The False Doctrine of a 7-year Tribulation

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Hobie

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'For then shall be great tribulation,
such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time,
no, nor ever shall be.
And except those days should be shortened,
there should no flesh be saved:
but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.'

(Matthew 24:21-22)

'Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened,
.. and the moon shall not give her light,
.... and the stars shall fall from heaven,
...... and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
........ And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven:
.......... and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn,
............ and they shall see the Son of man
coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet,
and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds,
from one end of heaven to the other.'

(Matthew 24:29-31)

* Here the tribulation is followed, 'immediately' by what is described in the verses of Matthew 24:29-31. This has not yet occurred.

In Christ Jesus
Chris
Most of these have come about..
"For several days before the Dark Day, the Sun as viewed from New England appeared to be red, and the sky appeared yellow. While the darkness was present, soot was observed to have collected in rivers and in rain water, suggesting the presence of smoke. Also, when the night really came in, observers saw the Moon colored red. For portions of New England, the morning of May 19, 1780, was characterized by rain, indicating that cloud cover was present.[3][4][8]

Religious interpretations[edit]
Since communications technology of the day was primitive, most people found the darkness to be baffling and inexplicable. Many applied religious interpretations to the event.[9]

In Connecticut, a member of the Governor's council (renamed Connecticut State Senate in 1818), Abraham Davenport, became most famous for his response to his colleagues' fears that it was the Day of Judgment:

I am against adjournment. The day of judgment is either approaching, or it is not. If it is not, there is no cause for an adjournment; if it is, I choose to be found doing my duty. I wish therefore that candles may be brought.[10]....New England's Dark Day - Wikipedia

"the meteor storm of 1833 that broke into people's modern day awareness – it was of truly superlative strength. One estimate of the peak rate is over one hundred thousand meteors an hour,[10] but another, done as the storm abated, estimated in excess of 240,000 meteors during the nine hours of the storm,[1] over the entire region of North America east of the Rocky Mountains."
ight became day 181 years ago.


"Burning meteors populated the heavens with thousands upon thousands of incandescent dots shortly after sunset on Nov. 12, 1833.

Through the small hours of the night and into the wee hours of the morning the glowing matter seemed to wait as if on cue, suspended on the onyx canvas. Several hours before the sun rose, the first star fell.

Then it was as if the heavens collapsed.

People who witnessed the astonishing display across North America spoke of it even decades later with eyes wide and a quiver in the voice.

“It seemed as if the whole starry heavens had congregated at one point near the zenith and were simultaneously shooting forth, with the velocity of lightning, to every part of the horizon, and yet they were not exhausted—thousands swiftly followed in the track of thousands, as if created for the occasion,” testified an onlooker.

“Never did rain fall much thicker than the meteors fell toward the earth; east, west, north, and south, it was the same,” said another. “In a word, the whole heavens seemed in motion.” ...Adventist Review Online | Lessons from the Night the Stars Fell 181 Years Ago

As for the tribulation, here is a good article on this...

"What Is the Tribulation?
As we discuss the great tribulation to take place just before Jesus returns, keep in mind that there have been several other "times of trouble" for God's people in the past.

For example, the children of Israel endured 400 years of tribulation just before the Exodus (Acts 7:6). The early Christians also passed through a time of trouble immediately after the stoning of Stephen (Acts 8:1). From A.D. 303-313, during the era represented by the Smyrna church (Revelation 2:10), God's people suffered a 10-year period of tribulation. But perhaps the most notable time of trouble was the 1,260 years of intense persecution waged against true Christians during the Dark Ages. "And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared by God, that they should feed her there one thousand two hundred and threescore days." "And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman." Revelation 12:6, 13.

As dark as each of these times were for God's people, none can compare with the final, great tribulation that is yet to take place. The great tribulation corresponds with the time during which the seven last plagues of Revelation chapter 16 will fall. "And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God." Revelation 15:1.

God's wrath will be directed against the ones who disobey His law, distort His truth, and oppress His people. "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness." Romans 1:18.

The great tribulation also coincides with the Battle of Armageddon. Both take place immediately before Christ's second coming. "And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon. And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done."

It is my belief that the great time of trouble will last only a month or two. Here are a few Scriptures that show it will be a short period of time.

Revelation 18:8 tells us, "Therefore shall her plagues come in one day." A "day" in Bible prophecy represents one literal year (Ezekiel 4:6, Numbers 14:34, Luke 13:32). So when Revelation says that "her plagues come in one day," it means within, or less than, one year's time. The very nature of the seven last plagues-the rivers and seas turning to blood and the planet being scorched with great heat-would render it impossible for the human race to survive more than a month or two. This is why Jesus said, "And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect's sake those days will be shortened." Matthew 24:22, NKJV....

Through The Tribulation | Inside Report Magazine | Amazing Facts
 

Bobby Jo

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...
The angel gives a breakdown of the 70 weeks as follows:
7 weeks of years for rebuilding of Jerusalem (verse 25)
62 weeks of years to the Messiah (verses 25-26)

You forgot to include the messiah (anointed one) after the seven:

RSV Dan. 9
25 Know therefore and understand that from the going forth of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built again with squares and moat, but in a troubled time. 26 And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off
There are TWO "anointed ones", but it's ok to ignore what doesn't suit your doctrines. But if you can find ANY PRECEDENT either in Scripture or in any Society were GOD uses to non-incremental numbers in this fashion, I'll beg your forgiveness, i.e., a mile a quarter, a cup and half, four score and ten, -- are all legitimate. But there is NO PRECEDENT where a pair of shoes cost seven and sixty-two dollars.


Alternately, FALSE doctrines are MORE IMPORTANT than Scripture. So PLEASE continue espousing the commentator LIES ...
Bobby Jo
 

Hobie

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They are pointing to Christ, then to when He is crucified..
Daniel 9:24-27 King James Version (KJV)
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Here is a good explanation...
"The Work of the Messiah
The intercessory prayer of Daniel addresses two main concerns: the sins of the people and the desolation of Jerusalem. Thus, God’s response deals with these two petitions. Through the work of the Messiah the people will be redeemed and the sanctuary will be anointed. The two specific petitions, however, are answered in ways that transcend the immediate historical horizon of Daniel: the work of the Messiah will benefit the entire human race.

Read Daniel 9:21-27. What work was to be done within the 70-week period? Why can only Jesus accomplish it?

  1. “To finish the transgression”. The Hebrew word for “transgression” (pesha‘) suggests the willful violations by an inferior against a superior (for example, Prov. 28:24). This word also occurs in the Bible with regard to open defiance of God by humans (Ezek. 2:3). Through the blood of Jesus, however, rebellion against God is quashed and humans are offered the merits that flow from Calvary.
  2. “To make an end of sins”. The verb carries the meaning of “to seal”, and here it means that sin is forgiven. Since the fall, the human race has been unable to live up to God‘s standards, but the Messiah will take care of our failures.
  3. “To make reconciliation for iniquity”. As Paul says: “For it pleased the Father that in Him all the fullness should dwell, and by Him to reconcile all things to Himself, by Him, whether things on earth or things in heaven, having made peace through the blood of His cross” (Col. 1:19, 20, NKJV). Here, too, only Jesus can bring about this reality.
  4. “To bring in everlasting righteousness”. Christ took our place on the cross and thereby bestowed upon us the blessed condition of “being right” with God. Only by faith can we receive this righteousness that comes from God.
  5. “To seal up vision and prophecy”. When Christ offered Himself in sacrifice, the Old Testament prophecies that pointed to His atoning work were sealed up in the sense that they were fulfilled.
  6. “And to anoint the Most Holy”. The Most Holy mentioned here is not a person but a place. So the statement refers to the anointing of the heavenly sanctuary as Christ was inaugurated there as our great High Priest (Heb. 8:1)....From Confession to Consolation - Sabbath School Lesson 10, 1st Qtr 2020
 

Bobby Jo

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They are pointing to Christ, ...

Yep. When the "translators" of your Version (and I use the term "translators" loosely) set forth to convert Hebrew into English, they had a "Jesus Agenda", because that's what they expected these verses to convey. And although Scripture didn't support that premise, they KNEW that Dan. 9 had that intent, so they contrived/contorted/distorted Scripture to achieve what was NEVER SAID.

So you are correct. The "translator" LIES appear to point to Jesus, but they're lies. The literal text allows NO SUCH TRANSLATION/INTERPRETATION:

RSV Dan. 9
25 Know therefore and understand that from the going forth of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built again with squares and moat, but in a troubled time. 26 And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off


But if you like to be lied to, and then repeat those lies, you certainly have FREE WILL. -- However, having been warned of your folly, your blood is on your own head. But also --, the blood of all who believe the lies you repeat ARE ALSO ON YOUR HEAD.


Let not many be teachers, for their penalty is greater
Bobby Jo
 

Hobie

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Yep. When the "translators" of your Version (and I use the term "translators" loosely) set forth to convert Hebrew into English, they had a "Jesus Agenda", because that's what they expected these verses to convey. And although Scripture didn't support that premise, they KNEW that Dan. 9 had that intent, so they contrived/contorted/distorted Scripture to achieve what was NEVER SAID.

So you are correct. The "translator" LIES appear to point to Jesus, but they're lies. The literal text allows NO SUCH TRANSLATION/INTERPRETATION:

RSV Dan. 9
25 Know therefore and understand that from the going forth of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built again with squares and moat, but in a troubled time. 26 And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off


But if you like to be lied to, and then repeat those lies, you certainly have FREE WILL. -- However, having been warned of your folly, your blood is on your own head. But also --, the blood of all who believe the lies you repeat ARE ALSO ON YOUR HEAD.


Let not many be teachers, for their penalty is greater
Bobby Jo
Lets look at older versions then...
"Daniel 9:24-27 1599 Geneva Bible (GNV)
24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thine holy city, to finish the wickedness, and to seal up the sins, and to reconcile the iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

25 Know therefore and understand that from the going forth of the commandment to bring again the people, and to build Jerusalem, unto Messiah the Prince, shall be seven weeks and threescore and two weeks, and the street shall be built again, and the wall even in a troublous time.

26 And after threescore and two weeks, shall Messiah be slain, and shall have nothing, and the people of the prince that shall come, shall destroy the city and the Sanctuary, and the end thereof shall be with a flood: and unto the end of the battle it shall be destroyed by desolations.
 

Hobie

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Daniel 9:24-26 Wycliffe Bible (WYC)
24 Seventy weeks of years be abridged on thy people, and on thine holy city, that trespassing be ended, and sin take an end (and sin is brought to an end), and that wickedness be done away, and everlasting rightfulness be brought, and that the vision and prophecy be [ful]filled, and the Holy (Place) of (the) saints be anointed.

25 Therefore know thou, and perceive; from the going out of the word that Jerusalem be builded again, till to Christ, the duke, shall be seven weeks of years and two and sixty weeks of years; and again the street shall be builded, and walls, in the anguish of times. (And so know thou, and understand; from the going out of the word that Jerusalem be rebuilt, until the Anointed One, yea, the Prince, or the Ruler, shall be seven weeks of years and sixty-two weeks of years; and the streets and the walls shall be rebuilt, in the time of anguish.)

26 And after two and sixty weeks of years Christ shall be slain. And it shall not be his people, that shall deny him. And the people with the duke to coming shall destroy the city, and the saintuary; and the end thereof shall be destroying, and after the end of battle shall be ordained desolation. (And after sixty-two weeks of years the Anointed One shall be killed. And it shall not be his own people, who shall deny him life, that is who shall kill him. Yea, other people, coming with their own ruler, shall destroy the city, and the sanctuary; and its end shall be in utter destruction, and after the end of the battle there shall be ordained a desolation.)
 

Hobie

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Here is Youngs Literal translation...
"Daniel 9:24-26 Young's Literal Translation (YLT)
24 `Seventy weeks are determined for thy people, and for thy holy city, to shut up the transgression, and to seal up sins, and to cover iniquity, and to bring in righteousness age-during, and to seal up vision and prophet, and to anoint the holy of holies.

25 And thou dost know, and dost consider wisely, from the going forth of the word to restore and to build Jerusalem till Messiah the Leader [is] seven weeks, and sixty and two weeks: the broad place hath been built again, and the rampart, even in the distress of the times.

26 And after the sixty and two weeks, cut off is Messiah, and the city and the holy place are not his, the Leader who hath come doth destroy the people; and its end [is] with a flood, and till the end [is] war, determined [are] desolations.
 

Bobby Jo

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.. 26 And after threescore and two weeks, ...

Show me ANYWHERE in Scripture or any Society where two non-incremental numbers are summed.-- I.e., a mile and a quarter, a cup and a half, four score and ten, -- are all legitimate. But there is NO PRECEDENT where a pair of shoes cost seven and sixty-two dollars. Newton said that if GOD had intended to say "sixty-nine", HE would have said "sixty-nine".

Now having established what Newton called "DOING VIOLENCE TO SCRIPTURE", the RSV, the MSG, and possibly others get it right:

RSV Dan. 9:25 ... to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built again with squares and moat, but in a troubled time. 26 And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off, ...

MSG Dan. 9:25-26 From the time the word goes out to rebuild Jerusalem until the coming of the Anointed Leader, there will be seven sevens. The rebuilding will take sixty-two sevens, including building streets and digging a moat. Those will be rough times. After the sixty-two sevens, the Anointed Leader will be killed

So per your commentators, Jesus must of had a BROTHER, -- or the "translators" contrived a "Jesus Agenda" WHICH DOES NOT EXIST. -- And when you're ready for more evidence, we can continue the conversation, but it's usually at this point were people stop their ears and run away.

So here's the challenge: Simply show me the precedent for summing two non-incremental numbers, and I'll believe YOU. Otherwise, believe NEWTON.
Bobby Jo
 
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Enoch111

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Yes, but if you twist it so that it distorts what is plain and put in a substitute that hides the truth, then you have a lie or falsehood covering scripture lays out.
You won't find me *twisting* or *distorting* Scripture. Check out any of my posts.
 

Enoch111

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I do have a question about your last comment about the new Temple. All I can see in Scripture is the reference about the New Jerusalem coming from heaven. Perhaps you could clarify, which I am sure you can!
That was a reference to Ezekiel's temple, and you will find full details in Ezekiel chapters 40-47. It is called *the sanctuary*.

And of this measure shalt thou measure the length of five and twenty thousand, and the breadth of ten thousand: and in it shall be the sanctuary and the most holy place.(Ezek 45:3)

Moreover I will make a covenant of peace with them; it shall be an everlasting covenant with them: and I will place them, and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in the midst of them for evermore. My tabernacle also shall be with them: yea, I will be their God, and they shall be my people. And the heathen shall know that I the LORD do sanctify Israel, when my sanctuary shall be in the midst of them for evermore. (Ezek 37:26-28)
 
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Bobby Jo

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You won't find me *twisting* or *distorting* Scripture. Check out any of my posts.

If you unknowingly repeat a lie, and someone believes you, will they blame the "source" or YOU for repeating it?

So if they blame YOU because you didn't do due diligence, then you're culpable in "twisting" and/or "distorting" Scripture. And so it would seem that you defend the Daniel 9 "interpretation" (and I use that term loosely) of "490 years", with a "Jesus fulfillment", -- which are TOTAL LIES, from start to finish.

Fair enough?
Bobby Jo
 

CharismaticLady

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The 2300-day prophecy, of which the 70-week prophecy is a small part, was to begin at the command that effected the restoration of Jerusalem. This command went forth under King Artaxerxes Longimanus in the year 457 BC

The decrees of Artaxerxes and Cyrus in Daniel 9 were out of Persia when the Jews were under the rulership of the Medes and Persians, before the Grecian takeover.

The 2300 day prophecy cannot start with the Persian decree, as it was completely fulfilled during the time of the Grecian rulership in 167 BC to 160 BC, with 164 BC as the middle of the week when the temple was defiled. It was cleansed by Jacob Maccabees. The 2300 day prophecy is not in years, but in actual days totaling just under 7 years. The specifics that make it 24 hour days is the description of evening and morning, just as in Genesis 1.

You are combining prophecies that have nothing to do with each other.
 

Paul Christensen

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The decrees of Artaxerxes and Cyrus in Daniel 9 were out of Persia when the Jews were under the rulership of the Medes and Persians, before the Grecian takeover.

The 2300 day prophecy cannot start with the Persian decree, as it was completely fulfilled during the time of the Grecian rulership in 167 BC to 160 BC, with 164 BC as the middle of the week when the temple was defiled. It was cleansed by Jacob Maccabees. The 2300 day prophecy is not in years, but in actual days totaling just under 7 years. The specifics that make it 24 hour days is the description of evening and morning, just as in Genesis 1.

You are combining prophecies that have nothing to do with each other.
This thread has taken on a whole new interest with your involvement in it! :D:D:D :p:p
 

CharismaticLady

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Why not? It will add to the fun of reading the responses and reactions.

Some believe that Romans 11 has something to do with Daniel 8's 2,300 day prophecy. But the interpret 2,300 days as "years" when Daniel 8 is all about Greece, before Rome conquered them and came into power. The 2,300 days are stated as "evenings and mornings," and just as in Genesis 1, evenings and mornings was a 1 day period, 24 hours, just under 7 years. That is why evenings and mornings was specified to show these are as they are written, and can't be turned into prophetic years. The time of the end was the end of Grecian rule over the world. The "little horn" of Daniel 8 is not the same "little horn" of Daniel 7. But they do show paradigms of three different 7 year periods. What you mentioned in Romans 11 is the last paradigm of the 7 year Great Tribulation when all of Israel will be saved. Some are erroneously pulling aspects of different prophecies and combining them willy-nilly and even changing 7 years to 2300 years. Oy vey!

Daniel 8's period of 2300 literal days (6.3 years) is from 167 BC. to 160 BC (Jewish revolt) when in the middle of that period, just before 164 BC when Antiochus Epiphanes IV died, he slaughtered a pig on the altar in the Jewish temple in honor of Zeus, defiling it. It was in the middle of the Maccabean revolt. Jacob Maccabees cleansed the temple.

Daniel 8:8 (Greece) Therefore the male goat grew very great (Alexander the Great); but when he became strong, the large horn was broken (died in his 30's), and in place of it four notable ones (his four generals) came up toward the four winds of heaven. 9 And out of one of them came a little horn (Antiochus Epiphanes IV) which grew exceedingly great toward the south, toward the east, and toward the Glorious Land (Jerusalem).

This was a paradigm of the next Jewish revolt.

Daniel 9:26-27 shows another period of time after the death of Christ, which He, Himself, prophesied about the destruction of that period's Jewish temple by Rome. The prince is not Jesus but like another little horn Titus, and in the middle of the Jewish revolt of 66 AD to 73 AD, in 70 AD the temple was destroyed, defiling it. And the Jewish custom of burnt offerings in the temple was forever destroyed, finally putting an end to it as Jesus prophesied.

Daniel 7 is placed first and is a history of the Jews from the Babylonian captivity all the way to the second coming. It is similar to the great statue with the head of gold (Babylon), breast of silver (Medes and Persians), girdle of bronze (Greece) two legs of Iron (Rome), and feet and toes of mixture of iron and clay (strong and weak countries). The culmination is the period of the Great Tribulation and the little horn is the Antichrist. The paradigms of him prior to the end was Daniel 8 (Grecian antichrist) Antiochus Epiphanes IV, and Daniel 9 (Roman antichrist) Nero with his general Titus.
 

Hobie

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The decrees of Artaxerxes and Cyrus in Daniel 9 were out of Persia when the Jews were under the rulership of the Medes and Persians, before the Grecian takeover.

The 2300 day prophecy cannot start with the Persian decree, as it was completely fulfilled during the time of the Grecian rulership in 167 BC to 160 BC, with 164 BC as the middle of the week when the temple was defiled. It was cleansed by Jacob Maccabees. The 2300 day prophecy is not in years, but in actual days totaling just under 7 years. The specifics that make it 24 hour days is the description of evening and morning, just as in Genesis 1.

You are combining prophecies that have nothing to do with each other.
Not so, the scriptures shows this was during the time of the Medo-Persian Empire and looking forward, and what came after it, the Greek Empire with Alexander the Great. Here is a good explanation..."The 2300 day prophecy in Daniel is the longest time prophecy in the Bible and is of vital importance to understand, and yet the truth of this important prophecy is rarely heard today. But on this page you will see this great prophecy come to light. Please prayerfully study this subject and ask God to guide you.

Daniel 8:13-14 ...'Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? And he said, unto two thousand and three hundred days, then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.'

There are two sanctuaries mentioned in Daniel 8. In verse 11, we have 'miqdash', which can be a sanctuary dedicated to either God or an idol. And in verses 13 and 14 we have 'qodesh', which refers specifically to a holy place of God. So "the sanctuary" to be cleansed at the end of this 2300 day time period, as mentioned above refers to a holy place of God. We know that there is no longer an earthly sanctuary which was used by the Levitical priesthood, so this sanctuary must be the original sanctuary in heaven where Jesus dwells and mediates for us (which Pauls confirmed in Hebrews 8 and 9).

Let us confirm an important point first. The majority of other Christians believe that this prophecy relates to a literal 2300 DAYS, and that it will happen in the last days. But this cannot be right. If you read the vision in Daniel 8, you will see that it talks about a ram, a goat and a little horn. And Gabriel actually confirms who the ram and goat represent. They represent Medo-Persia and Greece. Which means the horn that comes after them is Rome. Both Pagan and Papal Rome.

So what does this mean? Think about it. If the vision concerning the 2300 'days' includes Medo-Persia, Greece and Rome, then that time frame of "2300 days" MUST be able to span those nations. Would 2300 literal days span those nations? No, but 2300 YEARS would! And this also means the 2300 "days" HAVE to start sometime during the reign of Medo-Persia, because that is the first kingdom in the vision (the ram).

This also lines up with the fact that the 70 weeks prophecy of Daniel 9 is PART of the 2300 day vision, because at the end of Daniel 8 it says that no one understood the 2300 day vision. Then in Daniel 9, Gabriel says he has come to give Daniel understanding about THE VISION. What vision? The only one that is not understood is the 2300 "days". Gabriel then goes on to explain the 70 weeks prophecy, which everyone agrees is not 70 literal weeks (490 days), but 490 YEARS. So the 2300 prophetic "days" also HAVE to be YEARS.

And this all falls into line with the DAY FOR A YEAR principle in Bible prophecy.

Another reason why the 70 weeks prophecy has to be part of the 2300, is that without the 70 weeks which Gabriel gives to help Daniel understand the 2300 "days" (years), we would not have a starting point for the 2300 years, which would render that prophecy useless. But with the 70 weeks, we have a starting date.

The Vision
So to get a complete picture of this "vision" and a true understanding of it, let's start in Daniel 8, which is where this 2300 day "vision" begins. Daniel 8:2 ...'And I saw in a vision' ... So Daniel is now in a vision.

(v3) ...'Then I lifted up mine eyes, and saw, and, behold, there stood before the river a ram which had two horns.'

(v5) ...'And as I was considering, behold, an he goat came from the west on the face of the whole earth, and touched not the ground: and the goat had a notable horn between his eyes.'

Notice that these two animals are animals that were used in the Old Testament "sanctuary" service. This is another point which shows that the 2300 "days" (years) which deals with the sanctuary are connected to Medo-Persia and Greece, and cannnot be placed in the last days. So just to confirm without doubt the identity of these two animals, let us read what Gabriel says.

Daniel 8:20-21 ...'The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia. And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king.'

Then in verse 9 we have this little horn that comes out from one of the "four winds of heaven", which basically represents the four directions of the earth. Now what kingdom rose to power after Greece? Pagan Rome! Which later on became Papal Rome, as Pagan Rome handed power over to Papal Rome - the Roman Catholic Church. Let's look at this 'little horn'.

Daniel 8:9-12 ...'And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land. And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them. Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down. And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.'

So this little horn, which rises after Greece 'waxes exceeding great', coming from the West, and conquers lands in the South, the East and also the 'pleasant land', which is Palestine. This refers in the first instance to the Pagan Roman Empire, which ruled also during the first advent of Christ and put Christ on the cross. Hence the term 'magnified himself, even to the prince of the host.'...2300 Day Bible Prophecy in Daniel
 
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Enoch111

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And so it would seem that you defend the Daniel 9 "interpretation" (and I use that term loosely) of "490 years", with a "Jesus fulfillment", -- which are TOTAL LIES, from start to finish.
I don't know what you mean by a "Jesus fulfillment", but the 70th week of Daniel is in the future, not in the past. So exactly what do you consider "total lies"?
 

Bobby Jo

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...
Let us confirm an important point first. ...

Dan. 12:4 But you, Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, until the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase.”
9 He said, “Go your way, Daniel, for the words are shut up and sealed until the time of the end.


Yeah, it's an inconvenient "point" so maybe it's not so important to obey it.
Bobby Jo