The Christian and Alcohol - What is wine?

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Raeneske

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Isaiah 65:8 Thus saith the LORD, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants' sakes, that I may not destroy them all.

Here we have something called new wine, which is considered a blessing by the Lord. This new wine is found in the cluster. What do these clusters bring forth?

Genesis 40:10 And in the vine were three branches: and it was as though it budded, and her blossoms shot forth; and the clusters thereof brought forth ripe grapes:

Grapes. Grapes are used to to make new wine. Here we have a drink that is considered a blessing from the Lord, new wine. But the Bible gives us strong admonitions against wine, so how can new wine be a blessing? Is it, that this drink is only a blessing in moderation? Or is it, that this new wine means something different than what most believe when talking about "wine".

Words change over time. For example, the word gay today also has the meaning of homosexual, which it did not have in the past. The word donkey, was not the word used for donkey, in the KJV. Today, searching for the meaning of the word wine, we find that it refers to an alcoholic beverage. And believe it or not, the word "wine" has not always referred to an alcoholic beverage. Looking at the word new wine, we can find this in Strong's Exhaustive Concordance:


Or tiyrosh {tee-roshe'}; from yarash in the sense of expulsion; must or fresh grape-juice (as just squeezed out); by implication (rarely) fermented wine -- (new, sweet) wine.

http://biblehub.com/hebrew/8492.htm


The wine found in Isaiah 65:8 refers to grape juice. This is not fermented grape juice. It is this wine, this grape juice, which is not always called new wine, that God says that is a blessing.

What then of it's alcoholic counter-part? Is this wine, the fermented one, a blessing? Or does the Bible consider that wine a poison?


Deuteronomy 32:32-33 For their vine is of the vine of Sodom, and of the fields of Gomorrah: their grapes are grapes of gall, their clusters are bitter: 33 Their wine is the poison of dragons, and the cruel venom of asps.

How strongly is this wine spoken against in this passage! The vine here is of the vine of Sodom! The fields here, are the fields of Gomorrah! What happened to Sodom and Gomorrah?

Genesis 19:24 Then the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven;

This wine brings destruction. This wine is not a blessing.

The grapes here represented, are the grapes of gall. What is gall?


gall, hemlock, poison, venom

Or rowsh (Deut. 32:32) {roshe}; apparently the same as ro'sh; a poisonous plant, probably the poppy (from its conspicuous head); generally poison (even of serpents) -- gall, hemlock, poison, venom.


This wine is the poison of serpents! It is gall, the cruel venom of the asps! Should this wine be taken in by a Christian? Is it safe for us to consume this poison, in moderation?

This is also called the poison of dragons. The words "asps" and "dragons" did not find their way into this passage by mistake. What is an asp?


pethen: (a venomous serpent) perhaps cobra

adder

From an unused root meaning to twist; an asp (from its contortions) -- adder.


An asp is a serpent, a venomous one. As I said, the words "asps" and "dragons" did not find their way into this passage by mistake. Who is the old serpent? Who is the dragon?

Revelation 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

That's right. Alcoholic wine is the stuff of devils. It is Satan that would have a Christian consume this alcoholic beverage, this poison. Is it any wonder then, the Scriptures have this to say about such a poison:

Proverbs 20:1 Wine is a mocker, strong drink is raging: and whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise.

Fermented wine is a poison, a mocker. Strong drink is a poison and is raging. "Whosoever is deceived thereby is not wise."

Many teach that it is okay to drink fermented wine, but in moderation. But the Bible admonishes us not even to LOOK at wine when it's fermented.


Proverbs 23:29-35 Who hath woe? who hath sorrow? who hath contentions? who hath babbling? who hath wounds without cause? who hath redness of eyes? 30 They that tarry long at the wine; they that go to seek mixed wine. 31 Look not thou upon the wine when it is red, when it giveth his colour in the cup, when it moveth itself aright. 32 At the last it biteth like a serpent, and stingeth like an adder. 33 Thine eyes shall behold strange women, and thine heart shall utter perverse things. 34 Yea, thou shalt be as he that lieth down in the midst of the sea, or as he that lieth upon the top of a mast. 35 They have stricken me, shalt thou say, and I was not sick; they have beaten me, and I felt it not: when shall I awake? I will seek it yet again.

The wine that "giveth his colour in the cup" is fermented wine. During the process of fermentation, wine changes color. And notice, this same wine bites like a serpent, and stings like an adder. This is the poisonous wine that we are not to consume, this fermented wine.

But didn't Jesus make wine for the wedding? Yes, He did. But this is not fermented wine that Jesus made. Jesus did not perform a miracle so that the guests could drink the wine of Satan, but the wine which the Bible says is a blessing.


John 2:10 And saith unto him, Every man at the beginning doth set forth good wine; and when men have well drunk, then that which is worse: but thou hast kept the good wine until now.

Judging from the context of the passage, we can tell that the guests at the wedding had already been drinking wine. If they were drinking alcoholic wine, why would Jesus provide more alcoholic wine for them? Was he trying to get them drunk? Was he trying to give them a buzz? No, this is something our Lord and Saviour would NEVER do. The wine Jesus provided was grape juice.

At the last supper, did Jesus provide grape juice or fermented wine? Consider what is stated:


Mark 14:24-25 And he said unto them, This is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many. 25 Verily I say unto you, I will drink no more of the fruit of the vine, until that day that I drink it new in the kingdom of God.

Matthew 26:27-30 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it; 28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins. 29 But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom. 30 And when they had sung an hymn, they went out into the mount of Olives.

Jesus will not drink of the fruit of the vine until he drinks it new with us in the kingdom of God. Was Jesus saying he would drink fermented alcohol with the disciples in the kingdom of God? Or, was He referring to grape juice? The wine here spoken of, which the disciples drank of, is new wine. They were drinking grape juice.

Consider what was given at the last supper. The unleavened bread, and the unfermented wine.


1 Corinthians 5:6-7 Your glorying is not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump? 7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:

The little heaven represented here is not a good leaven. This leaven was to be purged out. This leaven represents sin. As Jesus was sinless, so the unleavened bread represented Jesus, as He has never sinned.

Likewise, fermented wine is the wine of Satan. Was there any of Satan in Jesus?


John 14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me.

Nothing within Jesus responded to Satan's satanic suggestions. Not even by a thought did Jesus sin. Christ is the sinless, Lamb of God. He is without spot, the Saviour of the World.

Does Ephesians 5:18 sanction wine drinking?


Ephesians 5:18 And be not drunk with wine, wherein is excess; but be filled with the Spirit;

Not at all. The Bible speaks out against the drinking of fermented wine. Is wine all of a sudden not poisonous? So what is this passage saying? And what is it not saying?

Consider how when one drinks enough fermented wine, they become drunk. We Christians need the Holy Spirit. We don't need a little bit of the Holy Spirit, but we need to be FILLED with the Holy Spirit. In no way is it sanctioning the drinking of a little wine, in the same way it's not saying it's okay to have a little bit of the Holy Spirit. No, be ye filled with the Holy Spirit. What about the word excess? That word is not referring to the amount of fermented wine that is drunk, but to a state of being.


excess, debauchery

From a compound of a (as a negative particle) and a presumed derivative of sozo; properly, unsavedness, i.e. (by implication) profligacy -- excess, riot.


The word excess here is the same word as riot, which is actually used in 1 Peter 4.

1 Peter 4:3-4 For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries: 4 Wherein they think it strange that ye run not with them to the same excess of riot, speaking evil of you:

Notice the "excess of riot" mentioned. The word riot here is the same as the word excess in the previous passage. They both are mean sinful behaviour. Notice how riot here is spoken of as "excess" of riot. That word excess DOES refer to an amount. So, is it okay for Christians act with riotess, sinful behaviour, just not excessively? Of course not. We shall not sin, that grace may abound.

But wait. What about "excess of wine" in 1 Peter 4:3? Those three words come back to one word. That word simply means, drunknness:


drunkenness

From oinos and a form of the base of phluaros; an overflow (or surplus) of wine, i.e. Vinolency (drunkenness) -- excess of wine.


The Christian is not allowed to drink alcohol.
 

RANDOR

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Raeneske.....Boy.....you sure put a lot into that...it must have been laying heavy on your heart.
Thank you for sharing.
God Bless †
 

StanJ

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Wine is wine...grape juice is grape juice. The Hebrews had a word for each, so unless you believe every translator got it wrong, one is fermented and one is not.
 

DPMartin

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For one it seems you take Gen 40 way out of context. The mention of wine in the butler’s dream is for the sake of Joseph in that it was related to what the butler did for the Pharaoh. Just as the baker and his relationship with bread. The only thing other that would be considered associated to anything would be to Christ in that the body hanged, the baker being associated to bread, and the Life lived, the wine being the blood, and the blood being the life of the body and the butler being associated to the serving of the wine to Pharaoh.

As far as your statement that Christians shouldn’t drink alcohol for reasons you’ve managed to create by hacking the scriptures to your liking. Is ludicrous. The Lord God never told His People that wine is evil nor the fruit thereof, as you want to portray.

Drunkenness is unwise for sure, but that doesn’t make consumption of wine evil, the first miracle Jesus did was to turn water into wine for a wedding so that it could be consumed by those who have already had wine to drink. So according to you Jesus encouraged others to do what you say they shouldn’t. It would be confusing if what you think scripture means on this subject was true, wouldn’t it?

Most references that Lord God makes, though not all, to wine or wine press so on and so forth especially in the cases with the prophets has everything to do with the fulfillment of what shall happen to Christ or the demise of and enemy, or the wicked.

Bread, the justification for the flesh to live, (Gen:3:19) and the wine that is associated to Noah and the two where brought to Abraham by Melchizedek king of Salem the priest of the most high God. Of whom was the foreshadowing of whom we know to be King of Jerusalem, of which Jerusalem once was in Abrahams day and we know to be the priest of the most high God our Lord Jesus Christ who brought the justification to be in the flesh in the Presence of God, and the life that is His to the Apostles.

That is what a Christian should contemplate and learn more about when it comes to the wine and the bread otherwise if you see it unwise to drink alcohol then don’t.
 

RANDOR

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Apr 13, 2014
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Woe....men........woe........Now if someone has been delivered from drinking alcohol by all means he should not drink not one sip.

But.....if a man/woman....acts differently than they should with this in their system......then they to should not drink.

But.....if a man can reframe and keep satan at bay......meaning the knock on the door does not register...then by all means one can drink.

Me personally.....haven't drank in 26 years....was delivered from it....drinking for me went hand in hand with not doing nice things (not pleasing to God)

To each his own.......pertaining to drinking :)
 

StanJ

Lifelong student of God's Word.
May 13, 2014
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DPMartin said:
For one it seems you take Gen 40 way out of context. The mention of wine in the butler’s dream is for the sake of Joseph in that it was related to what the butler did for the Pharaoh. Just as the baker and his relationship with bread. The only thing other that would be considered associated to anything would be to Christ in that the body hanged, the baker being associated to bread, and the Life lived, the wine being the blood, and the blood being the life of the body and the butler being associated to the serving of the wine to Pharaoh.
As far as your statement that Christians shouldn’t drink alcohol for reasons you’ve managed to create by hacking the scriptures to your liking. Is ludicrous. The Lord God never told His People that wine is evil nor the fruit thereof, as you want to portray.

Drunkenness is unwise for sure, but that doesn’t make consumption of wine evil, the first miracle Jesus did was to turn water into wine for a wedding so that it could be consumed by those who have already had wine to drink. So according to you Jesus encouraged others to do what you say they shouldn’t. It would be confusing if what you think scripture means on this subject was true, wouldn’t it?

Most references that Lord God makes, though not all, to wine or wine press so on and so forth especially in the cases with the prophets has everything to do with the fulfillment of what shall happen to Christ or the demise of and enemy, or the wicked.

Bread, the justification for the flesh to live, (Gen:3:19) and the wine that is associated to Noah and the two where brought to Abraham by Melchizedek king of Salem the priest of the most high God. Of whom was the foreshadowing of whom we know to be King of Jerusalem, of which Jerusalem once was in Abrahams day and we know to be the priest of the most high God our Lord Jesus Christ who brought the justification to be in the flesh in the Presence of God, and the life that is His to the Apostles.

That is what a Christian should contemplate and learn more about when it comes to the wine and the bread otherwise if you see it unwise to drink alcohol then don’t.
Exactly...and Eph 5:18 states; Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit.
Nothing about do not DRINK wine. IF as the OP asserts, this is grape juice, you can't get drunk on it.