SHABBAT SHALOM

[GracePeace]

I can't find "New Creation" but I do find "New Creature" is this what you talking about?

When Paul says we are a "New Creature", that new creature is a part of the New Creation spoken of in Revelation (even the very same wording is used--"all old things have passed away Behold all things are new")--a "creature" is "created", thus a new creature infers and is evidence of a new act of creating and not by coincidence this is precisely what is foretold in Revelation. We're just foretastes of it.

Gal 6:15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

2Co 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

Rom 8:18 For I reckon that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory which shall be revealed in us.
Rom 8:19 For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.
Rom 8:20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
Rom 8:21 Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
Rom 8:22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
Rom 8:23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
Rom 8:24 For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope: for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
Rom 8:25 But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.

This New creature. It is redemption from corruption which we fell into.
It's not a recreating it's a cleansing.
You redeem a bottle of soda. You wash it and reuse it, you don't create another bottle.

So these are two different arguments : 1) the New Creation hasn't arrived, 2) the New Creation is just the same old one and not new.

Responses :
1) If any man, be in Christ is WILL BE a new creature? No, He IS a new creature. New, creation has dawned.
2) In Revelation it says heaven and earth flee away and new heavens and earth are made. That is a new heavens and earth not the same ones.

Unless ye become as little children...
You need to start over clean not physically be reborn from a womb again.

I don't believe you've proven that.

This verse:
Rom 8:20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,

this vanity, this hope..

Mat 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.
Mat 6:23 But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!

You ever notice how many prominent people in power get black eyes? weird.
Why Do So Many Politicians and Celebrities Have Black Eyes?
Why Do So Many Politicians and Celebrities Have Black Eyes?

Most of them are Luciferians and prefer the darkness.
They are just showing us their true nature.

Not relevant.

This New Creation.. I believe is a conversion process, going from darkness to light.
It's not another creation but rather a transformation into a new way.
You don't keep making a caterpillar until you come up with a butterfly.
The caterpillar is the butterfly before it evolves into a new creature.

No. Adam was destroyed and Christ is head of new race. If a clay pot is defiled it can't be cleaned it has to be destroyed. The only changing from a caterpillar to a butterfly going on in Adam is from evil to more evil (ending in the mark of the beast).

So if we are transforming, evolving, converting into a new creature which is still the original only changed...
would we still need another rest after attaining that rest through conversion?

Not related to a new act of creating be necessitating a new act of resting.

Hope all goes well at the doctors.
Hugs

It's not for me. Thanks

 

[Ziggy]

1Co 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

I liken this to Joshua pulled from the fire and given new clothes.

Zec 3:3 Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and stood before the angel.
Zec 3:4 And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.

Now has Joshua become a New Creature? Redeemed, converted, changed from corrptible to incorruption?

I have this theory. It's called History repeats itself.
The new heaven and the new earth in the book of Revelation is the heaven and the earth recorded in Genesis.
World without end.
Beginning and ending like the circle of life.
Once having created "the loop" the circle.. it is neverending.
If there is a New Sabbath it will be the same as the Old Sabbath until all creation eternally comes to the knowledge of God.
Those who have died not knowing the Lord will live through another cycle.
Those that have been converted no longer need to climb up and down Jacob's ladder unless they are sent or choose to be as angels unaware like travellers just passing through.
Touched by an Angel.. or Highway to Heaven.

However there is a difference between the old and the new. One has a sun and moon and the other does not.
However, the heaven and earth in Genesis was formed before the sun and moon and stars.
They perhaps existed in the Light that God said was good. But it prefered the darkness so God set lights in the heavens to guide us.
Meaning the new heaven and new earth as well as the old heaven and the old earth, existed in the light.. in the Kingdom of God.
But was made subject to vanity... so that there would be hope.

Everything is a test.
So Adam is Satan and Jesus is God.
Satan told Jesus all things had been given unto him and he could give it to whomever he chose.
The only one God gave all authority to over everything was Adam.
However, Adam sold himself to the devil by being obedient to him/her.. do genders matter?
They sold themselves to death.. because of vanity.. being made subject to vanity..

I have a question..
How many times you think we been round this merry go round?

 

[GracePeace]

1Co 15:54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

I liken this to Joshua pulled from the fire and given new clothes.

Zec 3:3 Now Joshua was clothed with filthy garments, and stood before the angel.
Zec 3:4 And he answered and spake unto those that stood before him, saying, Take away the filthy garments from him. And unto him he said, Behold, I have caused thine iniquity to pass from thee, and I will clothe thee with change of raiment.

Now has Joshua become a New Creature? Redeemed, converted, changed from corrptible to incorruption?

I have this theory. It's called History repeats itself.
The new heaven and the new earth in the book of Revelation is the heaven and the earth recorded in Genesis.
World without end.
Beginning and ending like the circle of life.
Once having created "the loop" the circle.. it is neverending.
If there is a New Sabbath it will be the same as the Old Sabbath until all creation eternally comes to the knowledge of God.

There is a new creation now. It even says "created in Christ for good works"--God calls it a new creation even if you think it doesn't qualify.

Those who have died not knowing the Lord will live through another cycle.

Not sure what you're referring to here.

Those that have been converted no longer need to climb up and down Jacob's ladder unless they are sent or choose to be as angels unaware like travellers just passing through.
Touched by an Angel.. or Highway to Heaven.

Jacob's Ladder wasn't climbed by people but by angels right? Guess it doesn't matter since it's not the topic.

However there is a difference between the old and the new. One has a sun and moon and the other does not.
However, the heaven and earth in Genesis was formed before the sun and moon and stars.
They perhaps existed in the Light that God said was good. But it prefered the darkness so God set lights in the heavens to guide us.
Meaning the new heaven and new earth as well as the old heaven and the old earth, existed in the light.. in the Kingdom of God.
But was made subject to vanity... so that there would be hope.

Everything is a test.
So Adam is Satan and Jesus is God.
Satan told Jesus all things had been given unto him and he could give it to whomever he chose.
The only one God gave all authority to over everything was Adam.
However, Adam sold himself to the devil by being obedient to him/her.. do genders matter?
They sold themselves to death.. because of vanity.. being made subject to vanity..

I have a question..
How many times you think we been round this merry go round?

Not sure what you mean.

 

[GracePeace]

Ziggy
Are you aware it has been observed that John's Gospel was purposefully presented as a other Genesis? That's because "New Creation".

 

[Ziggy]

Ziggy
Are you aware it has been observed that John's Gospel was purposefully presented as a other Genesis? That's because "New Creation".

All I can say @GracePeace is we'll find out when we get there. or not.
All I know for sure is:
When my world is a bit topsey turvey and I need to find a quiet place,
I come to this thread and listen to the songs that are posted here.
This is my safe place, my Sabbath resting place.
24/7/365
I do not promote or hinder whatever day someone wants to worship in. One or all or any.
I do not claim if you keep this day or that day you are right or wrong.
That's between YOU and the Lord.
I just created a hole in the internet fabric of things to find some comfort.
I respect everyones ideologies whether I can see it their way or not.
We are all learning. And subject to misunderstandings and mistakes.
I'm not here to argue, only to give a point of view from many different perspectives.
Like a rainbow of many colors. I believe there are many meanings in the scriptures.

You say New Creation requires a New Sabbath. OK
I say New Creation enters us into the Sabbath that already exists.
That the Sabbath is not so much a physical day although it was given to a physical existence to rest in.
But the ultimate meaning of Sabbath is to rest in God in His Day.
And I don't believe God is restricted to a 24 hour day. But his Day is eternal.

God created the Sabbath day and made it Holy and Sanctified it.
It is set apart from all other days.
This seventh day represents the last day. The day we enter into eternal rest with God himself.
It is a memorial, an event that is still yet to be.
But even while we are waiting for it, we can hmm.. imitate what it will be like. By remembering to keep it.

Like the Passover was kept as a rememberance of this past (being freed from Egypt) and future. (Being freed from eternal death)
But was kept and remembered yearly as not to forget what was and is and is yet to come.
That's how I understand the Sabbath.
It's not supposed to be a law of hostility.
It's supposed to be the gift that we anticipate entering into once we have ended our days.

Will there be another? I don't know.
I don't see a reason for another, but that's ME.
Other people see things through the rainbow spectrum too.
So you could be right or not.. I could be right or not.
It's not about right or wrong.
It's about what we do with the time we have been alloted.
Find Peace, Find Rest, it is always there waiting to be found.
24/7/365

Hugs

 

[GracePeace]

All I can say @GracePeace is we'll find out when we get there. or not.
All I know for sure is:
When my world is a bit topsey turvey and I need to find a quiet place,
I come to this thread and listen to the songs that are posted here.
This is my safe place, my Sabbath resting place.
24/7/365
I do not promote or hinder whatever day someone wants to worship in. One or all or any.
I do not claim if you keep this day or that day you are right or wrong.
That's between YOU and the Lord.
I just created a hole in the internet fabric of things to find some comfort.
I respect everyones ideologies whether I can see it their way or not.
We are all learning. And subject to misunderstandings and mistakes.
I'm not here to argue, only to give a point of view from many different perspectives.
Like a rainbow of many colors. I believe there are many meanings in the scriptures.

There is a right and a wrong way of interpreting though--if not, there would be no reason to read them as opposed to anything else.

You say New Creation requires a New Sabbath. OK
I say New Creation enters us into the Sabbath that already exists.

A warrantless dismissal of the pattern -- Creation --> Rest --> Commemoration of Rest (Sabbath)

Like the Passover was kept as a rememberance of this past (being freed from Egypt) and future. (Being freed from eternal death)
But was kept and remembered yearly as not to forget what was and is and is yet to come.

"Kept"--you mean by the Jews?
Paul warns the Galatians against observing such things--you would really help yourself reading Galatians and asking for understanding.

That's how I understand the Sabbath.
It's not supposed to be a law of hostility
It's supposed to be the gift that we anticipate entering into once we have ended our days.

Will there be another? I don't know.
I don't see a reason for another, but that's ME.

When the Creator creates, He rests, and the rest is commemorated (Sabbath).
Since there will be a new creating, there will be a new resting (new Sabbath).
That's, as has been stated and restated, the "reason"--this view is borne out of respect for God's Word.
I'm not saying you intentionally disrespect God's Word, I'm just defending my side.

Other people see things through the rainbow spectrum too.
So you could be right or not.. I could be right or not.
It's not about right or wrong.
It's about what we do with the time we have been alloted.
Find Peace, Find Rest, it is always there waiting to be found.
24/7/365

Hugs

As long as you are not saying "this is the right thing to do" which at least implies (even unintentionally) "those who do not do this aren't doing right" which means "all who do not do this are wrong" which means "do this or you will not enter God's Kingdom", I think Romans 14 may allow for it.

 

[Ziggy]

Why am I torturing myself?

Because Iron sharpens Iron.

I find it extremely uncomfortable.

It's supposed to be. To make you strong.

I'm not adversarial or confrontational.

That's why you need to get strong. To look the adversay in the eye and be still.
Don't ignore condenscending behavior. Call it out!

It will only get twisted anyways.

Then go to another thread and just walk away.

 

[GracePeace]

Why am I torturing myself?

Because Iron sharpens Iron.

I find it extremely uncomfortable.

It's supposed to be. To make you strong.

I'm not adversarial or confrontational.

That's why you need to get strong. To look the adversay in the eye and be still.
Don't ignore condenscending behavior. Call it out!

It will only get twisted anyways.

Then go to another thread and just walk away.

It really is uncomfortable to have people disregard truth.

 

[Ziggy]

 

[Ziggy]

Psa 118:24

This is the day which the LORD hath made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.

Shabbat Shalom

 

[Ziggy]

1Ch 29:11

Thine, O LORD, is the greatness, and the power, and the glory, and the victory, and the majesty: for all that is in the heaven and in the earth is thine; thine is the kingdom, O LORD, and thou art exalted as head above all.

 

[Ziggy]

 

[Ziggy]

 

[Ziggy]

Shabbat Shalom
HUGS

 

[Ziggy]

 

[Ziggy]

 

[Ziggy]

 

[Ziggy]

 

[Ziggy]

 

[Ziggy]