Some say we are not to lay the foundation again. My point is that most of religion NEVER teach the foundation. When asked why they are saved most all will never mention the cross. They will most always retreat into works of religion
The Cross that no one wants to talk about
- Thread starter H. Richard
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You quoted my post. So the question remains/ who are you calling slow. Thefact that you are dragging your heel exposes you. I did not convict anyone least of all me. I asked a simple question. are you going to answer either question?
I do think that most christians would agree that christs cross is essential to salvation. Though your insults reveal other things about your faith.
how do you know no one acknowledge that Jesus atoned? are you in touch with every conscious?
this is the "Christian section" of a "Christian site" therefore salvation in Christ Jesus is not only assumed its presumed believed and trusted. therefore its not necessary to continue in the kiddy pool and we can move on to the deep end of revelation and edification in Christ. once one is born into the world they know who brought them into the world because they are wanted (in the case of good parents) and move on to the task of learning how to live the life they have received of their parents. no different in being born of the Holy Spirit. one receives the Life of Christ in the son ship enjoyed by Christ in the Presence of the Father. hence we move on to how to live that same Life, that is in the Presence of the Father, and enjoy in the sharing there of, which edifies.
for example; many people think the scriptures are for the justification, but it shows us that we are experiencing the same God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob. which edifies, affirms and teaches us in accordance to its purpose. if you want to continue to repeat yourself over and over the milk of the faith, you are more than welcome to, but the rest of us just might seek wisdom knowledge and understanding that is of God that He gives freely for a reason.
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NO! I am not since our attitude and tone is an argumentive one. I am not interested in arguing.
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Just as the religious accused Jesus and Paul of many things just because they did not agree with them it also happens on forums. You insulted me when you talk about me rather than the idea behind the post.
Why don't you ask those in your church why they think they are saved and let their answers prove my point. Since all that is taught in religions is a social/moral gospel very few will say Jesus' shed blood has saved them from their sins. most will not agree that Jesus atoned for all their sins Most will talk about their church and what they do in their church.
Helen
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H.Richards response to Sword..
I have a hard time seeing that "the Cross" has worked much humility or brokenness in you! We are used to arrogant 'stone throwers' and brow beaters with high opinion of themselves ..on Christian Sits...I hope your attitude in thinking that you know more than the rest of us brings you joy.
Just remember, that the yard stick you judge others with is the same one God will measure you with.
" For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again."
You have no idea where have each have walked, or the dealings we have each been through with the Lord.
"Physician heal thyself" ...If you didn't want people to answer your Opening Post then I wonder why you wrote it in the first place!
I have a hard time seeing that "the Cross" has worked much humility or brokenness in you! We are used to arrogant 'stone throwers' and brow beaters with high opinion of themselves ..on Christian Sits...I hope your attitude in thinking that you know more than the rest of us brings you joy.
Just remember, that the yard stick you judge others with is the same one God will measure you with.
" For with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again."
You have no idea where have each have walked, or the dealings we have each been through with the Lord.
"Physician heal thyself" ...If you didn't want people to answer your Opening Post then I wonder why you wrote it in the first place!
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Just like a Christian you think what you have written is pure without judging while all you have written is judging me. Boy you must have really been hit hard by the fact that I said most do not talk about the cross. Did it convict you?
***I'm a Calvinist, bud, we don't think we can do anything right!
Thanks. I got a good laugh out of this one. But, of course, you realize that according to some you must become perfect in the flesh to be saved.
Why don't you start a thread asking the same question? Let the answers prove your point.
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ESSENTIAL???. It is the only reason we can have salvation. Just because a person says that they believe in Jesus does not mean they have faith in what He did on the cross for their benefit. Every church that calls it's self Christian can say they believe in Jesus. But do they believe His shed blood has atoned (paid) for their sins. Salvation is the works of Jesus on the cross plus nothing.
1 Cor 1:17-18
17 For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel, not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of no effect.
Christ the Power and Wisdom of God (cf. Isa 29:14)
18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
NKJV
Gal 6:12-15
12 As many as desire to make a good showing in the flesh, these would compel you to be circumcised, only that they may not suffer persecution for the cross of Christ.
13 For not even those who are circumcised keep the law, but they desire to have you circumcised that they may boast in your flesh.
14 But God forbid that I should boast except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world.
15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision avails anything, but a new creation.
NKJV
You don't believe the blood that was shed at the cross is able to establish perfection?
2 Corinthians 7
7 Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God.
Matthew 5
48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.
o
What do you mean our attitude? You opened your staement with for the slow. I asked you a simple question as a brother in Christ as that is what we are. The point I am making is you do not have the right to talk to anyone like that . You actully warned against calling any man a fool. But you are acting up and know that you are in the wrong. Man up and except you made a mistake. Stop accusing me of being argumentative.
you certainly are not the only one, The devil loves christians dweeling on sin as it keeps them seperated from Christ, and yes very few, even christians fully comprehend what He has done and insist that they need to do something to save themselves, we all do it, it is teh nature of men to want to pay back(well most some love freebies , i certainly do when i can get them) but the world has taught us ,pay pay pay and when done pay again. But it also says
Joh 16:8 And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
Joh 16:9 Of sin, because they believe not on me;
Which is why it also says
Joh_5:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
But that takes faith, and teh enemy will always oppose it., and once in faith sin just becomes like that anooying mosquito always bugging you but no longer filling you with "GUILT". Guilt says, I dont believe what He did.
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mjrhealth, I know you are a child of God based on what you write. There are others that I also know are children of God by what they write. But as you can clearly see the replies are from those that I do not seem to see faith in what Jesus did on the cross + nothing as their faith. They are the ones that oppose the cross (the work of God). These are the ones that oppose the children of God who glory in the cross, the work of God.
I enjoy your writings.
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If you do not want to be accused of arguing then don't do it. Stop making the poster the subject of your relies. Sorry but I do not see you as a brother. I see you as one that opposes everything I believe in. I started this thread about the failure of the Christian religion to preach the cross and shed blood of Jesus. Most of the posts here are about what some see as mans efforts to save themselves. It is those that are convicted by my writing that I am addressing.
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I see you have read the scriptures and selected what you think is true. However when Jesus said we must be perfect you have to go on in the same scriptures to where the Apostles said "then who can be saved". Jesus said "with man it is impossible. But with God all things are possible".
So you have to understand the whole, not just the part. Man can not make himself perfect by what he does. God IMPUTS righteousness to those who trust, have faith, in what God has already done on the cross. The flesh can not make it's self perfect by what It does. The shed blood of Jesus on the cross paid (atoned) for all the sins of the world, including mine and yours. It is written that everyone has a pardon from their sins of the flesh but if you don't believe it then it is not in effect.
Isa 53:5-6
5 But He was wounded for our transgressions, He was bruised for our iniquities; The chastisement for our peace was upon Him, And by His stripes we are healed.
6 All we like sheep have gone astray; We have turned, every one, to his own way; And the Lord has laid on Him the iniquity of us all.
NKJV
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