The Bible And Abortion

[JohnPaul]

Is it true that the Supreme Court is now a majority of Conservatives, who overturned the law?

What happens when the majority is Liberals who support the right of choice, they can again overturn the ban?

Are you a liberal?

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

Are you a liberal?

Very CONSERVATIVE here in England

 

[Philip James]

A "person" before they have a heart or brain or other organs?

Not possible

?? What is your definition of 'person'?

Legally, women weren't 'persons' im Canada until 1929..

I am that same human that has developed from the first division of the fertilzed egg of my mothet to right up to this day.

At what time did I become a 'person'

Pax et Bonum

 

[ScottA]

Exodus 21:22-23

“And when they strive together men and they injure woman pregnant so that they go out children of her but not he is mortal injury to fine he shall be fined. As he shall place on him husband of the woman and he shall give on judgements. But if harm he is then you shall give life in place of life” (The Hebrew-English Interlinear ESV Old Testament; Literal reading)

This passage is about a violent argument between men, where there is a pregnant woman present near them. During this struggle, the woman is somehow “injured” (nâgaph, which can also include fatal injuries), which caused the “children (masculine plural, boys), to “come out” (yâtsâ’) of the woman. It is clear from the Hebrew, that the “mortal injury” is of the children, and not the woman, as we have the masculine, singular, “’âsôn” used, as the ESV rightly reads, “he is”. “’âsôn” is used in the Old Testament for serious, and even fatal injuries.

The Hebrew “wə·yā·ṣə·’ū yə·lā·ḏe·hā”, literally, “children come out”, is translated as “to miscarry”, or, “born prematurely”, or “fruit depart”, or “come out”, etc, in our English Versions. The masculine plural, shows that there is more than one boy in the womans womb.

In verse 23, “’âsôn” is used to show that either, one, or both of the boys died from the result of the injuries sustained by the woman, during this violent argument between the two men. It is clear, “then you shall give life in place of life”, which is a requirement of death, and not injury.

It is clear from verse 23, that if the child, or children, died, which can only mean, “to miscarry”, and not as some English translations read, “she gives birth prematurely”, as in the NASB, as this does not mean that the child or children, did not live. “she has a miscarriage”, is used in these Versions: NAB; NASB 1977; Douay-Rheims Bible; NRSV; Lasma Syriac Bible; The Contemporary Torah, JPS, 2006, etc

This miscarriage was caused by the fighting of these men, and could well have been deliberate, and not accidental. The seriousness of this, where there is death, results in the death of those who caused the woman to miscarry. If this is the punishment that Bible demands for miscarriage, there can be no doubt that those who perform premeditated abortions, are equally guilty with the Lord.

Exodus 21:22-23 is the of God regarding Satan, who's quarrel is with the Father...which is made manifest in the lives of men.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

Exodus 21:22-23 is the of God regarding Satan, who's quarrel is with the Father...which is made manifest in the lives of men.

and your evidence for this is exactly what?

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

?? What is your definition of 'person'?

Legally, women weren't 'persons' im Canada until 1929..

I am that same human that has developed from the first division of the fertilzed egg of my mothet to right up to this day.

At what time did I become a 'person'

Pax et Bonum

I mean a LIVING HUMAN

 

[Philip James]

I mean a LIVING HUMAN

The zygote is demonstrably alive and human,

Pax et Bonum

 

[ScottA]

and your evidence for this is exactly what?

Revelation 12

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

The zygote is demonstrably alive and human,

Pax et Bonum

Living without a heart?

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

Revelation 12

No relation whatsoever

 

[ScottA]

No relation whatsoever

So you say. But every eye shall see, even you.

 

[Philip James]

Living without a heart?

Yes.
Lots of orhanisms are alive without hearts..

an organismic state characterized by capacity for metabolism (see METABOLISM sense 1), growth, reaction to stimuli, and reproduction

Definition of LIFE

Pax et Bonum

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

Yes.
Lots of orhanisms are alive without hearts..

an organismic state characterized by capacity for metabolism (see METABOLISM sense 1), growth, reaction to stimuli, and reproduction

Definition of LIFE

Pax et Bonum

So if a zygote was removed from the womb it can survive on its own?

 

[amigo de christo]

So if a zygote was removed from the womb it can survive on its own?

If one throws a baby in the lake can it survive on its own . NO . But its still murder to throw that baby in that lake .
Just as it is murder to remove that baby from that womb . We can kid ourselves all day and call it whatever we like to make ourselves
try and feel better . BUT ITS LIFE , ITS A BABY and thou shalt not kill .

 

[amigo de christo]

The zygote is demonstrably alive and human,

Pax et Bonum

The scenario i am about to give is not possible . YET IF IT WERE even the most stuanch baby killer would be PRO LIFE on that day .
Are you ready .
Here goes .
Now visualize this . A time machine was invented . And i took a pro choice person with me back in time
to the very moment of his conception . And said , WELL its just a zygote ..........
Shall we destroy it now . THAT PRO CHOICER would be screaming , WAIT , WAIT ITS GONNA BE ME . ITS GONNA BE ME ONE DAY
SEE THE POINT YET . THOU SHALT NOT KILL . LETS PROTECT THOSE BABIES .

 

[Philip James]

So if a zygote was removed from the womb it can survive on its own?

Humans cant survive on there own until theyre some years old and have learned the skills to survive..

Does this mean anyone who cant survive on their own is a non person?

What about the elderly and infirm, the handicapped? Non persons?

Again I ask, how do you define a 'person' ?

Pax et Bonum

 

[dhh712]

and yet you said in your first post

"I don't have as strong a feeling on the plan-B pill. I feel that it should not at all be used by a believer in the truth of God's word. Yet, since it's not certain that a pregnancy has occurred"

I don't have as strong a feeling on plan-B as I do on the misoprostol. At work I put in an exemption to not have anything to do with dispensing the misoprostol. I did not do this for the plan-B. That is what I meant when I said I do not have as strong a feeling on the plan-B as I do with the misoprostol. Personally, as a believer I would not have anything to do with the plan-B or misoprostol for abortion. I'm sorry that was not clear. It has to do with my responsibilities at work.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

If one throws a baby in the lake can it survive on its own . NO . But its still murder to throw that baby in that lake .
Just as it is murder to remove that baby from that womb . We can kid ourselves all day and call it whatever we like to make ourselves
try and feel better . BUT ITS LIFE , ITS A BABY and thou shalt not kill .

HOW can you say that a zygote is a "baby"? there are NO organs, NO heart, which means, NO LIFE!

 

[marksman]

Thanks for your time to reply in detail

You say, "Life clearly begins at conception", but do we really know at what time does this take place? It seems a grey area in the medical world. Is the "zygote" a "living person"? or, is this when the embroy becomes a "Fetus"? Is there evidence in the Bible on this development?

I believe that when life begins is obvious. When the sperm joins with the egg. At that moment in time, everything it needs to become human exists. There is not one case where anyone has proved that bits get added here and there and when they are all assembled it is human or has life.

So many pro-abortionists claim it is not human until it is born. So I ask them what is it the moment before it comes out of the womb? The answer is always the same. Silence. So when I show them a baby in the womb at six months that has a head, a body, legs, arms, hands, feet, eyes, lips, nose, fingers, toes, and a thingamabob if it is a boy, where did all that come from if it is not human? Answer. silence.

Another claim is that it is not human at conception. So I ask when is it human? One week. One month. Three months. Six months. The fact is they don't know. It is all guesswork for them. The main reason they deny humans at conception is due to the fact if they admit to that they have to admit to God being involved and that is the last thing they want to do.

I attended a meeting put on by a female politician who wanted to promote abortion. She waffled on about this that and the other to justify abortion. When it was time for questions I held up a photo of a perfectly formed aborted baby. I said to her "Is this a baby or not? and I showed it to everyone there.

Her reply "It all depends" Gotcha. Of course, it was a baby but she didn't want to admit it as it would screw up most of her arguments.

 

[marksman]

HOW can you say that a zygote is a "baby"? there are NO organs, NO heart, which means, NO LIFE!

Sorry but you are wrong. If your hypothesis is right when are all these things added?