Teh Shack - Not my testimony

[Willie T]

I read ' The Shack ' some years ago, and got a lot out of it - I think it spoke to different people in different ways, but understanding the wider context of what inspired the book makes me want to read it again- I wonder if I kept the copy I had or gave it away !!!!
I do remember many of my ' church ' friends not liking it - but I figure if God speaks through the words of something and it challenges you to reflect and move forward, then it is being used in a positive way.
Butterfly

I have found that if "churchy" people don't like something, it is usually a message almost directly from God that this is something I need to listen to.... it is the Truth in more ways than one.

 

[Helen]

I agree with the others here...religion has done a number on us all.
Good posts here, and good and interesting thread.

None of us enjoy someone poking their finger into the thin walls of our 'Shack'.
We at least try to 'look like' we have it all together in one place!

 

[Butterfly]

I have found that if "churchy" people don't like something, it is usually a message almost directly from God that this is something I need to listen to.... it is the Truth in more ways than one.

I found it interesting that in the video Paul mentions a time when he was confronted by Christians waving placards ect, opposing the book. He introduced himself to them and found out that none of them had read it - so there judgements were not personal, but based on what other people had said to them- yet they were willing to march and protest.
Thinking about it, many of my church friends had not read it either !!
I prefer to judge for myself X
Butterfly

 

[Willie T]

I found it interesting that in the video Paul mentions a time when he was confronted by Christians waving placards ect, opposing the book. He introduced himself to them and found out that none of them had read it - so there judgements were not personal, but based on what other people had said to them- yet they were willing to march and protest.
Thinking about it, many of my church friends had not read it either !!
I prefer to judge for myself X
Butterfly

We Christians are often like sheep in more than one way.

 

[Helen]

I found it interesting that in the video Paul mentions a time when he was confronted by Christians waving placards ect, opposing the book. He introduced himself to them and found out that none of them had read it - so there judgements were not personal, but based on what other people had said to them- yet they were willing to march and protest.
Thinking about it, many of my church friends had not read it either !!
I prefer to judge for myself X
Butterfly

And Wow! Isn't that an "Ouch".
How often have we all been guilty of judging someone or some incident purely by what we have 'heard' about it..and just take it as fact on face value!! God forgive us.

That is why I hate the media...they tell us something, and we believe it as if it was fact. Very scary.

Blessings H xx
( I am going to inbox you in a moment)

 

[mjrhealth]

Well i have nearly finished the book, read it on the train on way home from work. Funny thing is, even though his story is different to mine, nearly everything he writes about in that book, God has being teaching me over the last 30 something years, and even more so in the last 10. Like I said, when he started talking about God in his testimony I thought, He knows God, and now even more so, the way I know God.

God is truly awesome.

God bless

 

[Butterfly]

I have been listening to more of his interviews and the theology behind the book - while starting to read the book again. Must admit I did not grasp what the real theology was about the first time round. I was in too much pain because of things that were going on. God has also been teaching me, or should I say ' opening my eyes ' - I am really grateful for the thread as God is really using his testimony xx
Butterfly

 

[Willie T]

I just got banned from another forum because I dared to say that I liked this book. The owner immediately came on to post that he didn't think I was "orthodox" enough to be on his forum.... then he called me a "False Teacher." It inspired me to resurrect this thread, and read all the blessed things you guys said.

Thank all (well, "most") of you for being you.

 

[Triumph1300]

I never heard about this book.
That's why I didn't have a clue what you guys are talking about.
I guess I'm not up to date on the latest christian things.

 

[Willie T]

I never heard about this book.
That's why I didn't have a clue what you guys are talking about.
I guess I'm not up to date on the latest christian things.

This was found online......
WARNING: This is a book club discussion of “The Shack.” If you haven’t read the book and don’t want anything spoiled for you, you probably shouldn’t read this post or its comments. There are bound to be spoilers lurking around here somewhere, so proceed with caution.**

There is so much to say about this book, but I will attempt to keep my comments in this initial post brief. I will participate in the discussion too, and will be making additional comments throughout the weekend.

The first time I heard about this book was an email from a woman who used to be in a book club with me. We NEVER agreed on any book that we read. So, the more she gushed on and on about how fabulous the book was, the more I didn’t want to read it. Curious though, I jumped on Amazon and read the description. The first sentence on the back cover was enough to seal the deal. All I needed was “daughter … abducted” and “brutally murdered” to know I was NOT going to read this book. I just knew I would hate it.

The over the next year or so, this book sorta stalked me. I felt like EVERYONE was asking me what I thought of it. Facebook groups started popping up. I saw articles in magazines and emails about it. I finally gave up and decided to throw it in the pot … but not for 5 more months. And even once November was upon me, I waited until the last moment. I actually finished it this morning.

There are three groups of people when it comes to “The Shack” that I have noticed. 1. People who LOVE it. It is the book that really got God out of the box for them. They couldn’t put it down. 2. People that didn’t like it … at all. 3. People who don’t understand what the big deal is. I think I fall into group 3. I didn’t hate it like I thought I would. In fact, that first part and about the abduction and murder, I thought was the best writing in the book. I flew through that part. But I didn’t love it either. In the end, I thought it was ok.

The controversy surrounding the book has been mainly theological in nature. So, while I have the big space to write, I thought I’d ask: How important is it that a NOVEL be theologically correct? It is a novel, right? Not a dissertation on the Trinity. A novel. So, does it matter? Should it matter?

I love historical fiction. It is my favorite. I give lots of license when it comes to historical novels. It is fiction after all. But that freedom of fiction only is given in reference to the fictional characters in the book. The historical context must be accurate … otherwise it is fantasy … not history. For instance, I would never appreciate a book about the Civil War where the South won. The historical context would have been corrupted.

I’m not sure if the same can be translated to a novel that is theological in nature. After all, there are incredibly smart theologians that would have all kinds of different opinions about the Trinity. So I’m just throwing that out onto the table … how important is the theology in a novel? Or does fiction get a “free pass” because it is JUST a novel?

What did you like about the book … or not like? What spoke to you? What bothered you? What did you learn? How did it challenge you? And how do you respond after reading it?

Remember that book discussions are just that … discussions – full of opinions, disagreements, and thoughts. Share away! Check back often to read other’s comments and let them know your thoughts too.

 

[Butterfly]

This was found online......
WARNING: This is a book club discussion of “The Shack.” If you haven’t read the book and don’t want anything spoiled for you, you probably shouldn’t read this post or its comments. There are bound to be spoilers lurking around here somewhere, so proceed with caution.**

There is so much to say about this book, but I will attempt to keep my comments in this initial post brief. I will participate in the discussion too, and will be making additional comments throughout the weekend.

The first time I heard about this book was an email from a woman who used to be in a book club with me. We NEVER agreed on any book that we read. So, the more she gushed on and on about how fabulous the book was, the more I didn’t want to read it. Curious though, I jumped on Amazon and read the description. The first sentence on the back cover was enough to seal the deal. All I needed was “daughter … abducted” and “brutally murdered” to know I was NOT going to read this book. I just knew I would hate it.

The over the next year or so, this book sorta stalked me. I felt like EVERYONE was asking me what I thought of it. Facebook groups started popping up. I saw articles in magazines and emails about it. I finally gave up and decided to throw it in the pot … but not for 5 more months. And even once November was upon me, I waited until the last moment. I actually finished it this morning.

There are three groups of people when it comes to “The Shack” that I have noticed. 1. People who LOVE it. It is the book that really got God out of the box for them. They couldn’t put it down. 2. People that didn’t like it … at all. 3. People who don’t understand what the big deal is. I think I fall into group 3. I didn’t hate it like I thought I would. In fact, that first part and about the abduction and murder, I thought was the best writing in the book. I flew through that part. But I didn’t love it either. In the end, I thought it was ok.

The controversy surrounding the book has been mainly theological in nature. So, while I have the big space to write, I thought I’d ask: How important is it that a NOVEL be theologically correct? It is a novel, right? Not a dissertation on the Trinity. A novel. So, does it matter? Should it matter?

I love historical fiction. It is my favorite. I give lots of license when it comes to historical novels. It is fiction after all. But that freedom of fiction only is given in reference to the fictional characters in the book. The historical context must be accurate … otherwise it is fantasy … not history. For instance, I would never appreciate a book about the Civil War where the South won. The historical context would have been corrupted.

I’m not sure if the same can be translated to a novel that is theological in nature. After all, there are incredibly smart theologians that would have all kinds of different opinions about the Trinity. So I’m just throwing that out onto the table … how important is the theology in a novel? Or does fiction get a “free pass” because it is JUST a novel?

What did you like about the book … or not like? What spoke to you? What bothered you? What did you learn? How did it challenge you? And how do you respond after reading it?

Remember that book discussions are just that … discussions – full of opinions, disagreements, and thoughts. Share away! Check back often to read other’s comments and let them know your thoughts too.

I have gone on to read a number of books about the theology of the Shack, it's definately been an eye opener. I am still weighing things up with regards to that, but actually reading the writers testimony just put such a different slant on the book.
I think it's awful that you got banned for just suggesting the book.
I did not fully understand what ' the Shack ' was totally about the first time I read it, hence why I would totally recommend hearing the testimony of the writer first, and reading another book called ' God and The shack - this contains a number of interviews with the writer.
Butterfly

 

[Willie T]

Considering some Catholic views, I found this article pretty interesting:
https://www.ncronline.org/blogs/ncr-today/shack-finding-god-dark

'The Shack': finding God in the dark
Mar 3, 2017
by Sr. Rose Pacatte
The Shack," based on the 2007 best-selling novel by William P. Young, is now a major motion picture starring Sam Worthington and Oscar-winning actress Octavia Spencer. In wide release today, the film, in my humble opinion, far surpasses the novel.

As anyone who reads my reviews knows, I am not a fan of the "Christian" genre, because most of those movies lead with a message rather than the story. I prefer to figure out what the movie means rather than sit in a theater as if it were a Sunday school classroom or a church with a preacher teaching me. I prefer to have the filmmaker trust me, the audience, to figure it out.

It's fine to make Christian films, but films about people who happen to be Christian are much more interesting. Here, producer Gil Netter and director Stuart Hazeldine get it right. The team of writers unclutters the wordy and sometimes confusing dialogue of the novel, leaving us to ponder and marvel at what is going on between Mack, Worthington's character, and the deity.

But here's the deal about "The Shack." It is completely unique in the realm of films about Christians, Christian theology and spirituality. It deals with a grieving, guilt-ridden man's grief over the loss of a child by introducing him to the persons of the Trinity (Spencer and Graham Greene as the feminine and masculine expressions of God the Father, Sumire Matsubara as the Holy Spirit, and Avraham Aviv Alush as Jesus the Son) over a weekend in the woods.

Sometime after the kidnapping and murder of his youngest daughter, Missy (Amelie Eve), Mack returns to the shack in the woods where her bloodstained little dress was found. He is determined to find the murderer and even brings a gun with which to kill him.

There, he encounters a young man in the woods who disarms him and invites him to walk with him. All of a sudden, they pass from winter's frozen forest to a lovely country home. Mack is greeted by a woman, "Papa" (Spencer), and soon meets Sarayu (Matsubara). It becomes evident to Mack that he is in the presence of the Holy Trinity.

But Mack is angry and confused. His plans of revenge have been thwarted. The perennial question of why God permits evil is addressed throughout the weekend and the conversations invite Mack to think about his identity as a man, his relationship with God, his family and his neighbor.

The vibrant, almost surreal atmosphere and the saturated color scheme of the dwelling place of heaven in "The Shack" reminded me of director Vincent Ward's 1998 fantasy drama of the afterlife, "What Dreams May Come." At some point, it might be interesting to compare and contrast the two films, but "The Shack" is a completely different cinematic experience because God, as the Trinity, plays gentle, loving and patient counterpoint to Mack's anger and anguish, offering great solace to a grieving father.

My colleague Sr. Nancy Usselmann described "The Shack" as a cinematic retreat. To me, it is cinematic poetry.

"The Shack" is an honest consideration of a Christian theological explanation for why bad things happen to good people. If you loved the book, I think you will be able to say the film surpasses it. If you had a hard time reading the book, as I did, but you are open to an experience of the Christian imagination informed by Trinitarian theology, well, take a chance that you may be inspired.

If you know grief and loss, the film offers comfort. If you are angry at God for any reason, test it out at the movie theater. Take a risk during Lent that you may find God in the cinematic art, and in the dark, at the multiplex.

 

[Triumph1300]

After reading these previous posts I''m not running out to get this book or see the movie.
It's interesting though.

Every once and awhile books or movies pop up and get christians on the band wagon.
I remember in the late 1970's Hal Lindsay's "Late Great Planet Earth" and all the hoopla about it.
I did read it, a friend gave it to me. I still have it in my book case.
I wasn't even a Christian at that time. It did make me pick up a bible though.

 

[Helen]

I just got banned from another forum because I dared to say that I liked this book. The owner immediately came on to post that he didn't think I was "orthodox" enough to be on his forum.... then he called me a "False Teacher." It inspired me to resurrect this thread, and read all the blessed things you guys said.

Thank all (well, "most") of you for being you.

Yes, it has been amazing to see all the for and against of the book.
I wasn't over keen on it , until I saw him interviewed ...then and only then did I understand why he wrote the book as he did.

I'm not one for allegories...( unless it is Paul. LOL )

PS. that is one reason really I appreciate this Site...they have a high tolerance for 'open thoughts' before they suspend someone...which seems to be only for three months.

 

[Willie T]

I know I am not the only "cheap" person here. So for some of you, I have found this free, full-length audio book:

 

[Helen]

Oh thank you! Well found.

 

[Willie T]

These questions were TOUGH! Some of them were so hard, I haven't yet answered them.
How about each of you?
Papa's Ponderings: The Shack Discussion Guide

 

[Butterfly]

Thanks for posting the study guide link - just finished work, too tired to think - will mull over the questions tomorrow on my day off xx
Butterfly

 

[Butterfly]

There are a lot of questions !!! Lol
I have been pondering the first two- about ' outward religion ' and its impact on children.
Personally I never really saw religion being different to faith , not even sure I knew anything about faith when I was growing up. Yet somehow , before I came to faith as an adult, I already believed God was ' up in the sky ' ' distant '. I believed in ' being good ', and that breaking the rules were stealing, murder, ect. I believed in hell and had a fear about it- and I did not come from a family who went to church, but I was sent to Sunday school in the local Church of England church. I knew Jesus had lived and died on the cross, but no more than that - did not understand about having a personal relationship with him, and I knew nothing of the Holy Spirit. I believed you had to dress smart for church and that Sunday's had rules , but not in my house !
Then, when I came to faith I just fell in line with what my church taught and did, faith and religion mingled together and I just saw it all as ' being Christian ' . The rules about Sunday grew, but I was married to a non believer, so it caused division. For my children it meant two viewpoints - but they came to church. All of them are now adults, all of them hated going to church and were impacted by the attitudes - which God started to open my own eyes to about 15years after coming to faith. The I started to see the difference between ' religion ' and ' faith in relationship with Jesus '
Children see and witness what the parents do and foundations of beliefs, fears, ect are laid within the subconscious. As we grow up we believe what has been laid as truth and that will equally impact how we respond, react and live with regards to beliefs.
I see outward religion often leading to hypocracy and a judgemental attitude to others who do not conform - instead of leading people to Christ I believe it makes people feel a failure
, leads to so much inward and false guilt ( as opposed to conviction ) and creates so many problems with forgiveness.
Sorry, not sure that is what you wanted when you asked about the questions, but that's my slant on the first two questions - I work a lot, so I won't waffle on too often !!!!! Lol
Butterfly

 

[Butterfly]

I wonder if I can ' waffle ' on abit more and share the following.
I grew up believing that my grandfather was ' a pillar of society ' he stuck to the ' rules ' ect ect ,
At the age of 21 years old - I became pregnant , I was not married - but went on to marry the father - I felt I had let my parents and grand parents down- I had stopped going to church years before , and did not come to faith until I was 24 - so my guilt before God was not really felt for some years ) I remember writing to my grand parents apologising, neither of them said anything. My parents supported and loved me, but I knew I had let them down.
When my mum died five years ago I had a conversation with my aunty, she revealed something to me that made me so angry- my grandmother was in fact pregnant before she got married. The whole family knew, but no one said anything to me, no one came alongside - they let me think ' I was the black sheep ' of the family - reputations, inner guilt perhaps, who knows. Outwardly conveying one thing, while hiding things within.
Isn't this what happens with many who convey a ' religious outward life ' in public one thing, but privately no one really knows - yet God sees everything. My perception of my grand parents was based on ' what I saw , not on what I knew ' - that, to me, lays at the heart of religion- it's all about appearances.
Right I will stop now xx