THE CHURCH

[Helen]

Lol

.yeah experience trumps scripture in your world...you might drink t

Lol...in your world experience trumps scripture.
In the Kingdom scripture rules. Do not drink the koolaid aid when they offer it
You are like the ones who believed Marshall Applewhite and tried to go on the comet.

Okay, I'll buy it.

Show me where the bible proves that we are not an integral part of His Temple.
I know you will find just the very opposite.

We are each a part of His Temple, as we are a part of His Body.

Which bible do you read? ( serious question)

How do you read 1 Cor 3:16
" Know ye not that ye are the Temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? "

 

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

Okay, I'll buy it.

Show me where the bible proves that we are not an integral part of His Temple.
I know you will find just the very opposite.

We are each a part of His Temple, as we are a part of His Body.

Which bible do you read? ( serious question)

How do you read 1 Cor 3:16
" Know ye not that ye are the Temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? "

That is not the issue. Of course we are part of the temple. We do not get special voice messages from heaven saying we are bricks

 

[Helen]

That is not the issue. Of course we are part of the temple. We do not get special voice messages from heaven saying we are bricks

Well, I don’t know when God told you that. But , go for it...if makes you happy.
You are obviously one of those who believe that God stopped speaking in the NT .

Have at it!

 

[FHII]

That is not the issue. Of course we are part of the temple. We do not get special voice messages from heaven saying we are bricks

So what's going on here? Are we arguing over whether we are bricks? Really?

Well, I don't have a scripture that says we are bricks. But I do have Eph 2 which states we are built on the foundation of the Apostles and prophets with Jesus being the chief cornerstone. It also likens us to a building fitly framed into a temple.

Then there is this:

1 Peter 2:5 KJV
Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Bricks make buildings but so do stones. They kinda serve the same purpose. So I don't see the problem with talking about us being bricks in God's temple.

As for whether God is sending someone special voice messages... I am going to stop short in saying he doesn't. Maybe he does.

But there is no shortage of folks on the net claiming God directly spoke to them. If all of them are true then God talked to more people directly in the last 19 years than the entire OT era!

I doubt every one of them. Again, I stop short of saying it isn't possible. But God has many ways to communicate with us directly without speaking to us from the sky or whatever.

God talks to us through circumstances. He doesn't tell us to avoid the drunk driver 2 miles down the road. He may send you a flat tire to slow you down.

He speaks to us through our Bible reading. You want to hear from the Lord right now? Well pick up one of the 66 letters he wrote to us.

He speaks to us through sermons from his chosen men. Or dreams. He even sends angels. Not even Mary heard directly from God... God sent Gabe.

God could talk to us directly, but he has other ways he uses. Is that not good enough? I have a theory as to why he does it the way he does... But I can't fully prove it. I won't put it forth, but I will say that he isn't looking to do things the easy way.

So again... I stop short of saying God never speaks directly to anyone. I do say it is a rare thing. Those that say he did are putting themselves on the second level as Noah, Moses, Isaiah and Paul. Yet, these men had a very important message. Well beyond being a brick.

 

[Helen]

So what's going on here? Are we arguing over whether we are bricks? Really?

Well, I don't have a scripture that says we are bricks. But I do have Eph 2 which states we are built on the foundation of the Apostles and prophets with Jesus being the chief cornerstone. It also likens us to a building fitly framed into a temple.

Then there is this:

1 Peter 2:5 KJV
Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Bricks make buildings but so do stones. They kinda serve the same purpose. So I don't see the problem with talking about us being bricks in God's temple.

As for whether God is sending someone special voice messages... I am going to stop short in saying he doesn't. Maybe he does.

But there is no shortage of folks on the net claiming God directly spoke to them. If all of them are true then God talked to more people directly in the last 19 years than the entire OT era!

I doubt every one of them. Again, I stop short of saying it isn't possible. But God has many ways to communicate with us directly without speaking to us from the sky or whatever.

God talks to us through circumstances. He doesn't tell us to avoid the drunk driver 2 miles down the road. He may send you a flat tire to slow you down.

He speaks to us through our Bible reading. You want to hear from the Lord right now? Well pick up one of the 66 letters he wrote to us.

He speaks to us through sermons from his chosen men. Or dreams. He even sends angels. Not even Mary heard directly from God... God sent Gabe.

God could talk to us directly, but he has other ways he uses. Is that not good enough? I have a theory as to why he does it the way he does... But I can't fully prove it. I won't put it forth, but I will say that he isn't looking to do things the easy way.

So again... I stop short of saying God never speaks directly to anyone. I do say it is a rare thing. Those that say he did are putting themselves on the second level as Noah, Moses, Isaiah and Paul. Yet, these men had a very important message. Well beyond being a brick.

Thank you ..glad you wrote that. You used scripture that I forgot.
It wasn't 'my ' issue..I just jumped in when he was making nasty remarks about the friend of mjrhealth.

Who know how God speaks ...Romans 1:20 says he speaks continually through creation around us. He speaks through His written word.
He speaks into our very heart...He is our Father. He is not silent.
So who is this person to deride and sneer when someone say that God spoke and encouraged them.
We have enough enemies without it coming from within our own camp.

Thank you.

 

[Windmillcharge]

Today the preacher must have a degree from a Seminary school.

They don't have to have a degree. That most do is down to a variety of reasons.
The few I know who haven't been to college have spent far longer reading and reading to educate themselves in theology.

 

[Anthony D'Arienzo]

Well, I don’t know when God told you that. But , go for it...if makes you happy.
You are obviously one of those who believe that God stopped speaking in the NT .

Have at it!

BG,
GOD has stopped speaking except through His finished word and work.
This is not optional but final Heb1:1-3...rev22:18-19
We do not say this to be contentious,but accurate.

 

[Mjh29]

Sorry. You can rant, but it changes nothing.
Maybe you never hear the Lord speak to you...too bad for you.
You believe those times are over...too bad for you.

You don't have a Father son relationship with the Lord, too bad for you.

But you keep declaring that God did not speak it to him,changes nothing.
That is like telling a blind man that got his sight back that he still couldn't see.

" The man with an experience is never at the mercy of a man with just an argument. "

If you believe you and others hears Christ talking to you, why aren't you writing down exactly what He said and adding it to your Bible? If Christ speaks directly to you, that is divine revelation and therefore should be added to the canon of Scripture.

The Bible is the Word of God given to man
You believe Jesus speaks to you, which is the Words of God given to man

So, why don't you add it to your Bible? And more, why don't you demand others add it to their Bible as well? I mean, you've heard the voice of God; it would be a sin if the whole world did not know of this new revelation, this new Scripture!

 

[H. Richard]

If you believe you and others hears Christ talking to you, why aren't you writing down exactly what He said and adding it to your Bible? If Christ speaks directly to you, that is divine revelation and therefore should be added to the canon of Scripture.

The Bible is the Word of God given to man
You believe Jesus speaks to you, which is the Words of God given to man

So, why don't you add it to your Bible? And more, why don't you demand others add it to their Bible as well? I mean, you've heard the voice of God; it would be a sin if the whole world did not know of this new revelation, this new Scripture!

I don't believe she is saying that Jesus speaks words as we hear them with our ears. But it is a truth that Jesus speaks to us in His words that He has given us in Paul's gospel of grace given to him by Jesus..

The Holy Spirit opens the eyes of the children of God so that they can understand the words of God. As the scriptures state, a person can not understand the scriptures unless God opens their eyes and that is through the spirit (1 Cor 2:12-16) below.

1 Cor 2:12-16
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.
13 These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one.
16 For "who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct Him?" But we have the mind of Christ.
NKJV

1 Cor 3:1-4
3 And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ.
2 I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able;
3 for you are still carnal. For where there are envy, strife, and divisions among you, are you not carnal and behaving like mere men?
4 For when one says, "I am of Paul," and another, "I am of Apollos," are you not carnal?
NKJV

Yep it is going on today when people say I am of the Baptist church, the Methodist church, the RC church, etc.

 

[Mjh29]

I don't believe she is saying that Jesus speaks words as we hear them with our ears. But it is a truth that Jesus speaks to us in His words that He has given us in Paul's gospel of grace given to him by Jesus..

The Holy Spirit opens the eyes of the children of God so that they can understand the words of God. As the scriptures state, a person can not understand the scriptures unless God opens their eyes and that is through the spirit (1 Cor 2:12-16) below.

1 Cor 2:12-16
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.
13 These things we also speak, not in words which man's wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one.
16 For "who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct Him?" But we have the mind of Christ.
NKJV

1 Cor 3:1-4
3 And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ.
2 I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able;
3 for you are still carnal. For where there are envy, strife, and divisions among you, are you not carnal and behaving like mere men?
4 For when one says, "I am of Paul," and another, "I am of Apollos," are you not carnal?
NKJV

Yep it is going on today when people say I am of the Baptist church, the Methodist church, the RC church, etc.

Yes, I agree that the Holy Spirit speaks to the hearts of men through the Word, but people have been saying they heard God say something to them, which is what I was speaking of.

 

[H. Richard]

They don't have to have a degree. That most do is down to a variety of reasons.
The few I know who haven't been to college have spent far longer reading and reading to educate themselves in theology.

Some will say that a person can not know what scriptures say unless they hear it from some one else.

I am really amazed that some of the people do not really know that the Holy Spirit is alive and well and able to keep the children of God and also educate them.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Don't carry your ideas to the extreme. There is a time when a person who has become a child of God must teach what he/she has learned. As you have acknowledged only a few are of God. But today there are many who stand in a pulpit and preach who are not teaching the gospel of grace.

I once had a conversation with an associate pastor who after telling him what I see in the scriptures agreed with me but said he could not teach that from the pulpit because he would loss his position in the church organization and his pension. So the lies go on.

There are churches that do not preach the gospel of grace. They preach a gospel of works mixed with grace and it will not lead anyone to Christ. Why? Because that mixed gospel only makes people self-righteous and is of the Devil.

The RCC killed many who were children of God. Calvin did the same in Switzerland when he had those who were Jews and those who were catholic killed unless they left the country.. Many religious people do the same when they pour out their snake venom against another poster. The children of God will always be game for the Devil and the Devil is in many churches and on many forums. I can not turn a blind eye to it.

Such incredible self-imposed ignorance.
Not sure HOW many times you will need to be taught something before it finally sinks in . . .

 

[Helen]

BG,
GOD has stopped speaking except through His finished word and work.
This is not optional but final Heb1:1-3...rev22:18-19
We do not say this to be contentious,but accurate.

Well, we will just have to disagree on this and go our separate ways. Neither of us will change our stand.

I am sorry for you , you have a FATHER who never speaks to you. And the sad thing is, it doesn't even bother you!!!

Oh well.
BUT, try telling @Frank Lee that Father does not speak to him! Good luck on that.
On Christmas day he was in hospital , told by the end of his stay that he had cancer ..a mass in his lung. He had a biopsy and CT scan etc etc
long story short, in spite of all that "evidence" GOD TOLD HIM that he did not have cancer and he would not die.
Sure enough...just this week..yesterday I believe ...he get all the full results... NO CANCER. ( a problem that needs 100% healing, but not cancer or death sentence.
Frank did not listen to man, doctors, but to God his FATHER who speaks to him.

I could tell you stories of my own life, and the life and HEARING relationship of my Christian friends...
God is indeed alive and well...and still speaking to His people.
God bless you ..and open your ears and heart.

No point in continuing this conversation any more.
.... Helen

 

[Dave L]

Well, we will just have to disagree on this and go our separate ways. Neither of us will change our stand.

I am sorry for you , you have a FATHER who never speaks to you. And the sad thing is, it doesn't even bother you!!! View attachment 5638

Oh well.
BUT, try telling @Frank Lee that Father does not speak to him! Good luck on that.
On Christmas day he was in hospital , told by the end of his stay that he had cancer ..a mass in his lung. He had a biopsy and CT scan etc etc
long story short, in spite of all that "evidence" GOD TOLD HIM that he did not have cancer and he would not die.
Sure enough...just this week..yesterday I believe ...he get all the full results... NO CANCER. ( a problem that needs 100% healing, but not cancer or death sentence.
Frank did not listen to man, doctors, but to God his FATHER who speaks to him.

I could tell you stories of my own life, and the life and HEARING relationship of my Christian friends...
God is indeed alive and well...and still speaking to His people.
God bless you ..and open your ears and heart.

No point in continuing this conversation any more.
.... Helen

I don't hear God speak audibly. But faith tells me he answered my prayer, or if I'm moving in the right direction. It's more of a witness of the Spirit that says "It's OK.
“And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.” (Matthew 21:22) (KJV 1900)

 

[Helen]

I don't hear God speak audibly. But faith tells me he answered my prayer, or if I'm moving in the right direction. It's more of a witness of the Spirit that says "It's OK.
“And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.” (Matthew 21:22) (KJV 1900)

I agree with you...and Dave, I am glad to see you write that...in times past I took your posts to blankly say that you did never 'hear' anything from our Father.

Yes agree with the inner witness of His Spirit leading or confirming us.
You will say I am a mystic and maybe so...but "for me" I can be reading along in the word and suddenly a verse with jump out at me..and my inner witness leaps....He speaks in answer to, or in rebuke , or encouragement. That is Father speaking to me.

I used to read lots of Watchman Nee's books years ago.
He explained how he was lead...it was by the inner voice.
In a situation if he was aware of a rising of his spirit within...he went ahead moving forward in faith. If he was aware of a 'withdrawing' of his inner man and no witness of the Spirit..then he took that as a stop. And did not go ahead.
I kinda witness to his thoughts there.

Once, and once only...I had a real serious question that needed answering from God. For months I heard nothing, no direction..then one day I opened my bible for my daily morning reading at a place.
I then turned to do something...forget what..turned back and accidently knocked my bible...and right there a few verses "jumped out at me"..
Those verses addressed my question to the very letter. I am 100% convinced it was my Father.

I have actually heard the audible voice of the Lord...christmas eve 1975
Not sure I ever want to again...it was pretty scary. So loud it shook the house.
My husband did not hear or feel anything.

I know you have me marked as a nutter...but, what can I say

 

[CoreIssue]

Good one @Enoch111 Well said.
Sounds very 'Watchman Nee' ...

Watchmen Nee.

You do realize he was a cult founder I hope. Along with Watchmen Lee.

 

[Dave L]

I agree with you...and Dave, I am glad to see you write that...in times past I took your posts to blankly say that you did never 'hear' anything from our Father.

Yes agree with the inner witness of His Spirit leading or confirming us.
You will say I am a mystic and maybe so...but "for me" I can be reading along in the word and suddenly a verse with jump out at me..and my inner witness leaps....He speaks in answer to, or in rebuke , or encouragement. That is Father speaking to me.

I used to read lots of Watchman Nee's books years ago.
He explained how he was lead...it was by the inner voice.
In a situation if he was aware of a rising of his spirit within...he went ahead moving forward in faith. If he was aware of a 'withdrawing' of his inner man and no witness of the Spirit..then he took that as a stop. And did not go ahead.
I kinda witness to his thoughts there.

Once, and once only...I had a real serious question that needed answering from God. For months I heard nothing, no direction..then one day I opened my bible for my daily morning reading at a place.
I then turned to do something...forget what..turned back and accidently knocked my bible...and right there a few verses "jumped out at me"..
Those verses addressed my question to the very letter. I am 100% convinced it was my Father.

I have actually heard the audible voice of the Lord...christmas eve 1975
Not sure I ever want to again...it was pretty scary. So loud it shook the house.
My husband did not hear or feel anything.

I know you have me marked as a nutter...but, what can I say

Have you ever had a "Freudian slip" where something totally unplanned came out of your mouth? I know that is God producing the words according to this and similar passages. “The preparations of the heart in man, And the answer of the tongue, is from the Lord.” (Proverbs 16:1) (KJV 1900) And also in the night if "cat napping" I think in my voice some things I know are beyond me that are from the Lord. But I think bible examples of God speaking audibly are rare.

 

[Helen]

Watchmen Nee.

You do realize he was a cult founder I hope. Along with Watchmen Lee.

Yep.
But Core..unlike you...I can eat the good and spit out the seeds.
I never throw the baby out with the bathwater.
All God's people are a mixture...even you, even me...we "think" that WE see clearly , but we ALL see through a glass darkly ...UNTIL He which is perfect has come...

 

[CoreIssue]

Christ is the founder, foundation and head of the church. While the church isn't the building iy most assuredly is all the people in the buildings that belong to Christ. Including local churches.

 

[Helen]

Have you ever had a "Freudian slip" where something totally unplanned came out of your mouth? I know that is God producing the words according to this and similar passages. “The preparations of the heart in man, And the answer of the tongue, is from the Lord.” (Proverbs 16:1) (KJV 1900) And also in the night if "cat napping" I think in my voice some things I know are beyond me that are from the Lord. But I think bible examples of God speaking audibly are rare.

Yes AMEN! Totally...

Maybe you and I are not as far apart as we maybe think that we are.