John S said:
Once Saved - Always Saved - Even if a person gambles too much, drinks too much, spends too much time at the less savory parts of the internet, ogles the 16-year old babysitter too much, or many of the other activities that God might find offensive.
Once Saved - Always Saved means that WE have decided who will go to Heaven or Hell and who will not. WE are equal to God in determining these things.
I'm Sorry but I would think that God would find this kind of thinking as HIGHLY offensive - but maybe I'm wrong. Maybe He doesn't have a problem with it after all.
I'm NOT His equal. I don't decide whether I'm going to Heaven or not. I will leave that up to God to decide.
John S,
Salvation is not conditional on sin, rather on faith and God's mercy. God finds vanity offensive, pride is offensive to God, and so are many other things humanity harbors. This is why we need a Savior, because we are incapable. Is it we are saved by our actions, or by God's actions?
No one is claiming equality with God, only that God's promises are true!
Psalm 37:23-24
23 The steps of a man are established by the Lord,
And He delights in his way.
24 When he falls, he will not be hurled headlong,
Because the Lord is the One who holds his hand.
Perhaps you do not believe this verse...
Philippians 1:6
6
For I am confident of this very thing, that
He who began a good work in you will perfect it until the day of Christ Jesus.
Ok that one may not be clear enough.
Ephesians 1:3-4
3 Blessed
be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly
places in Christ,
4 just as
He chose us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we would be holy and blameless before Him. In love
This might explain it better.
Ephesians 2:8-10
8
For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;
9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
10
For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.
Maybe Jesus is more convincing...
John 6:37-40
37 “All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will certainly not cast out.
38 “For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.
39 “This is the will of Him who sent Me, that of all that He has given Me I lose nothing, but raise it up on the last day.
40 “For this is the will of My Father, that everyone who beholds the Son and believes in Him will have eternal life, and I Myself will raise him up on the last day.”
Or perhaps...
John 10:29
27 “My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me;
28 and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.
To look a bit at the last verse... The sheep follow the Good Shepard. Only His sheep are saved. Those He saves have their salvation decided before the foundations of the world. These do abhor sin. These do continue to the end. These abide in Christ, because this is the will of the Father that is working, and Jesus will lose nothing.
Purity said:
Wise!
Though heaven is not the reward of the saints.
Hi CRFTD
The technique of asking questions is integral to one gaining an understanding of a matter. The Apostle Paul uses this technique extensively throughout most of his writings to help the reader engage with the subject.
Here is a section in Romans 8 a well known much loved passage.
Rom 8:31 What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
Rom 8:32 He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
Rom 8:33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
Rom 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
Rom 8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
5 verses 6 questions.
Some questions you will find are closed questions, you know "yes or no", while others are open questions; they require a statement in response.
Has this comment originated from our other discussion where numerous Scriptures were posted to state a single truth and yet you continue in your resistance to that truth?
Purity
Another disappointing spirit manifested.
Lets look at number 2.
The second element was the upholding of true and wholesome teaching. Gr. didache: instruction; thus, teaching. To "continue steadfast" without the important basis of understanding, would be thus of little value. There are many communities that manifest a zealousness for activity, but lack a true understanding. As such they are no different from the Jewish community, who "have a zeal of God, but not according to knowledge" (Rom 10:2). The "apostles' doctrine" is that based upon the outline of salvation given in Acts 2:14-36.
Rom 10:2KJV
Rom 10:2ESV
Rom 10:2YLT
Rom 10:2NET
Therefore Salvation in relation to OSAS will be "conditional" upon the continuing in the Apostles doctrine.
So the outline given shows this...
Acts 2:17
17 ‘And it shall be in the last days,’ God says,
‘
That I will pour forth of My Spirit on all mankind;
And your sons and your daughters shall prophesy,
And your young men shall see visions,
And your old men shall dream dreams;
Acts 2:21
21 ‘And it shall be that
everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.’
Acts 25-27
25 “For David says of Him,
‘I saw the Lord always in my presence;
For He is at my right hand, so that I will not be shaken.
26 ‘Therefore my heart was glad and my tongue exulted;
Moreover my flesh also will live in hope;
27
Because You will not abandon my soul to Hades,
Nor allow Your Holy One to undergo decay.
Acts 32-33
32 “This Jesus God raised up again, to which we are all witnesses.
33 “Therefore having been exalted to the right hand of God, and having received from the Father the promise of the Holy Spirit, He has poured forth this which you both see and hear.
Here again it says God is the one who saves, not that we save ourselves.
Again I do not disagree that impropre belief does not achieve salvation... But those who are saved, are being saved, and will be saved do not have improper belief, nor do they have improper teaching, and they continue to the end because it is God purposing their salvation.