The " catching up " rapture must be so very very close!!

[Davy]

I'd say muddled speculation.

Any date setting for Christ's future coming is... just wild speculation.

But the event of Israel in the middle east becoming a nation again in 1948 is not. It is about the idea of the fig shoot being set out in Christ's parable of the fig tree in Matthew 24.

Per Jeremiah 24, God showed Jeremiah a vision of two baskets of figs, one basket of good figs, good to eat, and showed it represented Judah. Then God showed him another basket of figs, rotten figs, 'evil' figs, and they represent the crept in unawares that crept in among Judah long ago in their history, which also went captive with Judah to Babylon. God said He would bring them both back to the holy land, and not remove them again.

So when was that promise fulfilled for Judah to return? Not after the 70 years God said Judah would be captive to Babylon, and then a small remnant of them returned. That period doesn't work because later in 70 A.D. the Roman army came and destroyed Jerusalem, and removed Judah out of the holy land. So even that 70 A.D. period doesn't work.

But in 1948, when Israel became a nation again, with many of Judah returning to the holy lands, so far... that has fulfilled the Jeremiah 24 return of Judah. And mind you, that is only about the Jews, and not the ten lost tribes of Israel that were scattered first in their own captivity to Assyria. The ten tribes have still yet to return today, and won't until Jesus returns.

This is what Christ's parable of the fig tree is about...

Matt 24:32-34
32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:

The fig tree, when it begins sprouting leaves, then the summer fig time is near. Judah, representing the good fig per Jer.24, must be planted back in the land first, for this to happen.

33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
KJV

Then in that... generation when the good figs (Judah) are planted again back in the holy land, that represents the 'generation' on earth that shall "see all these things", meaning all the SIGNS of the end Jesus gave in that Matthew 24 chapter, which lead up to His future return and gathering of His Church.

Thus Jesus' parable of the fig tree reveals the final generation on earth that will literally see His future coming.

We still do not know the day nor hour of His coming, but by that parable of the fig tree and the Jews returning to the holy land to become the nation of Israel again, that event fulfilled the Jeremiah 24 prophecy of God's promise to Judah to return them, and thus that return of 1948 represents the final generation on earth that will see Christ's return.

 

[MA2444]

Those who understand prophecy for the end written in God's Word understand that Trump cannot succeed in turning things around. If he gets in office, he may help us temporarily, but in time Lucifer's children will take back over, just like how they did before. It's important to realize that this 2nd world earth age was pre-ordained to be destroyed by fire. This present time is our not are real home. So it is futile to dream of a better world during this present 2nd world earth age, as believing that is actually in opposition to God's written Word.

Oh good grief man! No one said Trump stops the great tribulation from happening.
When Jonah finally got to Ninevah and gave them the message of impending destruction, what did they do, and did it effect what God would do?

They repented and this made God not destroy Ninevah. That was the deal. Turn from your wicked ways or be destroyed/ That's a choice and they chose to do exactly that so God didnt destroy them. It's always, choose/free will. Life or death, sin or righteousness, God or whoring with others gods.

So even when Trump wins this election, it will be for a season and Trump doesnt save the world, God does that. Trump will do what he can as a man and I expect he will do pretty darn good, just like last time. But the great trib is still coming, that doesnt change!

I have to laugh at all that; as if Trump's behavior can change God's Plans! Funny!

Everyone on earth who is human can change God's plans for us to the extent of, life or death for us. What this amounts to I think is nothing more than your own personal dislike for Trump, lol. A lot depends on what Trump does! And even when he wins and accomplishes certain things, it will be as if Trump has won a few battles, but not the war! Get real.

 

[Reddsta]

The global conflagrations described in Revelation will not take place until after the Rapture — that is until after God has evacuated His people from the planet.

Greetings GISMYS_7...

So you mean "suddenly"...think light switch...once the rapture occurs...or is it more of a "controlled rollout" exactly like we see today and for the last 100+ years? You know the scripturally prophesied "global conflagrations" that have been covertly developing your thought life...without you realizing it? Is it those ones?

Redd...

 

[Cassandra]

Hebrews 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.

That verse is referring to the rapture, the blessed hope, the completion of our salvation, i.e. the redemption of our bodies.

In Revelation 11, the sounding of the 7th trumpet is not tied to the rapture. The 7th trumpet sounds and the mystery of God (Revelation 10:7) to take the kingdoms of this world out from under Satan and his angels mystical kingdom of Babylon the great begins. The dismantling of Satan and his angels kingdom begins with Satan and his angels cast down to earth. From that point, Satan will have but a time, times, half times before his kingdom is completely destroyed.

And you know this how?
At the 2nd coming, those that look for Him shall He appear the second time without sin.
Jesus comes visibly, audibly AFTER the GT.
Where do you get that Satan comes from Heaven then? Jesus said I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. Luke 10:18 "And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven."

 

[Douggg]

And you know this how?
At the 2nd coming, those that look for Him shall He appear the second time without sin.

There will be the Second Coming of Jesus to this earth in power and great glory in Matthew 24:30.

Hebrews 9:28 though is not talking about that event. But about Jesus coming again (i.e. a second time) in John 14:1-4 for the rapture/resurrection to heaven.

John 14:
1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.

Where do you get that Satan comes from Heaven then? Jesus said I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. Luke 10:18 "And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven."

Luke 10:
17 And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name.
18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.

Was Satan permanently cast down to earth because of the seventy disciples were able to cast out demons from possessed and ill people ?

I think Satan received a knock down punch at that time, but not a knock out punch. The knock out punch will be when Michael and his angels cast Satan and his angels down to earth (from the second heaven) to never recover to that lofty place again.

 

[Davy]

Where do you get that Satan comes from Heaven then? Jesus said I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. Luke 10:18 "And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven."

Correct, per Jesus in Matthew 24:29-31 that His coming to gather His Church is after... the "great tribulation". His coming return is what ends that future tribulation.

But the point about Satan and his angels being cast out of heaven down to the earth at the END of this world is written here...

Rev 12:7-12
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, "Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night."
11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.
12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
KJV

Notice the above timing is in reference to Christ having already been crucified, simply because those saints overcome Satan "by the blood of the Lamb" (Jesus). That's the 5th Seal event of Revelation 6, which is when some of us will be delivered up to give a Testimony for Jesus at the end of this world, per Mark 13:9-13. So that above casting out event has to be for the END of this world, not back at Satan's original time of rebellion against God.

Coupled with that, notice in Rev.12:6 just prior to that casting out, it is mentioning the 1st half of the Dan.9:27 symbolic "one week" (7 years), with "a thousand two hundred and threescore days" (i.e., 1260 days). By that Jesus is showing us that after the 1st 1260 days period of the "one week", is when Satan and his angels will be cast out of the heavenly dimension down to our earthly dimension, in plain sight, right here on earth. The majority of Churches are way... behind with understanding this, and are not prepared for it.

(I think I'll create a separate Thread for this.)

 

[rebuilder 454]

I have to laugh at all that; as if Trump's behavior can change God's Plans! Funny!

What the 'shadow government' has been doing to try and destroy Trump should be a major 'sign' that Trump turning things around is not in God's Plan. I wish it were, but I will stay with what God says in His Word, and keep 'watching' the SIGNs of the end that Jesus gave us leading up to His future return.

Yes the gatherings of Jesus!
Were you referring toThe pre flood/prejudgement gathering, of mat 24 "before the flood", or the postflood/postjudgement gathering of rev 19?

 

[rebuilder 454]

Correct, per Jesus in Matthew 24:29-31 that His coming to gather His Church is after... the "great tribulation". His coming return is what ends that future tribulation.

But the point about Satan and his angels being cast out of heaven down to the earth at the END of this world is written here...

Rev 12:7-12
7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, "Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night."
11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.
12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
KJV

Notice the above timing is in reference to Christ having already been crucified, simply because those saints overcome Satan "by the blood of the Lamb" (Jesus). That's the 5th Seal event of Revelation 6, which is when some of us will be delivered up to give a Testimony for Jesus at the end of this world, per Mark 13:9-13. So that above casting out event has to be for the END of this world, not back at Satan's original time of rebellion against God.

Coupled with that, notice in Rev.12:6 just prior to that casting out, it is mentioning the 1st half of the Dan.9:27 symbolic "one week" (7 years), with "a thousand two hundred and threescore days" (i.e., 1260 days). By that Jesus is showing us that after the 1st 1260 days period of the "one week", is when Satan and his angels will be cast out of the heavenly dimension down to our earthly dimension, in plain sight, right here on earth. The majority of Churches are way... behind with understanding this, and are not prepared for it.

(I think I'll create a separate Thread for this.)

That verse you posted says nothing about Jesus doing the gathering.
But yes he will return postrib with the saints from heaven where they would have been for 7 years.
Read the other gatherings of rev 14 (during the trib) ....and mat 24 " before the flood" gatherings.

But I do realize you can not go there.
... As you have shown us.

 

[Davy]

That verse you posted says nothing about Jesus doing the gathering.

The Rev.12 chapter is not... about the event of Christ's coming and gathering of the Church. It's about the time of the old world with Satan's original rebellion per the Rev.12:3-4 verses, and with the Rev.12:6-17 verses about the coming time of "great tribulation". So let's not try and change the subject of my post, when you show you still need to actually read it.

Now, in case you refer to my quote of the Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture, that is... about the event of Christ's future return and gathering of His Church. The Mark 13:24-27 verses are a parallel that goes with it. And both of those Scripture examples link with what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 about Christ's coming to gather His Church, AFTER... the great tribulation.

But yes he will return postrib with the saints from heaven where they would have been for 7 years.

Nope. That idea is from men's false Pre-trib Rapture theory. It is nowhere written in God's Word. Like Jesus said in that Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 Scripture, He comes AFTER... the tribulation to gather His Church, not PRIOR to it, which is what you are falsely claiming per a pre-trib view by men.

So either you 'recognize' what Lord Jesus Himself showed in that Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture about the time of His coming for His Church, or you do not. Based on what you have said, you show that you are in a state of deception about that future event.

 

[rebuilder 454]

The Rev.12 chapter is not... about the event of Christ's coming and gathering of the Church. It's about the time of the old world with Satan's original rebellion per the Rev.12:3-4 verses, and with the Rev.12:6-17 verses about the coming time of "great tribulation". So let's not try and change the subject of my post, when you show you still need to actually read it.

Now, in case you refer to my quote of the Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture, that is... about the event of Christ's future return and gathering of His Church. The Mark 13:24-27 verses are a parallel that goes with it. And both of those Scripture examples link with what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 about Christ's coming to gather His Church, AFTER... the great tribulation.


Nope. That idea is from men's false Pre-trib Rapture theory. It is nowhere written in God's Word. Like Jesus said in that Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 Scripture, He comes AFTER... the tribulation to gather His Church, not PRIOR to it, which is what you are falsely claiming per a pre-trib view by men.

So either you 'recognize' what Lord Jesus Himself showed in that Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture about the time of His coming for His Church, or you do not. Based on what you have said, you show that you are in a state of deception about that future eve

Lol
You just proved my point, via omission.
You prove with every post you are forbidden those verses.
Rev14
Mat 24:38
Rev 19
Destroy your deal
That is why those verses are forbidden to you

I showed you in your verse that Jesus does not do ANY gathering postrib..
I addressed your verse and corrected you.
You never will address the verses I showed you.
I do understand though.
You painted yourself into a corner via omission.
Lol

 

[rebuilder 454]

The Rev.12 chapter is not... about the event of Christ's coming and gathering of the Church. It's about the time of the old world with Satan's original rebellion per the Rev.12:3-4 verses, and with the Rev.12:6-17 verses about the coming time of "great tribulation". So let's not try and change the subject of my post, when you show you still need to actually read it.

Now, in case you refer to my quote of the Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture, that is... about the event of Christ's future return and gathering of His Church. The Mark 13:24-27 verses are a parallel that goes with it. And both of those Scripture examples link with what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 about Christ's coming to gather His Church, AFTER... the great tribulation.


Nope. That idea is from men's false Pre-trib Rapture theory. It is nowhere written in God's Word. Like Jesus said in that Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 Scripture, He comes AFTER... the tribulation to gather His Church, not PRIOR to it, which is what you are falsely claiming per a pre-trib view by men.

So either you 'recognize' what Lord Jesus Himself showed in that Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture about the time of His coming for His Church, or you do not. Based on what you have said, you show that you are in a state of deception about that future event.

"...mans false pretrib rapture theory"
All those postribbers into error via omission have the same belief that they are right.
It is their belief.
It IS a huge huge investment in error.
My verses blow postrib rapture outta the water.
It would be a huge blow to them if they ever read them.
Maybe best that they stay forbidden
Lol

 

[rebuilder 454]

The forbidden verses
Rev 14:14
Mat 24:38
Game
Set
Match

Lol

 

[Adrift]

According to Wiki, a 2010 survey showed that about 40% of Americans believe that Jesus is likely to return by 2050. This varied from 58% of white evangelical Christians, through 32% of Catholics to 27% of white mainline Protestants. I've been listening to the obsessors now every year for over 6 decades saying "It's going to happen this month, next month, this year or next year". I find it easier to just be prepared and assume it's going to happen today.

 

[Cassandra]

There will be the Second Coming of Jesus to this earth in power and great glory in Matthew 24:30.

Hebrews 9:28 though is not talking about that event. But about Jesus coming again (i.e. a second time) in John 14:1-4 for the rapture/resurrection to heaven.

John 14:
1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me.
2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.
3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.



Luke 10:
17 And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name.
18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.

Was Satan permanently cast down to earth because of the seventy disciples were able to cast out demons from possessed and ill people ?

I think Satan received a knock down punch at that time, but not a knock out punch. The knock out punch will be when Michael and his angels cast Satan and his angels down to earth (from the second heaven) to never recover to that lofty place again.

The Second coming is the resurrection , a visible audible event.
There is a 1000 year space,
Then God will make a new heaven and new earth, bring the Holy city down. that is when Christ comes to live here.

 

[Douggg]

The Second coming is the resurrection , a visible audible event.
There is a 1000 year space,
Then God will make a new heaven and new earth, bring the Holy city down. that is when Christ comes to live here.

Jesus will be present on the new earth following the Great White Throne Judgment.

On this present earth, Jesus will be present when He Returns at His Second Coming to it.

His Second Coming to this present earth is Matthew 24:30. Also in Ezekiel 39:21-29. Also in Zechariah 14, as He will stand on the Mt. of Olives. The same place that Jesus was seen by the disciples leaving this present earth, and told by two angels He would return in like manner as He left in Acts 1:9-12.

 

[rebuilder 454]

The Rev.12 chapter is not... about the event of Christ's coming and gathering of the Church. It's about the time of the old world with Satan's original rebellion per the Rev.12:3-4 verses, and with the Rev.12:6-17 verses about the coming time of "great tribulation". So let's not try and change the subject of my post, when you show you still need to actually read it.

Now, in case you refer to my quote of the Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture, that is... about the event of Christ's future return and gathering of His Church. The Mark 13:24-27 verses are a parallel that goes with it. And both of those Scripture examples link with what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 about Christ's coming to gather His Church, AFTER... the great tribulation.


Nope. That idea is from men's false Pre-trib Rapture theory. It is nowhere written in God's Word. Like Jesus said in that Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 Scripture, He comes AFTER... the tribulation to gather His Church, not PRIOR to it, which is what you are falsely claiming per a pre-trib view by men.

So either you 'recognize' what Lord Jesus Himself showed in that Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture about the time of His coming for His Church, or you do not. Based on what you have said, you show that you are in a state of deception about that future event.

Take it up with Jesus.
It is He gathering during the trib in rev 14:14
It is He that said his coming is BEFORE THE FLOOD.
But, no, you are comfortable pretending those verses are not there.
You don't address them because they ruin your doctrine.
There is no hope , outside of omission, for your theory.

 

[rebuilder 454]

And you know this how?
At the 2nd coming, those that look for Him shall He appear the second time without sin.
Jesus comes visibly, audibly AFTER the GT.
Where do you get that Satan comes from Heaven then? Jesus said I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. Luke 10:18 "And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven."

Mat 24:38 He SAID his coming is before the flood. Pretrib
Rev 14:14 he gathers DURING THE TRIB sitting on a cloud with a sickle in his hand.
That COMPLETELY REMOVES any hope of a postrib rapture

But I suppose one could change 1 Thes 4 to " the dead in Christ DO NOT Resurrect first", since postribbers insist the rise AFTER the rev14:14 gathering

100% pretrib rapture

 

[Davy]

Mat 24:38 He SAID his coming is before the flood. Pretrib

No, Jesus didn't say His coming would be before a flood. You are ADDING to that Scripture, something Jesus warned against in Rev.22.

Rev 14:14 he gathers DURING THE TRIB sitting on a cloud with a sickle in his hand.
That COMPLETELY REMOVES any hope of a postrib rapture

Nope. Jesus showed His coming to gather His saints is "Immediately after the tribulation of those days..." per the Matthew 24:29-31 Scripture. Now with that Scripture, you are instead TAKING AWAY from God's Word, which Jesus also warned against in Rev.22.

But I suppose one could change 1 Thes 4 to " the dead in Christ DO NOT Resurrect first", since postribbers insist the rise AFTER the rev14:14 gathering

100% pretrib rapture

You could... do that, that is, if you don't mind Jesus' curse He warned those who do such as that will suffer...

Rev 22:18-19
18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
KJV

I don't think you understand the danger of the game you are playing.

 

[ewq1938]

Jesus will be present on the new earth following the Great White Throne Judgment.

On this present earth, Jesus will be present when He Returns at His Second Coming to it.

His Second Coming to this present earth is Matthew 24:30. Also in Ezekiel 39:21-29. Also in Zechariah 14, as He will stand on the Mt. of Olives. The same place that Jesus was seen by the disciples leaving this present earth, and told by two angels He would return in like manner as He left in Acts 1:9-12.

Like manner is not the same as like place. Jesus did not ascend from the Mt of Olives anyways.

 

[Douggg]

Like manner is not the same as like place. Jesus did not ascend from the Mt of Olives anyways.

Yes, Jesus did ascend from the Mt of Olives.

11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

12 Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.