, but eventually...

"Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:" Acts 17:29-30

And then see...

"I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth." Rev 3:15-16

 

[VictoryinJesus]

For a period of time God may allow us to get away with things that are really, like double mindedness, but eventually...

"Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:" Acts 17:29-30

And then see...

"I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot.
So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth." Rev 3:15-16

concerning the topic of salvation, another passage that I’ve been considering today is:

2 Corinthians 4:7-11 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. [8] We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; [9] Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; [10] Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body. [11] For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, (Mark 10:30, with persecutions) that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.

‘Always delivered unto death for Jesus sake’ ...that what is not moth eaten or burnt, or withered, or consumed; the life of Jesus might be made manifest.

 

[Enoch111]

Which man was so certain that he could and would never fail?

Every man can fail but God and Christ cannot fail. And that was my point.

EPHESIANS 1: GOD HAS PREDESTINATED HIS CHILDREN
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
6 T o the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace...

 

[VictoryinJesus]

concerning the topic of salvation, another passage that I’ve been considering today is:

2 Corinthians 4:7-11 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. [8] We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; [9] Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; [10] Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body. [11] For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, (Mark 10:30, with persecutions) that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.

‘Always delivered unto death for Jesus sake’ ...that what is not moth eaten or burnt, or withered, or consumed; the life of Jesus might be made manifest.

Can relate to ‘perplexed’

‘we are perplexed, but not in despair;’
Topical Bible: Perplexed 2. (a.) Entangled, involved, or confused; hence, embarrassed; puzzled; doubtful; anxious.

 

[amadeus]

concerning the topic of salvation, another passage that I’ve been considering today is:

2 Corinthians 4:7-11 But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us. [8] We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; [9] Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; [10] Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body. [11] For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, (Mark 10:30, with persecutions) that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.

‘Always delivered unto death for Jesus sake’ ...that what is not moth eaten or burnt, or withered, or consumed; the life of Jesus might be made manifest.

To become unsaved after meeting Jesus and receiving the Holy Ghost a person has to purposely disobey God. We really have power even if we don't even think about it when we do use it. We have to ignore or neglect or suppress that power, the Holy Spirit in us, to do those things.

Once you really have met the Master and really walked with Him for some length of time going away from Him is not going to be an accidental occurrence. But, if a person little by little over time begins to goes against what he knows is right before God, he may find himself in a place eventually where there is no room or time for repentance. Or he will actually fall out of love with Jesus and then God will send him a delusion and he will believe he is OK, when he is not. These are hypothetical situations which I don't like to detail because I am not God and really am unable to accurately and fairly judge. Fortunately for everyone I am not to be their ultimate judge in the things of God. But too many people like to take hold of a place where they never have to worry about falling or turning away from God. In this natural span of years allotted to us, I don't believe there is such a place. If we really love God and daily work on loving Him more, I do not believe we will ever have a problem with backsliding.

 

[amadeus]

Every man can fail but God and Christ cannot fail. And that was my point.

EPHESIANS 1: GOD HAS PREDESTINATED HIS CHILDREN
3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:
5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,
6 T o the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.
7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace...

God cannot fail, but we can take over our own reins then even if we try to fight a battle against sinning all alone, we will usually or even always lose. God does not lose battles, but we do have to power to quench the Holy Spirit of God in us. Churches as a part of their scheduled programs teach their people to do just that, quench the Holy Spirit, although they would not call it that.

 

[Waiting on him]

To become unsaved after meeting Jesus and receiving the Holy Ghost a person has to purposely disobey God.

If I was this kind of father to my children I would hope someone would shoot me in the head.

 

[historyb]

what does 'saved' even mean?" might be another interesting avenue

Salvation is a Process
The road to God’s Kingdom is often bumpy and sometimes hazardous, but it leads to the pearl of great price. No effort is too great for such a glorious treasure. Our role in the process of salvation consists of four steps:

Salvation is a Process

How Are We Saved? - Theology - Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of America

--------------------

I wish we could get cold here with an air conditioner, all we have is an water cooler in So Cal with 110 heat and 30 percent humidity.

 

[ChristisGod]

If I was this kind of father to my children I would hope someone would shoot me in the head.

We know the new birth(spiritual) like the physical birth is irreversible. Thats why Paul says we are sealed with the HS and that His dwelling in us is His down-payment(guarantee) of our inheritance.

 

[Enoch111]

Salvation is a Process

Salvation is BOTH an accomplished fact and a process. If you were to die tonight, you are either saved or lost, depending on whether you are a child of God. The process is called sanctification, and it culminates in glorification. Sanctification follows justification.

 

[Tong2020]

what does 'saved' even mean?"

"saved" means delivered out of danger and into safety, and delivered from that which is evil and into that which is good.

For the Christian, such deliverance or salvation, more than from the evil things that happens in this world that harms them, is from sin, slavery to sin, and ultimately from the second death. In general, such is deliverance or salvation from death (without life, being separate from God) and into life (being in fellowship with God).

Tong
R1041

 

[2 Chr. 34:19]

Saved from torment, where there will be weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth.

My lovely aunt died young many years ago. She was such a good person, but not a Christ believer. When I saw her last week, she was weeping and wailing uncontrollably

 

[Brakelite]

To become unsaved after meeting Jesus and receiving the Holy Ghost a person has to purposely disobey God. We really have power even if we don't even think about it when we do use it. We have to ignore or neglect or suppress that power, the Holy Spirit in us, to do those things.

Once you really have met the Master and really walked with Him for some length of time going away from Him is not going to be an accidental occurrence. But, if a person little by little over time begins to goes against what he knows is right before God, he may find himself in a place eventually where there is no room or time for repentance. Or he will actually fall out of love with Jesus and then God will send him a delusion and he will believe he is OK, when he is not. These are hypothetical situations which I don't like to detail because I am not God and really am unable to accurately and fairly judge. Fortunately for everyone I am not to be their ultimate judge in the things of God. But too many people like to take hold of a place where they never have to worry about falling or turning away from God. In this natural span of years allotted to us, I don't believe there is such a place. If we really love God and daily work on loving Him more, I do not believe we will ever have a problem with backsliding.

I think that is a very good evaluation. It allows for free will and a deliberate determination to follow after unrighteousness, but expresses the difficulty that I believe would come with such a decision knowing God would make such a decision unattractive.

In response to their insolence, and their ingratitude for His providence; God
sent a swarm of deadly poisonous vipers

I think it would be more accurate to believe that those snakes were always in that wilderness, but Good removed His protection. I think the same could be said of many instances where we tend to think of ours and Israel's suffering as a direct result of God's action, but I rather think He is simply getting out of the way. "Except the Lord be merciful we would all perish".

quarantine will heal us?

The quarantine in one sense is Good hiding Himself in order to allow us time to come to Him and develop our faith. Like the curtains in the sanctuary. They were there to protect everyone from the death that would result from our sinful natures getting to close to God's holiness.
You know how we feel when we offend a friend or a spouse? We don't want to look them in the eye until we are certain we are forgiven. Sometimes even one offended by adultery never trust fully again although she had forgiven and stayed in the marriage. Isaiah was "undone" ... Woe is me he cried... Because He saw himself as he truly was in the light of Gods glory. God isn't going about seekng excuses to destroy us. On the contrary. He's going about doing all He can to save us from ourselves.