Standing… Survey… YES or NO………………?ONCE SAV-ED…SAV-ED FOREVER [OSAS)?

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Once Sav-ED, Sav-ED Forever (OSAS)


  • Total voters
    13

Scott Downey

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2021
9,566
5,721
113
65
St. Thomas
Faith
Christian
Country
Virgin Islands, U.S.

The Narrow Way​

22 And He went through the cities and villages, teaching, and journeying toward Jerusalem.

23 Then one said to Him, “Lord, are there few who are saved?” And He said to them,

24 “Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able.

25 When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from,’

26 then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.’

27 But He will say, ‘I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me, all you workers of iniquity.’

28 There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, and yourselves thrust out.

29 They will come from the east and the west, from the north and the south, and sit down in the kingdom of God. 30 And indeed there are last who will be first, and there are first who will be last.”

 

Scott Downey

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2021
9,566
5,721
113
65
St. Thomas
Faith
Christian
Country
Virgin Islands, U.S.
Luke 13:25
When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to stand outside and knock at the door, saying, ‘Lord, Lord, open for us,’ and He will answer and say to you, ‘I do not know you, where you are from,’

Genesis 7

13 On the very same day Noah and Noah’s sons, Shem, Ham, and Japheth, and Noah’s wife and the three wives of his sons with them, entered the ark— 14 they and every beast after its kind, all cattle after their kind, every creeping thing that creeps on the earth after its kind, and every bird after its kind, every bird of every sort. 15 And they went into the ark to Noah, two by two, of all flesh in which is the breath of life. 16 So those that entered, male and female of all flesh, went in as God had commanded him; and the Lord shut him in.

Matthew 24

37 But as the days of Noah were, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be.
38 For as in the days before the flood, they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark,
39
and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be.

40 Then two men will be in the field: one will be taken and the other left.
41 Two women will be grinding at the mill: one will be taken and the other left.
42 Watch therefore, for you do not know what [g]hour your Lord is coming.

Taken away to destruction they will be, they will all perish, taken away as in the flood except for them in the ark of God; which for us today is Christ.
And

26 “Therefore if they say to you, ‘Look, He is in the desert!’ do not go out; or ‘Look, He is in the inner rooms!’ do not believe it. 27 For as the lightning comes from the east and flashes to the west, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be. 28 For wherever the carcass is, there the eagles will be gathered together.


Isaiah 66:16
For by fire and by His sword The Lord will judge all flesh; And the slain of the Lord shall be many.

Jeremiah 25:33
And at that day the slain of the Lord shall be from one end of the earth even to the other end of the earth. They shall not be lamented, or gathered, or buried; they shall become refuse on the ground.

2 Thessalonians 1

3 We are bound to thank God always for you, brethren, as it is fitting, because your faith grows exceedingly, and the love of every one of you all abounds toward each other, 4 so that we ourselves boast of you among the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and [a]tribulations that you endure, 5 which is manifest[b] evidence of the righteous judgment of God, that you may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you also suffer;

6 since it is a righteous thing with God to repay with [c]tribulation those who trouble you, 7 and to give you who are troubled rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels,

8 in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.

9 These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, 10 when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints and to be admired among all those who [d]believe, because our testimony among you was believed.
 

Rockerduck

Well-Known Member
Nov 7, 2022
3,099
2,519
113
70
Marietta, Georgia.
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Jesus's sacrifice on the cross defeated death for those who believe on Him and will not perish. John 3:16
Jesus bought and paid for all those that are chosen by God and given to Jesus. John 10:28-29

1 Corinthians 6:19-20
- Or do you not know that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and you are not your own? 20 For you were bought at a price; therefore glorify God in your body and in your spirit, which are God’s.

No Holy Spirit means no salvation. When you belong to Jesus, He will never leave you or forsake you.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Scott Downey

Big Boy Johnson

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2023
4,982
1,847
113
North America
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
You don't understand the scriptures, God's plan or God's nature. You accuse me of calling our Lord & Savior a liar in an attempt to win an argument and further augment your Himalayan ego.

That's what those who don't believe what the Lord says keep saying! :rolleyes:




So it's your theology that Jesus fails

Jesus is not the One failing, those that refuse to believe what He says are the failures.





When you belong to Jesus, He will never leave you or forsake you.

Unless of course the Father cuts you off of the Vine for not bearing fruit as Jesus told us about in John 15

John 15:1,2
I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. John 15:5 IF A MAN ABIDE NOT IN ME, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

*** WHO... is to do the abiding according to Jesus???? That’s right, WE are!

John 15:4,5
Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

*** WHO... is to do the abiding according to Jesus???? That’s right, WE are!

John 15:8-10
Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.
As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love. If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

HOW are we to abide in Christ, thru our own strength and ability???
NO... thru the Lord Who strengthens us!

Philippians 4:13
I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me.
 

Scott Downey

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2021
9,566
5,721
113
65
St. Thomas
Faith
Christian
Country
Virgin Islands, U.S.
This will be the third time I am coming to you. “By the mouth of two or three witnesses every word shall be established.” 2 I have told you before, and foretell as if I were present the second time, and now being absent [a]I write to those who have sinned before, and to all the rest, that if I come again I will not spare— 3 since you seek a proof of Christ speaking in me, who is not weak toward you, but mighty in you. 4 For though He was crucified in weakness, yet He lives by the power of God. For we also are weak in Him, but we shall live with Him by the power of God toward you.

5 Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you [b]are disqualified. 6 But I trust that you will know that we are not disqualified.

Paul Prefers Gentleness​

7 Now [c]I pray to God that you do no evil, not that we should appear approved, but that you should do what is honorable, though we may seem disqualified. 8 For we can do nothing against the truth, but for the truth. 9 For we are glad when we are weak and you are strong. And this also we pray, that you may be made complete. 10 Therefore I write these things being absent, lest being present I should use sharpness, according to the authority which the Lord has given me for edification and not for destruction.

Greetings and Benediction​

11 Finally, brethren, farewell. Become complete. Be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace will be with you.

12 Greet one another with a holy kiss.

13 All the saints greet you.

14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the [d]communion of the Holy Spirit be with you all. Amen.

 

NotTheRock

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2024
823
469
63
49
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Jesus is not the One failing, those that refuse to believe what He says are the failures.

God sent Jesus to unite all things back to him. If Jesus is unsuccessful at doing so, regardless of the reason, then he FAILED. The theology of most of Christianity, including you, is that Jesus FAILS. Of course, Jesus said that the Gates of Hell will NOT prevent him from accomplishing his mission. You claim that Jesus is a LIAR because you say that he FAILS. See how that "liar" slur can cut both ways?
 

Scott Downey

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2021
9,566
5,721
113
65
St. Thomas
Faith
Christian
Country
Virgin Islands, U.S.
God sent Jesus to unite all things back to him. If Jesus is unsuccessful at doing so, regardless of the reason, then he FAILED. The theology of most of Christianity, including you, is that Jesus FAILS. Of course, Jesus said that the Gates of Hell will NOT prevent him from accomplishing his mission. You claim that Jesus is a LIAR because you say that he FAILS. See how that "liar" slur can cut both ways?
Ephesians 1:10 that in the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, [c]both which are in heaven and which are on earth—in Him.

What is being gathered? All things in Christ, not all things like the wicked and unbelieving, they are not in Him.
Fact is they are cast out as they do not abide in Christ who is the life, and Christ is the Creator of all men. But if they do not abide in the vine they are cast off, separated from God, Christ and eternal life, they just have temporary life for a short time in the flesh.

It is undeniable that Christ created all things and in Him all things consist and all things were made for and through and to Him.

John 15

“I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser. 2 Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit He [a]takes away; and every branch that bears fruit He prunes, that it may bear more fruit. 3 You are already clean because of the word which I have spoken to you. 4 Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me.

5 “I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing.

6 If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned. 7 If you abide in Me, and My words abide in you, you[b] will ask what you desire, and it shall be done for you. 8 By this My Father is glorified, that you bear much fruit; so you will be My disciples.

verse 6, even though He created them, they do not abide in Christ, so they are rejected and unfit for the kingdom of God.
 

Big Boy Johnson

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2023
4,982
1,847
113
North America
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
2 Corinthians 13:5
Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless indeed you are disqualified.

That wouldn't be in God's Word if the OSAS doctrine were actually true
Here's another one that wouldn't be in God's Word if OSAS were actually true:

1 Corinthians 9:27
But I keep under my body, and bring it into subjection: lest that by any means, when I have preached to others, I myself should be a castaway.





God sent Jesus to unite all things back to him

To bring all things under God's authority, yes.

To cause all beings to be saved, no that's the false doctrine of universalism

Those holding their position as a universalist are claiming Jesus is a liar:

Mark 16:16
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.


Jesus is clearly telling us not all are saved, so why do the universalist continue speaking in behalf of the devil claiming Jesus is a liar
 

NotTheRock

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2024
823
469
63
49
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
We disagree Rock, that's all. You're free to jump to whatever conclusions suit you.
I'm not "jumping to conclusions". Either Jesus succeeds at uniting all things back to the Father or he fails to do so. Which is it in your theology?

I highly encourage you to re-think the "forever Hell" doctrine. It is a false theology straight from Satan. I can help you with more scripture. The idea that Jesus runs a forever torture chamber is ludicrous.
 

NotTheRock

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2024
823
469
63
49
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Matt 7:
[21] Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

It's apparent from other scriptures that Jesus is able to purify them later so that they can enter Heaven at a later time.

Lamentations 3:31
For the Lord will not cast off forever
 

NotTheRock

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2024
823
469
63
49
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
To bring all things under God's authority, yes
Everything has always been under "God's authority".

You are trying to change the meaning of the verse to advance the theology that Jesus operates forever torture chambers. Your theology is wrong. Your monolithic ego blinds you to truth.
 

NotTheRock

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2024
823
469
63
49
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Mark 16:16
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Matthew 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.


Jesus is clearly telling us not all are saved, so why do the universalist continue speaking in behalf of the devil claiming Jesus is a liar

You lack understanding and discernment.
 

NotTheRock

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2024
823
469
63
49
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Ephesians 1:10 that in the dispensation of the fullness of the times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, [c]both which are in heaven and which are on earth—in Him.

What is being gathered? All things in Christ, not all things like the wicked and unbelieving, they are not in Him.
No, Scott. Paul is saying that God is gathering ALL THINGS and using Christ to do so. Paul even includes all things in Heaven to demonstrate the totality of all things.

By the way, here is a better translation of Ephesians 1:10 CLNT
to have an administration of the complement of the eras, to head up all in the Christ -- both that in the heavens and that on the earth --
 

Nancy

Well-Known Member
Staff member
Apr 30, 2018
17,500
26,959
113
Buffalo, Ny
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Eternal security and unconditional security I think are not the same. we need to have continued faith until the very end. Also obedience, we can choose to disobey. We can willfully choose to disobey, we have left His hands by doing so and choosing to not obey.

Colossians 1:23 says, "Provided that you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel you heard." This verse seems to be saying that assurance of salvation is conditional upon persevering in faith.

Hebrews 3:14: "For we have come to share in Christ, if indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end."

Genesis 4:7 "If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? and if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him."

There are others but, I cannot in good conscience believe we OSAS. Not to mention, some will be blotted out of The Book Of Life...and to me, that say's a hard no, no OSAS.

If I'm wrong, God forgive me but, too many contradictions IMHO.
 

Big Boy Johnson

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2023
4,982
1,847
113
North America
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
You lack understanding and discernment.

You lack honor and respect for the Lord Jesus and do not believe He speaks Truth.

I'll be glad I'm not you on judgement day! :funlaugh2

We know now what "not the rock" means :rolleyes:





Everything has always been under "God's authority".

If that were true, Jesus never would had to go to the Cross.

We see in the Book of Hebrews that Jesus has not assumed full control over this world yet:

Hebrews 2:8
Thou hast put all things in subjection under His feet. for in that
He put all in subjection under Him, He left nothing that is not put

under Him. But now we see not yet all things put under Him
 

NotTheRock

Well-Known Member
Aug 10, 2024
823
469
63
49
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
You lack honor and respect for the Lord Jesus and do not believe He speaks Truth.

I'll be glad I'm not you on judgement day! :funlaugh2

We know now what "not the rock" means :rolleyes:







If that were true, Jesus never would had to go to the Cross.

We see in the Book of Hebrews that Jesus has not assumed full control over this world yet:

Hebrews 2:8
Thou hast put all things in subjection under His feet. for in that
He put all in subjection under Him, He left nothing that is not put

under Him. But now we see not yet all things put under Him

As I said. You lack understanding.