The Fire That Consumes - Does Hell Burn Forever?

[BarneyFife]

This is the root of false doctrine.

The root of false doctrine is the love of sin.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Except that scripture says only God is immortal. Only God. No one else. And God is Spirit. So He's the only immortal Spirit. That's a biblical fact and knowing that means you need to place every other scripture that may be understood in different ways in context with what you know... That only God is immortal. Immortality comes as a gift. To the righteous. Not to sinners. In fact the Lord booted Adam and Eve out of Eden so they couldn't eat of the tree of life so there could be no immortal sinner.
Note you have to revise all other assumptions you've made based on this truth.

Not in the least!

The dead losts' souls are in the part of hell called the place of torments and are in torment awaiting the lake of fire.

If you read the Scriptures you find that those tossed in the lake, the smoke of their torment (or torturings) ascends forever and ever!

Jesus died for all the sins of the whole world! Even teh lost have had their sins pay for. They are lost not because they sin, but because they reject the payment (Jesus). thus have to suffer the consequences of sin forever.

Also if one looks at teh order of thigs thrown into the lake of fire shows death is abolished.
Rev. 20:

12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire

The second death is not people going to hell, but the second death is the grave and death being destroyed- then people after death is no more are thrown into the lake of fire.

Jesus even warned of going to Gehjenna where the worm never dies, the fire doesn't go out, and people continue to wail and gnash their teeth.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

This is the lie the serpent told Eve in the garden. It is the lie upon which every pagan religion is based on.

No the lie the serpent told is that we would be like God deciding what is Good and Evil. Eve lied to the serpent when she said they could not even touch it lest they die! Andguess what! The day they did eat, they did die! (spiritually)

 

[BarneyFife]

Not in the least!

The dead losts' souls are in the part of hell called the place of torments and are in torment awaiting the lake of fire.

If you read the Scriptures you find that those tossed in the lake, the smoke of their torment (or torturings) ascends forever and ever!

Jesus died for all the sins of the whole world! Even teh lost have had their sins pay for. They are lost not because they sin, but because they reject the payment (Jesus). thus have to suffer the consequences of sin forever.

Also if one looks at teh order of thigs thrown into the lake of fire shows death is abolished.
Rev. 20:

12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire

The second death is not people going to hell, but the second death is the grave and death being destroyed- then people after death is no more are thrown into the lake of fire.

Jesus even warned of going to Gehjenna where the worm never dies, the fire doesn't go out, and people continue to wail and gnash their teeth.

Pitting Scripture against itself. You can do that to manufacture any doctrine you like. Like the pagan-influenced, early church did to create eternal torment.

God is not a monster.

 

[justbyfaith]

Let it suffice that there is a possibility that there will be eternal torment as a punishment for sins.

Therefore, let every man regard a sinful lifestyle as being worthy of eternal torments and seek to avoid those torments by running to the Cross of Jesus Christ in order that he might lay his sins at the foot of the Cross and receive the soul-cleansing blood as it falls from Jesus hands and side.

 

[BarneyFife]

Let it suffice that there is a possibility that there will be eternal torment as a punishment for sins.

Therefore, let every man regard a sinful lifestyle as being worthy of eternal torments and seek to avoid those torments by running to the Cross of Jesus Christ in order that he might lay his sins at the foot of the Cross and receive the soul-cleansing blood as it falls from Jesus hands and side.

Your tone is like a judge handing down a binding decision, JBF.

What we could do is to study the Bible more closely and vindicate God's character as not being that of a monster.

 

[BarneyFife]

Therefore, let every man regard a sinful lifestyle as being worthy of eternal torments

I have a serious problem with this part, in particular.

 

[marks]

But I am human. How can a lifetime of sin cost an eternity of torture?

Those who have suffered have ceased from sin. Question . . . how do you eliminate sin even from those who have not repented? Suffering will drive sin away from them as their minds are filled with their suffering. Just a random thought there . . .

Much love!

 

[marks]

The same language that is used to describe the eternal state of the redeemed is also used to describe the eternal state of the wicked. We live into the ages of the ages, and they are tormented into the ages of the ages.

Eternal punishment in Matthew 25 is actually the same torment as in John, "fear hath torment". This is not destruction, it is the ongoing torment such as when you fear.

It's all there in the details.

Much love!

 

[Base12]

Round and round you people go. Yet, you never solve the problem. You never see the Truth.

The answer has been given to all of you on a Silver Platter over and over, yet you all would rather look down your noses and scoff.

Is it really that difficult to accept the fact hat you all have been misled your whole lives? Is your ego that enormous?

Not a single one of you on this forum understands what God means by Love you enemies.

What a joke. And now the world hates you for what you have done. Everyone is going to suffer tremendously, both good and bad.

Pathetic.

 

[BarneyFife]

Those who have suffered have ceased from sin. Question . . . how do you eliminate sin even from those who have not repented? Suffering will drive sin away from them as their minds are filled with their suffering. Just a random thought there . . .

Much love!

They are brought to ashes.

 

[BarneyFife]

The same language that is used to describe the eternal state of the redeemed is also used to describe the eternal state of the wicked. We live into the ages of the ages, and they are tormented into the ages of the ages.

Eternal punishment in Matthew 25 is actually the same torment as in John, "fear hath torment". This is not destruction, it is the ongoing torment such as when you fear.

It's all there in the details.

Much love!

It's all covered in posts #7 and #8.

 

[justbyfaith]

And now the world hates you for what you have done.

Even as Jesus said would be the case in John 15 and other passages....but I will say that they hate us not for what we have done; but for who we are.

 

[BarneyFife]

Round and round you people go. Yet, you never solve the problem. You never see the Truth.

The answer has been given to all of you on a Silver Platter over and over, yet you all would rather look down your noses and scoff.

Is it really that difficult to accept the fact hat you all have been misled your whole lives? Is your ego that enormous?

Not a single one of you on this forum understands what God means by Love you enemies.

What a joke. And now the world hates you for what you have done. Everyone is going to suffer tremendously, both good and bad.

Pathetic.

Speaking of egos: You're all spic-and-span, I guess, eh? No flies on you?
"God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers..."
We must sin as you sin, or we must not sin at all, right?

 

[quietthinker]

Let it suffice that there is a possibility that there will be eternal torment as a punishment for sins.

Therefore, let every man regard a sinful lifestyle as being worthy of eternal torments and seek to avoid those torments by running to the Cross of Jesus Christ in order that he might lay his sins at the foot of the Cross and receive the soul-cleansing blood as it falls from Jesus hands and side.

These are not my motivations in the least. I am not running....I am drawn by a beauty that outshines what humans can imagine....or are you unfamiliar with the song, 'wide wide as the ocean, high as the heavens above, deep deep as the deepest sea is my Saviours love?'

 

[quietthinker]

The same language that is used to describe the eternal state of the redeemed is also used to describe the eternal state of the wicked. We live into the ages of the ages, and they are tormented into the ages of the ages.

Eternal punishment in Matthew 25 is actually the same torment as in John, "fear hath torment". This is not destruction, it is the ongoing torment such as when you fear.

It's all there in the details.

Much love!

look at it like this; for ever and ever is as long as it is....life for the redeemed ongoing, no end forever to the full........destruction of sin and sinners forever. When something is destroyed it is destroyed....for ever

 

[Brakelite]

Not in the least!

The dead losts' souls are in the part of hell called the place of torments and are in torment awaiting the lake of fire.

If you read the Scriptures you find that those tossed in the lake, the smoke of their torment (or torturings) ascends forever and ever!

Jesus died for all the sins of the whole world! Even teh lost have had their sins pay for. They are lost not because they sin, but because they reject the payment (Jesus). thus have to suffer the consequences of sin forever.

Also if one looks at teh order of thigs thrown into the lake of fire shows death is abolished.
Rev. 20:

12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire

The second death is not people going to hell, but the second death is the grave and death being destroyed- then people after death is no more are thrown into the lake of fire.

Jesus even warned of going to Gehjenna where the worm never dies, the fire doesn't go out, and people continue to wail and gnash their teeth.

So when scripture says
KJV 1 Timothy 6:15-16
15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

You really think by quoting other scripture Paul's declaration to Timothy becomes invalidated?

 

[CharismaticLady]

The first important fact about hell is this: The unsaved do not go to any place of punishment as soon as they die, but are reserved in the grave until the day of judgment to be punished. Christ explicitly taught this truth in the well-known parable of the wheat and the tares. After the householder had sown the wheat in the field, his servant came to report that tares were growing among the grain. His question was whether he should pull up the weeds while they were still very small. The householder's answer was, "Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of the harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them; but gather the wheat into my barn." Matthew 13:29, 30.

Follow the words of Christ as He explains the meaning of the parable: "He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth." Matthew 13:37-42.

No one can simplify the parable by enlarging on what Jesus said. It is so clear that a child can understand it. He said the tares represented the wicked people, and that they would be cast into the fire "at the end of the world." It was in the harvest that the separation would take place, and He plainly stated, "The harvest is the end of the world." How can anyone misconstrue these words of Christ? The whole idea of the wicked going into the fire at the time of death contradicts our Lord's specific teaching that they would be cast into the fire at the end of the world.

Since the judgment also takes place after Christ comes we can see how impossible it would be for anyone to be punished before that time. Justice demands that a person be brought into judgment before being punished. Peter declared, "The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished." 2 Peter 2:9.

If we let the Bible mean what it says, there can be no doubt on this point. The wicked are "reserved" until when? Until the "day of judgment." To be what? "To be punished"! This means they cannot be punished before that judgment day. Does the Bible tell where they are reserved until then? Christ Himself said, "Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, and shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation." John 5:28, 29.

How plain! Jesus said that both good and bad will come forth from their graves to receive either life or damnation. This proves that from the time of death until they come forth in the resurrection they are not receiving any recompense or punishment. It all happens after they come forth. They are reserved until that day just as Peter indicated, but Christ spelled out where they will be reserved-"in the graves."

Yes, I agree, Barny.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Pitting Scripture against itself. You can do that to manufacture any doctrine you like. Like the pagan-influenced, early church did to create eternal torment.

God is not a monster.

Same could be said of you!

And no God is not a monster. But yours or mine definition of monster is nothing.

It only matters what Scripture says and SCripture says their torment ascends up forever and ever.

And it also says that death and the grave are destroyed before people are cast into the lake of fire.

1 Corinthians 15:26
The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

Rev. 20:

13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

If we let Scripture speak for itself we come to teh conclusion- People are tormented forever in the lake of fire.

Even Jesus said so!

YOu can falsely accuse God of anything but that is His Word

 

[Ronald Nolette]

So when scripture says
KJV 1 Timothy 6:15-16
15 Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
16 Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen.

You really think by quoting other scripture Paul's declaration to Timothy becomes invalidated?

Not in the least! Given teh rest of SCriptures from the fall of man and Jesus death and what it gained for all mankind (Jesus paid for the sins of everyone not just believers) through the end of revelation everyone shall live forever.

We are not immortal by nature while God is. We are all men and angels given immortality.

Before the lost are thrown into th elake of fire, death and the grave are first cast into it and destroyed. this is Jesus promise also in 1 Cor. 15:26

With death destroyed- people can no longer die!