Shall we discuss this?

[Truther]

An identifier of His allegiance, with the two being two separate Beings; the Father being the God whom He serves, in keeping with Post #14.

Is that what Rev 3:12 means?

He speaks of his God 4 times in a single verse, even being in heaven for decades at the time?

It appears to me the last Ada(redo of the 1st Adam), has a God, yet is God too.

This can only make sense if we give Jesus, the individual, back his God, but celebrate him as God too.

The "Col 2:9 effect" is that powerful.

As a matter of fact, instead of 2 everlasting Fathers the incarnationists inadvertently teach, the only Everlasting Father, "fathers us" through the son.

This also makes the son, the "Everlasting Father" by default.


God THROUGH Jesus.

 

[Truther]

OK then. It didn't seem like it.

No, I was teaching it in homes, churches and prisons...whew!

 

[marks]

As a matter of fact, instead of 2 everlasting Fathers the incarnationists inadvertently teach,

I thought you said you understood the view. Who teaches "2 everlasting Fathers"?

Much love!

 

[Hidden In Him]

That was only a manifestation of Jesus for mankind.

He can appear any way, everywhere or any size after his resurrection.

He ascended to God which is everywhere?...I think not.

Everywhere? The throne of the Father exists in 3rd Heaven.

What is your position regarding Heaven? Do you regard it as a literal place?

 

[Truther]

Act 7:55 But he, being full of the Holy Ghost, looked up stedfastly into heaven, and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing on the right hand of God,
Act 7:56 And said, Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of man standing on the right hand of God.
Act 7:57 Then they cried out with a loud voice, and stopped their ears, and ran upon him with one accord,

seems they are still stoning those who follow after Christ

How big is God's right hand?

 

[marks]

No, I was teaching it in homes, churches and prisons...whew!

So it still doesn't seem like it to me.

So you believed in the incarnation for 30 years but now you don't, is that correct?

Much love!

 

[mjrhealth]

LoL. This always happens when we get into a debate. It becomes very tough sledding, because trying to pin you down is like trying to chase down a barnyard full of chickens, LoL... (no offense, just saying. I remember now why we never seem to get very far).

Not sure if I even know how to respond here, other than to ask the exact same question over again, and request a clearer response.

Its not a debate, there is truth and there is lie, if Jesus didnt die for you, than you have no salvation, God cannot have an Heir if HE doesnt have a son, and Jesus cannot be an Heir if HE does not have a father, but as my friend told me, how can men deny Jesus when they dont know Him,

 

[Truther]

I thought you said you understood the view. Who teaches "2 everlasting Fathers"?

Much love!

Incarnationists...inadertently.

They teach the son is actually the Everlasting Father, per Isaiah 9:6.

That is not what the verse is saying at all.

It says the (present tense)baby/son...shall be the(future tense)...

Read it and see for youself.

 

[mjrhealth]

Yes. He was Heir to the throne of David. Please explain: Are you spiritualizing the parable, or do you relate it to events taking place during New Testament times?

You would be surprised if you bothered to ever ask the one who is the Truth, that man Jesus who is being so dishonoured by men.

 

[Truther]

Everywhere? The throne of the Father exists in 3rd Heaven.

What is your position regarding Heaven? Do you regard it as a literal place?

Yes.

There is more than one heaven though per Paul.

The heaven we are speaking of is among us, though we cannot see it with carnal eyes.

When we die, we will see it for the 1st time.

Hebrews 12 says we are come unto this invisible realm, but obviously cannot see it yet.

 

[Truther]

So it still doesn't seem like it to me.

So you believed in the incarnation for 30 years but now you don't, is that correct?

Much love!

Correct.

I just cannot buy God becoming a microscopic sperm cell and mating with Mary's egg as incarnationists suppose.

Rather, I think God made a sperm cell and fertilized Mary's egg, making the son of God, and Mary making the son of man(David).

The first Adam was made from dirt, but the last Adam was made though an ovary.

 

[marks]

Incarnationists...inadertently.

They teach the son is actually the Everlasting Father, per Isaiah 9:6.

That is not what the verse is saying at all.

It says the (present tense)baby/son...shall be the(future tense)...

Read it and see for youself.

The Everlasting Father?

Interestingly, we have the ability to know how the Jews of that day understood this passage, by the way they translated it into the LXX.



Father of the about to be eon. Father of the age to come. Like that.

Much love!

 

[Hidden In Him]

Its not a debate

This is in the Debate Forum. It's a debate.

if Jesus didn't die for you, than you have no salvation

Jesus died for me in the flesh, and descended to the lower parts of the earth in Spirit. Anyone who would say He died completely is misrepresenting orthodox New Testament teaching.

 

[Truther]

The Everlasting Father?

Interestingly, we have the ability to know how the Jews of that day understood this passage, by the way they translated it into the LXX.

View attachment 10168

Father of the about to be eon. Father of the age to come. Like that.

Much love!

Egad.

Stick to the KJV.

Thanks.

 

[marks]

I just cannot buy God becoming a microscopic sperm cell and mating with Mary's egg as incarnationists suppose.

Again . . . I don't believe this, and I don't personally know anyone who does. Just the same, God, becoming a zygote. Yeah. That's humbling One's Self.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Egad.

Stick to the KJV.

Thanks.

Don't you like digging deeper?

 

[Truther]

Again . . . I don't believe this, and I don't personally know anyone who does. Just the same, God, becoming a zygote. Yeah. That's humbling One's Self.

Much love!

God is humble?

I trow not.

The last, sinless Adam humbled himself....yes indeed.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Yes.

There is more than one heaven though per Paul.

The heaven we are speaking of is among us, though we cannot see it with carnal eyes.

When we die, we will see it for the 1st time.

Hebrews 12 says we are come unto this invisible realm, but obviously cannot see it yet.

If you agree that the throne of the Father is in 3rd Heaven, how can the fullness of the Godhead come to dwell within Christ after His resurrection and yet He still ascend to be with the Father if the Father was no longer there?

 

[Truther]

Don't you like digging deeper?

Into extra Biblical error?

Nope.

I am not into the modern works of who knows who they are...

 

[marks]

God is humble?

I trow not.

The last, sinless Adam humbled himself....yes indeed.

5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

What does it mean that Jesus "took upon him the form of a servant"?

Much love!